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CMH vs LED vs HPS
- Thread starter Gerardbutler79
- Start date
An extreme example sure, but no more swapping and paying for bulbs every two turns, no more insane electric bill in a market where electric costs have nearly doubled in the past 5 years while wholesale cannabis prices have been cut in half or more since 2020. The ability to dim, the ability to alter spectrum to whatever you want, these benefits are huge imo. Like ive said before i started out as a big naysayer toward led but its just better in every way for me.
If you are curious about which fixture to choose i have experience with gavita, ion, chilLed, boulder lamp and agrobar. Im happy to discuss their results if you have any interest.I'm hAppy it works for you, believe me I love it's benefits but the smoke is just not what I'm looking for, In no strain or set up... Weird.
But, I look forward to doing a side by side with a led panel like you have Crooked8
exoticrobotic
Well-known member
I'd like to hear about the different fixtures you've used if you have time @Crooked8
Dunno if i mentioned it
but I wasn't happy with the 2 Maxibright led 300w fixtures i bought.Apart from one burning out; when they were both running, even though supposedly identical to my eye they appeared to have very different spectrums. But they're hobby led fixtures, not professional ones.
I like the different look to your Agrobars, they seem like they may have a better spectrum with white, yellow, blue and red chips.
Corpselover Fat
Active member
I assembled these back in 2019. It's amazing how fast things moved in the led world after that. At that point there were very few boards or bar lights available. I took my time to do research and learn what all those par, dli, umol etc meant so I could make reasonably sound decisions. It came out at ~500€ which was not cheap, but it was as efficient as anything on the market and much cheaper. Each of the four boards has 308 lm301b in 3500K. I forget the exact figures, but with the power supplies I use they will produce around 900umol/s combined and use 320w while doing so. The boards have no heat sinks. They are so large (44*28cm) that they dissipate enough heat by themselves.
In the pic the boards are slanted for lighting a single plant.
In the pic the boards are slanted for lighting a single plant.
Exactly. HPS create heat and light from gas like the sun. LED isn’t the same. I just smoked some led sour diesel that was so dense I had to grind it for it to burn in a joint.
Sounds like they used PGRs, sour diesel, led spectrum or not, should never really be super dense. Im from the tri state area, where it came from, held several cuts of it over the years and I was an early tester for karmas sour d. Something im very familiar with that does not get insanely dense under led. It either wasnt sour or it was pgr imo. Fuck do i love sour, maybe its time to pop some bx2s
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Absolutely my friend. The ion is my least favorite, least efficient and overall i just find them cheaply made. I currently use one for veg but only until i replace it. Gavitas also lack efficiency for their pricetag. I used both the 1930e which is designed to replace 1000w de hps. You hang them high up and tbh i disliked them from the start. This was the first fixture i used years ago and was still adamant about hps being superior for flower. In all fairness, I was running too high of VPD so this is something to consider. I dont see many facilities running them these days though so i think i was on to something. We got a bunch of 1700e because i was sure a bar fixture was the answer. I also started tuning into lower vpd for the first few weeks and saw my first solid led product that could compete with hps but i still wasnt sold. From here I wanted to try the mixed spectrum of cmh and led which boulder lamp makes a light called the cmh + led. It was too red and for whatever reason made our flagship strain come out super leafy. So at this time we bought 2 of the boulder lamp perfect par 650 leds and 2 agrobar720s. We isolated them each to their own tray in the same environment and ran our flagship strain and several others under both. Agrobars absolutely have more blue and green light in a very complete spectrum. Again, the boulder lamps were too red and caused our main bitch to throw more leafy growth in flower, whereas the agrobars produced the densest form of flower with that cut than ever. Ive run it since 2013, i was blown away. Everything seemed to be denser under agrobars and just overall healthier. Boulder lamps lights did great, far outperforming the gavitas and only really the flagship gal seemed to hate it, i just think she hates a lot of far red. The guy who runs boulder lamp is awesome, his name is Fazle and hes definitely a super nerd. Sweetest dude ever but i think he saw the insane demand for far red diodes and assumed this was the ticket to creating the best light. Most strains crushed under his lights and also for 70w less per light i was really happy with everything other than the one. Ultimately weve gone all agrobar simply because everything we throw under them seems to love it. I would put both boulder and agrobar in a space over an hps anyday. However id rather run hps than those 1930 gavitas, they defeat the purpose imo. Led close, hps far away, in between doesnt work ime.I'd like to hear about the different fixtures you've used if you have time @Crooked8
Dunno if i mentioned it
Apart from one burning out; when they were both running, even though supposedly identical to my eye they appeared to have very different spectrums. But they're hobby led fixtures, not professional ones.
I like the different look to your Agrobars, they seem like they may have a better spectrum with white, yellow, blue and red chips.
Edit, forgot to mention the ChilLeds. They make built and build it yourself fixtures. I built one myself for veg, it was easy. It is actually badass compared to the ion and i do plan to try one of them for flower. Their ratings are badass.
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we used a mars fce8000 in our 5x5ft tent last grow, took down the plants last week, and yesterday started to trim some of the plants- initial observation is that the plants are very leafy... these are clones from our previous grow/s which were under 315's cmh, and there is much more leaf under the led's- we have not smoked any of the new crop yet, as that is always the bottom line- maybe in a week...
Haze dom genetics tree style under LED. My issues are not able to keep them green how I like them. They fade very fast.. These got an ec and CA/MAG bump. The top plant is at 40, bottom is at 50 days.
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we took down the remaining plants today... very disappointed how airy the various plants are... not sure if i will flower with the mars fce8000 next grow in the fall- i am leaning to go back to '2' 315's in my 5x5ft tent- i'd luv to use my 1000w hps/mh switchable, but how to vent the heat is a real problem... i read there is a learning curve with led's , but fuk there is so much fluff , i guess i'll be smoking hash for a while...
What genetics???. This plays a much bigger role in that. The Mars FCE-6500... I have it dimmed to a stable 600w and had no issues with that.
sorry to hear you had a rough run, been there many times. If you want to go over your past run in detail im sure we can figure out the issue/issues. Fwiw i still love 315cmhs myself, still veg with them for stuff that stays too short otherwise.
we grew '2' diff headbangers and a tha melon from karma- headbangers were 'ok' got some nice bud, but the tha melon was a lousy weight... we had '2' purple punches and a runtz from barney's - the PP yielded shitty, the runtz a bit better..
also had a bx2 from old rez seeds. we will shitcan the cuttings from this plant - also had a sour diesel kush from rez.... disappointing yield..
final weight unknown at the moment- i would guess maybe 8oz's.... and prob double that of popcorn and leaf matter...
unless the bud is ass-kicking which i doubt, a disappointing run... under led... and an fce8000 in a 5x5ft tent is def enough... i think more then enough lite...
Those shouldn't have any issues being fluffy, very odd... I don't mind low yields as long as the quality is fire. The HK X THH I ran was a bit fluffy but still had good yields.. She was still really lovely smoke.. Flowered under the same LED.
Ca++
Well-known member
Random perhaps.. But I have noted higher water use with LED, that needs RH to keep it under control. Not only that, but the water loss isn't mostly at the top, so this blue light opening the stomata is having quite some effect. The floor fans that improved HID grows, proved to worsen my LED ones.
I just did a mixed lighting run. Kept the extract low, to mimic a less easy to work space. Canopy RH was higher and water loss reduced.
I think this water distribution throughout the plant, could key in with the mid leaf signs that turning up the wick often produces for people. In my sleepless state, I'm wondering if there is a distribution problem where the mid leaves are getting what the top should of, had that light level had the IR dose that usually comes with it.
Perhaps I should just sleep.
On another note... the smell. I was taken back to something I had forgotten. Something I had not been missing, but abruptly returned. A pungent overtone. Over the wider bouquet the LED weed has. A monotonous sulphur related smell, we associate with 'skunk' in general. I got some out round a friends, who had been smoking with guests. The smell didn't overtake theirs. Theirs just lost any smell at all, no matter how much they pinched it.
Some might get excited by that, and I did enjoy shrugging it off. However, it's not what I'm looking for.
I just did a mixed lighting run. Kept the extract low, to mimic a less easy to work space. Canopy RH was higher and water loss reduced.
I think this water distribution throughout the plant, could key in with the mid leaf signs that turning up the wick often produces for people. In my sleepless state, I'm wondering if there is a distribution problem where the mid leaves are getting what the top should of, had that light level had the IR dose that usually comes with it.
Perhaps I should just sleep.
On another note... the smell. I was taken back to something I had forgotten. Something I had not been missing, but abruptly returned. A pungent overtone. Over the wider bouquet the LED weed has. A monotonous sulphur related smell, we associate with 'skunk' in general. I got some out round a friends, who had been smoking with guests. The smell didn't overtake theirs. Theirs just lost any smell at all, no matter how much they pinched it.
Some might get excited by that, and I did enjoy shrugging it off. However, it's not what I'm looking for.
Corpselover Fat
Active member
Now I have no idea if Mars are honest these days, but fce8000 should be more than twice the light compared to two 315's. I'm kind of surprised you were happy with two 315's in 5*5. I found a single 315 wasn't quite enough in a 2*4 for me. Funny how different results people get
hey ... my previous grows were in a 4x3.5ft tent, with the '2' 315's - i thought that it was not enough lite, and during flowering i would add 2, sometimes 3 cheap led lights- hearing good things about led's (mostly good) , i decided to upgrade (was it an upgrade) to the mars lite, and then i needed a bigger tent... all in all it was a shitty grow, only thing that can save it is if the weed is kick-ass- which i am doubting... i plan on testing this weekend...Now I have no idea if Mars are honest these days, but fce8000 should be more than twice the light compared to two 315's. I'm kind of surprised you were happy with two 315's in 5*5. I found a single 315 wasn't quite enough in a 2*4 for me. Funny how different results people get
