MotherLode Gardens 2017

[Ibechillin]

Thanks for checking this out Mushroombrew.

The wilted branch that i removed i disected after removing to be sure it wasnt stem borers. Branch inner tissue was perfect all the way throughout except at the very end where it was connected to the main stalk was brown and starting to get soft.

Pretty sure i have fusarium, figured i would let you diagnose Schrews issues because you have experience with this stuff.

 

[mushroombrew]

Your welcome. Yes seems to be Fusarium. It usually get worse. Make sure you discard plant material. Don't leave it laying around. It spreads viciously
Potassium Silicate slows it down.
I used bleach to treat infection sites topically. Saved 70% of my crop.
It is a strong oxidizer. Much better than H2O2.
I'll take you through it if you like.
Just helped another guy with fusarium wilt in Coco.
Man so much Fusarium this year?!

 

[MedResearcher]

Broads: Google Everwood Farm, can order a 100 pack of Swirski Mite satchels. Hang a couple satchels on each tree inside the canopy. Healthy seed plants in organic soil should resist them fairly well on their own and hopefully give the predators time to win the battle.

Keeping the plants cleaned out really helps as well.


Drooping tops: The drooping tops is a hard call. Could need a deeper watering. Years ago I had it on a huge Blue Dream. I assumed it was over watering, so I backed off a bit. It got worst. Eventually I dug the tree up. The top 6... 8 inches of soil was moist, below that the soil was bone dry. No way to say for sure, but I would guess a deep watering, and also some top dressing this time of year helps them through the stretch.


Wilt: Wilt is really scary, can be devastating. Could use mycostop as a preventative measure. Afaik it kills off all other fungus's, which is not ideal since you try to promote good fungal activity. Although less fungal activity and no wilt, is better than fungus and dead plants.

Might not be a wilt either. On huge trees occasionally I see the branch's knuckle up at the joint. The wind slowly works it back and forth and the knuckle grows and grows. Eventually the knuckle simply pops the branch out of the stalk. Very random though, one branch here, maybe a second over there. So for me its never been a factor, very very minimal loss. Although if it seems like it is spreading, and more than one here and there, it most likely is something more serious.

Fusarium will start with the lowest branch on the plant. Wilt the top of it, and proceed down it until the branch is a goner. Then move to the next higher branch on the stalk. Progressively killing the entire tree. The effect are much more drastic during the heat of the day, where in the morning and evening it might not even wilt much at all, but come noon, it looks like shit.

Stay up Screws, these are normal problems most if not all big tree growers deal with. I remember Tom Hill saying how growing large trees was the most challenging way to grow Cannabis. No wonder almost all of the large farms are shifting to light dep. So much easier to keep a plant healthy for 10-12 weeks compared to 32-36 weeks!

Mr^^

 

[Ibechillin]

Your welcome. Yes seems to be Fusarium. It usually get worse. Make sure you discard plant material. Don't leave it laying around. It spreads viciously
Potassium Silicate slows it down.
I used bleach to treat infection sites topically. Saved 70% of my crop.
It is a strong oxidizer. Much better than H2O2.
I'll take you through it if you like.
Just helped another guy with fusarium wilt in Coco.
Man so much Fusarium this year?!

Ive been following what you posted in the plants dying overnight thread, 100ml bleach to 900ml water and spray on infected area very lightly, being careful not to overspray/let it soak into the soil.

 

[EastBayGrower]

without a doubt the change into flowering (late july-early august) is the most stressful time for these plants, if there's anything wrong thats when its gonna show up, atleast thats what ive heard in lectures and seen somewhat firsthand..

those mites are just bad luck, your scaring me, survive the fire just to get russets a week later WTF! mites could have come from anyone of the many firetrucks that came from all over the western US into the county... scares me just thinking abouth the hitchhikers...

good thing you got rid of the the effected branches at first site, hopefully itll stop em in there tracks, only got another week or two before spraying with oils will mess with the final product, unless your do some thoughrou washes with the firehose after... good luck in the fight..

 

[redlaser]

july is always a difficult month here it seems, and this year was no different. Apart from the rodent damage, there seems to be 3 different problems that we are experiencing now

1. Drooping tops - a few plants are drooping from the top down. the main growth tip is affected but the lateral branches seem fine. I've seen this before, it is a recurring problem. seems to stunt vertical growth but not lateral growth. possible soil imbalance or virus?

2. Wilting/dying branches - I've found scattered instances of dying/wilting lower branches on big plants, with no visible cause. It appears the joint where the affected branch meet the main stalk is soft... the wilting branches pull right off the stalk easily. leaving a hole/indentation. Seems to be limited to lower branches and does not seem to be spreading. possible infection or virus?

3. Just this morning we discovered what appears to be russet mite damage on a few lower branches of a very large plant. This is a big problem, i've never seen damage like this at this location. Not sure where the plants could have picked up mites , everything is from seed. I am still worried the damage will spread. I cut off the affected branches and am going to spray wettable sulfur, followed by essential oils. Also ordered some predator mites. Daily inspections will tell whether the treatment is effective.


I wish i could figure out how to get through this part of the season without having problems every year. it's really depressing seeing a perfectly healthy garden begin to deteriorate, especially when i dont know why.

Bummer on the plant loss, no small thing.
How much water are the problem plants getting a week? Mounds will help somewhat with drainage, but they can be overwatered like anything else. My armchair guess would be more water than they can process, leading to pythium/phytophra probably with the dead and dying tissue.
If I remember right at least one of these issues happened last year about this time. Excess water can take a while to show symptoms, and July would be about right. Only you know how much you water, but I remember last year you said some amount that I thought was a lot.

Anyway, they make inexpensive digital meters that home depo sells that go on hoses to count gallons used. Or measure what the dripper does in an hour. I would dig into the mound a little to see how wet it is.
Probably let them dry out if that seems like it could be the issue. Watering is a balancing act between too much and not enough, not always easy. I'd rather let plants slightly dry, or only give them slow deep watering every 4-8 days depending in size.

Mites can travel on wind and insects and clothing, pet hair. They wont attack healthy plants generally in my experience. I found some on a container grown plant of mine in a poorly made organic mix last week. Next to that plant are healthy plants in a better mix. No mites on those plants.
I would guess the plant with mites is in that latest mix you got that had some fert imbalances.

Sometimes branches that slowly die have been partially broken by birds or wind, but they won't have soft brown areas where the branch broke. Two weeks between sulpher and oil treatments.



And Avid, Floramite, and Forbid are for ornamental plants, not for human consumption, and for sure no tests have ever been done to determine if it's safe to smoke those pesticides.

 

[Shcrews]

The russet mite damage appeared on a very healthy large plant in the middle of a plot surrounded by healthy plants. I also discovered a few plants in the native soil plot that seem to have the same kind of damage. i sprayed sulfur today. will spray sulfur again tomorrow as well as essential oils. may also do a foliar feed.

The wilting hasn't seemed to spread since i removed the affected lower branches. it may be fusarium i am not sure. Wilting branches has occurred on 3 or 4 plants in mounds, none are very exposed. The plants in native soil seem unaffected by the wilting.

top droop... i think this may be overwatering as redlaser suggested. definitely not stem borers. I try to not overwater this season, have been giving a few days between waterings but it's always hard to judge in the mounds. most of the plants seem fine so not sure why only a few would be affected.

I'll take some pictures of the problem plants tomorrow

 

[redlaser]

You have big plants, but that straw will really help keep the top from drying out. I've got four inches of straw and the soil never really dries out. Watering every 5 days at a gallon per square foot with drip. My plants are younger, about half of yours. I don't use moisture meters but they might help you. I usually just stick my finger in the ground to gauge moisture levels. Maybe deeper to know more, not a big hole, won't hurt the plant.

Best rule of thumb, if it's wet don't water, creates nutrient intake issues, disease. and if temps drop losses will increase.

 

[Shcrews]

You have big plants, but that straw will really help keep the top from drying out. I've got four inches of straw and the soil never really dries out. Watering every 5 days at a gallon per square foot with drip. My plants are younger, about half of yours. I don't use moisture meters but they might help you. I usually just stick my finger in the ground to gauge moisture levels. Maybe deeper to know more, not a big hole, won't hurt the plant.

Best rule of thumb, if it's wet don't water, creates nutrient intake issues, disease. and if temps drop losses will increase.

i'm well aware of this. i have been trying hard not to overwater this year but it's difficult to gauge the correct amount in the mounds when the plants needs and weather are both constantly changing. Anyway i'm still not sure the top-droop symptoms are due to overwatering but it is a decent guess. If it is overwatering then i dont know why only a few scattered plants would be affected, my drip system waters every mound evenly.

 

[Dog Star]

Wish best,off course to beat those pests fast and totaly..

never sees broads on mine plants but i read they are mofos,not wish them ever..

Good also those fires avoided your garden,it was some serious news that days..
and i sees your pics here.. its a third year i read your thread and i will be sorry
if i sees you loose your crop after so much work and sweat..

Positiv vibes your way Shcrews,hope you made great and safe..

 

[EasyGoing]

Mites can come from the soil you ordered as well. The two main sources imo are clones and soil. Then you have friends, wind and birds, ext ext.

One of the better tools I have used to fight russets is Nuke Em. Expensive for gardens our size, but worth every penny. Hit them hard now, cause once buds form its almost impossible to knock them back. Good luck.

 

[mushroombrew]

Ive been following what you posted in the plants dying overnight thread, 100ml bleach to 900ml water and spray on infected area very lightly, being careful not to overspray/let it soak into the soil.

Well he tried it. The only negative compound formed is NaOH. But it takes a lot more than is in a squick spray to damage a plant.

Basically it sterilizes the "wound". Pathogens slow down and plant can recover.

So far I had success. And Another chap has 8 days left and is trying to make it!

 

[EastBayGrower]

top droop... i think this may be overwatering as redlaser suggested. definitely not stem borers. I try to not overwater this season, have been giving a few days between waterings but it's always hard to judge in the mounds. most of the plants seem fine so not sure why only a few would be affected.

I'll take some pictures of the problem plants tomorrow

you could always use the old bamboo stick al the way down to the bottom of the mound and you can just pull it out and see where the bamboo is still wet... im trying to do a full drench every couple/3 days now, but give a lil water daily to keep the soil cap moist in these 100+ days...

one nice change is the weather has really cooled off nicely

 

[jidoka]

Is sulfur and oil a safe combination right on top of each other? My memory aint for shit but I seem to think that is a no no for some reason

Spray that sulfer when the sun is going down, every other night for 3 or 4 times. I have seen that work. And I know guys that do sulfer burns all the time...they still don't have a clue what a russet mite is

 

[mushroombrew]

i'm well aware of this. i have been trying hard not to overwater this year but it's difficult to gauge the correct amount in the mounds when the plants needs and weather are both constantly changing. Anyway i'm still not sure the top-droop symptoms are due to overwatering but it is a decent guess. If it is overwatering then i dont know why only a few scattered plants would be affected, my drip system waters every mound evenly.

Can you post a pic of the droop. I'm definitly curious.

 

[plantingplants]

I wouldn't spray anything you plan to ingest with Forbid, unless you want cancer, tumors, or fucked up mutations. Forbid is a hard core chemical not made for consumption, I'd avoid it at all costs.

https://www.domyownpestcontrol.com/msds/Forbid 4F Ornamental Label.pdf

Forbid is manufactured by Bayer, one of the leading chemical manufacturers and the owner if Monsanto. That should say enough.

Please dont use forbid!!!

? what ??? What are you talking about with cancer and tumors and mutations? Forbid is oberon at a higher strength. Look at Oberon. Safe for food, with some pre-harvest intervals as low as 3 days. Low mammalian toxicity, which is the same status as omri approved spinosad.

Can you back up your claims with some facts?

 

[EasyGoing]

PP - Look at the banned list of substances for cali. Both Forbid, and spinosad are on the list now...... Not arguing if one is bad for your health or not, but just being banned alone is enough for me not to use it.

Essential oils and sulfur I believe is ok, but don't quote me on that. Need oil and the likes is no bueno.

Jidoka, I hope you never find out what a russet mite is.


Hate to say it Screws, but all these folks seem to have not fotten the borg before. Whatever you do, if it's organic, you will be spraying every three days apart, or every day IMO. Russets lay eggs in the leafs, where spray doesn't effect eggs. In the heat of summer with our temps, these buggers are reproducing three times a day......... So add that up..... Population regrowth three time a day, and sprays wont effect eggs........ Yea, it sucks.

Worst part, is if you don't get on top of it now, you wont stand a chance. So, IMO. Don't spray this or that this week and stand back. Spray anything and everything daily for two weeks. Things that worked for me in the past is Nuke Em, use up to the day of harvest 6-8tbl per gallon. Essencial oils at 30 drops a gallon with spreader, but I only trust "Now organic and Pure" brand as I have tested them. If you don't, many of those sprays will have at least spinosad in it, and you will fail your concentrates at a minimum. Sulfer I heard works, but never tried it. DE works, food grade 6 tbl per gallon of water foliar. I try to spray daily, but take Sundays off if possible. IF that is the case, spray your DE last, so it has a chance to stay on the plant and work for the time in between sprays. Creates super sharp shards that the bugs will be shredded by.

Key to every foliar application is complete wetness. Drench those girls down like a wet t contest. Spray at night or AM when temps are below 80.

 

[redlaser]

i'm well aware of this. i have been trying hard not to overwater this year but it's difficult to gauge the correct amount in the mounds when the plants needs and weather are both constantly changing. Anyway i'm still not sure the top-droop symptoms are due to overwatering but it is a decent guess. If it is overwatering then i dont know why only a few scattered plants would be affected, my drip system waters every mound evenly.

As far as why one mound/ plant is affected and not another, could be a few things. i would measure how much different mounds are getting with a one gallon under an emitter for an hour.. unless all mounds are on the same level with the same pressure, there can be more water going to lower mounds and sometimes less to the higher ones and the last ones on the line. The mounds closest to the source of water always get the highest amount. I know it's supposed to be equal but I've found it's not.
The plants showing symptoms may not be able to drain as well because of shelf rock or clay affecting them more.
I still think you'll have a killer year there, place is impressive this year and was in the past as well.
I don't think it's likely you would have fusarium or phytophora diseases without the water issues, so letting them dry more between waterings would help to keep that from accelerating. Your finger is your friend, if it's damp when you stick it in it doesn't need water.

 

[cbcool]

? what ??? What are you talking about with cancer and tumors and mutations? Forbid is oberon at a higher strength. Look at Oberon. Safe for food, with some pre-harvest intervals as low as 3 days. Low mammalian toxicity, which is the same status as omri approved spinosad.

Can you back up your claims with some facts?

Ok maybe cancer and mutations are bid extreme, I was amped up from having a pesticide debate with a friend.

But, it says right on the label, "do not use on vegetables. .., do not use on plants intended for feed or forage... do not use on fruits or nuts..."

If you can't eat it why would you want to smoke it? But thats just my logic.

 

[EastBayGrower]

whats the K meter saying? you measure brix? just curious...