The Search for Trip Weed

[Donn]

If the idea is to purge this thread down to specific reports, then I imagine a template isn't going to work very well for the existing posts. Anyway, my impression is that while we may need some parameters for evaluating, this thread is also about evolving the parameters. What is "trip" anyway? I don't think there's a good answer, right now, and that's the most interesting thing about the thread, or could be anyway.

It looks to me like the natural tendency is, in the absence of some kind of firm hand on the tiller, a thread like this will gradually turn into a rambling show-and-tell of strains with narrow leaves. With that firm hand on the tiller, it will do the same, but at least with an occasional re-focus on "trip".

Also, please - I get that people love to see pictures, but maybe just one?

 

[MostlyMe]

If the idea is to purge this thread down to specific reports, then I imagine a template isn't going to work very well for the existing posts. Anyway, my impression is that while we may need some parameters for evaluating, this thread is also about evolving the parameters. What is "trip" anyway? I don't think there's a good answer, right now, and that's the most interesting thing about the thread, or could be anyway.

It looks to me like the natural tendency is, in the absence of some kind of firm hand on the tiller, a thread like this will gradually turn into a rambling show-and-tell of strains with narrow leaves. With that firm hand on the tiller, it will do the same, but at least with an occasional re-focus on "trip".

Also, please - I get that people love to see pictures, but maybe just one?

I am pretty sure TB was suggesting a new thread.

As for this thread, I know mods tend to think otherwise, but I don't mind if it drifts off topic sometimes. It's like a club house: everyone's there because of whatever the club is for, but that doesn't mean people only talk about that.

 

[Madjag]

Too early to smoke report, however this strain auto-flowered in Mid-April, a month after popping up in Mid-March, as soon as it hit 12/12 or so here in Arizona. I'm thinking it's the Zamal genetics at work since it's known for its tropical auto-flowering characterisitcs.

Smoke report in 3-6 months...hahaha...

[Zamal/Warlock x Critical Mass] xOaxacan

 

[rhinoman 1]

Hey TB, yes spot on with the sour d like Sam said its from his early version of skunk1. You can tell by the serration on the leaves . This is one of several anomalys that come from this strain. Another one is the short fan leaf on bushweeds Thia plant he posted recently. the sour d pic you posted looks more Mexican than the original plant which was the Mexican pheno/ Nepal temple Kush and both were 12 weekers.

 

[ThaiBliss]

Rhinoman - Thanks for the information.

Madjag - Nice plants. Nice that you will get early harvests in the summer season. I believe the type of auto-flowering in Zamal lines might be due to root restriction, and this trait is not limited to Zamal. I have seen it in others. I notice your plants are in relatively small pots. It does not take much to trigger it.

Donn - MostlyMe is correct. I intended to suggest a new thread for the smoke reports.

Please check out the first posts for trip weed definitions. The biggest surprises about the reactions to this thread was the popularity, and especially the disparate ideas of what trip weed is. To me, the most concise definition would be sensory enhancement. Colors are brighter, sounds are louder and more distinct, the feeling of touch is enhanced, and food tastes more intense. This all leads to a bigger appreciation of the world around us, and a feeling of the profundity of life. Energy levels and thought processes are enhanced. This is all quite the opposite of knock down couch-lock weed typical of most Indicas. I think shared experience helps others to understand. Anyone who has smoked Thai Sticks in the 70s know where I am going with this idea. There are plenty of other strains which I consider trippy, and they all are variants on the theme. Some are warmer, euphoric, and fun, while others are highly introspective and can be disturbing. Many highs go through phases. They start out scary, introspective, and evolve to euphoric as the user gets used to it and gains control over the experience.

All definitions are welcome here. In most, if not all, of what people have expressed, there seems to be significant overlap.

 

[ThaiBliss]

Here is a re-post of the second post in this thread. Perhaps I should do this occasionally. These are not definitions, per se, of what trip weed is. They are more like descriptions of experiences that make me think they were smoking trip weed by my definition:

I collected a bunch of descriptions of Zamal and Zamal derived strains like Zamaldelica and others to start my "Zamaldelica - The Search for Trip Weed" thread. I'm posting them here because they encapsulate the spirit of the type of high that I am looking for, and I'd like to share what I'm really going for here:


Dubi - "I remember walking with a friend in the city, totally disoriented. We were walking in streets we know since we are children but we almost coudnt recognize them. It looked like a different place or city for us. We neither knew what we were doing or going, walking without direction around the old streets of my city."

British Hempire – "wow, what a smoke, very very potent, all in the head, a clear, electric, euphoric racing high, I'm a very experienced, hardcore smoker, I smoke all day every day yet this stuff had me higher that I think I've ever been before and positively messed up my friends who tried some. I took a walk to my friends house, a place I have been many many times and couldn't find it, walked up and down the street looking for the house, then had to ring him on my mobile phone as I got really confused, just awesome stuff. I have been in a satate ot total euphoria on this stuff, makes you talk a lot about mad ideas, sing silly little songs to yourself and wander about looking very baked but grinning insanely, just as close to herbal acid as I've ever experienced, straight to the number one slot on my list of best smokes."

Terpene - "...all I can say is HOLY S***. If you are looking for the terror ridden, thai clarity..." "First two hours were INTENSE, scary to the point anyone who wasn't a seasoned smoker would not want to be high anymore..." "...you see at 2 frames per second and there are a lot of "whoa, how long have I been here...... wait, did that just happen?" moments."

Xinox - "...first time i try it, i just look at the street through the window and i literally bug on it..." "you have some kind of slight stroboscopic effect. Then you feel some waves in your body, like you are carry in a wave. We also try this weed at 5 on my vaporizer and the conclusion of the assembly was clear that this weed is heavy shit..." "The high is strong but also very clear, it's indeed very psychedelic and long lasting. This pheno is almost hallucinatory, with some very visuel kind of effects. I'm quiet sure that this weed could easily paralyze a beiginner."

Dubi - "Zamal has a unique kind of high, it's crazy, psychedelic and out of control, especially i have found extremely powerful and crazy plants crossing zamal with other sats and sat/ind hybrids. It has huge breeding potential to get incredible sativa experiences in the hybrids..." "...with a terrorific electric high. It can produce serious paranoia and anxiety when correctly grown..." "...some phenos produced some of the most powerful sativa high i've ever smoked. A mix between anphetamine and LSD." "It was an overpowering accelerated, psychedelic, disorienting crazy high." "Zamal lemon produced one of the closest experience to LSD i've had smoking cannabis."

VanVulpen – "...added a totally new dimension to the musical experience, and gave me the true meaning of "rollercoaster weed""

DeadM -"...another one was terrorific..many friend after one can't smoke anymore of it ..they were unable to speak and move..."

Chamba – "...it was very intelligent and trippy in a way that I often felt like (if I smoked enough of it) of watching myself from above which gave a new perspective of things..at the same time it took ages to put my shoes on!"

BongHitter99 - "…walking back to my room and WHAM! I’m fucking high now!....electric fiery energy courses through my body…heat felt in chest and face…my hearts pounding hard now, I know im in for a ride....feeling extreme euphoria, almost like I want to love the whole world…this is some serious love weed for sure!...very UPBEAT! And motivating …..clear, no couchlock or heavy body load, ….this shit is great for club hopping, partying, socializing….this high just takes your breath away in awe..."

Unknown Guest - "No doubt the very best weed I smoked in my life was Zamal. It only happened to me a couple of times to find some stash that reminded of zamal's quality in holland. The best weed is the one that was not touched nor fertilized by man during its whole life. When they hear about our HPSs and fertilizers stuff, they laugh a lot."

Laugan Gaucher - I love Haze! I don't like most of powered zamal/haze hybrids. psychotic and hallucinogenic. Like Lsd or psilocybine you can have good time and bad time at the same time."

Mosca Negra - "Gerrit's Zamal is some SUPER FINE SMOKE!!!"

 

[Donn]

To me, the most concise definition would be sensory enhancement. Colors are brighter, sounds are louder and more distinct, the feeling of touch is enhanced, and food tastes more intense. This all leads to a bigger appreciation of the world around us, and a feeling of the profundity of life. Energy levels and thought processes are enhanced.

things I like about this perspective:

- It isn't so much about how strong/powerfuil/intense. You could go light on it, or heavy, and still recognize these phenomena. I think there is lots of stuff out there that you can use to get really messed up, if you vaporize a lot of it - that's not very interesting. Quality over quantity.

- It's clearly something good, in the sense of beneficial at least, and hopefully enjoyable as well. Sometimes we may have to grapple with the unpleasant, but only because that's our reality.

- It's well suited to the nature of the plant. I liked LSD (well ... sort of), but the best LSD is LSD. I see some overlap, and indeed it's reflected in your account, but cannabis at its best is more subtle, and doesn't seem to come off well as a heavy duty psychedelic on that scale.

- It's about a starting point. You're set up with this sensory enhancement etc., and of course the question for you is "where now?" You don't have to just get passively carried off on a trip.

 

[Lacocina]

Hello madjag,

I ran Golden Tiger last year in The Southwest and it finished around Thanksgiving outdoors huge plants... Mine turned a rusty red like old school Santa Marta red after curing .. ended up being my favorite effect slow building trip with a smooth spicy taste... I made a few seeds crossing it with Candyland and Bay 11 for this year... My question is do you find yours turn red as well over there ?

 

[Lacocina]

223605 1

 

[Lacocina]

Picture URL

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[Madjag]

@Lacocina

Even harvesting a bit early, the pistils definitely get redder here in the Sonoran desert, probably due to the dryness and high temps in the Fall. Rusty....a good choice of descriptive words.

 

[idiit]

French Touch Seeds has two zamal strains available:
thks to lesnah for the heads up.


1). k1 from Bourbon Breeders: "Kalité Tizane" stabilisée pendant une decennie par les Breeders Bourbon à la Réunion . from what I gathered I think this is the pepper zamal.



Réunion (French: La Réunion, IPA: [la ʁeynjɔ̃] ( listen); previously Île Bourbon) is a French island with a population of 840,974 inhabitants (as of January 2013[1]) located in the Indian Ocean, east of Madagascar, about 175 kilometres (109 mi) southwest of Mauritius, the nearest island.

Le Centre Social de Cannathérapie Île de la Réunion, fédère à lui seul plus de 14 CSC’s sur tout le département.

Avec le soutien du Collectif Breeders Bourbon, leurs membres développent de nouvelles variétés thérapeutiques issues de nos landraces réunionnaises.

Plus de 90 membres actifs répartis sur 14 Clubs, dont plus de 40 jardiniers confirmés ou amateurs.

CSC974LaReunion

As many have to be expected, our collective breeders is also involved in this rat race for the creation of new varieties of cannabis. We all know the popularity of these big seed banks, multinationals even, for some, regularly for us to lay new varieties of cannabis, focusing mostly, a panel of feminized seeds to names and strains, very few know, shamefully neglecting pure strains that have thrilled us all in the 70/80 years.

The Breeders Collective Bourbon dedicated himself, as you may have read earlier, exclusively to the preservation of pure landraces Reunion strains since 1962. The goal is to create new therapeutic hybrid varieties from our own landraces in selecting the best Indica or Sativa old school strains that have spiced our youth.

It is clear that our delay in the metropolis and other European countries that our work has remained in the shadows, because we really did not expect to live up, face all these magicians of the seed, who knew take advantage of favorable laws in their countries and their large financial resources to grow at a rate that Creole can not know.

We used to take our time in the Meeting, as on many islands I think, and this is probably why our work is quality. Unfortunately our little paradise has been shaken when we saw that a certain US bank marketed the Zamal different versions .... (Zamal Délica Zamal or Hash)

Our reaction was not expected and we asked directly accountable to the bank, which has never been able to give us the exact strains Zamal that were used for these crossings, leaving vaguely imply that their friends have sent to them seeds during their stay in Reunion.

This rant is also used to make clear that our work is purely based on the creation of new genetic "therapeutic", hence the importance of knowing exactly strains we work with, because for some, we will find more or less CBD and THC and other molecules useful to our development. It was our duty to do first recognize our strains to the world, hence our partnership with our friend Victor and his wonderful team that makes up the French Touch Seeds.

You will find the Mango Carrot and K1 strains that will be most suited to European conditions. Stabilized at less than 3% of hermaphroditism, the genetics of our landraces can be exploited now, certainly by true connoisseurs, but partnerships with our collective will to make culture accessible to all.

http://www.softsecrets.nl/fr/abc/10002664-divles-hybrides-made-in-974divdivdiv

2). Mangu'Carot

LANDRACES - Mangu'Carot - ( Regulière )
Landrace Mangu'Carot / Sativa 100% / Flo int :100-120 jours / Flo ext : Octobre
La Mangu'Carot est la Landrace la plus commune est le plus connue de l'île de la Réunion, avec des souches malgaches, africaines et indiennes qui font de la Mangu'Carot une variété forte en terpènes qui, avec un bon curing, présente une odeur de mangue fraiche et un léger goût de carotte sur le palet. Nous conseillons de cultver la Mangu'Carot en intérieur à partir de boutures directement en 12/12 pour mieux les maitriser. Variété euphorisante idéale pour les lendemains difficiles... Ces semences sont à faire germer avec une bonne temperature tropicale

Landraces - Mangu'Carot - (Regular)
Landrace Mangu'Carot / Sativa 100% / int Flo: 100-120 days / Flo ext: October
The Mangu'Carot Landrace is the most common is the best known of the island of Reunion, with Malagasy, African and Indian strains that make Mangu'Carot strong variety terpene which, with good curing, this a fresh mango scent and a slight carrot taste on the palate. We recommend the cultver Mangu'Carot indoors from cuttings directly 12/12 to better control them. Euphoric ideal variety for hangovers ... that seed to germinate with good tropical temperatur


I google translated some stuff.

iirc the auto zamal in zamaldelica came from gypsy who got his stock from Christophe and is a perennial strain( yes, a perennial).

Plants that live from year to year, ranging from trees to dandelions

http://www.biology-online.org/dictionary/Perennial

The Zamal that Gerrit has ....was gifted to him in seed form by myself many years ago...

I aquired the seeds from a French grower/breeder on La Reuinion island in the Indian Ocean c

^gypsy

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=101916

Christophe's story is quite an interesting and rather romantic imo:

^^ http://www.cannabiscafe.net/foros/showthread.php/77629-especies-Protegidas?p=2322983#post2322983

fritzman claims to have recently reproduced the zamal from Christophe's stock sent to him by ...?

fritzman has the Christophe stock reproductions currently available from what I get from fritz ( like pulling teeth).

lots of ppl don't trust fritz. frankly, I don't trust him too much either. I did not buy vials of fitzman's sperm I hope he was honest and did a good replication/preservation run. I have run lots of his strain reproductions/preservations. he did not breed these strains. this strains were gifted to him via the generosity of others. some were excellent. many experienced landrace growers/members here at ic have run his preservation work and are very pleased. I have communicated with several of these members.
I have been pleased with what I got in the past from fritz. got my beans 4/4 times. buying seeds is a lottery/roll of the dice with most sources. he's a little flaky in his communication and zamalito (who worked with fritz) was very disheartened by fritz's breeding technique/integrity.

how hard is it to do a bean run? if you screw it up how hard is it to throw away the shit and start over?


there is only one way to find out. zamal ( up to 13 actual subs-trains of zamal from reunion from what I've read) is hard to fake. time will tell.

Seeds of Africa has the fruity ( fermented fruit terps) zamal available.


there is also a white wire and a red wire zamal iirc. there is a zamal strain called "dry foot" translated to English from French.
^ these are not currently available from what I've read.

there are multiple zamal hybrids currently available.

 

[Madjag]

Smoke Report Sample

Smoke Report Sample

@ThaiBliss

Here are some fairly detailed smoke report forms from another website. They may be too detailed, however they sort of summarize and point the way I think and could be adapted to y(our) use:

 

[Madjag]

 

[pinkus]

Leaf serration tells f%&*-all about origin!!!

Leaf serration tells f%&*-all about origin!!!

I'm SOOOOO tired of seeing people taking serration patterns as concrete evidence of lineage. It's NOT!!! (IMO) Even of the same plant leaf serration patterns vary.

Double serration looks cool and MAY be indicative of linage, but are no trail of breadcrumbs.


LOL it wasn't even this thread that set me off.

 

[satva]

Smoke report format

Smoke report format

I vote for Cannabisso's smoke report format. Smoke 5 joints and write a report. <lol>

I've been smoking quite a bit of Destroyer lately and it's awesome. It's my first time smoking Destroyer. Very strong stuff. Almost too strong for me.
It's euphoric, and you get very high after each joint, even if you smoke 5 joints per day.
It's pretty long lasting 3 hours +
It does have a destroying falloff though. You feel a bit exhausted at the end of the day after the 5th joint. That's the only drawback so far.
Makes the eyes very red.
Taste/odor : fruits, spices, pepper, vanilla

 

[purple clouds]

zustin's zamal is different then christophe's. I don't think anyone saved zustins version.

christophe worked the line only a couple generations before gypsy got them if memory serves me right. he supposedly stabilized the line more to increase the chances to find the super potent trippy plants.

 

[idiit]

in christophe's post on edge forum that I just posted Christophe was given a seeded branch from the mangue carrote that was more powerful than his favorite hazes and so trippy he had visual halucinations. these are the seeds that Christophe sent out per Christophe's post.

gypsy got his zamal beans from Christophe. dubi, mangus, others, perhaps fritzman got gypsy's seed stock which is why years ago fritz was stating that he (fritz) had Christophe's zamal.

delicatessen uses a different zamal according to a post here iirc from homero64 who is friends with someone close to Mario at deli seeds. Mario has the epic rene madre cut that is so beautiful and trippy that is predominately zamal/congo with a touch of mex ( r. Clarke's first lady oaxacan)..

the problem is that from what I've read the mangue-carotte is best after one or two years ( it's a perennial). not many of us have a tropical environment to reveg naturally the zamal. however we could keep it indoors and take cuts after one-two years but like dubi and I have posted the auto-flower cut is very difficult to keep alive. hermi free males of the auto flower perennial zamal mangue -carotte are also very difficult to get out of seed stock.

 

[JamieShoes]

i think youre pulling my leg eh

 

[Madjag]

in christophe's post on edge forum that I just posted Christophe was given a seeded branch from the mangue carrote that was more powerful than his favorite hazes and so trippy he had visual halucinations. these are the seeds that Christophe sent out per Christophe's post.

gypsy got his zamal beans from Christophe. dubi, mangus, others, perhaps fritzman got gypsy's seed stock which is why years ago fritz was stating that he (fritz) had Christophe's zamal.

delicatessen uses a different zamal according to a post here iirc from homero64 who is friends with someone close to Mario at deli seeds. Mario has the epic rene madre cut that is so beautiful and trippy that is predominately zamal/congo with a touch of mex ( r. Clarke's first lady oaxacan)..

the problem is that from what I've read the mangue-carotte is best after one or two years ( it's a perennial). not many of us have a tropical environment to reveg naturally the zamal. however we could keep it indoors and take cuts after one-two years but like dubi and I have posted the auto-flower cut is very difficult to keep alive. hermi free males of the auto flower perennial zamal mangue -carotte are also very difficult to get out of seed stock.

.....and Gerrit Slot of Magus Genetics got his Zamal seeds from Gypsy similarly.....he used them in his 2008 Masibindi (Zamal A x Warlock) as well as in his earlier 2005 cross, Warlock x (Zamal B x Warlock).....all of which hit ICMag's seed store in one way or another for a short window of time.