Vote NO to legalize cannabis....Or else

[shaggyballs]

Anyway back on topic.

Alaska

Although there is strong support to vote for the legalization of recreational marijuana in the Last Frontier state this November, there also exists strong opposition. Big Marijuana Big Mistake, otherwise known as Vote No. on 2, is a grassroots coalition dedicated to keeping marijuana illegal in Alaska. The coalition argues that the ballot measure would industrialize and commercialize not only marijuana, but also concentrates and edibles, which are more potent and have caused deaths in Colorado. In addition to health consequences, Big Marijuana Big Mistake is concerned that recreational marijuana would be heavily commercialized by giant, out-of-state corporations that would change the landscape of local communities with mass marketing, advertising and storefront properties. It would not be individual farmers and business entrepreneurs who would reap the rewards of recreational marijuana legalization, but these corporate entities. Meanwhile, the task force assigned to regulation of recreational marijuana would actually cost the state more than the current law enforcement.

Problems in alaska

 

[shaggyballs]

just remember.. a lot of people want to believe that everything they were told and taught is true.. and the government isn't just watching us.. but watching out for our well being.. which is just BULLSHIT.. the government only helps the rich.. fucks the poor... and snuffed out the middle class.....

u think there ever going to pass laws that actually HELP THE PEOPLE.?? nope.. just big corporations and big pharma.. and the paper industry and the clothing industry.. its not going to change .. its going to get more retarded.. like alcohol. when they say something is legal.. BUT.... that's the ball and chain aspect.. if we give u the right to smoke it and use it.. we take away the right to grow it.. why? because.. if everyone grows there own .. and smokes there own.. then no1 makes money off of it !!!..

but what they don't get is.. if people grow there own and smoke there own.. then those people will be able to spend the money they were spending on marijuana.. could be put into a different part of the economy.. and help the economy.. but instead.. they want to fuck u in every hole u have.. and then take it out of your ass and put it in your mouth.. its disrespectful . and a disgrace.. to a country that is supposed to be about the PEOPLE. not the GOVERNMENT.

By the people and for the people...how can that ever be wrong?

 

[shaggyballs]

It is hard to believe it is so difficult to convince Americans that FREEDOM is a good thing!

I like this so I stole it from ElusiveQuark

I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

Worth repeating

 

[shaggyballs]

What is the real tragedy is:
People who believe the government needs the vote of the people to do what it wants....Now that makes me LOL

Do you really believe the government needs your vote to do what they want.....I will try not to resort to poor debate tactics like personal attacks as they are not helpful and are child like!

Much like an election this thread has turned into a mudslinging contest!

Only the foolhardy think this will be productive.

If we stand against the most powerful force in the world together we will prevail!!

If we continue to remain divided and make things into a personal issue of mudslinging we will undoubtedly fail!

Tell me what do you think is a more viable solution to the problem?

Ok those who can not contribute to a healthy debate, may now resume the personal attacks!!

Thank you and have a nice day!

 

[shaggyballs]

I haven't heard anyone that is not in favor of legalization. I also am not aware of any place that currently has or proposes legalization.

well said

 

[shaggyballs]

Nope. The only reason any states want to legalize is because they want to make money off it, once they're done taxing and regulating the majority of the profit into their hands, and demand drops, the state is going to end up, in the long run, with way less tax dollars than it was expecting, thus making it a failure financially. Take Oregon for example, if their bill passes it calls for a 35 dollar per ounce 'privilege tax' to be paid by the producer. That's 560 dollars per pound tax just for having the privilege to do business, those are the exact words from the bill. Well, good luck with that, by then California outdoor black market will be at 50$ per oz you all can keep anything that costs more than that. Some businesses in certain states will turn a small profit if the market supports people with no friends can go buy weed from the store, but the majority will not pay the extra price that will come with a taxed regulated product thus the black market will continue to thrive. GOod luck trying to sell an ounce for 100 bucks come 2017, even at 100 bucks a lb you'll be making money in Cali.

Too much tax!

 

[shaggyballs]

This is the same situation in CA. We voted to amend the Constitution by popular vote via prop 215. The senate then "restricted" the amendment without voter approval, via SB 420.

SB 420 places a restriction on plant counts and quantities you may posess. These restrictions are now null and void and a medical patient is allowed to cultivate and posess, "as much as is necessary for their medical condition" as defined in Prop 215.

The senate restricted the amendment?
They can't do that can they???

 

[shaggyballs]

I am seeing the same tired arguments we seen with Prop 19 here in Cali-- "They don't let us grow enough!!"
But, most Voter Initiatives start at the bottom, as it is easy to Amend as long as you are not hindering or restricting-- In other words, Legislators can raise the plant count, but they cannot lower it without another vote--

What?

 

[shaggyballs]

Does anyone here believe the state constitution supersedes the US criminal code?

Well does anyone?

I wish you all good luck in your legalization battle!(I truly mean that)
It will be a long bumpy road.
Freedom and equal right for all!
Shag

 

[budtang]

Well these pot laws....meant ONLY to control the population (LOL, good one)

That's the ONLY reason that law exist. I've spoken with attorneys in Colorado who actually know what they're talking about. Not random stoners like you on internet forums who believe they're experts merely because they smoke bowls within the boundaries of Colorado state lines. That's what THEY told me. If everyone could grow weed out of their homes for retail millions of people would swarm to Colorado and the state would suffer in more ways than one. That's why the law exist. Legislatures foresaw that problem and took steps to try to deal with it.

You really have no clue what you're talking about, or why the laws you have in Colorado exist. The Colorado regulation system is based on Casino gaming regulations. Are you aware of this? That's why you can't have a commercial grow operation in your home. The same way you can't run a Casino out of your home. That's how stupid Colorado's legalization model and that's why it needs to be reformed. The Casino industry is entirely different than the Cannabis industry. The Cannabis industry needs an independent set of regulations that is completely separate from the Casino gaming, alcohol, and tobacco industries.

Washington and Colorado are a joke and anyone who fails to acknowledge is a naive, gullible, and irresponsible little child.

didn't do a very good job of "controlling population" then...did it, Mr List Cop?
LOFL.

That's precisely what I said 10 pages ago, guy.

The law has failed to motivate people not to move to your state and, as a direct result, your state is now losing millions of dollars in lost tax revenue because there is a huge black market for residential growers that isn't being taxed. Millions of people are swarming there regardless of the fact that they can't grow for retail out of their homes. The laws targeted residential growers, but residential growers only constitute a very small percentage of weed smokers. Even if you could motivate every grower to stay away from the state you wouldn't do anything to motivate millions of weed smokers from relocating to that state. That's why it's a pointless law and a feeble attempt to control the situation. One that will end up costing the state a lot of money in lost tax revenue, unnecessary law enforcement, and damage to the environment.

You saw a few UHauls leaving town, huh? I guess that means you're on top of all 5 million residents of Colorado and their experiences in the industry. Statements like that are the reason internet forums are such shitty places to get information from. They're full of people like you quick to spread horrible information at every turn. lulz

"I saw a UHaul leaving. I know what I'm talking about." Seriously, guy?

 

[LSWM]

The senate restricted the amendment?
They can't do that can they???

Exactly. This was appealed and taken to the Supreme Court of CA. They decided that the Senate had overstepped and restricted a voter approved amendment. The limits set forth in SB 420, are now null and void and the only limitation is what is in Prop 215 which states, "as much as is necessary for your medical condition."

 

[budtang]

- When you want changes & improvments, petition for it! Bring it to your legislators. If a large enough number of people hound them long enough for the same changes, change will eventually happen.

Petitions? I was thinking more along the lines of class action lawsuits to end these illegal business practices restricting small business owners from participating in the free market.

Its better to hound them than each other, right?


After all, aren't we all on the same team?

No, we're not on the same team.

Some of us are fighting for the freedom to participate in the free market and others (Jhhhnn, monsoon, etc. ) are trying to defend corporate corruption and their hijacking of the cannabis industry before it ever gets off the ground. It's more than just the right to grow for retail. Under their model you can't breed, make your own crosses, and expand the genetic diversity of cannabis as a whole. That's one of the most significant aspects of cannabis horticulture. Any serious grower wants the ability to breed. All of that will be approved only for a small niche of wealthy players. It's scary to think about what can happen under Colorado's and Washington's legalization models. Phillip Morris is licking their lips getting ready to rape this industry because of their stupid fucking regulations. You know how many well respected breeders operate out of their homes? They would have to pack up and move out of the country if Colorado's model is adopted on a nationwide scale. You call that legal?

It would be nice if these guys would at least acknowledge what a joke their system has become, but you can't even get that out of them. It's all just,"Whatever. It's better than Oklahoma. Shut up and stop complaining."

 

[LSWM]

So you've shifted the goalposts from "no psychoactive effect" to "very limited psychoactive effect" (nudge-nudge, wink-wink, Know what I mean? Know what I mean?

Still waiting to hear a legitimate response and not some quick dismissal as if everything I wrote was fantasy. It certainly wasn't.

 

[bentom187]

No, we're not on the same team.

Some of us are fighting for the freedom to participate in the free market and others (Jhhhnn, monsoon, etc. ) are trying to defend corporate corruption and their hijacking of the cannabis industry before it ever gets off the ground. It's more than just the right to grow for retail. Under their model you can't breed, make your own crosses, and expand the genetic diversity of cannabis as a whole. That's one of the most significant aspects of cannabis horticulture. Any serious grower wants the ability to breed. All of that will be approved only for a small niche of wealthy players. It's scary to think about what can happen under Colorado's and Washington's legalization models. Phillip Morris is licking their lips getting ready to rape this industry because of their stupid fucking regulations. You know how many well respected breeders operate out of their homes? They would have to pack up and move out of the country if Colorado's model is adopted on a nationwide scale. You call that legal?

It would be nice if these guys would at least acknowledge what a joke their system has become, but you can't even get that out of them. It's all just,"Whatever. It's better than Oklahoma. Shut up and stop complaining."

 

[hurdy gurdy man]

Any move toward legalization should be endorsed. The concept of an illegal plant is absurd.

Users of all people should know better, and those who deny it have shit for brains.

 

[resinryder]

Taking it out the hands of users and putting it in the hands of a corporate entity who's only motivation is profits is the result of people having less than shit for brains. Example from Washington's legal pot shop-22.00/gram=9856.00/pound plus tax. SWEET!!! Who is being better served with that price?

 

[Jhhnn]

Some of us are fighting for the freedom to participate in the free market and others (Jhhhnn, monsoon, etc. ) are trying to defend corporate corruption and their hijacking of the cannabis industry before it ever gets off the ground.

You don't want a free market, because in a free market the price of cannabis would be so low that it wouldn't pay your electric bill. Indoor growing under lights would be a quaint relic of the past. You want to keep what you have in a market that isn't free at all. Please don't pretend otherwise.

It's more than just the right to grow for retail. Under their model you can't breed, make your own crosses, and expand the genetic diversity of cannabis as a whole. That's one of the most significant aspects of cannabis horticulture. Any serious grower wants the ability to breed. All of that will be approved only for a small niche of wealthy players.

It's not legal now, in large part. Ask Gypsy. Nor is it like most of today's genetics were created or obtained in a legal fashion at all. As with the price of pot, the price of seeds is maintained largely because they are illegal. Creating seeds under the cover of a MMJ license in CA, shipping them to Europe so that they can be shipped back to this country is not a perfectly legit business model at all. In a free market environment, marijuana seeds woud be sold at the garden center with the cucumber seeds. I doubt you really want that.

It's scary to think about what can happen under Colorado's and Washington's legalization models. Phillip Morris is licking their lips getting ready to rape this industry because of their stupid fucking regulations. You know how many well respected breeders operate out of their homes? They would have to pack up and move out of the country if Colorado's model is adopted on a nationwide scale. You call that legal?

It would be nice if these guys would at least acknowledge what a joke their system has become, but you can't even get that out of them. It's all just,"Whatever. It's better than Oklahoma. Shut up and stop complaining."

I'm sure it's scary if the current CA model pot biz is how you make your living. For the vast majority of users, it's not scary at all. It's not scary to voters who favor legalization for other reasons, either.

You argue to maintain your own narrow financial interests, which is fine, so far as it goes. I get that, even if you claim it's for other reasons. I object to the pretense and to assignation of motives we don't have.

Nobody here is trying to force the CO model onto CA at all. When you try to paint it as something it's not, those of us who live it will try to tell it like it is for us. It works for us a lot better than the way it was before.

 

[bentom187]

You don't want a free market, because in a free market the price of cannabis would be so low that it wouldn't pay your electric bill. Indoor growing under lights would be a quaint relic of the past. You want to keep what you have in a market that isn't free at all. Please don't pretend otherwise.

As with all products the free market makes it cheaper and more abundant if the demand is there. This should be wake up call.

With the additional benefit to innovate like using solar panels or some other method of obtaining electricity. The grid is not the only option and I doubt the companies would not be competing to absorb all the new growers on the market by lowering their prices.

More weed, cheaper weed, competitive qualities and more strain choices. And practicing what you love to do for a living or recreation.

How is that bad again ? We should be free to make the choice to thrive or fail or just do it for ourselves.


"The attempt to regulate, control, and prescribe all manner of conduct and social relations is very old. It was always the practice of primitive peoples." -Calvin Coolidge

 

[HunterJ]

"The attempt to regulate, control, and prescribe all manner of conduct and social relations is very old. It was always the practice of primitive peoples." -Calvin Coolidge

And still is.

 

[monsoon]

"Ass"ignation of motives we don't have is correct here as well...

So you want someone in CO to say it sucks?

Ok...it sucks. Thing is..it STILL doesn't suck like where you are! You can't even grow fuckin tomatoes in your yard! LOFL. Kinda funny/ironic that you are on such a crusade to find admittance from those of us in CO that our system isn't "perfect" (oh...wahhhhh....) when it appears that you can do nothing locally to a system that ..by your own accounts..is severely fucked up/broken. So here you are...telling us WHAT? Why is that again?

As I said before and completely contrary to what you are TRYING TO SAY I BELIEVE....I don't at all care for the retail side of 64...nor do I endorse it....or support it. It truly wasn't needed here....but the state needed the promised 40 million (first year) for schools...and SAFER needed MORE than just "we all wanna get high" banner tagged to the Amendment to get it by the public....and that is WHY we have A64 now...OK..that..and the SHOWING MADE BY THE MMJ "Industry"...which has been an unregulated/Wild West kinda thing since the dispensaries came online outside any law/regulation in 2009.

True....there are measures in place that can....and do....CONTROL it all...like the licensing...and the ability of towns/counties to opt out of any/all of the commercial side of the equation and the ability of >every< property owner in the State to say "yes" or "No" to pot..in any form...on THEIR property. (it's plain to see who rents and who owns by who supports such a measure)

Not gonna say "your attorney is wrong"...cus what happens in Commerce City/Denver/the FR/wherever they may be is different cus all of those towns are such a visual shithole and NEED the income from weed...but overall...the entire "commercial" side of the weed game up here (Western Slope) is SEVERELY limited...and "they" limit it here without fear it will 'hurt the population" because there are >other< huge/big money/long term interests such as tourism and skiing that bring in FAR MORE $$$ than weed ever could.

Surely..in your infinite knowledge of it all....you can fathom that one part of a state may be different than another and that tossing a blanket over it all weakens most, if not all of what you have "learned from the attorney" (who should have told you/made that distinction///LOL)

It's like saying it only snows at night (you could no doubt find an attorney >somewhere< who would back this statement up...LOL) or that because there's a blizzard happening at the Drunkos game in Denver the ENTIRE state MUST BE BURIED. Sorry to burst the bubble... but it's like comparing Tahoe to Big Bear... or LA to Needles. Different across the board...and each area takes advantage of completely opposite stances within the same LAW and set of parameters given by A64.

Like I say...there are no retail stores here in my county. (most towns have "opted out")

Whatever is on the street here is all STILL being distributed under the table/under the radar/outside of the tax scheme known as A64/ on Craigslist (where they think/claim their sales, by "donation", are legal but they are not) or ..it is sold in the MMJ dispensaries. (where it's still about $225 a bag + 4% county/state tax locally)

Whatever though. Believe what you will...or not. You have no bearing or stake in any of it anyway.