Vote NO to legalize cannabis....Or else

[monsoon]

It's sad to watch someone who is so restricted they can't even grow a veggie garden railing against a system that allows other stoners to grow and possess this plant without fear in our homes.

 

[JointOperation]

I never expected perfection to be there right at the beginning of legalization. I expected all sorts of stupidity that would need rectified. Kind of like the first generation of new technology. It gets better over time. Knowing the greed of the government, I expected it to be over taxed. But..... I also expect all the negatives to come out in the wash. I must say, it didn't start out as bad as I expected.
- When you want changes & improvments, petition for it! Bring it to your legislators. If a large enough number of people hound them long enough for the same changes, change will eventually happen. Its better to hound them than each other, right? After all, aren't we all on the same team?
- My point is, work for change. We got out foot in the door with legalization. Lets just work to improve what we got instead of kicking each other in the teeth. I'm not from Co, but I say 'we' because Co is the first step for ALL if us here in the US. Still a big shit load of improvements & work to be done. We need team players!

see I think getting the foot in the door is the complete wrong idea.. why should we have to get our foot in the door.. then change everything later? it didn't work with alcohol .. what makes you think it will work with cannabis..

I think this country needs to start doing things the RIGHT WAY FIRST.. instead of having to fix things or change them later....

CHANGE WAS OBAMAS Entire CAMPAIGN and you think that getting it legalized in certain ways is a good idea.. since CHANGE worked SOO WELL..

and look at all the IGNORANT MORONS that think Obama is a GREAT HUMAN BEING..

I personally think hes gay.. and michelle is Michael and and Getting a GAY BLACK PRESIDENT.. was the PLAN FROM DAY 1

 

[budtang]

It's sad to watch someone who is so restricted they can't even grow a veggie garden railing against a system that allows other stoners to grow and possess this plant without fear in our homes.

Are you still the 5th grade? Is this football? Are we having a competition here?

Your system is piece of fucking shit. Get off your lazy fucking asses in CO and WA. Do something about it you irresponsible little children before you do more damage than good.

 

[JointOperation]

I lol'd repeatedly through this thread and for that, I thank you all...

you've managed to mangle constitutional history, and someone even mentioned Paul Revere LMFAO...
Paul Revere was stopped by a British patrol on his way to Concord. He never made it anywhere! They even took his horse...
The actual ride was done by a man named Israel Bissell...



So tell me more about all the things the schoolbooks taught you....

History books are written by the winners of wars...

"Jesus" was the stolen story of Simon was the stolen story of Mithras was the stolen story of Osirus was the stolen story of Horus and older Babylonian gods and more...

example:


View Image

And almost everything you "know" is wrong...

To believe in some libertarian ideal situation is foolishness, because there is not one governmental system that does not run on greed...
CO legislation is the very first step, because CA was too lazy, and did not do the legal footwork to make a nationwide "model" for any real legalization...
There will be compromises along the way, and nobody is gonna get everything they want... sorry to burst the bubble, but you cannot fold your arms like an indignant child, and pout your way into everything you want, all at once. Instead, it will take patience, time, and future legal battles fought long and hard along the way.
There will be negotiations, and compromises... Monsanto will control a major stake because fools will smoke cancerous chemicals as long as you put a starburst sticker on it that says 30% THC...
Nothing will ever be perfect, but I'd rather cry about plant counts than prison racks and chow trays...

your a smart dude obv.. lol..

but this country is full of stupid people.. think about it like this..

YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT.. SMOKE.. DRINK.. AND your environment also..

so when someone says.. I only smoke ORGANIC WEED.. but eats McDonalds 4 days a week.. I laugh..

when someone tells me there Vegan or Vegetarian.. I also laugh.. your body isn't even made to digest that..

and when someone says.. I don't smoke marijuana because its dangerous.. but I drink.. I laugh again.. also like the one.. I don't smoke marijuana.. but hey you wana go out for a CIG? lol..

if people want to know why we don't live as long as we could or everyone wonders why cancer is EVERYWERE?.. its not because the WEED.. its because the thinking PROCESS .. we don't treat OUR BODIES like we TREAT OUR CELLPHONES.. if u drop your cell phone.. u freak out.. but u put poison in ur system every day because a DR. says its ok.. and we don't ask questions?

at the DR.. most people don't ask nearly enough questions..

but when you get the new IPhone.. u go RESEARCH THE FUCK out of every fuckin aspect and app ..

our body is a MACHINE.. and without proper maintenance how can anyone think you can stay healthy..? like a engine with Dirty OIL.. its not as effiecient.. and not as healthy as it could be running...

but instead.. we care more about our laptops . cellphones.. and other stupid materialistic BULLSHIT.. instead of the 1 thing that actually keeps us alive.. and moving.. lol

its ASS BACKWARDS if you ASK ME

 

[Jhhnn]

Let's see how great Colorado's/Washington's model is for a minute:

1. Grow for retail out of your home: Go to jail

2. Breed out of your home with more than 6 plants: Go to jail

3. Sell seeds produced in your home: Go to jail

4. Evade taxes by not claiming the weed/seeds you sell because the regulations won't allow you to do that: Go to jail

What legalization of cannabis were you proponents referring to, exactly? Oh, you mean the legalization model that is designed to benefit "Joe Smoker?" When "Joe Smoker" was NEVER in a position to do serious jail time for purchasing a sack of weed under any model of prohibition. "Joe Smoker" wasn't having his fucking life ruined from prohibition. Growers/distributors were the people suffering from prohibition the most. Not "Joe Smoker" who gets a little possession charge for a sack of weed. Under Colorado's and Washington's legalization model you people have effectively done NOTHING to help out the people who stand to face serious legal charges for weed related crimes and have effectively done NOTHING to help people who have had their lives ruined because of prohibition.

You guys are setting a trend in Colorado/Washington where the biggest problems (legal consequences people face) with prohibition aren't even remotely getting solved. Those problems are getting written into law!!! The biggest problem with prohibition wasn't cops arresting people for minor possession charges, or terminal patients not getting a substance that could make them feel a little better before they die. That was a miniscule part of the problem. Which, is the ONLY problem your models fix. The biggest problem with prohibition was 99 year prison sentences being handed down to a guy with a house full of plants. A person who receives that kind of a prison sentence is effectively having their life taken away from them. It's the same as murder as far as I'm concerned. The amount of suffering that person experiences while they rot away in prison for the rest of their lives is FAR GREATER than a cancer patient who has to deal with pain for a few years before they die.

Growers will still do prison time under Colorado's and Washington's legalization models. The biggest problems caused by prohibition will continue as a result, and that's a disgusting fact that Colorado/Washington proponents should be ashamed of, but like little children their more concerned with the mantra of "MY TEAM IS BETTER THAN YOURS."

I just don't see what good these legalization models do when they allow for the biggest problems caused by prohibition to not only persist, but get written in stone and cemented for future generations to adopt.

Problems with prohibition summarized:

Terminal patient= few years of suffering

Joe Smoker= a minor inconvenient possession charge

Grower/distributor= FUCKED FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Give me a call when you guys actually legalize weed and solve the biggest problems caused by prohibition. Until then...stop sticking feathers up your butts and calling yourselves chickens.

And we return to the notion that it's all about You, that your narrow commercial interest is all that matters, that all legalization efforts must be tailored to that.

Why is it that you should be the center of everybody else's universe? What's in it for the ROTW whose interests are somewhat different?

What is it that you do for us that's so fucking wonderful? Why should Californians in general care about your little gravy train?

Sooner or later, we all need to get over ourselves. Your turn.

 

[budtang]

And we return to the notion that it's all about You, that your narrow commercial interest is all that matters, that all legalization efforts must be tailored to that.

No, it's not. What is good for growers like me, who actually face serious charges unlike the beneficiaries of your system, is good for "Joe Smoker." What's bad for growers like me is bad for "Joe Smoker."

It's about the art of cannabis horticulture and how your system effectively destroys a process that is responsible for making cannabis the diverse genetic substance that it is today. Most strains wouldn't even exist if growers followed your system. Your forming a system that makes what people are doing on this forum illegal, dumbfuck.

You're putting all of our lives at risk. Thank you for that Jhhhnnnn. We appreciate your incompetence.

Why is it that you should be the center of everybody else's universe? What's in it for the ROTW whose interests are somewhat different?

What is it that you do for us that's so fucking wonderful? Why should Californians in general care about your little gravy train?

Sooner or later, we all need to get over ourselves. Your turn.

It's about keeping lives from getting destroyed you braindead fucking moron. Not greed. How many times do we have to explain this to you fucking idiots?

People are going to grow for retail out of their home whether it's legal, or not. You might as well take steps to keep those people out of prison. You're doing absolutely nothing to help out with that problem. I don't give a damn about making money. I care about staying out of prison you fucking idiot. Making money to pay bills is always going to be second to that. Dozens of breeders who have done more for cannabis then you could ever dream of feel the same way. You're just pissing all over the careers of well respected growers and breeders and labeling their work as nothing more than "greed." Why don't you go fuck yourself, Jhhhnnnn? Take your little pussy ass 6 plant set up and shove it up your ass. I can see why you don't care about residential operations. It's because you're a shitty grower who only grows 6 plants at a time in a fucking closet and has no serious interest in cannabis horticulture. Nor do you have any serious knowledge on it. You're just a hobby grower.

Thousands of serious growers on this forum are breaking your laws and are criminals according to your system of legalization. What justification do you have for that? Are you proud of the fact that you've turned thousands of growers into criminals according to your system? Are you proud of the fact that millions of residential growers who are responsible for making cannabis the dynamic desired product it is today are being turned into criminals by your system? Why are you a member of forum that is occupied primarily by growers who break your laws? You clearly don't support what this forum is about at all. Hell, forums like this will be targeted for termination under Colorado's legalization model. After all, we're all here breaking the laws of that system.

Thank you for turning the cannabis breeding community into criminals Colorado and Washington. We appreciate everything you do for this forum, it's members, and for cannabis as a whole. Thank you for making what we are doing here on this forum ILLEGAL. We appreciate that Jhhhnnnnn. Thanks. Thank you for making all the time, sacrifice, and work that breeders have done over the years to expand the cannabis gene pool an illegal act. You're really doing a lot to help out the cannabis community.

But, hey. At least those fucking yuppies buying a sack won't have legal problems. Right, jhhhnnn?



: )

 

[Seaf0ur]

You're getting rather abusive... If you cannot defend a logical position with facts and instead insist on reverting to schoolyard taunts and bullying there is no point for debate. You continue to complain about the plights of the "serious grower"... whilst sounding like a spoiled child. Jhhnn has no more personal control over the Colorado lawmaking process than YOU did over California's GMO labeling laws... Why didn't you make them label it budtang? You have singlehandedly poisoned all of us! And why haven't you fixed the front yard garden issue yet?

 

[budtang]

You're getting rather abusive... If you cannot defend a logical position with facts and instead insist on reverting to schoolyard taunts and bullying there is no point for debate. You continue to complain about the plights of the "serious grower"... whilst sounding like a spoiled child. Jhhnn has no more personal control over the Colorado lawmaking process than YOU did over California's GMO labeling laws... Why didn't you make them label it budtang? You have singlehandedly poisoned all of us! And why haven't you fixed the front yard garden issue yet?

Sorry.

I get hostile against corrupt laws that demonize and destroy the art of cannabis horticulture and people's lives in the process. I give people who defend such actions precisely the level of respect they deserve.

You guys should go over to the vendor section of the forum and inform them all that there is no place for their small scale residential operations to exist in the coming "legal" cannabis system. Thanks for that Colorado. You're doing a lot to preserve the traditions of the cannabis horticulture community. We appreciate eeeeeeeeeverthing you guys do for us. lmao!

Bye Bye OGRaskal

Bye Bye BOG

Bye Bye ICMAG

Take a fucking hike guys. Get out of the USA. The residents of Washington and Colorado don't want you here. You guys are all greedy criminals according to our wonderful little system here in Colorado and Washington that is supported, ironically, by ICMAG members like Jhhhnnnn. You're welcome. The work you did to expand the genetic database of cannabis on a grassroots level out of your residential homes is now ILLEGAL according to our "legal" cannabis model. That process will never be allowed to take place again on that kind of a grassroots level. Please leave the country, or else you will face legal consequences for your actions.

It's hilarious how these guys label well respected growers and breeders at ICMAG "greedy assholes." That's what he's doing every single time he tries to pin that label on someone like me.

 

[Seaf0ur]

but you speak as if we have complete control over the process... and again I will point with the same fervor to Californias GMO labeling... By your assumption of complete control, in the same breath you accuse coloradoans of ruining legalization, you must also take complete credit for GMO's not having labels.... and in that thought, perhaps you can see where we are doing the best we can.
Make no mistake, legalization would never have even been a thought (on the governmental level) if the likes of george soros hadn't thrown down big cash, and monsanto had GMO'd cannabis long before now.
We arent legalizing it... THEY are... we are simply doing the best we can to steer the ship that has ALREADY been commandeered by big business...

 

[budtang]

but you speak as if we have complete control over the process... and again I will point with the same fervor to Californias GMO labeling... By your assumption of complete control, in the same breath you accuse coloradoans of ruining legalization, you must also take complete credit for GMO's not having labels.... and in that thought, perhaps you can see where we are doing the best we can.
Make no mistake, legalization would never have even been a thought (on the governmental level) if the likes of george soros hadn't thrown down big cash, and monsanto had GMO'd cannabis long before now.
We arent legalizing it... THEY are... we are simply doing the best we can to steer the ship that has ALREADY been commandeered by big business...

It's ALL FUCKED. Fix it. I'm not defending Cali at all. We're not talking about Cali. We're talking about the states that are on the forefront of full legalization on a recreational level and the problems that exist there. That's where the Federal Government is focusing their "experiment" on. That's where the entire country is focusing.

If you set fucking trends that open the door for corruption they will be adopted by other states. This is an urgent issue that needs to get dealt wealth quickly. Not ignored and applauded. He may not control the Government in Colorado, but he should at least have enough common sense to shut his fucking mouth and stop speaking in defense of it. You all should stop. He sure as hell shouldn't be labeling guys like me greedy assholes when this forum only exist because of guys like me who got their start in the industry on a grassroots level operating out of their homes.

 

[Seaf0ur]

No you're expecting US to somehow obtain complete control of the legalization process, fix everything the way YOU want it specifically without you raising a finger aside from whining into a keyboard

 

[budtang]

No you're expecting US to somehow obtain complete control of the legalization process, fix everything the way YOU want it specifically without you raising a finger aside from whining into a keyboard

Oh, really? I haven't spoken with attorneys about filing lawsuits?

Okay, guy.

 

[Seaf0ur]

I spoke to my momma about being a multi-billionaire... talkin bout it aint made it happen for me either... where was your big time lawyer for the GMO labeling? I been out here, with my kid on my shoulders, talking to the politicians... wherein lie the problem...

You know nothing of the situation. You know nothing of the current legal battles being fought against such things as the city council of golden imposing plant counts even more restrictive that what you're crying about. Its hell just maintaining the right to grow at all. I suggest you actually do something... like write a check to that lawyer instead of just giving him words... feel free to join in the fight at any time. Why did your state not do the legal work for "proper" legalization? you had ample opportunity... was it sheer laziness? I know you're not fond of talking about where you and your state failed... you're much happier pointing fingers.

 

[Seaf0ur]

oh thats right.... you are doing your part by whinnying around in this thread as if you knew what was going on here in colorado and what battles we actually face here right now... I have more than one friend who has already paid their lawyers to fight these battles... your check is late... until you actually get a lawyer in the fight, you're just bloviating.

 

[budtang]

I spoke to my momma about being a multi-billionaire... talkin bout it aint made it happen for me either... where was your big time lawyer for the GMO labeling?

I don't live in Colorado, or Cali.

Cali doesn't restrict residential grow operations. So, there would be no reason for me to sue them.

I spoke with real estate attorneys who were experts on cannabis zoning regulations in Colorado. Most of the lawyers I spoke with regarding the details of the legal system in Colorado stopped replying to my emails when they heard the words "class action lawsuit." They were afraid to go on record with any kind of advice after the possibility of a lawsuit getting filed was brought up. Mind you, I wasn't asking them to file one, or represent me. I was merely asking what their opinion was of the regulations that ban residential grow operations and obtaining the legal justification for doing so directly from an expert in the field. Not some random stoner on a internet forum.

Eventually, I brought up the possibility of class action lawsuits being filed against the state of Colorado by residential growers who want to pay taxes and heard the sound of crickets in return. They could see that it was more than a possibility. It's an inevitability and they didn't want their statements on record when it happens. They could see that there was credibility to a lawsuit like that and being the smart lawyers they are they immediately stopped discussing the issue with me. These were mainly realastate lawyers who were experts on the zoning legal issues surrounding the cannabis industry. That's why I was asking them about the details of the regulations. It was pretty funny to see how defensive these Colorado attorneys were of the system there when I tried to criticize it. Their demeanor and rhetoric was much like that of Colorado residents here. Denial and ignorance.

As I said, these were real estate attorneys, who make commissions on sales/legal deals of warehouse space for growing that would probably never be sold if residential grow operations were approved for retail. These people are clearly making money from these regulations. They have new found careers as "Cannabis Real Estate Attorneys." A position that wouldn't exist if residential grow operations were allowed to exist. It starts to become a lot more clear why people in the legal system in Colorado support these regulations after you go talk with them directly about it.

They're banking off them and that's why. It's largely a real estate scam, imo. They're using the legal system to force people to buy commercial property that would remain vacant forever, otherwise.

 

[Seaf0ur]

well, thats what people who want everything right now do not understand.... these legal battles will require fighting... attacking plant counts are certainly on the agenda... especially the constitutionality of a multi occupant situation in regard to household plant counts... which basically remove the constitutional right of any adults exceeding the number of 2... water usage... land rights... colorado... california... it means shit unless we can get the federal classification of cannabis removed from the list of schedule I drugs....

that's the real meat and potatoes

 

[armedoldhippy]

"you must spread the rep around before giving it to Seafour again" well, fuck...sorry, Seafour.

 

[Seaf0ur]

cant like your post because I "may not vote on any more threads today." LOL

 

[SirStynkalot]

NONE of congress would vote for it, that's for sure. It's missing their slice of the pie.

They're going to want heavy bribes to allow big tobacco to take over. Cmon, we all know it's coming.

 

[hurdy gurdy man]

NONE of congress would vote for it, that's for sure. It's missing their slice of the pie.

They're going to want heavy bribes to allow big tobacco to take over. Cmon, we all know it's coming.

I think it will be like the beer industry. Some people chose to brew their own, but most prefer to go to the store and pick up a 12 pack. It will be market driven, and if the cost is too high, people will grow their own, without the stigma that a home grower has in the prohibition based market of today.