Wholesale pot prices plummet. Now there starting to get better

[Klompen]

I do, and it is over and ending.

Not anymore for me I get weed from friends home grown or walk into a store and buy it now. No more sketchy parking lot deals, no more absurdly inflated prices, no more "narcs", "snitches". Good Riddance to all of that BS..

I understand some people made a living from it being illegal. That game is over and ending, they have to find another illegal product or risk. or become a real grower and agricultural business owner.

I haven't read all your contributions to this thread but this post is 100% spot on and reasonable. The black market sucks so bad. The risk of imprisonment, all the sketchy shit associated with it. I am so tired of the illegal market and its crazy inflated prices.

Yes, I know its tough for people used to pulling large profits off their product to accept that their product is now worth a lot less, but they need to decide what is more important to them; making money or doing the right thing.

Its funny though how this sort of crap happens even with legal markets. The emu business was extremely valuable at one point, with birds being as much as 30,000 dollars. Then Oprah said something about it and tons of people started setting up emu farming operations and suddenly they were worth about 600 dollars a bird. Some of the farmers already in the business were literally talking about killing Oprah because she "ruined their lives" by telling people about how valuable emus were.

Legalization needs to happen, and you can either decide to stand on the side of people like Ronald Reagan or you can stand with the average people who need it medically or just want to enjoy a harmless pursuit. Keeping it illegal and supporting a system that has been incarcerating millions of people and that is used as a tool of oppression by the police just to support your own personal profits is profoundly evil.

 

[TychoMonolyth]

Legal producers have told me that they plan to offload half to the black market still ...



I expect prices to be the same as last year and competition to be up ... Get your stuff trimmed up fast and out the door when cut ...

Shit.... LPs ran out here in July. same as last year.

 

[bigtacofarmer]

You are the one that sounds like a cop. I am on here promoting legal cannabis and legal homegrown cannabis. No place for cops in that.

You on the other hand are promoting the illegal status of cannabis for your own profit. You.. are ether a cop who profits from the court system and the prison industry. Or you are a criminal who profits from selling illegal goods.

The best part of legalization is people like you(cops and criminals) are going to have to “Get the fuck out!!” of the cannabis industry and go to meth, heroin, burglary or what ever low life criminal scumbags are doing.

Not really anything to do with your argument sir. But any law that say one person can grow a plant legally and profit and another does not have the same right is a typo. Any anyone who supports such a law is a real piece of shit. Not the good kind you compost and feed your plants. But the kind you want dispose of and taken as far from the village as possible.

As far as comparing black market growers to meth and heroin dealers. You are yet one more to prove you true ignorance.

Its the same plant. And supporting small farmers as opposed to huge cannabis farms does far more good for the comnunity.

 

[Klompen]

As far as comparing black market growers to meth and heroin dealers. You are yet one more to prove you true ignorance.

Its the same plant. And supporting small farmers as opposed to huge cannabis farms does far more good for the comnunity.

You're totally missing the point. He's saying that there's no reason it should be moving in the same circles as meth and heroin does. In terms of who moves the big quantities of weed around right now in the black market, its many of the same people also moving really bad shit around. Legalizing it ends that. Then if people really just want to make massive profits off of drug laws they can still try to traffic that garbage instead.

 

[MedResearcher]

Next year, hard to say. Can only really speculate.

I think the LP's will over produce. Maybe not over produce for the entire year, but at harvest there will be to much for the shops to handle. So, I think its safe to assume a large portion of the LP's full term will go black market. Have even heard first hand an LP laughing about the track trace program.


Overall, I think it will be similar to this last year. Really slow, and bad after harvest. The huge organized crews, large LP's, will flood everywhere with 1,000 packs. Eventually some point next spring/summer, the 1,000 packs will run out, and begin to be pieced together. Dwindling and dwindling until people cant even scrape together decent 100 packs of full term, so they have to pay the price and supplement with dep.


This years drought, felt better than last years. Those 1000 packs, destroyed the market but I feel like they also grew demand. So the second they run out.. hungry markets. I don't think the giant 1000 pack farms will increase for long, to easy to spot, to good of a bust to be left alone for to long.


Mr^^

 

[green404]

As far as comparing black market growers to meth and heroin dealers. You are yet one more to prove you true ignorance.

Its the same plant. And supporting small farmers as opposed to huge cannabis farms does far more good for the comnunity.

Illegal growers make a profit because of the inflated contraband price. Same reason meth and heroin dealers make money. Has nothing to do with the "little guy" it all has to do with inflated price due to risk.

Same exact concept with meth. One a legal production scale meth would probably be $5. lb all the "small chemists" would be out of business.

 

[theJointedOne]

...or become a real grower and agricultural business owner.

meh, go back to your keyboard, warrior

 

[FreedomGrower]

Legal yesterday ... illegal today (banned on 20 acres ag) ... Not going to stop growing or changing my prices ... I would make more being legal even with the taxes because I would be able to grow more and not worry about being beaten by code compliance and fined ... only people getting legal permits to grow are rich white people and x cops ...


I will never shop in a legal shop even if I'm allowed / forced to get legal in the future ...


And since no track and trace most legally grow cannabis is still being shipped out because it cannot pass testing ...

 

[Wendull C.]

You are the one that sounds like a cop. I am on here promoting legal cannabis and legal homegrown cannabis. No place for cops in that.

You on the other hand are promoting the illegal status of cannabis for your own profit. You.. are ether a cop who profits from the court system and the prison industry. Or you are a criminal who profits from selling illegal goods.

The best part of legalization is people like you(cops and criminals) are going to have to “Get the fuck out!!” of the cannabis industry and go to meth, heroin, burglary or what ever low life criminal scumbags are doing.

What you call "legal cannabis", was brought to you by those you now disparage.

I can not reconsile these two points.

Did you breed all your own genetics since 2016? Or do you profit from "whatever low life criminal scumbag" bred them or in some cases found them?

 

[troutman]

Same exact concept with meth. One a legal production scale meth would probably be $5. lb all the "small chemists" would be out of business.

 

[MedResearcher]

Illegal growers make a profit because of the inflated contraband price.

That can play a role in the supply, but that is not what sets the market price nor the profit margins. Its supply, demand, and expenses.

For example the wine industry. Wine has been legal for a very long time, legality plays no role in the market. There is an over supply of low grade wine, so you can go to Trader Joe's and grab a bottle for as low as a couple dollars. Many people do, it sort of tastes like wine and gets you drunk. On the other hand, you have small boutique batch's that will quickly run out, so a single bottle can easily sell for 1,000, if not 10,000 dollars or more.

Another example, the scotch market. A bottle of James Brook's for 13 dollars , or you buy a 60 year old Macallan for 70,000 dollars a bottle. As well, everything in between.


As the legal market matures, we will see both higher priced products than ever before and cheaper products. There will be a lot of low grade, or mid grade for cheap. The fantastic small batch stuff will be marketed to the rich and famous for top dollar.


You can have product that is priceless. One of a kind, limited supply. Around 10 years ago I had a batch of bubble hash that was out of this world, at slightly above room temperature it would basically melt into liquid. Every time I busted it out for company people would try to buy it, but it was not for sale. I shared it and enjoyed it for a couple years, but I would not sell a drop for any price.


Really I think being illegal, limited the marketing of really expensive canna. Just wait until you are drooling over 2,000 dollar ounce of 2019 Skunk Reserve Limited Solventless Extract that only the most upper class can afford to enjoy.


I have recently heard of some of Calis rich and famous paying insane prices for product from legal venues.


I think the average consumer will get inferior product per dollar due to legalization. Buy a piece of furniture from WalMart, see what you get. They basically sell you trash. Myself I put trash in the trash can, I try not to buy it and bring it home.


It is to bad many people have had some bad experiences buying canna. I think everyone does. I hate buying cars, I feel like I always get ripped off.

I don't think government regulation, and corporate run canna farms are going to stop the bad experiences. Look at our regulated, corporate food market. We have all been eating small amounts of round-up in everything. Almost every single commercial food product has some percentage of poison in it. The FDA set a legal amount of poison to be allowed in our food. You can bet the corporate canna will also have "legal" amounts of poison in it.

There are thresholds for many pesticides as well as fungus to pass testing. There are illegal pesticides that will have a 0% threshold, but there is a giant list of legal pesticides that you can use on canna, and thresholds of how much of the pesticide can be on the product and pass testing. Most if not all of the list of approved pesticides I would never use on Canna. I would not use it on canna that anyone would consume, not me, not my family, not my neighbors, or some random person in a city. That is called ethics. In a corporation there are not ethics only profit margins and ROI's. Capitalism and greed at its best.


Mr^^

 

[HHILL]

Well put MedResearcher, well put.

 

[Brother Nature]

In relation to the post above, how do natural disasters effect the legal market there? In terms of this year alone, California has seen some of it's worst and largest fires in prime cannabis growing country, that must effect the market in some way. I'd imagine that with legal production, there'd be some sort of testing required for potentially fire damaged product? What would be allowed, not allowed, does this raise the legal prices and lower the black market price, etc...?


I quite like reading through this thread as an ex Californian in a country that's only just starting to pave the way for legal, there's a ton of great an knowledgeable people here. I also did a bid a while ago for growing back when it was not legal so fuck you trolls, we paved the way for this, have some respect. Bloody kids these days...

 

[Klompen]

That can play a role in the supply, but that is not what sets the market price nor the profit margins. Its supply, demand, and expenses.

For example the wine industry. Wine has been legal for a very long time, legality plays no role in the market. There is an over supply of low grade wine, so you can go to Trader Joe's and grab a bottle for as low as a couple dollars. Many people do, it sort of tastes like wine and gets you drunk. On the other hand, you have small boutique batch's that will quickly run out, so a single bottle can easily sell for 1,000, if not 10,000 dollars or more.

The main issue with this comparison is that the very high end of wine production isn't really better. There's been plenty of blind testing studies that have shown that the exact price range of the wine isn't really what sets it apart, nor is even the age of it. Essentially rich idiots get sold on the idea that certain products are boutique and throw huge amounts of money at them for no real reason other than the fact that they can.

As the legal market matures, we will see both higher priced products than ever before and cheaper products. There will be a lot of low grade, or mid grade for cheap. The fantastic small batch stuff will be marketed to the rich and famous for top dollar.

Sure there's some degree of truth to this. I have noticed that there's a lot of cannabis flowing out of Colorado into the illegal markets here in the Midwest that look like really really good nug but smoke kind of like good mids. Thing is, there's also still plenty of really fantastic stuff coming out of the legal markets too. Best of all, if its legal you can just grow some for yourself.

Really I think being illegal, limited the marketing of really expensive canna. Just wait until you are drooling over 2,000 dollar ounce of 2019 Skunk Reserve Limited Solventless Extract that only the most upper class can afford to enjoy.

Rich people already can basically do whatever drugs they want. They already can afford the finest the black market has to offer and risk the least amount of legal troubles to get it. I can't just go out and buy any sort of drug I want like they can, but I can sure as hell grow my own pot and shrooms. Now access to good seeds can be tough for some people, myself included, but I can't imagine what the possible benefit of keeping it illegal and letting that prohibition wreak havoc on poor people simply to avoid some pot becoming boutique. Even when I could still afford weed I had to buy brick because uncompressed bud is 300-500 per OUNCE here. So for a lot of people the high end is already out of reach and it is exactly because it is illegal and ridiculously expensive.

I think the average consumer will get inferior product per dollar due to legalization. Buy a piece of furniture from WalMart, see what you get. They basically sell you trash. Myself I put trash in the trash can, I try not to buy it and bring it home.

I build my own furniture. I don't buy crappy furniture from Walmart and I am about as poor as a person can get without being totally vagrant.

It is to bad many people have had some bad experiences buying canna. I think everyone does. I hate buying cars, I feel like I always get ripped off.

Have you ever gone to buy a car and ended up hiding in an alley because 30 gang members showed up with guns to rob and kill you? I went to buy weed one time and only lived to tell the tale because I got spooked and got out of sight after the guy went in to supposedly get the weed. Pretty soon two vans pulled up in the alley where I had been moments before and about 30 guys came pouring out and started searching the alley with guns drawn and bitching that they couldn't find me. I've never had something like that happen when buying a car. I've known people who have been shot over weed deals, robbed at gunpoint, and sometimes even by the cops. I don't know anyone who went to buy a car and then had the cops show up right after the deal and take it from them without reporting it, or confiscating it and sending them off to prison. Not once.

I don't think government regulation, and corporate run canna farms are going to stop the bad experiences. Look at our regulated, corporate food market. We have all been eating small amounts of round-up in everything. Almost every single commercial food product has some percentage of poison in it. The FDA set a legal amount of poison to be allowed in our food. You can bet the corporate canna will also have "legal" amounts of poison in it.

There are thresholds for many pesticides as well as fungus to pass testing. There are illegal pesticides that will have a 0% threshold, but there is a giant list of legal pesticides that you can use on canna, and thresholds of how much of the pesticide can be on the product and pass testing. Most if not all of the list of approved pesticides I would never use on Canna. I would not use it on canna that anyone would consume, not me, not my family, not my neighbors, or some random person in a city. That is called ethics. In a corporation there are not ethics only profit margins and ROI's. Capitalism and greed at its best.

I can grow my own corn, my own tomatoes, and all manner of other foods. Even when I was in a trailer park and barely had a yard I was growing a lot of my own food in containers. I never put any poisons on it. 100% organic practices. I could do the same with my cannabis if its legalized. If its illegal, I face prison, robbery, and all manner of other evils over it. The odd few benefits of keeping it black market simply do not even begin to outweigh the price of keeping it illegal.

 

[MedResearcher]

You have some good points Klomp, but you are missing the big picture. They did not legalize cannabis, they regulated it.

Just two days ago, I heard a local story of a 75 year old woman in Nor Cal, having code enforcement kill her 5 plants, and fine her 10k dollars...... There is no argument for that. That is not legalization, not even close.

Guess after she pays her fine, she can go to the store and buy some random suspect product?


If it was really legal, like tomatoes and corn everyone would be celebrating, it should be a human right to grow a medicinal plant.


People get robbed and killed, over vehicles. Its not a vehicle, canna, Iphone, or your watch that makes people commit crimes, its money. Colorado is also regulated, they use private contracted ex-military to guard the product and money. Nothing is safer. There was a string of "legal" canna stores that got robbed in LA. The thieves executed everyone in the stores. They are converting a shut down prison into a grow factory for security.... you guys are romanticizing this.

I agree, legalization would be wonderful, the whole world could enjoy the plant and celebrate. This is just not that, not even close.


The fact that there are canna operations in the wide open combined with the fact that banks will not do business with the canna industry has actually led to a more volatile and dangerous situation. A busy store has to move millions of dollars of cash constantly. Any canna owner, which is public knowledge, through public business filings, basically has a target on their back. All that cash is sitting somewhere waiting to be taken. I know a woman who runs a "legit" store, she is a widow. Her husband was followed from his store, and murdered. The government regulating it without legalizing it, is keeping the prices high enough in an all cash business to make it an extremely dangerous industry.

Mr^^

 

[Dirt Bag]

Illiteracy only reinforces people's preconceived notion of the typical marijuana user.

R.I.F.

 

[green404]

That can play a role in the supply, but that is not what sets the market price nor the profit margins. Its supply, demand, and expenses.

When something is illegal to grow supply is way down because most normal people do not want to risk going prison. As soon as the risk of prison goes away the market starts getting flooded with growers and prices drop. See Colorado and Oregon.

As the legal market matures, we will see both higher priced products than ever before and cheaper products. There will be a lot of low grade, or mid grade for cheap. The fantastic small batch stuff will be marketed to the rich and famous for top dollar.

The comparison to wine and scotch is not a good one. With wine and scotch you have the agricultural product, fermentation and aging. Everyone of these parts has to be spot on and it takes years(take 10-50 years). It takes centuries for distilleries and wineries to establish a great system. To be superb all of these elements need to have all the stars align(a couple of great years in a century).

With cannabis you just have a agricultural product. 30-90day cure vs 40year aged scotch ? Not even close to the same investment.

I also did a bid a while ago for growing back when it was not legal so fuck you trolls, we paved the way for this, have some respect. Bloody kids these days...

You took a legal risk to make money. Your odds ran out. You didn't pave the way to anything except the billion dollar industry of The War on Drugs.


You guys have had easy money and it has made you legends in your own minds. The reality is you are growing weeds that have inflated black market price. That inflated price is going away. The people don't have to pay it anymore.

 

[Oliver Pantsoff]

The main issue with this comparison is that the very high end of wine production isn't really better. There's been plenty of blind testing studies that have shown that the exact price range of the wine isn't really what sets it apart, nor is even the age of it. Essentially rich idiots get sold on the idea that certain products are boutique and throw huge amounts of money at them for no real reason other than the fact that they can.



Sure there's some degree of truth to this. I have noticed that there's a lot of cannabis flowing out of Colorado into the illegal markets here in the Midwest that look like really really good nug but smoke kind of like good mids. Thing is, there's also still plenty of really fantastic stuff coming out of the legal markets too. Best of all, if its legal you can just grow some for yourself.



Rich people already can basically do whatever drugs they want. They already can afford the finest the black market has to offer and risk the least amount of legal troubles to get it. I can't just go out and buy any sort of drug I want like they can, but I can sure as hell grow my own pot and shrooms. Now access to good seeds can be tough for some people, myself included, but I can't imagine what the possible benefit of keeping it illegal and letting that prohibition wreak havoc on poor people simply to avoid some pot becoming boutique. Even when I could still afford weed I had to buy brick because uncompressed bud is 300-500 per OUNCE here. So for a lot of people the high end is already out of reach and it is exactly because it is illegal and ridiculously expensive.



I build my own furniture. I don't buy crappy furniture from Walmart and I am about as poor as a person can get without being totally vagrant.



Have you ever gone to buy a car and ended up hiding in an alley because 30 gang members showed up with guns to rob and kill you? I went to buy weed one time and only lived to tell the tale because I got spooked and got out of sight after the guy went in to supposedly get the weed. Pretty soon two vans pulled up in the alley where I had been moments before and about 30 guys came pouring out and started searching the alley with guns drawn and bitching that they couldn't find me. I've never had something like that happen when buying a car. I've known people who have been shot over weed deals, robbed at gunpoint, and sometimes even by the cops. I don't know anyone who went to buy a car and then had the cops show up right after the deal and take it from them without reporting it, or confiscating it and sending them off to prison. Not once.




I can grow my own corn, my own tomatoes, and all manner of other foods. Even when I was in a trailer park and barely had a yard I was growing a lot of my own food in containers. I never put any poisons on it. 100% organic practices. I could do the same with my cannabis if its legalized. If its illegal, I face prison, robbery, and all manner of other evils over it. The odd few benefits of keeping it black market simply do not even begin to outweigh the price of keeping it illegal.

2 Van's pulled up and 30 "gang members" jumped out with guns drawn looking for you huh......LMAO.....I died laughing at this. Thanks for making my day

OP

 

[green404]

Just two days ago, I heard a local story of a 75 year old woman in Nor Cal, having code enforcement kill her 5 plants, and fine her 10k dollars...... There is no argument for that. That is not legalization, not even close.

Code Enforcement, people get code enforcement for play sets, untrimmed bushes, campers. If that defines legalization for you then anything can be illegal.

Code enforcement infraction and fine is much different then felony imprisonment,

If it was really legal, like tomatoes and corn everyone would be celebrating, it should be a human right to grow a medicinal plant.

I agree it should be a human right to grow a medicinal plant and it is turning that that way state by state country by country. Legalization is here.

If someone grows tomatoes and corn they do not have the right to go sell them in a store. They need to get the product approved just like cannabis or any other agricultural product sold for human consumption. They can grow them for personal consumption just like cannabis in many states.

 

[MedResearcher]

Cannabis can be processed and cured long term as well. In one of the old hashish books, it stated that in Afghanistan they wouldn't sell the hash until it had cured for two years.


The current market trend is for really fresh product, which is great for the producers. Eventually long term curing will have a place within the market, like cigars. Think the average consumer is just a little Green to the product and industry.


I have seen the most expensive seeds and oil in my entire life in the last two years. Over twenty five years ago I could get a pound of low grade canna for around 250 dollars, cheap product is not a new thing it just comes from a different source.

Mr^^