Can ANYONE name the poison Eagle 20 with the active ingredient Myclobutanil??

[siftedunity]

Myclobutanil is a great tool, I've used it myself to sterilize cuttings in the past. It works like a charm. .

I think this is the main point. it has its applications used in a sensible way.. not as something you spray as a matter of course regularly.
as for environmental issues and whatnot, idk how people can drive a car and then come argue this shit online. theres so many more detrimental things happening on this earth that pose a much more imminent threat. most likely the chems in the shampoo you washed your hair with this morning or toothpaste you used is more hazardous than myclobutanil.

 

[GnarlsBarkley]

You think the chemicals in shampoo are more hazardous than the shit that just sent someone to the hospital and leaving them with permanent brain damage? idk about tht just seems like a bad excuse to rationalize using something bad.

 

[Chimera]

accessendx,

Ethylene, btw is produced by plants, in fact it controls the male/female switch in cannabis. It also causes ripening in bananas.

Barring lysol and other completely avoidable contaminants people might choose to expose themselves to, you are essentially talking about UREC, or Unintended Residual Environmental Contamination. It's essentially the background noise level of pesticides and fungicides in the air, water and soil, that we live with everyday.

When you start using these machines with which you can detect compounds in the ppb range, you pick up background molecules that are simply present in the environment. These can contaminating your products by it just being there in the water, or soil. You may have never even sprayed anything on your plants, but they could still have detectable levels of various compounds if the detection equipment is sensitive enough.

UREC is inevitable when we start growing cannabis where there has been agriculture previously, or if they spray in the greenhouse beside you, etc. However, there is a difference in these residual environmental levels, and what you see when a crop was sprayed at week 4 with Floramite. Same goes for Myclobutanil- you may not use it in that way, but some people are blasting crops well into flowering. This is all identifiable with these triple quad LC-MS systems.

Although I consider myself fairly environmentally conscious, I am not a vegan hippie farmer living off the land, farming by my own waste. I think my point is, that one can only control what one can control. Some stuff you can't control, but we may as well take us much caution as possible in making sure we don't contaminate the flowers unnecessarily.

Some people may say, well shit who cares; I am already getting exposed to chemicals daily, what's a little bit more.

Of course others will say: shit! I'm already getting exposed to these unavoidable chemicals daily; I should really do everything I can to minimize exposure to any extra avoidable man-made chemicals which may be harmful!

As a patient that chooses a natural herbal medicine, it's reasonable to assume as a non-grower that there are no chemical fungicides applied to the plant; in fact most regulated markets I know of don't allow Myclobutanil use at all, so it's a valid expectation from a consumer point of view. As a grower that self produces and consumes their own product, I think you should be able to spray whatever it is you want on your own plant. However, as a grower that supplies product on the market to others, one has a moral responsibility to produce flowers that don't contain unexpected chemicals to the consumer.

I guess for now until we have better regulation, buyers are in a caveat emptor situation. I personally think it should be a concern that much of the cannabis produced would likely be sprayed with Myclobutanil if its use wasn't restricted. If a chemical is safe, the producers should go through all the steps we have in society to show that it's safe, they should show how long it persists in the plant after a specific dose-application, and they should have studies that show that exposure at those levels (or those found in the concentrates from these plants) have no impact on human health. We don't have that info, because these products were never designed or intended to be applied to cannabis - the producers never went through the steps to evaluate these concerns under the EPA guidelines and testing / evidentiary requirements. So without that information, IMO, it's not right to use these chemicals when we suspect there could be harm.

Consumers should have the right to choose if they want to have these chemicals in their system or not, and allowing the use of untested Myclo-like products on Cannabis grown for the market, takes that choice away from the eventual consumer.

I guess the question is, as a grower, are you ok with knowing there could be unknown levels of residual pesticides and fungicides in your product? If so, are you ok with your products being identified as contaminated/tainted flowers in the marketplace?

 

[Weird]

shotguns are great tools against rats but they leave holes in the walls

if you need to workout side approved methods to perform the same horticultural practices that others practice without it speaks volumes of your integrity and capacity

grossly irresponsible to advocate the use of a product banned for use on cannabis in legal markets

at least your honest lol

 

[one.sixoneeight]

When applied correctly, myclobutanil is known to have low toxicity to humans.

This statement says all you need to know about toxicity. It is toxic to humans, it doesnt matter if its a little toxic or very toxic. The key thing to extract is that it IS TOXIC TO HUMANS.

 

[gaiusmarius]

accessendx,

Ethylene, btw is produced by plants, in fact it controls the male/female switch in cannabis. It also causes ripening in bananas.

Barring lysol and other completely avoidable contaminants people might choose to expose themselves to, you are essentially talking about UREC, or Unintended Residual Environmental Contamination. It's essentially the background noise level of pesticides and fungicides in the air, water and soil, that we live with everyday.

When you start using these machines with which you can detect compounds in the ppb range, you pick up background molecules that are simply present in the environment. These can contaminating your products by it just being there in the water, or soil. You may have never even sprayed anything on your plants, but they could still have detectable levels of various compounds if the detection equipment is sensitive enough.

UREC is inevitable when we start growing cannabis where there has been agriculture previously, or if they spray in the greenhouse beside you, etc. However, there is a difference in these residual environmental levels, and what you see when a crop was sprayed at week 4 with Floramite. Same goes for Myclobutanil- you may not use it in that way, but some people are blasting crops well into flowering. This is all identifiable with these triple quad LC-MS systems.

Although I consider myself fairly environmentally conscious, I am not a vegan hippie farmer living off the land, farming by my own waste. I think my point is, that one can only control what one can control. Some stuff you can't control, but we may as well take us much caution as possible in making sure we don't contaminate the flowers unnecessarily.

Some people may say, well shit who cares; I am already getting exposed to chemicals daily, what's a little bit more.

Of course others will say: shit! I'm already getting exposed to these unavoidable chemicals daily; I should really do everything I can to minimize exposure to any extra avoidable man-made chemicals which may be harmful!

As a patient that chooses a natural herbal medicine, it's reasonable to assume as a non-grower that there are no chemical fungicides applied to the plant; in fact most regulated markets I know of don't allow Myclobutanil use at all, so it's a valid expectation from a consumer point of view. As a grower that self produces and consumes their own product, I think you should be able to spray whatever it is you want on your own plant. However, as a grower that supplies product on the market to others, one has a moral responsibility to produce flowers that don't contain unexpected chemicals to the consumer.

I guess for now until we have better regulation, buyers are in a caveat emptor situation. I personally think it should be a concern that much of the cannabis produced would likely be sprayed with Myclobutanil if its use wasn't restricted. If a chemical is safe, the producers should go through all the steps we have in society to show that it's safe, they should show how long it persists in the plant after a specific dose-application, and they should have studies that show that exposure at those levels (or those found in the concentrates from these plants) have no impact on human health. We don't have that info, because these products were never designed or intended to be applied to cannabis - the producers never went through the steps to evaluate these concerns under the EPA guidelines and testing / evidentiary requirements. So without that information, IMO, it's not right to use these chemicals when we suspect there could be harm.

Consumers should have the right to choose if they want to have these chemicals in their system or not, and allowing the use of untested Myclo-like products on Cannabis grown for the market, takes that choice away from the eventual consumer.

I guess the question is, as a grower, are you ok with knowing there could be unknown levels of residual pesticides and fungicides in your product? If so, are you ok with your products being identified as contaminated/tainted flowers in the marketplace?

i kinda thought even sterilizing clones with this will leave you with contaminated buds? i actually binned strains before because they had systemic pm issues. would you flower a clone treated with this stuff? how long would you veg?

so how long would a clone have to be vegged after treatment until it can be used to take clones for flowering in a safe biological way.

 

[Mikell]

Just a quick note.

Chimera, you make up for years of whiney drivel that bogs these subjects down. Meat on the bone enough for dinner and stock.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

I've run into several people now who have reactions to cannabis with Eagle-20 on it.

At the end of the day, I don't count Eagle-20 as being part of the definition of "Clean Cannabis." Keep your sprayed buds for your personal stash, thanks.

 

[krunchbubble]

Just a quick note.

Chimera, you make up for years of whiney drivel that bogs these subjects down. Meat on the bone enough for dinner and stock.

WOW, I like it...

 

[siftedunity]

You think the chemicals in shampoo are more hazardous than the shit that just sent someone to the hospital and leaving them with permanent brain damage? idk about tht just seems like a bad excuse to rationalize using something bad.

its not to rationalise anything, im just pointing out your hypocrisy.


aside from that maybe there should be a system with weed as with food where you buy organic or regular.. and then the customer can decide on the risks they wish to take.


but I would imagine that 99% of food be it meat or veg, has traces of chemicals sprayed on the crops used to produce it. if your gonna moan about one, makes sense tht you should be trying to do something about the others too..

 

[SuperBudBros]

So can eagle 20 be used on vegging plants???

 

[GnarlsBarkley]

Myself and a lot of others wouldn't. There are always other options that are way less nasty. If you live in a legal state that regulates pesticides like CO for example you cannot use it at all as it is banned.

 

[accessndx]

When applied correctly, myclobutanil is known to have low toxicity to humans.

This statement says all you need to know about toxicity. It is toxic to humans, it doesnt matter if its a little toxic or very toxic. The key thing to extract is that it IS TOXIC TO HUMANS.

So is alcohol. So is oxygen in certain doses.. So is water in certain doses. What's your point?

 

[Lyfespan]

so much fear mongering in here, and no science.

witch hunt much you fucking no till guys, so tired of the "its our way or no way" mentalities GTFOH with that shit.

applying eagle 20 at 5ml per gallon sprayed right before flower and thru veg, tests coming too.

just too much BRO knowledge in the weed world, no facts or figures.

this is my opinion, and as such, is beyond contestation.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

so much fear mongering in here, and no science.

witch hunt much you fucking no till guys, so tired of the "its our way or no way" mentalities GTFOH with that shit.

applying eagle 20 at 5ml per gallon sprayed right before flower and thru veg, tests coming too.

just too much BRO knowledge in the weed world, no facts or figures.

this is my opinion, and as such, is beyond contestation.

Spoken like a true cash cropper.

Eagle-20 is a lazy fix for a bad environment, bad genetics or a poor grower. Anyone else care to call themselves out?

 

[Ogtg2213]

Speed o green had tests done before and eagle 20 and avid both show up in flowers in trace amounts even if only sprayed in veg.
Personally I'm against spraying anything on my plant. But that's just me.

 

[Weird]

what isn't broscience at all is that eagle20 is ONE way to deal with a problem that MANY other producers have solved without

now it is one thing to not give a fuck about yourselves but if your going to be a self loathing person who denies causation in your own lives because your afraid of the implications your going to get called out for it at this point of the game

its one thing to be like that another to promote is as even remotely acceptable

to many people paid to many real years to get to this point to let it be cheapened by people who just dont have it to give a fcuk

move out of the way there are people that do

 

[gaiusmarius]

i think we need a faq like thread about e20, with just the known facts and less rhetoric and anecdotal evidence. i have read nearly this whole thread trying to find the meat and i can't say i found much, just arguing back and forth. if anyone has any studies related to this subject or test results showing residue please share them, if you have nothing new, then leave it. making threads like this into a million page argument just makes it harder to get to the heart of the matter.

does anyone want to take it on, create 1 definitive document that will be posted as a closed thread, unless there is new pertinent info to add.

 

[Weird]

if you need those metrics to rationalize a product that is not designed and tested for this use and additionally banned for use in legal markets you are underlining the dysfunction here

if you think this mantra will help people adapt to the pressures of commercialization you are sadly mistaken

growers are fucking themselves and rather cast delusion than perceive the truth because there is no gray line when humanitarian ethics are the foundation of what a person does

we came this far to stoop this low?

Not me, don't care if everyone else sells themselves short it doesn't make it sexy enough for me to want to be part of that trend

the grossest part is there so much money there is no fucking excuse

1$ a lb of potatoes is a diff argument

 

[Weird]

the tastiest part though is through its use you further disfranchise yourself from proper practice and the legal baseline for acceptable practice