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Wilson!
Member
Russian,Hundu Kush (Sensi)
That is one awsome babe! What are you using for nutes, lamp, everything? Did you journal that one? Immitation is the highest for of flattery. I want to do what you're doing. You consistentialy have awsome grows. What's your secret?
yea but since every harvest pays for its self at least mine do...plus im not cheap with my friends. i could have done another run with the t5s and get 8oz or have my buddy buy a system for me and just give him some bud, i think an oz and a half is pretty much worth a light system that i can get many many better grows off of. without him i wouldnt have increase yeilds.
in this game its better to not be greedy.
in this game its better to not be greedy.
THC•20
Member
Bad News...
Bad News...
Wow, I experimented with the 12/12 from seed method and instead of using seeds I paid for or that might be of some good value I decided to use bag seeds. I'm so angry, I germinated 6 seeds and 5 sprouted and one was a hermie and the rest were males. I have never had such bad luck. But at least I know that's 5 males eliminated out of these hundreds of bag seeds lol.
Bad News...
Wow, I experimented with the 12/12 from seed method and instead of using seeds I paid for or that might be of some good value I decided to use bag seeds. I'm so angry, I germinated 6 seeds and 5 sprouted and one was a hermie and the rest were males. I have never had such bad luck. But at least I know that's 5 males eliminated out of these hundreds of bag seeds lol.
GrowingHigher
Active member
nice backdrop russian, I love the subtlety. Really great plant.
Machine Elf
Member
I haven't read through this whole thread so what I may be saying may already be stated, agreed with, debunked, or whatever, but this thread perked my interest for scientific reasons and I think what I say has some merit.
While this may be outdated information, I remember reading in a book somewhere that cannabis generally takes 3-4 weeks after germination of seed to form/store enough carbohydrates to go into the flowering phase.
This is the reason 12/12 from seed works, why it won't impact potency any, and why most growers have plants that show flowering at 3 to 4 weeks time.
I am sure with different plants and strains you could get plants that show as early as 2 weeks or late as 5 depending on the individual's and cultivar's characteristics.
I have criticisms and praises of this method for differing reasons. I applaud this method as there is a lot of experimentation that can be done with it, planting seeds and seeing what strains show sex earliest/latest and at what time. In addition to this, much can be done in the way of artificial selection, selecting either early or later flowering individuals from a given strain and only breeding with those and discarding the rest, then repeating the process of selection time and again in subsequent breeding to evolve lines that allow for flowering within 2 weeks or less maybe without affecting potency and yield (those traits of course also being selected for/against).
My criticism is that outside of such experiments where one wishes to determine how fast/slow a particular strain will show flowering or anything else one could devise, and breeding purposes, I think you are losing A LOT of germ/vegging light time (as contrary to what is said, the plant does have a germ/vegging life span even under 12/12, though short a time as it is - and it is those first few weeks before flower as previously mentioned that is that veg phase. The plant does not flower immediately under the 12/12 as it does not have the necessary energy to do so, and when it does after 3-4 weeks growing time, it does) that could be on 24/0 or whatever normal vegging regimen is used. Then after 3-4 weeks 12/12 can be applied as normal (and if you know how long already the strain takes to show flowering, 2, 3, 4, etc weeks, then you can time your 24/0 period and 12/12 period accordingly and save time!). This will solve problems with shorter plants (unless that is what you are going for due to space, etc) and should increase yields as plants will generally be larger having undergone X weeks worth of a full 24/0 light before the 12/12 switch at 3-4 weeks schedule, and still wind up finishing at the same time as plants 12/12 from seed.
I also think since we know it generally takes at least 2 weeks for flowers to show up, that light timing can be changed to 24/0 for the first 1-2 weeks then switched to 12/12 (late) second week/3rd week to induce flowers. Again this adds extra grow time for the plant (and may decrease time needed to induce flowering due to added carbohydrate buildup, like a strain that takes 4 weeks for flowering under 12/12 from seed may show flowers at 3 weeks with 20/4 from seed for 2 weeks then 12/12 started at near the end of the second week). Wouldn't this seemingly make sense and be a preferable method if not trying to experiment in some way, but instead for people wishing to grow a plant that maximizes yield in the shortest time span seed to harvest? Or would it stress the plant perhaps? I remember too that sex is determined within those first few weeks as well, so take note of stress factors that may influence sex here. Again I think with that there is a lot of room for good experimentation and some cool findings!
I don't know, I've never tried any of this stuff, but this is what my scientific knowledge and botany logic tells me. I know the method as is clearly works duh, but would it not be prudent to think it still cannot be improved upon, or techniques integrated for even better results (in the same light I tend to think that a flowering light schedule of 11.5 on and 12.5 off or 11 on and 13 off may also be ideal for maximum flower growth depending on strain of course.. But maybe not for certain reasons who knows?..)? I am sure armed with knowledge people can experiment on their own and post results. I can't imagine what I say seems far too unreasonable but I don't know if my data is outdated and logic skewed, things change in science all the time and such updates generally don't hit the public for 6 months to a year. I would love to hear what people who have experimented have discovered!
While this may be outdated information, I remember reading in a book somewhere that cannabis generally takes 3-4 weeks after germination of seed to form/store enough carbohydrates to go into the flowering phase.
This is the reason 12/12 from seed works, why it won't impact potency any, and why most growers have plants that show flowering at 3 to 4 weeks time.
I am sure with different plants and strains you could get plants that show as early as 2 weeks or late as 5 depending on the individual's and cultivar's characteristics.
I have criticisms and praises of this method for differing reasons. I applaud this method as there is a lot of experimentation that can be done with it, planting seeds and seeing what strains show sex earliest/latest and at what time. In addition to this, much can be done in the way of artificial selection, selecting either early or later flowering individuals from a given strain and only breeding with those and discarding the rest, then repeating the process of selection time and again in subsequent breeding to evolve lines that allow for flowering within 2 weeks or less maybe without affecting potency and yield (those traits of course also being selected for/against).
My criticism is that outside of such experiments where one wishes to determine how fast/slow a particular strain will show flowering or anything else one could devise, and breeding purposes, I think you are losing A LOT of germ/vegging light time (as contrary to what is said, the plant does have a germ/vegging life span even under 12/12, though short a time as it is - and it is those first few weeks before flower as previously mentioned that is that veg phase. The plant does not flower immediately under the 12/12 as it does not have the necessary energy to do so, and when it does after 3-4 weeks growing time, it does) that could be on 24/0 or whatever normal vegging regimen is used. Then after 3-4 weeks 12/12 can be applied as normal (and if you know how long already the strain takes to show flowering, 2, 3, 4, etc weeks, then you can time your 24/0 period and 12/12 period accordingly and save time!). This will solve problems with shorter plants (unless that is what you are going for due to space, etc) and should increase yields as plants will generally be larger having undergone X weeks worth of a full 24/0 light before the 12/12 switch at 3-4 weeks schedule, and still wind up finishing at the same time as plants 12/12 from seed.
I also think since we know it generally takes at least 2 weeks for flowers to show up, that light timing can be changed to 24/0 for the first 1-2 weeks then switched to 12/12 (late) second week/3rd week to induce flowers. Again this adds extra grow time for the plant (and may decrease time needed to induce flowering due to added carbohydrate buildup, like a strain that takes 4 weeks for flowering under 12/12 from seed may show flowers at 3 weeks with 20/4 from seed for 2 weeks then 12/12 started at near the end of the second week). Wouldn't this seemingly make sense and be a preferable method if not trying to experiment in some way, but instead for people wishing to grow a plant that maximizes yield in the shortest time span seed to harvest? Or would it stress the plant perhaps? I remember too that sex is determined within those first few weeks as well, so take note of stress factors that may influence sex here. Again I think with that there is a lot of room for good experimentation and some cool findings!
I don't know, I've never tried any of this stuff, but this is what my scientific knowledge and botany logic tells me. I know the method as is clearly works duh, but would it not be prudent to think it still cannot be improved upon, or techniques integrated for even better results (in the same light I tend to think that a flowering light schedule of 11.5 on and 12.5 off or 11 on and 13 off may also be ideal for maximum flower growth depending on strain of course.. But maybe not for certain reasons who knows?..)? I am sure armed with knowledge people can experiment on their own and post results. I can't imagine what I say seems far too unreasonable but I don't know if my data is outdated and logic skewed, things change in science all the time and such updates generally don't hit the public for 6 months to a year. I would love to hear what people who have experimented have discovered!
atmosphere
Member
It is on hydrodensa .
@Machine 11
We have been experimenting with this method since about 5 years ago . There is a lot to tell about it . One thing is for sure , starting on 12/12 is just one factor in the proces of growing cannabis , the results depend on a lot more than that ofcourse .
The results can be very great in very little time as the pictures above show
RussianGrower
Member
its strongSchlossi said:
what is SA?
I took in the Internet shop of smoking accessories, with express delivery
my city
lamp - 400W HPS,nutes - only for bloom Pokon for kakteen 10-12ml +pinch of MgSO4 /1,5l of water every third wateringWilson! said:
in Russian will be read? registration required
atmosphere
Member
Even plants that had 24/0 for three weeks will still need two weeks to start flowering after switching to 12/12 . This makes 5 weeks from the start to the first signs of flowering . Mature plants ( that were vegged even longer ) still take about a week after switching to 12/12 .
So it is not only the amount of energy a plant has that is needed to start flowering but also the amount of flowering hormones
The duration of the hours of light determine the amount of flowering hormones in a plant
With 12/12 alone:
The time they take to start flowering depends a lot on how fast and healthy you can get them to develop. When they get intensive light right away under the right circumstances they will show sex within 2 weeks . The faster they grow the earlier they will show .
Stress factors will delay development and therefore they will take more time to show sex . I do believe that 12/12 is not a stress fractor by its self.
Sure it can be improved ! last grow I started with 18 hours of light a day for 3 days and after that 12/12 . They still showed sex after 2 weeks.
When growing indoor from seed , you get the problem of plants becoming too tall (especially when you are doing a good job )
In that case you will start skipping veg time and end up without 18/6 or 24/0 time. I have never had the experience of plant staying too short. You mentioned " Again this adds extra grow time for the plant (and may decrease time needed to induce flowering due to added carbohydrate buildup" But sometimes it can be more important to prevent plants becoming too tall .
atmosphere
Member
2,5 weeks from the start , males a being removed
almost two months later :
they somehow manage to produce lots of buds with only few leaves . This is an advantage of the method without a real 24/0 or 18/6 time
almost two months later :
they somehow manage to produce lots of buds with only few leaves . This is an advantage of the method without a real 24/0 or 18/6 time
Just started flowering some of esbe's Arne's Blue Kush, not quite 12/12 from seed, but they've just started their second true set of leaves.
Kind of done it as an experiment, kind of done it to fill out empty space in my first flowering run, will post pics when there is something worth seeing!
Kind of done it as an experiment, kind of done it to fill out empty space in my first flowering run, will post pics when there is something worth seeing!
P
Portmac
An excellent and very long read......
Anyhow I have decided I will try this with my first grow, using flood & drain and also setting up a DWC.
Should be interesting to see what happens since I am a true hydro noob
Anyhow I have decided I will try this with my first grow, using flood & drain and also setting up a DWC.
Should be interesting to see what happens since I am a true hydro noob
Wilson!
Member
12/12 seedlings outside
12/12 seedlings outside
Hi 12x12er's, I use just one space that covers all the bases for 12/12. I germ, and pop the seedlings and just keep moving 'em up the size line.
I want to get a few outside. I have some KaliMist just sprouted and Mazar-I-Sharif that are 3/5 sprouted so far. I want to get these outside before sexing which for me has been around 23ish days so far on WW&NL. Do you think they will be hardy enough at 20 days to give it a go on the outs?
I also have 10 Mandala Safari Mix that I'll get germing soon as I get some space. fun fun fun
12/12 seedlings outside
Hi 12x12er's, I use just one space that covers all the bases for 12/12. I germ, and pop the seedlings and just keep moving 'em up the size line.
I want to get a few outside. I have some KaliMist just sprouted and Mazar-I-Sharif that are 3/5 sprouted so far. I want to get these outside before sexing which for me has been around 23ish days so far on WW&NL. Do you think they will be hardy enough at 20 days to give it a go on the outs?
I also have 10 Mandala Safari Mix that I'll get germing soon as I get some space. fun fun fun
GrowKindNugs
Member
GrowKindNugs
Member
enjoiGrower
New member
After watching all your beautiful babies on this, i finally had to join and get in. :smile:
So after researching for awhile im going to attempt my first grow with this method. One of my questions though, is it a good idea to LST when doing 12/12? most of the plants i seen look likes the bud just grows down the main stem prducing one big bud. which is why i thought it might be better off just not LSTing at all. vertical space may be an issue for me though as well.
So after researching for awhile im going to attempt my first grow with this method. One of my questions though, is it a good idea to LST when doing 12/12? most of the plants i seen look likes the bud just grows down the main stem prducing one big bud. which is why i thought it might be better off just not LSTing at all. vertical space may be an issue for me though as well.
