Tom Hill Haze

[Sanjuro]

When someone opens LLC it opens it for making money and no other purpose.
If you want to help people you open charity.

But opening a money making business and being successful does not obligate you to bring western hybrid fem seeds to every place in the world where they are still working with more traditional heirlooms and ruin those genetics. right?

What an asshole he is, meaning Arjan. When he does that all he’s thinking about is himself and his company getting publicity

 

[CannaT]

But opening a money making business and being successful does not obligate you to bring western hybrid fem seeds to every place in the world where they are still working with more traditional heirlooms and ruin those genetics. right?

What an asshole he is, meaning Arjan. When he does that all he’s thinking about is himself and his company getting publicity

Uh man you dont have knowladge at all....Cannabis was always brought somwhere from India...over the years it will addapt to surrounding when it grow and will become landrace...even all of our western cannabis is higly breeded landraces from all over the world....
Its not that big or bad thing as you think.

 

[CannaT]

I have nothing more to add. I gave my perspective, and you gave yours.

edit; actually, one thing I will add. I have been in business for myself since I was 21 years old. Making money, and not actively fucking people over are not mutually exclusive things. Some people have ethics, shit, most universities teach courses on business ethics... and then some people do not have ethics, and only care about the money. You have made it quite clear which camp you are in.

I choose otherwise, and I do okay. But I do not have the kind of money that Arjan, or many others in the cannabis business have. But I can sleep at night knowing that I do no evil. That matters to me.

Man you are not perfect just not born for business and thats it...
When there is race only one is 1st...you dont have capacity to be the best and thats all.
You dont learn about business in university man biggest business people are C students.
You are better for philosophy than pure business thats why you dont have money as Arjan.

 

[Sanjuro]

Uh man you dont have knowladge at all....Cannabis was always brought somwhere from India...over the years it will addapt to surrounding when it grow and will become landrace...even all of our western cannabis is higly breeded landraces from all over the world....
Its not that big or bad thing as you think.

This reply just show how out of it you are. That’s one stupid argument

You’re just a dutch fan boy. Rafa Van der Vaart of icmag hah hah

Arjan has the whole western world and the more developed part of the rest of it to sell his shit to

He really doesn’t need to go to africa, india and so on to taint the heirlooms with his fem skunk1, widow, dutch haze hybrids

And you talk about him like he invented coffeeshops and the seed selling business. bullshit. all this was already going on before he jumped in. He’s just a coat tail rider, not a creator of anything


and cannabis didn't evolve in india, it was NE corner of Tibetan plateu. It was in E Europe millions of years before indian sativas started existing. Yes. Show us how ignorant you really are

 

[Donald Mallard]

Uh man you dont have knowladge at all....Cannabis was always brought somwhere from India...over the years it will addapt to surrounding when it grow and will become landrace...even all of our western cannabis is higly breeded landraces from all over the world....
Its not that big or bad thing as you think.

this is untrue ,
yunnan in china is considered a place where cannabis was native to and originates from,
while there may be other places in asia , its ignorant to think it all came from India , if it even did and wasnt just taken there too from a place like yunnan ...
its always ironic to see folks telling others they dont know what they are on about ,
when they also dont know what they are on about ,, sad and crazy ...

 

[dubi]

Surely others will be better than me at explaining it...

Nevil haze is basically a hybrid(Nl5 x haze) x haze) some rare pheno are psychedelic etc but it remains a hybrid;

Ot1haze is a different thing, there are many schools of thought here, however it comes from another area of California, it is not related to Sam's and is more wild / jungle, and requires a little more effort to be grown;

Tom Hill Haze comes from the most Thai dom of the group, it is the only one that still has the purple pheno, it comes from the positronic stock and therefore from Sam;

Tfd /seedsman all come from Sam's stock, obviously each seedbank /breeder has selected it differently, more towards the Colombian side...

There are many lines of thought, and everyone has their own preferences, being a THH thread here that is appreciated more, however apart from ot1haze, the others come from Sam /haze brothers...

Quite accurate, except for that Purple Haze expressions can also be found in Oldtimer's Haze.

 

[dubi]

View attachment 19059837
Dry bud from a 40 year old cutting of Ohz x Sk#1.

I have it thanks to Karel, it's deliciously hazy.

 

[mexcurandero420]

I have it thanks to Karel, it's deliciously hazy.

With a little cure even better. He is a very nice guy.

 

[Farmer John]

This reply just show how out of it you are. That’s one stupid argument

You’re just a dutch fan boy. Rafa Van der Vaart of icmag hah hah

Arjan has the whole western world and the more developed part of the rest of it to sell his shit to

He really doesn’t need to go to africa, india and so on to taint the heirlooms with his fem skunk1, widow, dutch haze hybrids

And you talk about him like he invented coffeeshops and the seed selling business. bullshit. all this was already going on before he jumped in. He’s just a coat tail rider, not a creator of anything


and cannabis didn't evolve in india, it was NE corner of Tibetan plateu. It was in E Europe millions of years before indian sativas started existing. Yes. Show us how ignorant you really are

Amen.

 

[dubi]

Sam edited his comments in to this post Raho made in 2019: https://www.icmag.com/threads/quest...he-original-haze.77798/page-148#post-11998340

View attachment 19059974

So it appears like Oldtimer's stock was from the time before Sam hybridized the three landraces/heirlooms gathered from around Colombia. Their point of divergence was in the seventies, perhaps.

I agree with your last paragraph. Oldtimer's Haze genetics display Colombian sativa traits, green and purple phenotypes, along with terpenes and effects that perfectly match the old Original Haze pictures and smoke reports. The ACE Oldtimer's Haze analyzed mother confirms that OTH is entirely Colombian. There are many good Colombian samples at Phylos, and in my opinion, the Colombian results at Phylos are quite accurate (unlike others).

I also believe that Oldtimer's Haze diverges from an earlier point, prior to Sam's Original Haze selections in Holland, as Oldtimer's version is wilder and has a longer flowering time, while Sam's Original Haze is more tamed, has a shorter flowering time, and works best indoors. Both share many Colombian sativa traits.

The THH samples I had the pleasure of smoking were indeed Thai dominant, indeed excellent Thai traits. From what I understand by reading Sam's texts here on ICMag, Original Haze was and is for him entirely Colombian; therefore, the later hybrids with Thai were considered Haze hybrids.

Given that Original Haze is quite inbred, (Oldtimer's Haze even more) and works best in hybrids. Then, an Original Haze crossed with an excellent Thai can easily outperform in the first outcross compared to inbred OH, but I bet not so much if the Haze Thai hybrid is inbred without excellence.

 

[willydread]

Quite accurate, except for that Purple Haze expressions can also be found in Oldtimer's Haze.

You hurt me.
I thought you at least understood how much I like oldtimer haze....

Of course I know that ot1haze contains purple phenos, but (at least in theory) it is not related to Sam haze...
I hope I explained myself better....

Ot1haze is a different thing, there are many schools of thought here, however it comes from another area of California, it is not related to Sam's and is more wild / jungle, and requires a little more effort to be grown;

 

[Sanjuro]

Uh man you dont have knowladge at all....Cannabis was always brought somwhere from India...over the years it will addapt to surrounding when it grow and will become landrace...even all of our western cannabis is higly breeded landraces from all over the world....
Its not that big or bad thing as you think.

Don’t you think this is the wrong thread to be Arjan fan boy when everyone in it is arguing about old school heirlooms that created the Santa Cruz Bagseed Haze?

We f-cking call each other all kinds of names and feelings get hurt [i'm sorry @Mahakala] because we are passionate about weed! Have you noticed? hah hah

What do you think these passionate Haze lovers would say if someone asked them if they would like to have seeds stock of the original genetic material that made these 5% Hazes and the rest of the top level expressions you could find in the Santa Cruz line

Would they want these original lines in pure form?

or

If they would like those lines mixed with White Rhino, Widow, Shark Shock, SSH or what ever Arjan takes with him to Africa, S America or SE Asia to taint their heirlooms?

What do you think people would say? Personally i’d like the pure seed stock



And you have to keep in mind that Arjan most likely isn’t making millions by SELLING his fem seeds to people living in middle of nowhere Africa or SE Asia. He brings these dutch fem seeds with him without the native people asking for them, Isn’t that more or less the facts?

 

[El Timbo]

Given that Original Haze is quite inbred, (Oldtimer's Haze even more) and works best in hybrids. Then, an Original Haze crossed with an excellent Thai can easily outperform in the first outcross compared to inbred OH, but I bet not so much if the Haze Thai hybrid is inbred without excellence.

How about OT1H x THH?

 

[Farmer John]

How about AUH?

This is how myths and false info is born. Pretty amazing considering that they got the seeds in 2006.

 

[Salva]

You hurt me.
I thought you at least understood how much I like oldtimer haze....

Of course I know that ot1haze contains purple phenos, but (at least in theory) it is not related to Sam haze...
I hope I explained myself better....

En teoría... Al final que es la Original Haze? 3 colombianas como dice Sam o Colombia x Mexico x India x Thai? Sam dice que es 100% Colombiana. Si 0T1 es colombiana también es Haze? La Tom Hill Haze es Original Haze o un híbrido Haze x Thai? Que recibió Nevil exactamente de Sam? Que lío... 🫨🫠

 

[FellaAndrene]

How about AUH?
View attachment 19060922
This is how myths and false info is born. Pretty amazing considering that they got the seeds in 2006.

Say what you will - yes, Arjan's a shithead - but he has always been an avid traveller, and he does know how to make people work for him.

However, according to genetic mapping, that story might not be true.

Arjan's Haze and AUH were studied by Sawler et al. 2015. Here the red bar signifies actual NLD heritage:

 

[Salva]

Si no recuerdo mal, tendría que buscarlo otra vez... Nevil dijo que recibió una Haze que la llamó B si no me equivoco que florecía en 10 semanas y él mismo dijo que era un híbrido mezclado con indica... Por lo tanto... Que recibió Nevil?

 

[FellaAndrene]

Si no recuerdo mal, tendría que buscarlo otra vez... Nevil dijo que recibió una Haze que la llamó B si no me equivoco que florecía en 10 semanas y él mismo dijo que era un híbrido mezclado con indica... Por lo tanto... Que recibió Nevil?

Here: https://mrnice.nl/forum/threads/questions-for-nevil.4308/page-3#post-57318

And: https://mrnice.nl/forum/threads/grail-the-ultimate-haze-hybrid.4345/page-4#post-58097

 

[Salva]

Here: https://mrnice.nl/forum/threads/questions-for-nevil.4308/page-3#post-57318 View attachment 19060932
And: https://mrnice.nl/forum/threads/grail-the-ultimate-haze-hybrid.4345/page-4#post-58097
View attachment 19060934

Ahí ahí ahí lo dijo, así era, entonces la Haze B, que memoria tengo por lo tanto no sabemos que recibió, de ahí mi pregunta.

 

[Limeygreen]

@dubi is it safe to assume that some oth x thai are potentially being looked at for future release?