foxfarm ocean forest

[Guest]

Co2 is definately not necessary,but ffeding the plant is.Ocean forest is not a preferted soil,if I tried to go until flower with a seedplant or clone,it would be a skimpy starvin marvin.With clones,I feed 1/2 strength grow big the second watering after transpl;ant.With seedplant I'll start about 1/3 strangth on the third week or so,I veg seedplants for 6 weeks.You have to feed them man,ocean forest is the best of soils but you still need to feed your p[lants.

 

[ITI CHUSS IVI]

the plants are looking really good. I'm on day 16 so I think I'm going to wait at least another week or so before any nutes would be necessary. The reason I use FFOF is because it was always recommended by best growers I know. Next cycle (which will hopefully be in Feb.) I'm definitely going to start off in small containers. I appreciate all the info and I'll keep the pics updated.

 

[kokua]

Ocean forest is not a preferted soil

yes it is...

http://www.foxfarmfertilizer.com/products_soils1.html
http://www.planetnatural.com/site/ocean-forest.html
http://www.hhydro.com/cgi-bin/hhydro/HH00124.html

 

[guineapig]

Yeah the NPK ratio in FF is printed on the side of the bag.....its pre-ferted with
organic goodies, not synthetic time-release garbage fertilizers (imho)....

Is OF the best of soils? probably the best commercially available soil but that
Mushroom compost is good too (with even more nutes than FF so that stuff can
burn seedlings even easier than FF)....

At the end of flowering during the flushing, FoxFarm performs very well too (for those who choose to flush their organic medium).....just make sure to
saturate as much soil as possible and do not just keep watering in the same
place over and over again......to help avoid this problem you can buy a small
bag of "hydroton" (clay spheres) and sprinkle them around the surface of your soil......this causes the water to become more dispersed and gently
sink into more surface area of soil rather than super-saturating one area
over and over again.....

off-topic sorry....

guineapig your friend

 

[SEEDYNONO]

its very strange to me how these liquid ferts get adopted as such a nessessary thing for growing a plant. how do you think mj grew in the wild soils of the world if it wasn't being fed pbp and lk?! surely they would starve!

keep things as close to nature as possible with soil grows.. mother nature doesn't feed with full strength nutes in her rainshowers, neither do i.

 

[kokua]

This is why i love this site. So much helpful info from all the right ppl in the know. I feel like family here. Anyways I was wondering if just using the FFOF soil alone with regular cycles of watering would be enough. I dont want to add all these different nutes to an already nutrient enriched soil. Is the soil by itself enough to grow from veg to flower? Also is c02 really nessessary if i have a nice strong fan blowing through my grow room which is 4x4x6 plus a cieling vent drawing the hot air out? I was gonna get a c02 system but decided to do my first grow without it and then save enough money for a c02 moniter and controller for my 2nd grow. What do u guys think? I will have pics posted once i recieve my light and fan in the mail and finish building my grow room for all to critique. Thx
P.S My fan is a 265cfm Dayton exhaust fan

Save Co2 for a later day...Co2 works wonders if used properly and with the right conditions can add a nice % to your final yeild. But if used unproperly or under less than desirable conditions it doesn't add a thing. Users that see the most benefit from Co2 are those who have their growroom environments 'dailed in', which just means that conditions within your grow space are perfect for aggressive growth. It's a natural progression to make, but don't jump the gun too soon.

I use FFOF alone from clone and seed and it usually sustains through veg. I try to pot up plants in stages, (from a 3" to a 5" to a 1 gallon to a 2 gallon etc...) Every time I pot up I add more OF and more food for growth. I should probably tell you that I veg under 250 watts of fluro's. It is more than sufficient for my needs, but would not be considered aggresive by any stretch. I suppose if you wanted a more aggresive veg, under HID's, you might want to add some veg ferts after a bit. Either way, flowe ferts for the budding stage are a must!

 

[kokua]

its very strange to me how these liquid ferts get adopted as such a nessessary thing for growing a plant. how do you think mj grew in the wild soils of the world if it wasn't being fed pbp and lk?! surely they would starve!

keep things as close to nature as possible with soil grows.. mother nature doesn't feed with full strength nutes in her rainshowers, neither do i.

Mother nature doesn't grow plants in basements with containers and HID's...

When growing outside in the wild soils of the world... use as little as possible.

When growing inside in containers... use what works. PBP and LK work, and are all naturale

 

[guineapig]

Yes enough for a small plant but if you wish to grow a tree it would be adviseable to
amend the FF with organic ferts like guanos and blood meal for extended Nitrogen.....
also add a bit of bone meal just to make sure you have enough Phosphorous for the flowering period.....

(Yes let me just say that I wouldn't add these organic ferts to a 100% FF medium......but, if you use say 20% perlite, 20% coco/peat, 60% FF, I would think that would be a good mixture in which to add a bit of dry guanos and bone-meal.....) -gp edit

yes absolutely agree with kokua save the CO2 for a dialed-in grow, optimally with an intense lighting regimen......for now concentrate on providing fresh air, eliminating stale air, and providing a generally breezy atmosphere for your plantalones....this
atmospheric management is too-often overlooked and is very important

(and of course never forget odour control..... )

guineapig

 

[SEEDYNONO]

go read my previous posts.. the whole point was to go easy on the damn ferts because from my experience with certain sensitive plants adding even 1/2 of the recommended dosages of the liquid ferts caused more problems than i had when i cut back significantly on the doses and frequency and just gave them water mostly.

i think if you have a large enough container and transplanted correctly a flowering plant can make its way through flower with almost no ferts at all.. (staying healthy and green) and this is what i recommend for beginners who need to learn how to read plants and slowly work their way up on the nutes. it may cut back on yield if the plant was hungry for more nutes but i believe its better to have a slightly hungry plant than risking causing problems with overferting, build-up, etc. i see so many people who have problems who likely wouldn't have any problems if they had used plain water.. but they get advice that its deficient and to up the nutes. they just need to learn to not use the liquid nutes as a must but instead use them when the plant tells you it needs them.

some strains don't like nutes at all some won't bulk for shit without them.. it depends. i just like people to learn how to use them correctly instead of saying 'the bottle says ___.. so i am using it corretly.. but my leaves are yellow and falling off and some have orange tips and i can't figure out why the plants won't dense up.. i guess i should add more than the bottle says..'

 

[guineapig]

True SEEDY some plants are very finicky and are particularly sensitive to "wet feet" (saturated organic medium) and over-ferted soil.......I totally agree about an under-ferted plant being better than an over-ferted plant and I believe people should lean toward 1/4 strength instead of 1/2 strength.....then just keen observation of your
plant friends will be your guide....

guineapig in the house

 

[kokua]

go read my previous posts.. the whole point was to go easy on the damn ferts because from my experience with certain sensitive plants adding even 1/2 of the recommended dosages of the liquid ferts caused more problems than i had when i cut back significantly on the doses and frequency and just gave them water mostly.

couldn't agree more...


...very little is needed, especially in veg.

 

[guineapig]

Ok Seedy so you are saying people shouldn't mix in any dry organic fertilizers and
instead should rely on a very light regimen of liquid fertilizers when using 100% FF?

Sorry i am trying not to mislead people.......I wasn't advocating adding more
dry fertilizers to 100% FF.....I should have mentioned the adding of at least 20% perlite to FF is so regularly done that I forgot to mention it.....

So yes if using 100% FF, no dry organic ferts and limited dilute application of liquid amendments/enhancers.....

Sorry to have clogged this thread with confusion.... ....i am the weakest link, goodbye....

 

[SEEDYNONO]

that works for me and is the way i do it. not for everyone or everygrow of course. i believe that one should be concious of what they ammend their soils with if they choose to add anything.. and be concious of what they add to it after that. and compare that with what the plant is telling you it has or needs (the hardest part, made much harder if you already added to much or fed to much). when using ffof it is already pre-ammended in the bag so take that into account as well.

its just about understanding that the fool proof method certainly is not to add a bunch of ferts all the way though so there is plenty available.. there is a thing as too much, and its obvously common with new growers to overfert one way or another.

also when you ammend think about are you adding npk and micros as with some dry ferts or are you only adding n and p as some do with bone and blood meals?

everything is so dynamic and dependent that the only way to properly learn how and what to do is to understand the behind the scenes.

no matter how much i tell you exactly how to provide for the needs of your plant.. you still will have to learn for yourself how to provide for the needs of your plant.

 

[Guest]

DAMN dude, your taking it in the backside.
I get mine for $10. West Coast rules.


Seed

 

[ITI CHUSS IVI]

seedy would you recommend since I've only give water at this point to maybe just start off very light with the nutes I'll be using from advanced nutrients? I know their chart will call for more, but maybe only going with a 1/4 of what they recommend?

 

[Where'sMyBud?]

$10 on the west coast bc we're not paying for the gasoline the trucks use to haul it out to other parts of the USA!!!!

And yes, the west coast does rule, all the way to Alaska beotch.

Case and point: Just don't fert for 3-4 weeks when using OF, pure or cut. Fert only when needed and allow soil to dry thouroughly so that roots grow in search of water. Not that big a deal.

 

[Guest]

Hi folks, interesting read. I myself am a dedicated FFOF user. I use mine uncut in tall 3gal buckets. The soil tends to get hard but it doesnt seem to cause problems. I also have noticed that a few of my ladies are suffering a mind N overdose even tho I feed them VERY little N. In fact, the only N I give them is in the Cal/Mag 2-0-0. I have learned to make sure and veg longer and try to burn up the extra nutes before flower.

GP..I love the hydroton idea. I'll be doing that from now on.
Day 33. A11 and POG.

Notice how the plants are "too" green? Never fed them once.

And here are some of the last grow in FF


Seed

 

[kokua]

hey seed...the hydroton idea is great, but realize that it will add significant weight to the pot. I know personally I check the weight of the pot to see if the roots need moisture or not, the extra weight of the hydroton makes it a bit more difficult to test the moisture this way. I suppose after a while you would get used the the weight difference.

 

[SEEDYNONO]

yep yep not a problem. just keep it light at first. i don't mean to scare people off from using nutes! haha just start slow and work up slow unless the plant is showing you it needs more. true deficiencies in organic soil creep up slowly from my experience so there will be time to add more liquid ferts if you see the signs.. deficiencies that take a hold fast are usually always lock-ups.

also remember the most important time to be correct with nutes is during flower, but most vegging plants will do well even if you overfert a little.. but then there may be build-up in the soil that will cause problems when flower comes around.. so learn, learn, learn about how these things happen. a flowering plant that is overfed at that point may show nute burn signs immediately.

for reference i gave my new 3 week old in ffof flo plants a very weak shot of liquid karma (~3ml) and pbp grow (~3ml) mixed per gallon this morning with their watering.. and divided that gallon up among the 8 plants.. so it didn't soak the soil all the way through.. just around the stalk. the roots are still searching around in the grow bags so i don't keep them soaked at this point.. flo doesn't seem to like wet feet..

here are 4 of 'em looking a little overwatered a few days ago.. and this was with half dry soil 3 days after transplanting them to bags and soaking the soil all the way through. so i must remember to not soak these too much! the blue moon rocks i ran before this was a water hog always wanting to be more on the wet side even when the roots were searching in new containers.. so strain plays a big role in things.



i also added more holes on the bottom of the bags.. as all of the premade holes were on the sides..

 

[kokua]

nono, how do you like the B&W bags, other than the holes?