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Tom Hill Haze

Ur Humbl Nr8tor

Well-known member
Veteran
So most of these will likely have to hold off till next season in a new space hopefully with some light dep…but I may try and get a few out with the current four plants from his old seed run. As I mailed two parcels w cash due to the first one being 11 days late…he kindly sent me one of my cash payments back and added some kick ass BDL freebies to fuck around with.
16EA41D5-37F0-4B98-A96C-DFA253E5C02F.jpeg
 

MadMac

far beyond driven...
So most of these will likely have to hold off till next season in a new space hopefully with some light dep…but I may try and get a few out with the current four plants from his old seed run. As I mailed two parcels w cash due to the first one being 11 days late…he kindly sent me one of my cash payments back and added some kick ass BDL freebies to fuck around with.
View attachment 18855339
this is like it should be…. and a must ;-)
great to see that you all get your seeds…
can’t wait to see the first young plants … and of course flowering…
but the young plants tell it all… the leaf’s…
haze smalll slender baby leaf’s or WLD belly leaf’s…
later they will thin out … but when young you see what is in ;-)
M.
 

MadMac

far beyond driven...
To be honest subcools 5 packs were pretty much packed full of keepers
Sub cool was the biggest scam to me…
great marketing but the gear was marketing only…
Vortex looool … and all those others i’ll had grown…
fucked up genetics … inbreed like hell.. and impotent…
i#ll bought two times there gear… same shit than most others have…
also there description was wrong… looked like they never flowered a pure sativa…
don’t get it why they where so famous … only good marketing… like today on insta many do…
all indica trash… looool…. easy to bred the shit… looks good but high is nothing…
like all those east and west cost breeder… all use the same cut’s … who is true breeding there???
show me the plants…
SubCool was/is shit.
M.
 

windmills

Well-known member
"Sub cool was the biggest scam to me…"

I don't get it. One "breeder" knocking another, who has long since been deceased. Criticizing what they made, in an obvious attempt to elevate their own, by way of denigrating another. And, though he is not posting now, Tom called your's euro hay. Personally, I am a big fan of the combined genetics of sativa/indica. And, they are both equally easy to grow. Not rocket science. I partake in my share of straight sativa, and kush, and like both. Sub's Vortex was a High Times Cup Winner, so to say it was meh, would likely be an understatement and untrue. Lets all try and live in peace.
 

ICGA

Active member
Sub cool was the biggest scam to me…
great marketing but the gear was marketing only…
Vortex looool … and all those others i’ll had grown…
fucked up genetics … inbreed like hell.. and impotent…
i#ll bought two times there gear… same shit than most others have…
also there description was wrong… looked like they never flowered a pure sativa…
don’t get it why they where so famous … only good marketing… like today on insta many do…
all indica trash… looool…. easy to bred the shit… looks good but high is nothing…
like all those east and west cost breeder… all use the same cut’s … who is true breeding there???
show me the plants…
SubCool was/is shit.
M.
Sub may have been a dick and idk what years you got your packs in or how you grew them but they were never marketed as pure sativa. Also TGA states openly that they breed for flavor first potency second. They specialize in floral/fruit/candy flavored strains with good resin production. It's no Chem or haze effect but they were at the forefront of breeding for clean flavors that were prominent and relatively consistent. That being sed if you grew it like a land race rather then suped up modern strains it would have come out bland. His plants as well as his predisesors Brothers Grimm and BCGA selected plants that were optimized to have lots of fancy food and sugars and the potential of these plants can't be fully expressed with just a basic NPK nutrient regiment as they are far from wild expressions and were never marketed as crushingly intense highs but as unique intensely different terpine profiles with higher then average resin production. Honestly I found more phenos that fit the description or better then ones that didn't. I only found unsatisfactory phenotypes in his backcross of A13 and Bubba x spacequeen but that is to be expected a certain percentage of the time because there are more wild traits in those lines and some inbred progeny in the bx1/F1 generation will clump together and over power desired traits. Vortex is an amazing strain but if u just feed it NPK with HPS or even a better light your not really gonna see what it can do. It likes lots of fancy food and light, its not a wild sativa bred for its effect alone.
 
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Ur Humbl Nr8tor

Well-known member
Veteran
this is like it should be…. and a must ;-)
great to see that you all get your seeds…
can’t wait to see the first young plants … and of course flowering…
but the young plants tell it all… the leaf’s…
haze smalll slender baby leaf’s or WLD belly leaf’s…
later they will thin out … but when young you see what is in ;-)
M.
I’m growing old 10+ year stock atm. I’m pretty sure they will all thin out. Some are already there. The new batch??? Probably very good or great. Actually old stock has a single thick leaf with my eye on it. Then they all get from thick to thinner. I’m keeping an eye on all of them. I’m blasted on mushrooms, so take what I say…
 
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flower~power

~Star~Crash~
ICMag Donor
Veteran
So most of these will likely have to hold off till next season in a new space hopefully with some light dep…but I may try and get a few out with the current four plants from his old seed run. As I mailed two parcels w cash due to the first one being 11 days late…he kindly sent me one of my cash payments back and added some kick ass BDL freebies to fuck around with.
View attachment 18855339
. :cool:
 

johnnyla

Active member
Veteran
Yep, I pick what I like every time lol. Those of us that have been smoking weed since the 60s should know what's been lost. The quality of some plants grown in the 70s is still unmatched in the quality produced today. There were a lot fewer people growing back then.. So What's changed to cause the quality shift we see now?-----THE GENETICS HAVE CHANGED. It's all bottlenecked and watered down. There are only so many ways to breed the same chemotypes together.. Lot of weed today looks the same with the same high. Only the names have changed. Breeding Sativa landraces back into the gene pool is a must. Anything done well takes time. The 60 days or less priority needs to shift to 120 days.. Start breeding with landraces to find our own and stock stop the hype clone x hype clone bottleneck.
The lights hav changed. That’s the biggest environmental changes for indoor growers last 5 years which also coincides to the Beaster Midz quality of commercial weed. No way you can blame genetics alone for that. You have an industry that adopted the new lights across the board. I’ve smoked some dank LED weed, but it’s much harder to dial in, and the folks who think they go it dialed in do not. Like 90%+ of any store bought weed. Perfectly grown SUN/HPS weed is way better than LED in every department except MAYBE bag appeal. And fuck your lab numbers. I’m talking about smoking weed for the effect. I’ve been smoking and growing since 1991.

Neville’s Haze Pic for attention
 

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Hammerhead

Disabled Farmer
ICMag Donor
Veteran
The lights hav changed. That’s the biggest environmental changes for indoor growers last 5 years which also coincides to the Beaster Midz quality of commercial weed. No way you can blame genetics alone for that. You have an industry that adopted the new lights across the board. I’ve smoked some dank LED weed, but it’s much harder to dial in, and the folks who think they go it dialed in do not. Like 90%+ of any store bought weed. Perfectly grown SUN/HPS weed is way better than LED in every department except MAYBE bag appeal. And fuck your lab numbers. I’m talking about smoking weed for the effect. I’ve been smoking and growing since 1991.

Neville’s Haze Pic for attention
I still grow using the same lights ive used for 8 years now. I have added LED but still use CMH and always will. I prefer CMH over HPS. The biggest impact is genetics and bad growers. Doesnt matters what a crappy grower has when they can't grow it well. The love put into growing matters IMO. There are a ton more shitty growers today than ever before. The quality landrace genetics we use to have are gone!!!!. Not possible to get that back. Most people today don't have the knowledge/experience to even know what's been lost. The weed I speak of was gone well before 1990. Most landrace genetics has been bred with polluted cannabis genetics. Finding anything not is a chore with so much BS just to make $$$. It sure inst about the plant anymore!!.

IMO a good grower can grow quality weed using any light !!

LOL, Ive been growing since 1960..

As for Subcool I found a few killer phenos in his Querkle line. Everyone loved those plants. Quality is very subjective. We shouldn't be putting down what others like.
 
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Ur Humbl Nr8tor

Well-known member
Veteran
I’ve got an $1100 dollar led system that I bought in a clearance sale for under $700. It’s still in the box and never seen the ‘light’ of day. My indoors used to be under 430 watt Son Agro HPS bulbs. That system pretty much rocks minus the heat challenges. Glad I’m legal under SoCal sunshine though.
 

PlasmaTube

Well-known member
i have never had a hay pheno out of any haze stock. they have all been memorable. i had a 12% one that was dreamy and had the euphoria and it must have leaned columbian. it was almost indica in effect.
another one tested at 20% less memorable than the previous one.
i had 3 different repros from Mac and they all put you to work... no hay.
so from my limited experience even the duds are pretty dang good.
maybe people get mad because its not commercially viable?

one observation from the THH stock via madmac - the males show sex crazy early?
anyone else notice that?
Not sure how accurate this is or not, but the male was the first to show this run. Same with my Ace Malawi. First time running THH Repro from madmac.
 

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