The Lounge : Growers Round Table Discussion Thread

[VortexPower420]

I mainly run into some trace or N shortages in mid flower.

I don't run a cootz mix. I am heavy in casting just because the worms have been chewing threw it for years.

I stay all of except a little cal N in early veg to get them going.

I'll post up my dry mix later. I don't focused on traces (something I need to work out more).

Went I have more time I post my methods. I'm trying to take from the "notill" world and mix it with nutrient dense practices. I have been trying to gain better insight to this for years and have reading or have been to seminars of the big agronomist.

I find the exact targeting of minerals to be a difficult task. Labs are all over the place, soils are different and our peat based mixes are something different.

I do believe and agree with all the ratio that people are using. I boost mn b Ca all the tricks to get the plant healthy and well feed. I just believe the microbes have a huge role in this and I try and mind them as much as possible.

 

[VortexPower420]

I do admire your guys math and the ratios you have come up with.

You guys have summed up some equations I was trying to figure out about density, ppm and ratios.

Thanks for that.

 

[maxmurder]

Great thread thanks for starting it.

 

[growingcrazy]

Vortex,have you ever tested your containers?

 

[paradoxlost]

Yep- unless I fed those worms myself, I can't trust it. There's only 1500 other sources of N or bacteria. I think the neem meal is groovy, though.

Neem meal is nice because it favors mineralisation of N reducing leaching

 

[VortexPower420]

No I haven't I know that is huge information hole in this whole thing and I am shooting in the dark.

I plan on pulling some this round. One from a under preforming pot and one from best pot.

 

[growingcrazy]

No luck getting Spectrum to weigh anything aside from the K3 tests.

So we need to break this down into smaller subjects...

Soil-
outdoor
indoor (yes indoors)

Soilless
Outdoor - Coots/los/peat base mediums
Indoor - peat and coco base mediums

Also would like to compile a list of terms/questions that can be answered, put in order and stuck to the first page of this thread.

Who wants to give there interpretation of getting K from 4% to 8% during flower? For example lets say K starts at 450 ppm @ 4%.

I know I am not the only one that is doing it...

 

[jidoka]

In peat/coco how do you guys acct for the organic material. It isn’t cec but it holds stuff.

Gypsum is a 2 edge sword. Exactly as mentioned earlier. Go too far and you will go to lockout hell. Take one pot of coco, add 1 lb per cubic ft of gypsum and see what happens

What if I said you are much more likely to have a k shortage in veg than flower...is that topic appropriate for this thread? What if I said I no longer use gypsum in soil less? Big question do you want me here at all?

Edit...if I am soilless and organic-ish I am Tom hill minus gypsum, not coot

 

[VortexPower420]

I March to the beat of my own drum really. I have never followed anyone's mix but my own

I have had mediocre runs but never a failure.

Jidoka I would like to here. I have been moving away from it a little more as I get my soil saturated with Ca.

I assume my problems are from Ca lock out, traces and a little P even though I have enough, or I think I do.

I don't test so I don't know my K to start so I can't say with any certainty what is happening but I have been soaking zeolite in k sulfate for a few days and then applying to the soil at 1 tsp gal of soil with 1 tsp of kelp. It has gotten rid of my K def in late flower and I think I can attribute it to a yield increase. Hard to say because I am not changing just one factor at a time

 

[growingcrazy]

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[VortexPower420]

Most mixes are not build correctly

 

[growingcrazy]

I March to the beat of my own drum really. I have never followed anyone's mix but my own

I have had mediocre runs but never a failure.

Jidoka I would like to here. I have been moving away from it a little more as I get my soil saturated with Ca.

I assume my problems are from Ca lock out, traces and a little P even though I have enough, or I think I do.

I don't test so I don't know my K to start so I can't say with any certainty what is happening but I have been soaking zeolite in k sulfate for a few days and then applying to the soil at 1 tsp gal of soil with 1 tsp of kelp. It has gotten rid of my K def in late flower and I think I can attribute it to a yield increase. Hard to say because I am not changing just one factor at a time

One test and guessing is no such thing. If I blind folded you at the door of the bar and told you to walk in shoot a bullseye, what are your odds? Now how about if you were stood in front of the board before being blind folded?

Good analogy?

 

[VortexPower420]

Total 100% my down fall right now. I don't even have a dart board to shoot at yet. I get that. When I get some more scratch it is on the agenda.

I want to bring both world together. I believehe maximum will be found rooted a good mineral base driving a robust microbial population creating a full loop.

I have a lot to catch up on from the other thread to be where you guys are at, but I am on my way.

The benefits of gypsum on a soil low in Ca is undeniable. I am seeing where the limit is now.

I really want to understand how peat soils act compared to true soils that most people have a understanding of how they work.

 

[growingcrazy]

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[slownickel]

First sample, end of week 4.
View Image

Second sample, end of week 10.
View Image

Looking better numbers wise at the end. I have plants vegging in the bed right now, sucking up all of that K.

As Jidoka noted earlier, K deficiency is a real thing as plants mature in veg. If you can get the Ca, B and Si into the plant early, a good sign it all worked is the K def. Just be prepared for it. I bring K up at the end of veg and then transplant into the soil bed that is saturated with K from the last flower run. This along with foliar/ drench Ca gets roots to explode quickly into the soilbeds.

This is how I run my LOS/No-till style soil bed. My garden for my personal...

Jidoka, you have a sample from one of the big name coco's? Or is everyone running direct source coco now?

That last sample has a calculated 13.5% K. I think you went a bit high... How do the plants look? You are doing this before flower?

Wow.

 

[growingcrazy]

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[jidoka]

So high Na, high K, high Al, high Fe, high Fe, k2o 2x p2o5, micros our of whack, ec way high.

However it happened this is anti slow soil. I would expect lock out from the get

 

[growingcrazy]

So high Na, high K, high Al, high Fe, high Fe, k2o 2x p2o5, micros our of whack, ec way high.

However it happened this is anti slow soil. I would expect lock out from the get

.

 

[jidoka]

I did not mean disrespect. It is so easy for this to happen.

A useful step would be to start a list of don’t use this:

1) basalt or any other rock dust
2) azomite
3) damn near all compost
4) damn near all ewc

Edit...and yea, maybe nobody has fucked up more than me. But that is how I learn

 

[growingcrazy]

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