Vote NO to legalize cannabis....Or else

[kmk420kali]

What?

Is there a point to that?? Because I don't get it--

 

[Jhhnn]

I think more towns will come to their senses over time, monsoon. It's a lot like the end of alcohol prohibition. Lots of places chose to stay "dry" at first but few persisted for long. Some still do.

We need retail pot in some form or another for use to be completely legitimate & adult access universal. It kills the hypocrisy, sets users on an equal legal footing with everybody else. Tax revenues don't need to be what they were fluffed up to be at all for retail to exist- we won't be going back because the State doesn't make as much from it as they'd like.

In certain respects, the high price of entry into retail pot growing inhibits people from making what looks like a bad mistake to me. A64 demands that the State issue licenses to anybody who meets a rather low set of qualifications. People will take out a loan against the house, sell the farm, pour their savings into a grow op, quit their job to hitch a ride on a star. We can easily end up with way more pot than can be sold, crashing prices, creating a lot of misery & broken dreams. That's gonna happen anyway, so I'd rather it happen to people who can afford to lose, people who have more money than brains in the first place.

I think that the place for the little guy in all this (not really really little guys) is in operating a retail outlet much like a mom & pop liquor store. In that, it's all about location & tailoring inventory to the customers. They'll get the same kind of service & support as small liquor stores- delivery, stock rotation, 30 day billing, all of that. It wouldn't take much capital at all to do that. Dunno that it's currently possible, but their customer base could be expanded by selling snacks, soda, etc.

We're going to see whole new ways of packaging & marketing MJ products, particularly brand name products that will be available state wide. I think the whole dispensary way of marketing pot the same way as fresh produce will fade rather quickly. People who try & really like "Pete's Party Panama" will learn that all the ritualization is unnecessary if Pete can deliver the same thing purchase after purchase at any outlet in the State. Not everybody is a connoisseur nor are they even interested. Think Budweiser. And that's OK by me, so long as I can get the good stuff if I want it. Or just grow it myself.

 

[Sforza]

"The attempt to regulate, control, and prescribe all manner of conduct and social relations is very old. It was always the practice of primitive peoples." -Calvin Coolidge

California makes those primitive peoples look like slackers when it comes to regulating , controlling, and prescribing everything under the Sun. Nice place to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there, despite the beautiful scenery and lovely weather.

 

[Sforza]

"You can't even grow fuckin' tomatoes in your yard! LOFL.

Try cutting down a tree in your yard in California. Not only do you need a permit, if anyone objects, you have to have a hearing about it.

Never found such a place where everyone is so interested in what everyone else is doing or not doing and thinks that it his or her business to get all up in everyone else's business.

 

[armedoldhippy]

Try cutting down a tree in your yard in California. Not only do you need a permit, if anyone objects, you have to have a hearing about it.

Never found such a place where everyone is so interested in what everyone else is doing or not doing and thinks that it his or her business to get all up in everyone else's business.

heh, I would cut it and let 'em howl! when faced with an accomplished fact most folks go home, slam the door & sulk like little kids...

 

[SirStynkalot]

And it's still going.

 

[ColoradoOG]

I didnt come back to this thread to continue the way the approach I previously had but I would like to say something.

A few hours ago I lost my mother in law possibly to percscription narcos. This re enforced my goal all along and thats been to help as many people as I can. I know colorados laws are not perfect but we need cannabis to be available to as many people as possible. I hope none of u go through the heartbreak my family went through today. Next time your state brings up legalization I hope you really think about the people this could be impacting by your decision

Positive vibes to all. Love and light my family

 

[ElusiveQuark]

Prayers and good vibes your way Colorado OG.

Jhhnn - I wasn't sure of your angle. At first I pegged you as a contrarian. Now I see you are only worried healthy change could result in fast food being a thing of the past. Just kidding, sort of.

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

And it's still going.

This is the thread that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on my friend
Some people started arguing not knowing who was right
And they'll continue arguing it forever until they legalize


This is the thread that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on my friend
Some people started arguing not knowing who was right
And they'll continue arguing it forever until they legalize


This is the thread that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on my friend
Some people started arguing not knowing who was right
And they'll continue arguing it forever until they legalize

... ... ...

 

[Jhhnn]

Prayers and good vibes your way Colorado OG.

Jhhnn - I wasn't sure of your angle. At first I pegged you as a contrarian. Now I see you are only worried healthy change could result in fast food being a thing of the past. Just kidding, sort of.

Thank you for that, sort of. Oddly enough, inspected & tested retail weed may be a healthier product than a lot of what's currently available. You know how it is- some small growers see themselves as the masters of time & space, also masters of fungicides, insecticides, miticides, bud hardeners & you name it, unfortunately.

What's in the weed you buy today? Nobody knows except the guy who grew it.

 

[Jhhnn]

I didnt come back to this thread to continue the way the approach I previously had but I would like to say something.

A few hours ago I lost my mother in law possibly to percscription narcos. This re enforced my goal all along and thats been to help as many people as I can. I know colorados laws are not perfect but we need cannabis to be available to as many people as possible. I hope none of u go through the heartbreak my family went through today. Next time your state brings up legalization I hope you really think about the people this could be impacting by your decision

Positive vibes to all. Love and light my family

I sympathize with you a great deal. I've arrived at an age where I've lost a lot of people & it's never easy. Watch out for family members blaming themselves for things beyond their control- it's terribly, terribly unhealthy. Do your best to steer them away from it.

The few people where I yearn to piss on their graves seem to last forever, unfortunately.

 

[Seaf0ur]

just remember.. a lot of people want to believe that everything they were told and taught is true..

I lol'd repeatedly through this thread and for that, I thank you all...

you've managed to mangle constitutional history, and someone even mentioned Paul Revere LMFAO...
Paul Revere was stopped by a British patrol on his way to Concord. He never made it anywhere! They even took his horse...
The actual ride was done by a man named Israel Bissell...

Israel Bissell (1752 -– October 24, 1823) was a patriot post rider in Massachusetts who brought news to American colonists of the British attack on April 19, 1775. He reportedly rode for four days and six hours covering the 345 miles from Watertown, Massachusetts to Philadelphia along the Old Post Road, shouting "To arms, to arms, the war has begun," and carrying a message from General Joseph Palmer which was copied at each of his stops and redistributed:

So tell me more about all the things the schoolbooks taught you....

History books are written by the winners of wars...

"Jesus" was the stolen story of Simon was the stolen story of Mithras was the stolen story of Osirus was the stolen story of Horus and older Babylonian gods and more...

example:

Mithras was buried in a tomb from which He rose again from the dead—an event celebrated yearly with much rejoicing.

Every year in Rome, in the middle of winter, the Son of God was born one more, putting an end to darkness. Every year at first minute of December 25th the temple of Mithras was lit with candles, priests in in white garments celebrated the birth of the Son of God and boys burned incense.

Mithras was born in a cave, on December 25th, of a virgin mother.

He came from heaven to be born as a man, to redeem men from their sin. He was know as "Savior," "Son of God," "Redeemer," and "Lamb of God."

His followers kept the Sabbath holy, eating sacramental meals in remembrance of Him. The sacred meal of bread and water, or bread and wine, was symbolic of the body and blood of the sacred bull.

Baptism in the blood of the bull (taurobolium)—early
Baptism "washed in the blood of the Lamb"—late
Baptism by water [recorded by the Christian author Tertullian]

Mithraic rituals brought about the transformation and Salvation of His adherents—an ascent of the soul of the adherent into the realm of the divine. From the wall of a Mithraic temple in Rome: "And thou hast saved us by shedding the eternal blood."

The great Mithraic festivals celebrated His birth (at the winter solstice) and His death and resurrection (at the spring solstice)

And almost everything you "know" is wrong...

To believe in some libertarian ideal situation is foolishness, because there is not one governmental system that does not run on greed...
CO legislation is the very first step, because CA was too lazy, and did not do the legal footwork to make a nationwide "model" for any real legalization...
There will be compromises along the way, and nobody is gonna get everything they want... sorry to burst the bubble, but you cannot fold your arms like an indignant child, and pout your way into everything you want, all at once. Instead, it will take patience, time, and future legal battles fought long and hard along the way.
There will be negotiations, and compromises... Monsanto will control a major stake because fools will smoke cancerous chemicals as long as you put a starburst sticker on it that says 30% THC...
Nothing will ever be perfect, but I'd rather cry about plant counts than prison racks and chow trays...

 

[budtang]

This is the thread that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on my friend
Some people started arguing not knowing who was right
And they'll continue arguing it forever until they legalize


This is the thread that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on my friend
Some people started arguing not knowing who was right
And they'll continue arguing it forever until they legalize


This is the thread that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on my friend
Some people started arguing not knowing who was right
And they'll continue arguing it forever until they legalize

... ... ...

Let's see how great Colorado's/Washington's model is for a minute:

1. Grow for retail out of your home: Go to jail

2. Breed out of your home with more than 6 plants: Go to jail

3. Sell seeds produced in your home: Go to jail

4. Evade taxes by not claiming the weed/seeds you sell because the regulations won't allow you to do that: Go to jail

What legalization of cannabis were you proponents referring to, exactly? Oh, you mean the legalization model that is designed to benefit "Joe Smoker?" When "Joe Smoker" was NEVER in a position to do serious jail time for purchasing a sack of weed under any model of prohibition. "Joe Smoker" wasn't having his fucking life ruined from prohibition. Growers/distributors were the people suffering from prohibition the most. Not "Joe Smoker" who gets a little possession charge for a sack of weed. Under Colorado's and Washington's legalization model you people have effectively done NOTHING to help out the people who stand to face serious legal charges for weed related crimes and have effectively done NOTHING to help people who have had their lives ruined because of prohibition.

You guys are setting a trend in Colorado/Washington where the biggest problems (legal consequences people face) with prohibition aren't even remotely getting solved. Those problems are getting written into law!!! The biggest problem with prohibition wasn't cops arresting people for minor possession charges, or terminal patients not getting a substance that could make them feel a little better before they die. That was a miniscule part of the problem. Which, is the ONLY problem your models fix. The biggest problem with prohibition was 99 year prison sentences being handed down to a guy with a house full of plants. A person who receives that kind of a prison sentence is effectively having their life taken away from them. It's the same as murder as far as I'm concerned. The amount of suffering that person experiences while they rot away in prison for the rest of their lives is FAR GREATER than a cancer patient who has to deal with pain for a few years before they die.

Growers will still do prison time under Colorado's and Washington's legalization models. The biggest problems caused by prohibition will continue as a result, and that's a disgusting fact that Colorado/Washington proponents should be ashamed of, but like little children their more concerned with the mantra of "MY TEAM IS BETTER THAN YOURS."

I just don't see what good these legalization models do when they allow for the biggest problems caused by prohibition to not only persist, but get written in stone and cemented for future generations to adopt.

Problems with prohibition summarized:

Terminal patient= few years of suffering

Joe Smoker= a minor inconvenient possession charge

Grower/distributor= FUCKED FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Give me a call when you guys actually legalize weed and solve the biggest problems caused by prohibition. Until then...stop sticking feathers up your butts and calling yourselves chickens.

 

[Seaf0ur]

Oh, you mean the legalization model that is designed to benefit "Joe Smoker?" When "Joe Smoker" was NEVER in a position to do serious jail time for purchasing a sack of weed under any model of prohibition. "Joe Smoker" wasn't having his fucking life ruined from prohibition.

.,..until he found out about 3 strike laws and "mandatory minimums"

The biggest problem with prohibition was 99 year prison sentences being handed down to a guy with a house full of plants.

oh... and thats just one of the mandatory minimums i referred to...

 

[budtang]

.,..until he found out about 3 strike laws and "mandatory minimums"

You're full of shit. Nobody has had 3 strikes send them to prison over a sack of personal smoke. Get the fuck out of here. The average "Joe Smoker" gets caught with tiny amounts of weed. Not "99 plants."

 

[Seaf0ur]

lrn2google

The Three Strikes Law and Drugs - The Hills Treatment Center

According to the California Department of Corrections, there were 5,887 persons serving "Three Strikes" sentences at the end of 2010. More than 19% of them had been sentenced for drug crimes, including 32 people sentenced to life for marijuana violations.

With two strikes in place, the "Three Strikes" law makes a life term in prison possible for offenders who are charged with so much as stealing a lollipop. Past precedents have shown third-strike offenders to be prescribed with prison time for offenses such as accepting stolen ArmorAll cans, stealing spare tires, or taking unattended bicycles from garages. The "Three Strikes" law punishes crimes of burglary harshly, but it also unfairly punishes those who suffer from the disease of addiction and are convicted of drug-related crimes. These individuals need medical help in being educated and rehabilitated, not prison sentences. Despite the inhumanity of the "Three Strikes" law, which is commonly aimed at drug offenders or people with histories of substance abuse, a growing opposition has so far been unsuccessful in amending the laws.

 

[Seaf0ur]

`3 Strikes' Law Mainly Nets Marijuana Users - Chicago Tribune

Two years after California's tough "three strikes and you're out" law went into effect, twice as many defendants have been imprisoned under the law for marijuana possession as for murder, rape and kidnapping combined

After 20 Years in Prison, Missouri Man Serving Life Without Parole for Marijuana Asks Governor for Clemency

America's Shameful Prohibition: Life Sentences For Marijuana

Shall we revisit who is full of shit?

 

[professor p]

How do you folks feel about Oregon's legalization initiative with the OLCC (Oregon liquor commission) being in control?
Their board of directors was caught drunk driving and they have any other hypocritical situations that have taken place... Kinda like a legal mafia

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

Let's see how great Colorado's/Washington's model is for a minute:

1. Grow for retail out of your home: Go to jail

2. Breed out of your home with more than 6 plants: Go to jail

3. Sell seeds produced in your home: Go to jail

4. Evade taxes by not claiming the weed/seeds you sell because the regulations won't allow you to do that: Go to jail

What legalization of cannabis were you proponents referring to, exactly? Oh, you mean the legalization model that is designed to benefit "Joe Smoker?" When "Joe Smoker" was NEVER in a position to do serious jail time for purchasing a sack of weed under any model of prohibition. "Joe Smoker" wasn't having his fucking life ruined from prohibition. Growers/distributors were the people suffering from prohibition the most. Not "Joe Smoker" who gets a little possession charge for a sack of weed. Under Colorado's and Washington's legalization model you people have effectively done NOTHING to help out the people who stand to face serious legal charges for weed related crimes and have effectively done NOTHING to help people who have had their lives ruined because of prohibition.

You guys are setting a trend in Colorado/Washington where the biggest problems (legal consequences people face) with prohibition aren't even remotely getting solved. Those problems are getting written into law!!! The biggest problem with prohibition wasn't cops arresting people for minor possession charges, or terminal patients not getting a substance that could make them feel a little better before they die. That was a miniscule part of the problem. Which, is the ONLY problem your models fix. The biggest problem with prohibition was 99 year prison sentences being handed down to a guy with a house full of plants. A person who receives that kind of a prison sentence is effectively having their life taken away from them. It's the same as murder as far as I'm concerned. The amount of suffering that person experiences while they rot away in prison for the rest of their lives is FAR GREATER than a cancer patient who has to deal with pain for a few years before they die.

Growers will still do prison time under Colorado's and Washington's legalization models. The biggest problems caused by prohibition will continue as a result, and that's a disgusting fact that Colorado/Washington proponents should be ashamed of, but like little children their more concerned with the mantra of "MY TEAM IS BETTER THAN YOURS."

I just don't see what good these legalization models do when they allow for the biggest problems caused by prohibition to not only persist, but get written in stone and cemented for future generations to adopt.

Problems with prohibition summarized:

Terminal patient= few years of suffering

Joe Smoker= a minor inconvenient possession charge

Grower/distributor= FUCKED FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Give me a call when you guys actually legalize weed and solve the biggest problems caused by prohibition. Until then...stop sticking feathers up your butts and calling yourselves chickens.

To be honest I don't have the patience to argue at all. I was just posting my rendition of "the song that never ends", because this thread seems to never end, and yet everyone's minds are already made up. I leave any arguing up to you guys. Have at it.

 

[ElusiveQuark]

Here is a quick draft of legislation that I could get excited about.

Except for imposition of a sales tax not to exceed 20%, Congress shall make no law regarding the cultivation, possession or consumption of cannabis or cannabis seeds with respect to persons of majority age.

* no additional fees may be assessed on the basis of cannabis related business.

You would have a free market w/o govt intervention, allowing for consumers and sellers to set standards. Is there anyone that would not vote for this? Does the will of the people count or not?