Thumbs.
You can easily pick up these pots and see what they weigh.
Let the plants ask for water. How warm is it in there?
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Slownickel lounge, pull up a chair. CEC interpretation
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Thumbs.
You can easily pick up these pots and see what they weigh.
Let the plants ask for water. How warm is it in there?
Natural Farmer
New member
I thought Slownickel had mentioned this earlier in the thread. I think it does show however that Aluminum isn't only an issue in low pH soils. If I am wrong then my apologies.
brown_thumb
Active member
Yes, I estimate soil dampness by weight. Occasionally, I'll jam a finger in deep at the edge of a pot just to ensure I'm not misjudging weight but I'll stop doing this when I think the roots are growing near the outer perimeters of the pots. I wait for a few leaves to begin to droop before watering.
At this time of year it's high 40's F to mid 50's at night and high 60's to low 70's day. Humidity averages 50-80 percent. We do have cold snaps. As February approaches temperatures will rise. Hottest temps in summer during July and August are high 90's to low 100's with night temps in the mid to high 80's. Average humidity during hottest summer days is 20-30 percent and a bit higher at night. Early or late summer temps are approximately 90 day and 75 night with 30-60 percent humidity.
EDIT #1: It broke 80F today. We had a very mild winter despite two cold snaps that took us down to the mid teens once and mid twenties another time. We had a few weeks when nights reached low to mid 30's and days peaked low to mid 50's but I suspect we'll have an early and very warm spring. I'll bet I could move the larger plants outside in a couple of weeks but I'm afraid we might have another cold spell.
EDIT #2: I'm heating the grow box in winter and will move the plants to a cooled grow room in summer. When the indoor grow room is finished I doubt I'll ever bother with an outside or greenhouse grow again.
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C3 plants want cooler temperatures, so in the heat, folks need to learn to use some ammonia instead of nitrates. Most everyone is nitrate crazy in this industry. Even the organic guys with all those compost teas and working in high pH's have huge nitrate levels as ammonia is converted to nitrate by biology at high pH's.
This is why a lot of the indoor is so much nicer than most of the outdoor, never gets those heat extremes....
Hi guys
This is a very entertaining thread. Lots of good info too. Kudos for not devolving into the chaos of infinite regression into status-seeking that most organic soil discussions (anywhere) fall prey to.
Someday I will contribute my thoughts on the core topic of the thread, when I have time to do justice to the concepts I would like to discuss.
For now though, I had to jump in to point out that there are no woody trees that utilize C4 photosynthesis, including citrus. Almost all C4 plants are either grasses or sedges.
EDIT: Cannabis is not C4 either, nor are most crop plants, with the notable exceptions of maize, sugarcane and sorghum/millet, pineapples.
This is a very entertaining thread. Lots of good info too. Kudos for not devolving into the chaos of infinite regression into status-seeking that most organic soil discussions (anywhere) fall prey to.
Someday I will contribute my thoughts on the core topic of the thread, when I have time to do justice to the concepts I would like to discuss.
For now though, I had to jump in to point out that there are no woody trees that utilize C4 photosynthesis, including citrus. Almost all C4 plants are either grasses or sedges.
EDIT: Cannabis is not C4 either, nor are most crop plants, with the notable exceptions of maize, sugarcane and sorghum/millet, pineapples.
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plantingplants
Active member
Slow, is it not advisable to acidify a 7 pH soil to 6 with dilute sulfuric acid? Peat has too much Mg and elemental sulfur takes too much time.
There is more than enough S in gypsum to push Mg out. Realize you need a cation to push a cation. To lower the pH you can use citric acid, korean fruit enzymes, etc... sulfuric acid is nasty stuff and really does kill off all the soil biology. If you want to acidify stuff without plants... try it. I have NO experience acidifying in your mediums. Try it... one plant at a time though...
Personally, I don't like sulfuric acid. Everyone here that started with it, didn't like it and has given it up.
Ho much citric acid is applied along with nutrients to bring down the Ph ?, any calculation followed or just measure PH after small doses of application
What do you suggest to buy if I wanted to try out the Korean Fruit Enzymes to lower the ph? Only real korean fruit I could buy is the Korean Pear. Its the same shape as A Fuji Apple, but its brown/tan in color. I've actually germinated seeds from them before. I dont think the plant liked the enviroment/climate I live in. lol What store would I most likely find some of this stuff at?
Korean fruit enzymes its just a fancy name of fermentation. Ferment apple juice to get apple cider vinegar, which will have enzymes as well. I.think the main difference is in acids, lactic, acetic, citric which all.depends on microbes and.raw materials. I think citric acid is more.suitable for plants as it isnaturally excreted by plants to harvest nutrients
So I only usually mix 1-Gallon of water at A time if I need to feed the girls.. Ive recently been using citric acid since lemon juice wasnt holding long enough..
I start by sprinkling the smallest amount after I put it what ever else im using. Then I shake the Jug, and Aerate it for 5-10min before checking the ph.. I keep doing that and adding more citric if needed.. I know its kind of a long process but I just dont want to add to much. Plus I can make sure its the exact ph I want, not a tenth over or under.
plantingplants
Active member
Re:field soil weight vs our soil.. At what moisture level do they derive their 2 million pound figure? Field moist or bone dry? Because if we are going to compare the two weights then that's significant.
Get this: my soil is 82% lighter than field soil!
75% if i assume they weighed the field soil at a moisture level exactly between saturated and bone dry.
Still, that's crazy.
Edit: turns out the 2 mil lb slice figure is dry weight (via leadsled). 82% lighter! Gawd damn
Get this: my soil is 82% lighter than field soil!
75% if i assume they weighed the field soil at a moisture level exactly between saturated and bone dry.
Still, that's crazy.
Edit: turns out the 2 mil lb slice figure is dry weight (via leadsled). 82% lighter! Gawd damn
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plantingplants
Active member
....
Wait so I am a little confused-- they are sifting out the peat and not testing it? Isn't it the peat in our mix that is holding the most cations?
plantingplants
Active member
Fyi, they will rerun samples a la k3 for $10 if they still have some of your dirt.
plantingplants
Active member
So here are two results from the same sample plus the base distros I calculated with AA8.2 Ca- the first is the scooped results, the second is weighed and whatever else they do for k3. This soil is roughly 80% lighter than 2,000,000 lb acre soil.
CEC .. 17.7*
K 0.93 .. 5.2%*
Mg 4.4 .. 24.8%*
Ca 12.2 .. 68%*
Na 0.19 .. 1%*
40.1 cec
74% ca
20% mg
4% K
0.6% na
Very confused as to why some numbers didn't move at all. Like fe.. 1 ppm??? Doesn't make sense to me.
CEC .. 17.7*
K 0.93 .. 5.2%*
Mg 4.4 .. 24.8%*
Ca 12.2 .. 68%*
Na 0.19 .. 1%*
40.1 cec
74% ca
20% mg
4% K
0.6% na
Very confused as to why some numbers didn't move at all. Like fe.. 1 ppm??? Doesn't make sense to me.
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Realize that anything over 100 ppm of Fe is considered problematic.... Put a magnet to that medium when it is super dry and see what happens. Look for any powders...
Many soils in the world are iron based. Need lots of Mn.
There are some soils in the world that are nearly balanced when it comes to Fe and Mn.
And there are a very few parts of the world have more Mn than Fe (and they have by far, the highest yields in the world pretty much across the board). Not saying you can't do it on an Fe soil, just you need to stay on the Mn twice a week at the soil level and maintain your foliars with Mn as well.
Sweet! I have a used hard cover version... I wonder if the cover you have was the original cover or a recent addition by Growers, who is selling copies of the book...
How are the pictures inside?
Yo BD!
It works great! I do it a lot, always with a tad of something else.... The idea is using a small bit of EWC you can wash it in evenly.... just make sure you know what is in those EWC first! If you can find one that is not toxic in iron, that would be the best......
Response is what you are looking for! You have a good eye! Go with it!
Now... one caution. You will see response to Mg to the soil quite often.... don't do it. You will see great response to heavy nitrates, don't do it! There are repercussions if you use your eye blindly!
Congrats on the new baby!!!!
It works great! I do it a lot, always with a tad of something else.... The idea is using a small bit of EWC you can wash it in evenly.... just make sure you know what is in those EWC first! If you can find one that is not toxic in iron, that would be the best......
Response is what you are looking for! You have a good eye! Go with it!
Now... one caution. You will see response to Mg to the soil quite often.... don't do it. You will see great response to heavy nitrates, don't do it! There are repercussions if you use your eye blindly!
Congrats on the new baby!!!!
thats classic, thanks for the laugh
https://www.dynamicgreens.com/app/uploads/2014/11/more-food-from-soil-science.pdf
thats classic, thanks for the laugh
https://www.dynamicgreens.com/app/uploads/2014/11/more-food-from-soil-science.pdf
Funny sense of humor you have.
My original copy also has black and white photos. I was not nor am I currently sure that all the versions came out in black and white or not.
We all have the digital copy already, I have been handing it out for years.
Like many though, both BD and myself prefer to have a book instead of reading off a computer or a printed version.
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