Coco Tree's

[BongJohnSilvers]

Thanks for the great info DMJ! I started running my humidity at 65% and have seen explosive growth. And some of the best roots on clones yet.

 

[Meison]

First of all, +rep to you DJM. Insane results.

I have learned a lot from this thread. Read it twice, took notes. Did some research to be sure I got the idea and now I'm planning to switch from RW to coco. Although I will still clon in RW.

You sir have open my eyes to a lot of stuff

Just wanted to thank you, I have nothing to add to this thread but respect for you.

Cheers

 

[skull and roses]

Great thread!! Lots of real deal info.

 

[mowood3479]

I'd say it's strain dependent Zenski. There are cultivars which are just not going to do well over 80F. That said if you can get your RH up that high (refer to the VPD chart) perhaps it won't be a problem. You'd just have to try it and see.


I still really can't wrap my head around the odor control in a positive pressure room ran like that. If you pump air into a room without an active outtake wouldn't you just be pushing smell and humidity out any little crack or pinhole it finds possible.

Is DJM's room so well sealed that he is successful in moving air out, and only out through a passive carbon filter. The air being forced out of the room (as a result of the active intake) moves through a carbon filter with no fan..

.. and that works?

Or am I understanding his setup incorrectly?

That's how I read and understood it.. I don't really get how it works to keep rh higher than having an active exhaust and passive intake... (It's still sucking in the same outside dry c.o. Air)
I guess I'll have to try it.. But ya seems to me unless the room was super sealed ud have lots of smell leaks..
But proof is in the pudding, n im no expert

 

[meadowman]

Do you scrub the rest of the basement and recirculate it?

 

[Meison]

I'd say it's strain dependent Zenski. There are cultivars which are just not going to do well over 80F. That said if you can get your RH up that high (refer to the VPD chart) perhaps it won't be a problem. You'd just have to try it and see.


I still really can't wrap my head around the odor control in a positive pressure room ran like that. If you pump air into a room without an active outtake wouldn't you just be pushing smell and humidity out any little crack or pinhole it finds possible.

Is DJM's room so well sealed that he is successful in moving air out, and only out through a passive carbon filter. The air being forced out of the room (as a result of the active intake) moves through a carbon filter with no fan..

.. and that works?
Or am I understanding his setup incorrectly?

After reading about VPD I switched all fans to intakes, and set up the filter as a passive exhaust, I work with a 5x5 tent. Works awesome!!!!

No smell! You can stand in front of the passive filter exhaust and feel a strong wind coming out! Almost like 200m3/h!!!!!

I have 500m3/h going INTO the tent, the tent looks like a balloon now! Probably won't last as much as it should since the positive pressure forces the stitches...

I managed to get the RH up 15% thanks to this new setup, and temps are holding between 27-30°C!! I use the outside air to cool down the tent, also embrace the winter.

Winter is coming here in the deep south! Best time to light up all the watts possible

IMO a nice improvement in my room, thanks again DJM for all the info

 

[FlowerFarmer]

Are u guys still "pushing" through the filter's exterior (filter in the room).. or is the filter now outside of the room (essentially pushing through it..into the hole where the fan normally goes).

^with the passive pressure of course.. no fans.


So.. how cold of forced air intake is required to make this all work? DJM is dealing with cold CO nights in the 50s and it's handling 12k in this instance.

According to google my summer time average nights can be around 60-65F. Is this cool enough air to keep "X" amount of wattage running without AC? Is there any formula to determine this type of stuff. I've been committed to running sealed/co2 to ensure I've got control of the environmental. This equates to expensive build costs for grows not necessarily going to be permanent ops.



This also leads me to the question. I've got a 3 ton split now cooling 8k. That is about all a 3 ton would handle. Instead of using the split to cool 8k.. could I use it to condition air to the coldest possible.. and then use a forced intake from that "lung" room to cool 12-16k with only the 3 ton. Or would I need to be using that air too quickly.. meaning I'd be pulling air through my "lung" room too fast for any of that to work.

 

[Meison]

Are u guys still "pushing" through the filter's exterior (filter in the room).. or is the filter now outside of the room (essentially pushing through it..into the hole where the fan normally goes).

^with the passive pressure of course.. no fans.


So.. how cold of forced air intake is required to make this all work? DJM is dealing with cold CO nights in the 50s and it's handling 12k in this instance.

According to google my summer time average nights can be around 60-65F. Is this cool enough air to keep "X" amount of wattage running without AC? Is there any formula to determine this type of stuff. I've been committed to running sealed/co2 to ensure I've got control of the environmental. This equates to expensive build costs for grows not necessarily going to be permanent ops.



This also leads me to the question. I've got a 3 ton split now cooling 8k. That is about all a 3 ton would handle. Instead of using the split to cool 8k.. could I use it to condition air to the coldest possible.. and then use a forced intake from that "lung" room to cool 12-16k with only the 3 ton. Or would I need to be using that air too quickly.. meaning I'd be pulling air through my "lung" room too fast for any of that to work.

Hey FF, I have the filter inside the tent. Alot more area to apply the positive pressure, instead of a small outtake.

Here we have around 17-20°C at night, and with that I cool down 870 watts (not even close to your setup). I managed to get the temps down 2-5°C with ease, I will be looking to cool it even more as the outside temp drops closer to 10° or lower at night! Been wanting to light up a Gavita 750e for a while now, but its impossible without AC in the summer in a 6,5ft tall tent.

I think my fans sum up around 300+ cfm

I doubt there's a formula for cooling lights with outdoor air, I know that some manufacturers such as Gavita gives you the info about how many BTU should be needed to cool down a 1kw DE, but I can't imagine how to translate that BTU info, into cool outside air volume and temp. Guess the best way would be to test it till its dialed in!

Also, without an exhaust fan going on all the time. You don't loose too much CO2 I think, since it will be easier to achieve the ppms you want, and will only decrease very little with the passive exhaust

cheers

 

[DONAJTHEIII]

passive intake !!!! how the fuck does this work

def about to start reading this thread only saw this thread when it had two pages.



man Don from one Don to another your are the MAN



one question DJM


do you start the multiple feedings with no runoff as soon as your rooted clone is placed in your medium.

this is such a kick ass thread going to rip a bowl and look through all this new info


cheers fellas

 

[FlowerFarmer]

passive intake !!!! how the fuck does this work

No, I believe we are talking about ACTIVE intake - passive exhaust.

Meaning colder outside air is being pushed into the "sealed" space to maintain temp - exhaust is forced out of the room via the passive exhaust. There is no fan on the exit scrubber.. the air just doesn't have anywhere else to go besides out the passive exhaust.



Most people run their gardens the other way..active exhaust w/ passive intake. Air is sucked into the room via the intake because the room is ran under negative pressure.

 

[ghostmade]

Yeah ive heard a few times on a couple different forums that plant grow better with a positive pressure vs. Negative pressure. Anybody else heard this or got experience?

 

[DONAJTHEIII]

No, I believe we are talking about ACTIVE intake - passive exhaust.

Meaning colder outside air is being pushed into the "sealed" space to maintain temp - exhaust is forced out of the room via the passive exhaust. There is no fan on the exit scrubber.. the air just doesn't have anywhere else to go besides out the passive exhaust.



Most people run their gardens the other way..active exhaust w/ passive intake. Air is sucked into the room via the intake because the room is ran under negative pressure.

Totally fucked up on that flower lol i run passive intake

meant

PASSIVE OUTAKE WTF HOW DOES THIS WORK !!!!


aha still cant beleive this works so basically the fans are just flipped fans will be on the intake and a carbon filter attached to ducting on the exhaust side.


one thing to keep in mind though is that with this set up i feel your shit has to be pretty close to sealed as any cracks will just be pushing smell that hasnt gotten through the filter so i feel smell vunerability is hugeeee thing with doing it that way.


Flower have you tried this method yet ? i am super interested though going to pack this vape and catch up on this thread.

 

[WonderWoman]

If you want to run passive exhaust, you must have a sealed room.

 

[FlowerFarmer]

A 100% actual sealed room is a lot easier said then done.


Don, no I've never ran a positive pressure room. Always either negative pressure or "sealed" w/ AC & co2. By sealed I'm referring to no intake/outtake. I do tape it up the best I can, but they are not actually 100% sealed tight.

ghostmade,
I'm not so certain about better growth myself, but I've heard of the benefits of a positive pressure room discussed in terms of mold spores, bugs, etc. Hepa filter that active intake and you'll ensure no spores, etc are being pulled into the room at any cracks/pinholes due to the positive pressure.

My entire basement is under negative pressure and I can attest that air finds it's way in any way it possibly can.



Next winter I'm definitely going to try some cold air intake to see how many watts I can burn w/o running my split AC all winter.

 

[DunHav`nFun]

You`ll haveta deal with condensation and water fallin everywhere FF , wherever the cold air hits the controlled hotter room air.....pretty sure DJM rolls in a room inside a room after readin the whole damn thread , and it`s the first time I`ve seen positive pressure sealed rooms , but it`s all about what works best where you are , bar none......

I ran air exchange twice per minute for over 20 yrs with fliprooms inside a sealed lungroom with dialed success , but did have to pull fresh air in through hepa filters and active intakes from crawlspaces to prevent airborn nasties and critters , so I like the idea DJM came up with where the only way for air to escape is through the scrubber....now....

Krusty taught me howta grow big plants 20 yrs ago , and his FIRST cardinal rule was 70% RH through the life of the grow start to stop , and employ sulfur burners if the hint of PM reared it`s head , but nobody could do it without getting budmold/rot , botyritis , powdery mildew , ALL the airborn pathogens , so he backed off and said mid-late flower as low as 50% till end of cycle , and folks started seein some relief with decent returns.....but....

Where I live the RH stay`s 80-90% yr round , so I had no problems keeping RH in optimum parameters , but rather howta get rid of it by end of cycle without rooms full of white fuzzy molded 2 1/2 lb plants , and I did...

Heath Robinson showed me the benefits of air exchange twice per minute with no CO2 supplements other than ambient ppms in the air we breathe , and it was off to the races ....

I totally agree with dropping RH below 62% during the life of the grow is counterproductive if that`s where finished , dried and cured/stored product is supposed to stay once ready for market ,but I had to dial my environment down to prevent airborn bullshit in late bloomage and yields suffered...how much ?....

I never grew a plant bigger then 2.5 lbs , and there was still room in my rooms cu.ftg wise with the bare bulbs where the plants could`ve gotten bigger , but now that I know about "vapor pressure deficit" and the limiting factors I understand.....

Respect Don Juan , EVERYTHING here that`s been posted is real life experience in the trade after yrs of dialin shit in till it`s where it needs to be , and the kids that`ve questioned your findings over the yrs are destined to repeat history.....

Hope all`s well with you and yours bro...Most all the other old heads refuse to post and share knowledge here due to the lack of control over the younger crowd , but then again....This place sells seeds , and kids buy seeds....

I guess the best info I read was where your multifeeds had no runoff and no need for drip clean , and my experience with higher room temps causing higher transpiration/sweating rates , while also increasing nutrient uptake rates , shows plainly that once the "circadian rythym" where the plants suck juice and sweat it out repeatedly to prevent salt buildup in the medium works , and gives the grow area what it needs for RH to stay so big plants can flourish and swell during lights off.....anyways.....

Thanks for the show Don Juan.....You da man....

Peace...DHF.........

 

[dynamitejack]

Wow DJM thank you for posting this! My room is very similar to yours minus the massive yields! I'm going to make a few changes thanks to the awesome info in this thread.

I know others have asked, so I will too.. Can you please post some pics of your reservoir and irrigation set up? How do you correctly size the pump for the system? Do you use 1- 4 outlet distribution manifold per 2 plants?

One last thing, can you explain or post pics of your veg training? Your plants look like the explode with branches about 8" above the main stalk and I like it.

Thanks!

P.S. care to share your IG for us?

 

[al70]

The sides o my tent are being sucked in, that's passive intake, I'm extracting all the air,smell �� out, take too much air out n you'll lower the temps, tuning is the answer, dial everything in,goodluck

 

[19de1ta]

great thread

 

[Miraculous Meds]

Wheres ol master DJM at?

Probably got carpel tunnel and trimmers elbow by now.

Put some ben gay on that shit and let us know ur alive!

 

[Grow4Flow]

A 100% actual sealed room is a lot easier said then done.t.

ghostmade,
I'm not so certain about better growth myself, but I've heard of the benefits of a positive pressure room discussed in terms of mold spores, bugs, etc. Hepa filter that active intake and you'll ensure no spores, etc are being pulled into the room at any cracks/pinholes due to the positive pressure.

i'm sealed using positive pressure, starting to see PM so i treated and stopped! this style of grow definitely does not work everywhere