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Trump thread part 2 (Or anything else we want to talk about that's ridiculous in politics today)

HempKat

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Hiddenjems said:
Explain how the most popular ideas don’t win in pure democracy.
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Who said the US was a pure democracy? It's a constitutional republic with democratically elected representation. Pure Democracy would require the voters to vote on everything which is just not practical or feasible..
 
GOT_BUD?

GOT_BUD?

Weed is a gateway to gardening
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Republican voters show leniency toward moral misconduct by party members, study finds​


“Overall, we reinforce earlier findings that moral foundations are not a clear bedrock on which our beliefs about how to respond to transgressive politicians rest,” Redlawsk explained. “Instead, partisanship seems to be able to override moral foundations, especially among Republican voters in our studies and especially when the violation is perceived as less severe.”

“We’ve been consistently surprised about how readily supposedly core moral values are ‘pushed around’ by partisan preference. This study is the first to help us better understand it by looking at the perceived severity of a set of moral violations. We were somewhat surprised to see strong party differences in how severe the violations we used were perceived. The issue may be that rather than Republicans caring less about moral violations of their candidates, they simply don’t see the violations as being severe, compared to Democrats.”
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www.psypost.org

Republican voters show leniency toward moral misconduct by party members, study finds

A study found that Republicans are more punitive toward minor political transgressions unless the violator is from their own party, while Democrats consistently show a stronger desire to punish regardless of party affiliation, especially for more severe violations.
www.psypost.org
 
GOT_BUD?

GOT_BUD?

Weed is a gateway to gardening
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buzzmobile said:
Explain how the United States is a pure democracy, and I'll take a swing at it.

I'm going to vote for bread and circuses.
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That'll be a no for me on circuses. They treat their animals horribly and too many clowns.

I'll vote for elimination of lawns and sourdough bread.
 
zachrockbadenof

zachrockbadenof

Well-known member
Veteran
HempKat said:
I'm aware of the crime because I know people who told me about the crime, often times it's the person being cheated out of their food stamp money that I hear about it from. This means I'm not witnessing the crime which is why I can't prove it, I'm hearing about it 2nd hand. That's not sufficient to be counted as evidence in a court of law. It's what they call word of mouth. Now since I'm hearing about it from the people getting food stamps I could technically turn them in because they too are technically breaking the law. However it would still be word of mouth and since they're already being robbed by the conservative I don't feel as strong a need to report them. Plus often these are homeless people so it would be difficult for police to investigate them. So for them I usually just tell them what idiots they are for giving up the little bit of help they get just to score enough money to have a night or two of being able to buy a 12 pack of beer. I point out to them that if they keep doing that they'll go thru all their food stamps in a day or two and then have to deal with the rest of the month of having no easy access to food. Does that work? Probably not, it's not like I can always follow up with these people because I meet them thru volunteer work I do with a local church. The homeless come in to a soup kitchen and my task after helping to serve them is to sit down and talk with as many as I can to try to see if we can figure a way for them to no longer be homeless. That's when I learn of the crime. I don't know their name, where they can be found, and they tell me what they do in confidence. So not only would it be wrong to report them because it would violate that confidence but since I may never see them again the best I could do is tell the police some homeless guy just admitted to me he trades his food stamps for cash. Good luck to the police to find the right guy and detemine if what he told me was heresay or not. Plus it's been my experience the police aren't too keen on going after homeless people for such minor offenses that usually just end up with them losing their food stamp benefits. Also I don't always know the conservative they make their deal with and in those cases I can't report them. The police probably don't do much if anything with the leads I do give them but they'ree definitely not going to do anything with me reporting that some homeless guy trades food stamps for cash with some annonymous person who doesn't need food stamps.

Also I never said only conservatives are stealing. Sure some democrats get caught doing the wrong thing and if they do, just like the guy in NJ they should and deserve to be prosecuted. But it's hardly reasonable to compare someone who gets caught in a bribery crime to someone scaming poor people for food stamps. At least in the bribery crime both parties can afford a lawyer and both sides are fully aware they're committing a crime. The majority of these homeless people don't see what they do as a crime, they just simply see it as traddding something they have for cash. Also, not that it makes it any more or less right but since the democrat politician that gets caught in a crime isn't claiming to run on a platform of rule of law and fiscal responsibility. Also if you're being honest with yourself far more conservative politician's end up being caught involved in crimes then do democrat politicians.
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HempKat said:
Not true, you make too many assumptions, I hope you aren't considering a future as a lawyer. If you are you should warn your clients you're not very good at it. I'm aware of the crime because I know people who told me about the crime, often times it's the person being cheated out of their food stamp money that I hear about it from. This means I'm not witnessing the crime which is why I can't prove it, I'm hearing about it 2nd hand. That's not sufficient to be counted as evidence in a court of law. It's what they call word of mouth. Now since I'm hearing about it from the people getting food stamps I could technically turn them in because they too are technically breaking the law. However it would still be word of mouth and since they're already being robbed by the conservative I don't feel as strong a need to report them. Plus often these are homeless people so it would be difficult for police to investigate them. So for them I usually just tell them what idiots they are for giving up the little bit of help they get just to score enough money to have a night or two of being able to buy a 12 pack of beer. I point out to them that if they keep doing that they'll go thru all their food stamps in a day or two and then have to deal with the rest of the month of having no easy access to food. Does that work? Probably not, it's not like I can always follow up with these people because I meet them thru volunteer work I do with a local church. The homeless come in to a soup kitchen and my task after helping to serve them is to sit down and talk with as many as I can to try to see if we can figure a way for them to no longer be homeless. That's when I learn of the crime. I don't know their name, where they can be found, and they tell me what they do in confidence. So not only would it be wrong to report them because it would violate that confidence but since I may never see them again the best I could do is tell the police some homeless guy just admitted to me he trades his food stamps for cash. Good luck to the police to find the right guy and detemine if what he told me was heresay or not. Plus it's been my experience the police aren't too keen on going after homeless people for such minor offenses that usually just end up with them losing their food stamp benefits. Also I don't always know the conservative they make their deal with and in those cases I can't report them. The police probably don't do much if anything with the leads I do give them but they'ree definitely not going to do anything with me reporting that some homeless guy trades food stamps for cash with some annonymous person who doesn't need food stamps.

Also I never said only conservatives are stealing. Sure some democrats get caught doing the wrong thing and if they do, just like the guy in NJ they should and deserve to be prosecuted. But it's hardly reasonable to compare someone who gets caught in a bribery crime to someone scaming poor people for food stamps. At least in the bribery crime both parties can afford a lawyer and both sides are fully aware they're committing a crime. The majority of these homeless people don't see what they do as a crime, they just simply see it as traddding something they have for cash. Also, not that it makes it any more or less right but since the democrat politician that gets caught in a crime isn't claiming to run on a platform of rule of law and fiscal responsibility. Also if you're being honest with yourself far more conservative politician's end up being caught involved in crimes then do democrat politicians.
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if you accuse my client of a crime, we go to court and it's not proven, then it ain't a crime... as to what these people are doing, taking advantage of less-fortunate people... that in itself SUCKS...
 
zachrockbadenof

zachrockbadenof

Well-known member
Veteran
buzzmobile said:
OK, an ode to Summer
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WOW... way back when, me and my pals (all of us talent-less) played that song at a friday nite staten island comm. college coffee shop... high on weed/hash/quaaludes and coke, we thought we were at least as good as cream... sad but true, we couldn't even hold one of creams jock straps... BUT... the girls thought we were heavenly... and at the time that was all that mattered...
 
HempKat

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
zachrockbadenof said:
if you accuse my client of a crime, we go to court and it's not proven, then it ain't a crime... as to what these people are doing, taking advantage of less-fortunate people... that in itself SUCKS...
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What you're missing here is that I'm not the one accusing your client of crime, not in the context of going to court, I report the crime to the proper authorities, they investigate, if they find they have enough evidence then they arrest them and the states attorney along wth the help of a grand jury is the entity that ultimately accuses your client. At that point if you get them off it's usually due to a technicallity or a plea deal, either way they are still guilty but they either opted to not fight it for a lighter sentence or a mistake was made by the state preventing a proper conviction. You can rationalize in your mind that because you found some technicallity that they are innocent but the reality is they just got lucky that someone screwed up.

To use your example of the Democrat Senator that got busted for bribary. If the people executing the search warrant found the gold bars and money in some place not covered in the search warrant that evidence wouldn't have been able to be used against him and would be thrown out. He would still be guilty of committing a crime but due to that mistake they wouldn't have enough evidence to convict and he would walk free. it doesn't mean that he never committed a crime.
 
H

Hiddenjems

Well-known member
HempKat said:
Who said the US was a pure democracy? It's a constitutional republic with democratically elected representation. Pure Democracy would require the voters to vote on everything which is just not practical or feasible..
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I didn’t say that, but strawman arguments are popular I guess.
 
Shua1991

Shua1991

Well-known member
Hiddenjems said:
She was, when that was what was politically convenient. She helped bail criminals out of jail later on when that was the “in” position to have.

She’s a spineless career politician with none of her own core issues she supports with true passion. Like 99% of dems and republicans.
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These are facts.

We need a labor party, this democratic experiment has failed because both party's(the duopoly) tolerate malignant neoliberalism, and propagate it to fight any collectivist institutions, through regulatory capture and other means.

I heard Donald trump get called a scab in Michigan, a crowd of people chanted this, more class agitation is needed.
 
zachrockbadenof

zachrockbadenof

Well-known member
Veteran
HempKat said:
At that point if you get them off it's usually due to a technicallity or a plea deal, either way they are still guilty but they either opted to not fight it for a lighter sentence or a mistake was made by the state preventing a proper conviction. You can rationalize in your mind that because you found some technicallity that they are innocent but the reality is they just got lucky that someone screwed up.
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or the prosecutor did not prove his case... i never said that because u are found 'not guilty' , u didn't commit the crime.. as u correctly state, could be a technicality , or there was not enough evidence to convict..

its not a perfect system , but its what we got...
 
H

Hiddenjems

Well-known member
Shua1991 said:
These are facts.

We need a labor party, this democratic experiment has failed because both party's(the duopoly) tolerate malignant neoliberalism, and propagate it to fight any collectivist institutions, through regulatory capture and other means.

I heard Donald trump get called a scab in Michigan, a crowd of people chanted this, more class agitation is needed.
Click to expand...
Ranked choice voting with more than two parties to choose from would help workers.

The dems used to represent workers as a class because journalists were also in the blue collar pay scale. Not that journalists are making millions off corporations, the dems have left the blue collar crowd behind and made them the other with the deplorable label.

I remember real investigative journalism, when huge corporations were being exposed for environmental and worker treatment issues.
 
Zeez

Zeez

---------------->
ICMag Donor
Chumps 1991 757 / Hoopty broke down on the way to Bozeman and had to divert into Billings.
You can put a new dress on an old whore but it's ttill an old whore. Most 757s are in the bone yard now.
 
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