The Haze discussion thread

[Ghost Protocol]

The genetics were mexican/colombian/s. India/ thai. Long time ago but i believe was said 16 gens inbred but also humbly admitted does not breed true. This was so far removed from the dutch scene at the time it bled honesty and i truly believe could have only been writen by Sam.

Adam from the CIA (aka thseeds) was the only other sum bitch who knew what breeding true even meant at the time lol. It was a classic experience haha. I hate the EU it sux nutz.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Positronics at the time had 2 kind of packs. One showcased the line with pic on the front (like that silly hand pollinated by the skunkman sk1 crap" and the other had a generic posi front with a reverse side with a buttload of lines listed on green background and they just checked the box what it was. The seed i got came in the latter type packs.

 

[TheDarkStorm]

Howdy Ghost, your entire position is based on your notion that Rob don't make mistakes?

So if Rob is going off what Sam originally told him, and you are saying Sam is lying, I am confused at how you take Rob for gospel.

With so much information, disinformation, and misinterpretations it is hard to believe any of it sometimes. Language is a funny thing. Just because someone refers to something as "the Thai like one", does not always mean there are Thai genetics in it. I do not think Sam is being intentionally misleading. Could there have been some mixups with seeds and labels once changed hands, of course. After I plant things and label there is always a moment where I wonder, did I fuck anything up?! Mistakes happen, but all things considered it does not seem like same is being misleading. He has said it is a three way Colombian on more than one occasion and said it was also hybridized with Thai and other genetics at varying points in history. That said, in the catalogs it was always distinct in labeling them as such.

I do find it intriguing that Sam subitted dozens of samples to Phylos, many of them quite unique and rare. A bunch of pure Colombian lines, but not one listed as Original Haze.

Nevil's Haze submission from Ace seeds shows no close relatives which struck me odd, while the Oldtimers Purple #23 and Green #19 highlight something fascanating. Both list each other under close relatives, and both list multiple Colombian Gold submissions as close relatives but the Purple #23 also shows a close relative with a Thai submission where the Green #19 does not! Two of the Colombian Gold submissions that they both share as relatives show Thai Stick as their relative in the galaxy as well! The other handful of Colombians do not. The two Colombians showing this shared Thai ancestry were submitted by Mel Frank and Ma Dang. The Thai Stick in the galaxy with the shared Colombian and Oldtimers haze relatives was subimtted by Ma Dang as well.


Hear me out you guys, could the common denominator be wacky weed, Colombian Black? Thai genetics grown in Colombia?

As to your quote from Sam, and not trying to speak for the man himself, but that could also be read as he likes the lime green hazes, maybe with a bit of (hybridized) Thai blood in them. He has continually stated that outcrossing Original Haze is where it truly shines, and crossing it with tropical sativas is where the magic really happens. It makes sense that he would have a preference for something like the lime green types, and sometimes those lime green types hybridized with some thai blood mixed in speaking of two totally different plants or lines.

What if TFD and Wernard got the hybridized packs or a mixed bag of seeds and the descriptions were loosely accurate?

What if you are right?

We will not know until we know, and until them we have the seeds and genetics that we have. That said, based on the reports coming out, there seems to be some pretty legit stuff coming out of Todds recent release by way of Sam. I look forward to seeing some of the samples of it shared with Phylos to see what it's closest relatives are. I am guessing Colombian and maybe a little Thai blood lol. Much love

Those tests were done on lines that had been worked and seperated by ace from one single surviving line of oldtimers haze.....oldtimer did have two other completely separate but in someway related lines of haze....all sourced from the same people at the same time ...and they had others....bit like northern lites 1-9...

I think the nevils haze and the Mauritius are the wrong way around on phylos

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Is that what he talking about? That stuffs for squares lol.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Its purt funny.

You guys: "big respect boss i swear i wont fuck it up"

Holders: yeah right pal have some shwag and hyp it up.

Its really what it has come to looks like.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Is that the group going around mutilating squirells?

 

[sbeanonnamellow]

Howdy Ghost, not for nothing, but how do you know they didn't just feed you what you wanted to hear and bagged up some THUNK or ThaiHaze (I mean how freaking cool would Thai x Original Haze be!) or whatever sativa leaning haze hybrid they had behind the counter.

If they were bound by some honor you must be pretty charismatic to pry some originals off of them if you are at the same time suggesting they were bound by an honor agreement with Sam to not sell them pure. To an unbiased onlooker, what seems more likely in that scenario? The shop going against a supposed agreement with their main supplier, or indulging the whims of a fleeting customer? No offense to your legendary status in cannabis history. A living legend, like so many on this forum.

And I am not disagreeing with you. I was not there. These are just quetsions I think when I read and piece the bits and pieces together from others first hand experience. I can not help but play devils advocate in this situation.

Earlier I mentioned that I do not think Sam is purposefully misleading people on the genetic origin of Original Haze as it is known to him, but I will not go as far to say that he sold pure Haze to resellers because it seems from what you wrote above and what I have read before, Sam did not want people knocking the haze off and selling it pure. So if we take that at face value, why would we even think Sam gave them pure seeds to begin with? When he talks about the resellers, I do not want to put exact words in his mouth but I want to say I remember him suggesting that he can not be sure of exactly what they were selling. A sort of plausible deniability?

For me, the thing is, Sam is the common denominator in all of this. All the magic haze, apart from the Oldtimers haze, comes for the most part through him. I fail to see the ulterior motive Sam would have by purposefully misleading people with the accurate pedigree and genetic lineage of Original Haze. I can see why someone may not want to release a pure line, but Sam seems genuinely enthusiastic about cannabis and how varieties express themselves across geographic locations. About their pedigree and lineage. I really believe him on the Original Haze being Colombian as it is known to him. Does that mean it is only Colombian lines or does that mean selections from Mexican/Colombian imports worked towards Colombian types by the brothers? Who the fuck knows.

Saving up for a pack of your gear through Breeders Retail! And like I say I do not think Sam is misleading us about the pedigree of Original Haze as it is known to him, I do not think you are misleading us about your experience at the Positronics shop or with your haze. Much love

 

[sbeanonnamellow]

Those tests were done on lines that had been worked and seperated by ace from one single surviving line of oldtimers haze.....oldtimer did have two other completely separate but in someway related lines of haze....all sourced from the same people at the same time ...and they had others....bit like northern lites 1-9...

I think the nevils haze and the Mauritius are the wrong way around on phylos

Appreciate this Those sourcing the genetics and working the Northern Lites (respect the spelling btw) and Haze lines back in the day deserve so much more credit than they get. Much love

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Howdy Ghost, not for nothing, but how do you know they didn't just feed you what you wanted to hear and bagged up some THUNK or ThaiHaze (I mean how freaking cool would Thai x Original Haze be!) or whatever sativa leaning haze hybrid they had behind the counter.

If they were bound by some honor you must be pretty charismatic to pry some originals off of them if you are at the same time suggesting they were bound by an honor agreement with Sam to not sell them pure. To an unbiased onlooker, what seems more likely in that scenario? The shop going against a supposed agreement with their main supplier, or indulging the whims of a fleeting customer? No offense to your legendary status in cannabis history. A living legend, like so many on this forum.

And I am not disagreeing with you. I was not there. These are just quetsions I think when I read and piece the bits and pieces together from others first hand experience. I can not help but play devils advocate in this situation.

Earlier I mentioned that I do not think Sam is purposefully misleading people on the genetic origin of Original Haze as it is known to him, but I will not go as far to say that he sold pure Haze to resellers because it seems from what you wrote above and what I have read before, Sam did not want people knocking the haze off and selling it pure. So if we take that at face value, why would we even think Sam gave them pure seeds to begin with? When he talks about the resellers, I do not want to put exact words in his mouth but I want to say I remember him suggesting that he can not be sure of exactly what they were selling. A sort of plausible deniability?

For me, the thing is, Sam is the common denominator in all of this. All the magic haze, apart from the Oldtimers haze, comes for the most part through him. I fail to see the ulterior motive Sam would have by purposefully misleading people with the accurate pedigree and genetic lineage of Original Haze. I can see why someone may not want to release a pure line, but Sam seems genuinely enthusiastic about cannabis and how varieties express themselves across geographic locations. About their pedigree and lineage. I really believe him on the Original Haze being Colombian as it is known to him. Does that mean it is only Colombian lines or does that mean selections from Mexican/Colombian imports worked towards Colombian types by the brothers? Who the fuck knows.

Saving up for a pack of your gear through Breeders Retail! And like I say I do not think Sam is misleading us about the pedigree of Original Haze as it is known to him, I do not think you are misleading us about your experience at the Positronics shop or with your haze. Much love

Believe you me brother all of that has crossed my mind too. But this is way before thunk and i would not trust even Sams thai stock its all gone man its all just a memory. Was not even in existence back then his thai he crossed out to haze later i bet my left nut is bogus otherwise it would have stuck. No man. Trust me when i say the shit he gave posi was some of his finest work i been trying for decades to top it to no avail. I think he prolly maybe still has the seed but he damn sure aint giving it out anymore lol. Even going as far as to pretend it does not exist.

 

[Donald Mallard]

Tom i think ypuve gone off on a tangent and your evidence is sketchy at best particularly if your using what hempy says or what a high times article says over what sam has said here,
has he lied about everything to us here on ic, i really doubt that.
You can message him and simply ask rather than going around in circles chasing your tail while disrespecting sam and hos word . Thats not so cool really.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

its funny sometimes how that happens in life eh. I have given some of you guys my very best stock too. Cbf is holding bigtime lol. I not gunna get butthurt about it we'll all be dead soon the truth is far more important than any of this other.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Tom i think ypuve gone off on a tangent and your evidence is sketchy at best particularly if your using what hempy says or what a high times article says over what sam has said here,
has he lied about everything to us here on ic, i really doubt that.
You can message him and simply ask rather than going around in circles chasing your tail while disrespecting sam and hos word . Thats not so cool really.

Don i dont give 2 shits what hempy or bigherb or nevil or any other sumbitch says i am telling you the truth as i know it from all info ever gleaned and i hold sams words in the highest.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Sam is telling you the truth but you have to be very astute to hear it mate.

 

[sbeanonnamellow]

Much of which is what makes you a true steward for the plant and that will never be forgotten. I sincerely mean that with a full heart and smile Tom.

That goes for wally too. I fuckin' love you man! There are literally living legends in the story of cannabis, so many right here in this forum, sharing their thoughts and opinions. What an absolute treat.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Tom i think ypuve gone off on a tangent and your evidence is sketchy at best particularly if your using what hempy says or what a high times article says over what sam has said here,
has he lied about everything to us here on ic, i really doubt that.
You can message him and simply ask rather than going around in circles chasing your tail while disrespecting sam and hos word . Thats not so cool really.

My definition of respect is to not call him on it to his face. Again. I am not off on a tangent Sam is. He must have good reason i reckon but me rob anybody who been alive for a minute must giggle a bit.

 

[Ghost Protocol]

Anyway i have full confidence that the cream will always rise to the top and have told you all full well where i think it will come from in Sams own words i happen to agree with. You can seek out some other natative up to you i have already placed my bet lol.

 

[@hempy]

Don i dont give 2 shits what hempy or bigherb or nevil or any other sumbitch says i am telling you the truth as i know it from all info ever gleaned and i hold sams words in the highest.

I thought we were friends Tom lol

 

[Ghost Protocol]

We are Hempy biglove brother

 

[Ghost Protocol]

I dont think it is possible for sam to have lost his best thai heavy haze stock i think there is something more secret going on here. Make no mistake though the last incarnation of haze was the best blows doors on that lumbo crap lol.

 

[@hempy]

What kind of pure lines is still growing in the areas the original haze seeds came from?. Why hasn't someone brought in new stock from these areas? . Has the quality diminished to the point it's not worth getting fresh seed stock?. If it's still good where are the seeds?. Are the older seeds 1970-1980 better than what is available today.

The US government spent billions if not trillions on the war on drugs but the cartels spread the seed far and wide by exporting cannabis.

Genetics we saw in the 70s still exist both in house and abroad from the locations they originated from.

The largest threat to these genetics was not the US Government but came more from the Dutch hybrids that people imported in.

You only need to look at Jamaica to see this you see NL plants Skunk plants growing were only sativas once grew.