It's the Climate, stupid

[Jericho Mile]

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Nmsnf Hermits Peak Fire - Hermits Peak Canyon Calf Fire Update July 22, 2022 News for

inciweb.nwcg.gov

The burn boss is liable. Government lawyers do not come to your aid. I cleaned up the aftermath in Las Alamos…when that prescribed burn got away and nearly got into town. People lost their jobs on that one.

Spent a month there in the cold of November…dropping hazard trees off the road leading up to Palijarama ski park

That was gnarly cutting…deep snow…cold as fuck…ugly…aged 6 month…fire damaged monsters. I saw blue paint marking in my sleep. Must have personally dropped a 100+ B and C (pumpkins) class trees…and another 100+ smaller A class. Think we ran 5 saw teams.

2019 was back up there in summer…truck camping and running the ski park. Amazing how it recovers. Great trails around the perimeters of ancient volcanos. Bad ass.

* spent time looking for my friend’s crew belt buckle…that he lost in the timber and snow…on that assignment. Almost 20 yrs later…didn’t find it…but I did remember and found a couple of my felling work areas. Trees decomposing. Lots of regrowth. My falling pattern seemed to work…erosion control and all

 

[Three Berries]

Statistics have only been calculated since 1983

But records go back a long time. I bet Google even shows it. How I bout I show it for you. Should I do a Google that For Me link???????

If I found the time I could get a few more articles and pictures. But I am comfy with my viewpoints.

 

[Jericho Mile]

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…now you believe you’re donald trump. perfect.

 

[Three Berries]

 

[Jericho Mile]

Yup. He's a religious zealot.

….garden variety fanatic.

 

[Jericho Mile]

….about 70some years ago…we developed technology…and a “put forest fires out” ideology. Your chart there…may indicate this move.

Was it the science of its day to implement such a plan?

 

[Three Berries]

….about 70some years ago…we developed technology…and a “put forest fires out” ideology. Your chart there…may indicate this move.

Was it the science of its day to implement such a plan?

LOL you better get busy using it then if it's so much doom and gloom. Too bad they can't use the old forest cleanup procedures that kept the fires down.

 

[Cannavore]

Bjorn Lomborg is not a climate scientist. He's a Koch funded author connected to global conservative round table groups.

 

[Jericho Mile]

LOL you better get busy using it then if it's so much doom and gloom. Too bad they can't use the old forest cleanup procedures that kept the fires down.

What like chipping/thinning and prescribed burns…and natural Fire Use fires? All those tactics are being used widely on every National Forest and most State lands.

We had a fire use lightening strike that was monitored and guided over 120,000 acres last year.

You can’t do that when there are subdivisions in the way

Your generalizations are the weakness of your logic…well besides…being guided by bias.

75 plus years of fire suppression…along with long drought cycles…and more people building homes on forest boundaries….why this cycle is blooming

Cause and Effect

You don’t even realize when you’re not in an argument….Hempy Berry

 

[h.h.]

 

[Jericho Mile]

Bjorn Lomborg is not a climate scientist. He's a Koch funded author connected to global conservative round table groups.



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There’s no such thing as “Mega Fires” That’s a media thing. Hype. It’s not a professional term. Nobody…but the media talks like that. When you see “Mega” the hyperbole is on cue

 

[buzzmobile]

I’ll take Oaxaca

I'll second that.

 

[St. Phatty]

There’s no such thing as “Mega Fires” That’s a media thing. Hype. It’s not a professional term. Nobody…but the media talks like that. When you see “Mega” the hyperbole is on cue

More recently, they drag out the term "Mega" when the burned acreage goes over 100K.

What bugs me is the way they do burn piles.

They build the piles, then let them sit, for months and years.

So animals build their homes in the piles.

Then the humans return and torch the piles, burning the animals alive.

I strip everything I burn when I burn it, and sure it's a little bit of work, stripping the bark off so the animals can go on their way.

But it's better than burning them alive.

 

[Jericho Mile]

More recently, they drag out the term "Mega" when the burned acreage goes over 100K.

What bugs me is the way they do burn piles.

They build the piles, then let them sit, for months and years.

So animals build their homes in the piles.

Then the humans return and torch the piles, burning the animals alive.

I strip everything I burn when I burn it, and sure it's a little bit of work, stripping the bark off so the animals can go on their way.

But it's better than burning them alive.

The thing with burning piles…and prescribed burns in general…is that…there are a lot of environmental rules…and very small windows in weather, time, and available personnel…when burns can be done effectively…and with little danger of escape.

It’s very tricky. As a Fire dude…I didn’t get paid more for prescribed burns…less…because they are controlled burns…no hazard pay…and as a burn boss…I would be liable if shit got out of hand. Legally liable. What’s my motivation to be in charge?

Nothing is simple. There are many angles…especially when you put people and property first. Prescribed burns are expensive too….and there are inz and outz to the politics of getting the funding…the term “burning for dollars”

“Mega”Rainbows over a morning garden…monsoonal flow 6000’

 

[h.h.]

The area, just north of a YMCA camp, covered 173 acres, but NBC News found that because each step of work is reported separately, those acres were entered into the database multiple times.

They first appeared in 2016, when the Forest Service assigned workers to cut trees to reduce the area’s density. The agency came back two years later, pruning the remaining trees and piling the cut wood across the full 173 acres, then chipping 52 acres of it. A few months later, workers burned 18 acres of the piles.

The pruning, piling, chipping and burning were entered as separate items in the database and the agency reported them as 416 acres of treated land in its 2019 fiscal year totals to Congress. In summer 2021, it burned the remaining 155 acres of piles, reporting them in that year’s totals.

The Forest Service’s efforts ultimately reduced fire risk on 173 acres of land, but they were reported to Congress as 744 acres over four fiscal years.

The nation’s largest fire agency sent Congress 'misleading data' on its risk reduction program for years

At the nation’s largest fire agency, the program to reduce wildfire fuel is receiving much-needed investment. But for 20 years, it has tracked that work with “misleading data.”

www.nbcnews.com

 

[Jericho Mile]

Fire on the Federal level is a hustle for dollars…but not…as much as…the Green Industry and the Human Caused Climate Change campaigns.

There’s the real parallel

 

[moose eater]

I'm sorry. Many fires out west are set by arsonist. I don't have to look it up as I have read several news reports over the years addressing the issue. Denying it is a major cause is a personal issue.

In California there were several fires that devoured row after row of houses and left all the trees.

Forest fires are way down from a 100 years ago.

Huh? Alaska's as 'out west' in the US as a person can get without eating a regular diet of borscht. We're so far west that we're DAMNED near east.

And the VAST majority of our wildfires are caused by lightning.... And I DID look it up....

So many lightning strikes, in fact, that studies of lightning involving fire, EMP, etc., have been done here. Those folks 'looked it up' too.

 

[moose eater]

Huh? Alaska's as 'out west' in the US as a person can get without eating a regular diet of borscht. We're so far west that we're DAMNED near east.

And the VAST majority of our wildfires are caused by lightning.... And I DID look it up....

So many lightning strikes, in fact, that studies of lightning involving fire, EMP, etc., have been done here. Those folks 'looked it up' too.

By the way, our forest fire season used to run from about mid-to-late June into August or so. Now, take a peek into the expansion of 'fire season' here, as well as in the Yukon Territory (our neighbors to the east in Canada) this summer, as well as the recent decades, and you'll see we've been burning up here for a while, and it's not our traditional seasonal patterns.

 

[St. Phatty]

By the way, our forest fire season used to run from about mid-to-late June into August or so. Now, take a peek into the expansion of 'fire season' here, as well as in the Yukon Territory (our neighbors to the east in Canada) this summer, as well as the recent decades, and you'll see we've been burning up here for a while, and it's not our traditional seasonal patterns.

Hard to get data about "Worst Wildfire year for Alaska", in terms of acres burned.

I have the impression that New Mexico and Alaska are having "worst ever" wildfire years.

Of course, there are different ways to assess it.

The McKinley Fire in California so far has killed 5 people. Not city slickers who got caught in the wrong place. Rural residents who did know better, and still got caught by the fire.

The way that the fire + rain produced a sludge that got washed into the river and killed all the fish. Maybe that's one of those things that has always happened.

I don't think that Americans really understand what is happening in terms of the term, "The Pyrocene", that has been created to describe the onset of fire that started maybe in 2017, and has basically not stopped since then.

They still think that an airplane, powered by fossil fuel, carrying water or Red Nitrate Slushies will be there to Save the Day.

At some point they will learn to make their homes completely fire proof.

But I don't think that will happen until a lot more Americans get the Crispy Critter treatment. i.e. they will experience a genuine emergency, e.g. failure of an escape route from an incoming wildfire. And instead of 80+ casualties like in the Camp Fire in California, it will be a much bigger casualty number.

I expect it will have to be truly shocking before people change their behavior relative to fire.

e.g. wholesale replacement of wood decks with metal decks, and re-planting of front lawns with Creeping Myrtle or Cactus, i.e. plants that don't become a fire hazard when there's no water to water them.

I still see amazingly stupid behavior Fire Wise - even from Rural residents who sort of think "city slicker". e.g. they spend time & money to remove Live Green blackberry - which is no danger in the current fire year. It doesn't burn and doesn't need water.

My neighbor paid a gardener to remove non-flammable Creeping Myrtle, and now that area is filled with Dead Dry Grass. They spend time land-scaping and made the area MORE flammable because they were/ are stupid about plants and how they relate to wildfire.

When it was Creeping Myrtle, you could throw lit matches there and nothing would happen. Now they have another 50 yards of road-front property that is vulnerable to someone throwing the proverbial lit cigarette.

 

[moose eater]

Hard to get data about "Worst Wildfire year for Alaska", in terms of acres burned.

I have the impression that New Mexico and Alaska are having "worst ever" wildfire years.

Of course, there are different ways to assess it.

The McKinley Fire in California so far has killed 5 people. Not city slickers who got caught in the wrong place. Rural residents who did know better, and still got caught by the fire.

The way that the fire + rain produced a sludge that got washed into the river and killed all the fish. Maybe that's one of those things that has always happened.

I don't think that Americans really understand what is happening in terms of the term, "The Pyrocene", that has been created to describe the onset of fire that started maybe in 2017, and has basically not stopped since then.

They still think that an airplane, powered by fossil fuel, carrying water or Red Nitrate Slushies will be there to Save the Day.

At some point they will learn to make their homes completely fire proof.

But I don't think that will happen until a lot more Americans get the Crispy Critter treatment. i.e. they will experience a genuine emergency, e.g. failure of an escape route from an incoming wildfire. And instead of 80+ casualties like in the Camp Fire in California, it will be a much bigger casualty number.

I expect it will have to be truly shocking before people change their behavior relative to fire.

e.g. wholesale replacement of wood decks with metal decks, and re-planting of front lawns with Creeping Myrtle or Cactus, i.e. plants that don't become a fire hazard when there's no water to water them.

I still see amazingly stupid behavior Fire Wise - even from Rural residents who sort of think "city slicker". e.g. they spend time & money to remove Live Green blackberry - which is no danger in the current fire year. It doesn't burn and doesn't need water.

My neighbor paid a gardener to remove non-flammable Creeping Myrtle, and now that area is filled with Dead Dry Grass. They spend time land-scaping and made the area MORE flammable because they were/ are stupid about plants and how they relate to wildfire.

When it was Creeping Myrtle, you could throw lit matches there and nothing would happen. Now they have another 50 yards of road-front property that is vulnerable to someone throwing the proverbial lit cigarette.

I've been criticized for the fire-break around our home, but I've worked on forest fires and watched as lit debris traveled over 1/2-mile on the up-draft from the heat of the forest floor. Stuff that makes a conifer tree going up sound like a jet engine gaining rpm's, before it goes 'WHOOSH!!' like a Roman candle, shooting up abruptly from the bottom to the top. Spectacular stuff from up-close, providing your feet aren't melting..

There are spray foam kits available in a number of sizes, and can be applied to a structure similarly as larger mobile equipment might be used to apply similar substances to an aircraft, but not mechanized, per say, and smaller.. But a fire-break and (even, if possible) a secondary, underground, gray-water holding facility (no solids) with a high output trash pump attached, would be the ticket. We used to dream of such set-ups years ago, when we had more energy than money.

The Clear (Alaska) fire (a current fire), if I heard correctly, took over 70 structures (?), one of which (at least one) was a year-round cabin. Articles in the paper about the uses and dreams folks had re. their properties.

If you bring up a fire map of either the Yukon Territory or Alaska, the number of fire symbols, status, and size can become pretty impressive.

Here's one example of such a link.

Yukon Fire maps interactive

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