Wuhan Coronavirus is an Offensive Biological Warfare Weapon

[troutman]

I don't trust seed hacks.

Anyways, wind turbines should be installed to kill the Wuhan bats while making energy.

Study shows wind turbines killed 600,000 bats last year

 

[Gypsy Nirvana]

- If there is someone - some entity - some controlling cabal behind the creation and release of this virus - then they are doing a great job at obfuscating and fudging any evidence that might lead back to them - merely by the volume of conflicting claims from the Chinese and the USA - it leaves most people confused and unable to believe one side or the other - or indeed both sides - so makes it VERY hard to form any firm opinion -

- Perhaps it was intended - to make us all feel like rabbits, caught in the headlights - not knowing where to jump -



-

 

[RudeDog]

Link to the genome sequence:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/nuccore/NC_045512

You can tell that the sequence shows human manipulation.

Where does it show human manipulation in the sequence?

 

[troutman]

- If there is someone - some entity - some controlling cabal behind the creation and release of this virus - then they are doing a great job at obfuscating and fudging any evidence that might lead back to them - merely by the volume of conflicting claims from the Chinese and the USA - it leaves most people confused and unable to believe one side or the other - or indeed both sides - so makes it VERY hard to form any firm opinion -

- Perhaps it was intended - to make us all feel like rabbits, caught in the headlights - not knowing where to jump -



-

Elementary my dear Watson. Follow the money.

It could actually be a false flag to get the World to hate China.

 

[h.h.]

I don't trust seed hacks.

Anyways, wind turbines should be installed to kill the Wuhan bats while making energy.

Study shows wind turbines killed 600,000 bats last year

View Image

http://www.batcon.org/resources/for-specific-issues/wind-power

 

[h.h.]

I have no doubt that China is out to help China. They’re a pesky neighbor. I know this and expect it. I can scream and shout and fuss all about, but they will always be that pesky neighbor.

What matters is what we do. We knew the virus was coming and chose to ignore it. That’s not China’s fault. That’s our fault.

Personal responsibility. It seems to no longer exist. We can spend energy pointing fingers or we can buck up and start taking care of ourselves.

Difficult when our beloved leader is a total pussy.

 

[Chimera]

SARS-CoV-2 isn't derived genetically from SARS, despite the name.

SARS in an acronym for Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome- meaning the corona virus that causes SARS in humans.

SARS-CoV-2 = novel corona virus which also causes SARS. In other words, this is the second virus that causes the humans the measurable phenotype (SARS).

That doesn't mean that SARS-CoV-2 descended from SARS.


Think of it like this... throughout the series, the Simpsons had different cats, but each catwas named variations of Snowball, ie Snowball, Snowball 2, Snowball 3, etc.

These cats all shared a name- for whatever reason, the Simpsons chose to always name their cat Snowball. Even though all the cats are named a variation of snowball, that doesn't mean that Snowball 2 descended from Snowball, or that Snowball 3 descended from Snowball 2, etc.

Same thing with SARS. Genetic sequencing has already proved conclusively that SARS-CoV-2 did not descend from SARS, rather they shared an unidentified common ancestor.

See chart below, taken from nextstrain.org, shows clearly that SARS & SARS-CoV-2 land on separate branches of the coronavirus family tree.

So if you come across anyone saying that SARS-CoV-2 descended from, derived from, evolved from... whatever words you want to use... if the claim is that SARS-CoV-2 came from SARS, the person making the claim is completely misinformed, and clearly not a reliable source to point to.

 

[Chimera]

in the end, even if it's a naturally occuring virus, that doesnt nagate it getting accidentally released somehow. what we need is scientists to go out in the caves near wuhan and start collecting samples to see if it's present in the wild bat population which it should be if it's natural.

That last bit a false assumption.

Shi Zeng-Li did spend years spelunking through caves collecting samples & isolating viruses, but they never collected the one isolated & sequenced in Wuhan. They collected viruses very that were very closely related genetically, but the exact virus was never found.

Why? Because corona virus populations are in a constant state of genetic flux. A given virion (individual viral particle) only lasts for a week or so perhaps, then it must infect another cell in order to replicate. Viruses need a host like humans, to complete their reproductive cycle & spread.

Every time a virus goes through a round of reproduction, small genetic changes can occur. That means that a virus' descendants might not share the same genetic signature of the progenitor. Yes we can tell they are genetically related, but the progenitor "strain", may be extinct by the time you are looking at the descendants.

There is no guarantee anyone will ever find the strain from which this one derived... in fact they likely won't. We can only look for partial genetic signatures that showed shared homology - areas of the genome that are preserved over generations.

Again, I direct you to look at nextstrain.org ... this whole concept is painted out very clearly with visualizations. If we were to sequence the virus found in an individual in NY state, or in Peru, or in WA State, or India... we will see that no two viruses have an identical genome sequence? .

Why?

Because the virus has been undergoing mutations as it travels around the world, from person to person. The likelihood of matching a 100% identical genetic sequence to a virus found April/May in say NY, WA, Peru, to the one found & sequenced in Wuhan early January 2020 is zero, because like I said the viral genomes are in a constant state of flux as their genomes change over generations of replication.

So too has been happening in the wild, and for this reason, it's highly, highly highly unlikely that anyone will be able to match the genetic sequence of the SARS-CoV-2 "strain" with any other wild-derived relative. Even SARS-CoV-2 isn't really a single strain any more... it's a divergent (& convergent) family of genetically related strains, that all share a single phenotype (they can induce SARS in humans). That's what defines the type.

Clear?

 

[imiubu]

- If there is someone - some entity - some controlling cabal behind the creation and release of this virus - then they are doing a great job at obfuscating and fudging any evidence that might lead back to them - merely by the volume of conflicting claims from the Chinese and the USA - it leaves most people confused and unable to believe one side or the other - or indeed both sides - so makes it VERY hard to form any firm opinion -

- Perhaps it was intended - to make us all feel like rabbits, caught in the headlights - not knowing where to jump -



-

Yep, IIRC that is called "Tharn" or to "go tharn"

 

[dramamine]

That last bit a false assumption.

Shi Zeng-Li did spend years spelunking through caves collecting samples & isolating viruses, but they never collected the one isolated & sequenced in Wuhan. They collected viruses very that were very closely related genetically, but the exact virus was never found.

Why? Because corona virus populations are in a constant state of genetic flux. A given virion (individual viral particle) only lasts for a week or so perhaps, then it must infect another cell in order to replicate. Viruses need a host like humans, to complete their reproductive cycle & spread.

Every time a virus goes through a round of reproduction, small genetic changes can occur. That means that a virus' descendants might not share the same genetic signature of the progenitor. Yes we can tell they are genetically related, but the progenitor "strain", may be extinct by the time you are looking at the descendants.

There is no guarantee anyone will ever find the strain from which this one derived... in fact they likely won't. We can only look for partial genetic signatures that showed shared homology - areas of the genome that are preserved over generations.

Again, I direct you to look at nextstrain.org ... this whole concept is painted out very clearly with visualizations. If we were to sequence the virus found in an individual in NY state, or in Peru, or in WA State, or India... we will see that no two viruses have an identical genome sequence? .

Why?

Because the virus has been undergoing mutations as it travels around the world, from person to person. The likelihood of matching a 100% identical genetic sequence to a virus found April/May in say NY, WA, Peru, to the one found & sequenced in Wuhan early January 2020 is zero, because like I said the viral genomes are in a constant state of flux as their genomes change over generations of replication.

So too has been happening in the wild, and for this reason, it's highly, highly highly unlikely that anyone will be able to match the genetic sequence of the SARS-CoV-2 "strain" with any other wild-derived relative. Even SARS-CoV-2 isn't really a single strain any more... it's a divergent (& convergent) family of genetically related strains, that all share a single phenotype (they can induce SARS in humans). That's what defines the type.

Clear?

In light of this, how is it that we can positively identify this specific virus in humans, but not in bats?

 

[shaggyballs]

Where does it show human manipulation in the sequence?

Where does it show proof of natural origin in the sequence?

 

[shaggyballs]

- If there is someone - some entity - some controlling cabal behind the creation and release of this virus - then they are doing a great job at obfuscating and fudging any evidence that might lead back to them - merely by the volume of conflicting claims from the Chinese and the USA - it leaves most people confused and unable to believe one side or the other - or indeed both sides - so makes it VERY hard to form any firm opinion -

- Perhaps it was intended - to make us all feel like rabbits, caught in the headlights - not knowing where to jump -

-

I had started a thread that was going to lead to this conclusion.
The tread would have showed all the lies that have been told about this virus.

All the way from a hoax to a pandemic.

On day in our near future the media will be putting out so much misinformation, the public will no longer know what to believe.

Causing complete chaos and civil unrest.

There will be 2 sides to every story.
Example a cell phone video saying everyone is dying.
Next you will see an opposite video no one is dying.

You will see a hospital packed and hospitals empty.
There will be so much misinformation produced it will be impossible to discern what is truth and what is fake.

All by intention.
It has been a trial run thus far.

 

[Chimera]

In light of this, how is it that we can positively identify this specific virus in humans, but not in bats?

Perhaps this answer it, perhaps not- if not can you okease restate the question?

I mean technically, we can detect the virus in a bat, if it were present.

Not trying to be evasive, Im just not understanding which aspect you are referring to.

The simple answer is we can detect the virus in humans, because we have a genetic test for it. We can use the same test to test for this virus in bats.

We have tested millions of humans now for SARS-CoV-2, looking at a very specific piece of RNA in the SARS-CoV-2 genome. We haven't tested nearly close to as many bats (why would we?)

What we (humans) have done is sample bat feces and bats in some cases, we have sampled pangolins, we samples a bunch of animals found at the infamous wet market in Wuhan.

From all those samples, we have never found SARS-CoV-2 in bats. We have never found SARS-CoV-2 in pangolin. We have never found SARS-CoV-2 in any other species, except humans.

That doesn't mean it's not out there in an animal population- in fact the zoonotic transmission model depends on it, or some very very close relative of the virus to be found in an animal population.

Think of it like the missing link in evolution- we know that humans descended from an earlier primate that lies somewhere between us & chimps on the family tree. But we haven't ever found that 'missing link'. Yes it would be interesting to know to understand the complete picture, but there is enough corollary evidence that supports the claim to be sure, without actually having the missing link.

Same goes with the virus. Would knowing the exact route of transmission to inform our behaviour in the future? Fucking right it would. If we could put the family tree together piece by piece, it would be ideal. We just don't have the pieces, and perhaps never will. That doesn't mean we can't draw inferences from the data we have.

 

[Chimera]

Originally Posted by shaggyballs

Link to the genome sequence:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/nuccore/NC_045512

You can tell that the sequence shows human manipulation.

Originally Posted by RudeDog
Where does it show human manipulation in the sequence?

Where does it show proof of natural origin in the sequence?

... yet not a word on SARS & SARS-CoV-2. If anyone provides the answers there's no acknowledgement, just changes to topic again... over and over... circular logic... it's a manic wank fest

 

[shaggyballs]

Think of it like the missing link in evolution- we know that humans descended from an earlier primate that lies somewhere between us & chimps on the family tree. But we haven't ever found that 'missing link'. Yes it would be interesting to know to understand the complete picture, but there is enough corollary evidence that supports the claim to be sure, without actually having the missing link.

Same goes with the virus. Would knowing the exact route of transmission to inform our behaviour in the future? Fucking right it would. If we could put the family tree together piece by piece, it would be ideal. We just don't have the pieces, and perhaps never will. That doesn't mean we can't draw inferences from the data we have.

If we know for sure, man came from apes, as you allege where is the proof?
We don't know for sure as you allege do we?

You are a scientist right.
Can you really make statements like that without proof?
Try and publish a peer reviewed paper without proof.
You will be the laughing stock of the community.
Would you not?

This is the exact point I was trying to make.
We do not have the missing link.
It does not exist.
This suggests accelerated evolution in a lab.
The virus seem to have made a huge/impossible evolutionary jump to infect humans.

Much like humans....
How can you say this is true for sure without the missing link.
It is pure speculation on your part is it not?
If you say it is not....
Please provide the missing link.

 

[shaggyballs]

SARS-CoV-2 isn't derived genetically from SARS, despite the name.

SARS in an acronym for Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome- meaning the corona virus that causes SARS in humans.

SARS-CoV-2 = novel corona virus which also causes SARS. In other words, this is the second virus that causes the humans the measurable phenotype (SARS).

That doesn't mean that SARS-CoV-2 descended from SARS.


Think of it like this... throughout the series, the Simpsons had different cats, but each catwas named variations of Snowball, ie Snowball, Snowball 2, Snowball 3, etc.

These cats all shared a name- for whatever reason, the Simpsons chose to always name their cat Snowball. Even though all the cats are named a variation of snowball, that doesn't mean that Snowball 2 descended from Snowball, or that Snowball 3 descended from Snowball 2, etc.

Same thing with SARS. Genetic sequencing has already proved conclusively that SARS-CoV-2 did not descend from SARS, rather they shared an unidentified common ancestor.

See chart below, taken from nextstrain.org, shows clearly that SARS & SARS-CoV-2 land on separate branches of the coronavirus family tree.

So if you come across anyone saying that SARS-CoV-2 descended from, derived from, evolved from... whatever words you want to use... if the claim is that SARS-CoV-2 came from SARS, the person making the claim is completely misinformed, and clearly not a reliable source to point to.

View Image

Well you say one thing, the experts in the field are singing a different tune.
I am not convinced.
I do not feel your explanation is not enough to over turn what the experts are saying.

Who will you trust

An Experts with 40+ years in the field of virus development.
And
MIT PHD doctor doing real time research.
Both disagree with chimera.

You choose what you want to believe.

Here is something I do not understand at all.
If it is not related to SARS why do they call it SARS 2?
Why, I don't get it.

 

[shaggyballs]

... yet not a word on SARS & SARS-CoV-2. If anyone provides the answers there's no acknowledgement, just changes to topic again... over and over... circular logic... it's a manic wank fest

Well I was trying to keep away from the personal attacks.
But you keep them coming.
Why all the personal attacks.
They don't mean a lot coming from a liar and a scammer.

How can you trust the word of a known scammer and confirmed liar?

You claim to know more than the expert do.
But you only provide opinion.
Don't you have some old lady to fleece out of her pension.

 

[Chimera]

Here is something I do not understand at all.
If it is not related to SARS why do they call it SARS 2?

Same answer, it's not going to change just because you asked it again.

THey don't call it SARS 2, it's called SARS-CoV-2

Read carefully:

SARS & SARS-cov-2 ARE related. You can see this clearly from the family tree (attached)

SARS-CoV-2 is not descended from SARS (Again, see family tree)

SARS= Yellow dots
SARS-CoV-2 = red dots
Other Corona Viruses = blue dots

SARS is an acronym of Sever Acute Respiratory Syndrome, for the phenotype this virus can cause in humans.

 

[shaggyballs]

Same answer, it's not going to change just because you asked it again.

THey don't call it SARS 2, it's called SARS-CoV-2

Read carefully:

SARS & SARS-cov-2 ARE related. You can see this clearly from the family tree (attached)

SARS-CoV-2 is not descended from SARS (Again, see family tree)

SARS= Yellow dots
SARS-CoV-2 = red dots
Other Corona Viruses = blue dots

SARS is an acronym of Sever Acute Respiratory Syndrome, for the phenotype this virus can cause in humans.

View Image

If it is not related to sars why use sars in the name.

 

[shaggyballs]

Do you have any comments on this?

If we know for sure, man came from apes, as you allege where is the proof?
We don't know for sure as you allege do we?

You are a scientist right.
Can you really make statements like that without proof?
Try and publish a peer reviewed paper without proof.
You will be the laughing stock of the community.
Would you not?

This is the exact point I was trying to make.
We do not have the missing link.
It does not exist.
This suggests accelerated evolution in a lab.
The virus seem to have made a huge/impossible evolutionary jump to infect humans.

Much like humans....
How can you say this is true for sure without the missing link.
It is pure speculation on your part is it not?
If you say it is not....
Please provide the missing link.