Butane honey oil for dummies

[Tokingham]

Ummm, because of our usage, I of course I have already contacted our local Airgas, and no problem getting mercaptan free N-Butane in 100# pots here, and similarly no problem purchasing mercap free butane at the local medical head shop. We've extensively used Lucienne 4X, typically supplied from either South Korea, or England, with no hint of mercaps added.

Butane sold as stove fuel in the US does contain mercaps, which is added for leak detection. It isn't added to lighter fuel because of the objectionable taste and smell and small quantities normally involved.

Even if people can't smell mercaps, they can still taste them. Very hard to miss at 2.8 parts per billionth ( not parts per millionth) sensory threshold.

The folks that I have read about blowing themselves up, did so from unsafe practices, such as extracting with butane indoors.

What can I say? Mercaps or the lack there of has little impact on mindless acts, where the issue is really ignorance or stupidity even after enlightenment.

Even after it has been explained to some folks, they either don't believe the explanation, or somehow feel it doesn't apply to them. As you have noted, some of them were dead wrong.

You're funny. I am only telling you what I was told by the Airgas employee.

I never said mercaptans caused an exlposion, I am unsure how you got that from what I said. Yes unsafe practices, like not knowing you have a bunch of butane in the air. I am sure the idiots could SMELL the butane but ignored it an blew themselves up. The smelling agents are added in hope that they will prevent that from happening or anything like it.

How do you know the store bought butane has no mercaptans?

 

[Gray Wolf]

You're funny. I am only telling you what I was told by the Airgas employee.

I never said mercaptans caused an exlposion, I am unsure how you got that from what I said. Yes unsafe practices, like not knowing you have a bunch of butane in the air. I am sure the idiots could SMELL the butane but ignored it an blew themselves up. The smelling agents are added in hope that they will prevent that from happening or anything like it.

How do you know the store bought butane has no mercaptans?

Yeah, I've been assured that I look funny when I howl at the moon too! No doubt all true!

Regardless of what might be said by whom, I personally know that the store bought butane we use has no mercaptans, because I grew up in an oil refinery town and know what they smell and taste like.

Central to that self assurance is the knowledge that they would be impossible to miss at 2.8 PPB sensory threshold. Some studies show it as low as 1.1 parts per billionth.

The significance of that is that for instance our sensory threshold for acetic acid is about 700 parts per millionth. .0007 (7 X-04) parts, versus .0000000028 (2.8 X-09) parts for the higher estimate on ethyl mercaps. Note the five extra zeros after the decimal place, before a whole number, not to mention the 2 as the first whole number, versus a 7 (3.5X) with acetic acid.

I also talked to Airgas's central corporate technical group, because besides price and availability, I asked for certifications on contaminants like butadiene that their local technical group was clueless on.

All butane doesn't have mercaps added, though it is typically added to stove fuel, which may be what was going through the mind of the Airgas employee that you discussed it with. Stove fuel is probably the highest volume use of butane.

It isn't added to lighter fuel because of the small quantity of butane involved and the objectionable taste that it would add to tobacco.

It also isn't added to the N-Butane used as a propellant in food or to R-600 N-Butane refrigerant.

 

[pineolene]

in other words: he can't smell it so it must not be there.

 

[juicepuddle]

not smell, TASTE IT! Difference.

 

[Gray Wolf]

in other words: he can't smell it so it must not be there.

That is certainly one way to interpret what I just said! Another is to again read what I said and notice that all of our products have been volunteer panel tested, so you are questioning the senses of hundreds, not simply mine.

A more precise interpretation of my previous statement is that I nor any panel member doing testing, has detected the unmistakable odor or taste of mercaps.

Before casually brushing that aside, you might consider the math. For those whom might have missed or been challenged to understand the numbers, The 2.8 parts per billionth threshold sensory rate for Ethyl Mercaptan is around 35,000 times less ( .0007 divided by .0000000028) than that for acetic acid (100% vinegar).

Did anyone miss that part or just not understand the numerical significance???? Would expressing it as money make it more clear? Anyone think that concentrated acetic acid isn't noticeable?

.0000000028 divided by .0007 equals 2.9 X 10-6 or 2.9 X 10-4 percent points less. That is .00029 points, or 2 tenths of one thousandth of a percentage point, or of a penny. Not enough for a burger.

Missing that is about as hard as noticing that a bull elephant is standing in your living room or that someone just lambasted you upside your head with a baseball bat. That is why I wonder why we continue to beat this point.

There is or is not a bull elephant in the room, and I nor any of our panel members have ever detected it despite our best efforts.

Those insisting it is in the room undetected have an uphill battle against our knowingness that it can't possibly be so! Simply saying that you have been led to believe that it is so, begs for actual technical support data.

Peace brother PL. May I offer perspective, by asking you to field the following statement?

Ice water may contain a high percentage of every pathogen known to man. How have you come to believe that it is so salubrious without certifications?

Did you test it or come to believe that it was salubrious because someone told you so and you believed them? Have you actually looked at potable water standards?

 

[Trichgnomes]

Excellent points, Grey Wolf, as always.

Just wanted to share a quote with y'all, from the creator of the Tami-extractor. It is directly copied from the FAQ on their website. Sure, he is extracting different chemicals from other plants, but the principles are still sound, and inherently applicable.

I took the liberty of marking in bold the pertinent line, while italicizing the most specific of it.

Are there Mercaptans/Odorants present in N-Butane?

In the USA, detection of gas leaks by adding an odorant is typically required. When they are required the amount used should be detectable when the mixture of air and gas reaches 1/5 the lower combustible limit of the gas. Typically 1%. However you will find that most of the time, butane has no odorants added. You would be able to detect the odorants by the odor obviously and also by the spec sheet supplied by the supplier. There are lab grades of butane available with N-Butane supplied in a 99.9% purity and absolutely no odorants added at all. Fear of mercaptan ingestion is not of concern when pure butane is available.

As a matter of personal observation, I have never seen any butane with any Mercaptans added. This includes disposable canisters and commercial size tanks. I think this is because butane is NOT the best choice of fuel due to it's low condensing temperature.

This is another quote from him, which I believe goes onto show his credibility by way of countless first hand experience with butane and other solvents--alkanes and beyond.

I have used Butane, Heptane, Pentane, Hexane and more for extracting chemicals and oils from plants for over 5 years

Mercapatans merchapatans.

Drop knowledge not hate.

 

[pineolene]

Peace brother PL. May I offer perspective, by asking you to field the following statement?

Ice water may contain a high percentage of every pathogen known to man. How have you come to believe that it is so salubrious without certifications?

Did you test it or come to believe that it was salubrious because someone told you so and you believed them? Have you actually looked at potable water standards?

Good lord thats a lot of font edits. lol.
I only use RO water. Tap water and well water are disgusting. That's why I make all my own ice. Some of the dirtiest appliances in the world are ice machines. And yes, my city has detailed info as to what is in the water supply, for free, and fairly accurate. Altho the crap in my water changes as the seasons go because we drink off a rive r. Still, the water company is more open about their water than vector is about its canned gas mixtures. (unknown level of contaminants, 5x filtered means nothing).

In regards to the above post: he is a salesman first, and some of his business decisions prove that he is more concerned about money than anything else. ie the illegal tamis in cali (owned by a good friend, aka the king of hash). His credibility is compromised. He sells tamis in cali to hash makers so they can commit felonies. He won't even do demos in the state or admit that there are tamis here.

In regards to solvents. n-butane is as good as it gets for cannabinoids. pentane after that. be safe everyone. medical marijuana patients have died from bho explosions, they supposedly outnumber meth lab explosions in cali. some kids were even put into foster care because of bhotards.

 

[Tokingham]

Hmmmm.. well I do taste them so I think I am going to try ....hexane now. I will order some and post up in another thread about it.

 

[Gray Wolf]

Hmmmm.. well I do taste them so I think I am going to try ....hexane now. I will order some and post up in another thread about it.

Have fun experimenting!

We use HPLC reagent grade hexane regularly and have soaked plant material up to 12 hours in it without issues. It makes a nice extraction.

It is harder to purge than butane and has a gasoline flavor and smell if not fully purged.

The best way that I have found to do the final purge is to run it through two or three ethanol washes after evaporating off the hexane.

Another way to use hexane is to extract with alcohol and then mix the alcohol mixture with hexane and saturated salt water.

If you shake that up and allow it to separate in a seperatory funnel, the hexane will rise to the top with the cannabinoids and the alcohol saltwater mixture will be on the bottom with all the unwanted crap.

 

[pineolene]

Hmmmm.. well I do taste them so I think I am going to try ....hexane now. I will order some and post up in another thread about it.

Hexane also has its downsides:

* NIOSH REL

The National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH) has established a recommended exposure limit (REL) for n-hexane of 50 ppm (180 mg/m(3)) as a TWA for up to a 10-hour workday and a 40-hour workweek [NIOSH 1992].

* ACGIH TLV

The American Conference of Governmental Industrial Hygienists (ACGIH) has assigned n-hexane a threshold limit value (TLV) of 50 ppm (176 mg/m(3)) as a TWA for a normal 8-hour workday and a 40-hour workweek [ACGIH 1994, p. 23].

* Rationale for Limits

The NIOSH limit is based on the risk of skin and nervous system effects [NIOSH 1992].

The ACGIH limit is based on the risk of nervous system effects [ACGIH 1991, p. 754].

HEALTH HAZARD INFORMATION

* Routes of Exposure

Exposure to n-hexane can occur through inhalation, ingestion, and eye or skin contact [Sittig 1991, p. 889].

* Summary of toxicology

1. Effects on Animals: n-Hexane is a neurotoxin, a narcotic, and an irritant of the eyes, skin, and mucous membranes [Hathaway et al. 1991]. n-Hexane also causes productive and embryotoxic effects and is cytotoxic in mammalian and human test systems [NIOSH 1991]. The oral LD(50) in rats is 28,710 mg/kg, and the lowest lethal concentration in mice is 120 g/m(3) [NIOSH 1991]. Mice exposed to concentrations ranging from 1,000 to 2,000 ppm 24 hours/day for 6 days/week for 1 year developed atrophy and degeneration of hind leg muscle fibers [NLM 1992]. Mice exposed to 2,500 to 3,000 ppm n-hexane for 4 days developed liver enlargement within 24 hours of exposure onset [NLM 1992]. Rabbits exposed by inhalation to 3,000 ppm 8 hours/day for 8 days showed changes in the lungs, emphysema, necrosis of the bronchial epithelium, and atelectasis [NLM 1992]. Rats continuously exposed to 400 ppm developed anoxapathy, although intermittent exposure to 10,000 ppm 6 hours/day, 5 days/week for 13 weeks caused only mild paranodol axonal swelling [Hathaway et al. 1991]. The offspring of rats and mice exposed orally or by inhalation to n-hexane during gestation showed depressed weight gain after birth [Hathaway et al. 1991]. This agent also affects male and female reproductive capacity [Amdur 1991].

2. Effects on Humans: n-Hexane is a narcotic agent; an irritant to the eyes, upper respiratory tract, and skin; and a neurotoxin. Exposure of humans to 5,000 ppm n-hexane for 10 minutes causes marked vertigo; exposure to 1,500 ppm results in headache and slight nausea [Hathaway et al. 1991; Clayton and Clayton 1982]. In industrial settings, exposure to levels exceeding 1,000 ppm have been reported to cause mild symptoms of narcosis [Hathaway et al. 1991]. Eye and upper respiratory tract irritation has been reported to occur in humans exposed to 880 ppm n-hexane for 15 minutes [Clayton and Clayton 1982]. Dermal contact with n-hexane results in immediate irritation characterized by erythema and hyperemia; exposed subjects developed blisters 5 hours following dermal exposure to n-hexane [Hathaway et al. 1991]. The neuropathic toxicity of n-n-hexane in humans is well documented; cases of polyneuropathy have typically occurred in humans chronically exposed to levels of n-hexane ranging from 400 to 600 ppm, with occasional exposures up to 2,500 ppm [Hathaway et al. 1991]. Distal symmetrical motor weakness is common in most cases; however, in severely affected individuals, motor weakness may extend to the pelvic and high musculature [Rom 1992]. Nerve biopsies in affected individuals show swelling of the nerve and thinning of the myelin sheath. Functional neurological disturbances usually progress for a few months after termination of exposure. Although recovery is expected to occur within a year, clinical polyneuropathy has been reported in some cases to remain after 2 years [Hathaway et al. 1991]. Blurred vision, restricted visual field, and optic nerve atrophy has been reported to occur in association with n-hexane-induced polyneuropathy. Twelve of 15 individuals working with hexane for 12 years were found to have abnormal color discrimination [Grant 1986].

* Signs and symptoms of exposure

1. Acute exposure: Acute exposure to n-hexane may cause dizziness, confusion, nausea, headache, and irritation of the eyes, nose, throat, and skin [Hathaway et al. 1991].

2. Chronic exposure: Long-term exposure to n-hexane may cause disturbances in sensation, muscle weakness, and distal symmetric pain in the legs. Clinical changes include muscle atrophy, decreased muscle strength, footdrop, numbness, prickling, and a tingling sensation in the arms and legs. Neurological investigations reveal decreased motor nerve conduction, neurogenic damage and swelling of peripheral nerves with thinning of the myelin sheath. These symptoms may get worse for 2 to 3 months after cessation of exposure. Changes in vision may also be a symptom of chronic exposure to n-hexane [Hathaway et al. 1991].

 

[Gray Wolf]

Excellent point brother PL!

Even though hexane is used extensively in medical and food production, you must pay attention to purging details using any solvent to win!

Back to my previous point about purging! Hexane has six carbons in the chain and 14 hydrogen atoms, while butane has only four carbons. (Carbon atoms times two, plus two for the simple alkanes.)

The two extra carbons change the alkane from being slightly soluble in water, to insoluble in water, so it produces a more pristine extraction, but the extra atoms make it harder to purge afterwards. Thus the multiple alcohol washes.

Alas, as Will Rogers noted, "The world is full of folks who are damn sure of things that ain't so." If I may be so bold, not everyone can tell the difference between the natural taste of some of the extracts and those still contaminated with solvent or other contaminants in the solvent. Suffice to say that the taste is disagreeable to them, but alas, they may be misled in their impression of why.

Buddha noted that we will all die firmly believing we are right and most likely still be dead wrong. I am resolved at doing so myself.

Bolder yet and in the face of those whom say that cannabis extract tastes like candy, I personally don't care for the lingering aftertaste of cannabis oil and have spent a great deal of effort developing sublingual's that eliminate that aspect and are tasty to most people. I am emboldened by the local following, that agree with my tastes, have tried my solutions, and swear by it.

We also do ice water and dry sieve extractions, and I was just poking fun at them to make a point about potable water contaminants.

I didn't mention for instance, that even though the chlorine killed the coli form bacteria, their dead caucuses are still there and came from some living things asshole.

I could have pushed it further and noted that if you don't adequately purge the water from bubble, it can mold and the aflatoxins can be deadly, but of course if you pay attention to details, that isn't an issue, any more than hexane is adequately purged.

To me, the bottom line is that hash doesn't achieve the same medicinal results as oil concentrates, so the point is moot.

I personally enjoy hash extractions for their own unique and tasty attributes, but mostly use them as an interim step to oil production. Starting with bubble or dry sieve produces a unique oil, because much of the plant material contaminants have been taken out of the equation.

A survey of this site and others, will positively affirm that there is wide controversy on this subject, so mine is just one more opinion.

My best suggestion is for everyone to cut through the clutter and try it yourself, while paying close attention to details like purging.

If nothing else, it puts most of the arguments in perspective, so that we don't end up debating how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

 

[Hashmasta-Kut]

haxane fumes are poisonous for sure, one should wear proper safety wear when using it, you dont want to be breathing it at all.

 

[Gray Wolf]

Treat it like gasoline. White gas is a mixture of pentane and hexane.

 

[pineolene]

I didn't mention for instance, that even though the chlorine killed the coli form bacteria, their dead caucuses are still there and came from some living things asshole.

I could have pushed it further and noted that if you don't adequately purge the water from bubble, it can mold and the aflatoxins can be deadly, but of course if you pay attention to details, that isn't an issue, any more than hexane is adequately purged.

RO water would solve the dead coliform issue. I won't defend unfiltered tap water, that why I use all RO and make all my own ice.
And purging water from hash is super easy. I partly blame bubbleman for teaching the world how to do this incorrectly. Even the term "bubble", that relates to wet hash more than properly dried high quality water wax. Bubbling is from decarboxylation and is minor compared to the melt, unless your hash is wet in which case it will violently bubble then melt.

If you break you water hash up... it dries pretty simple compared to vac purging flammable solvents.
"deadly" lmao. PEOPLE DIE FROM MAKING BHO EVERY YEAR. Zero deaths from ice water hash to date. You don't want to go down this road, I document and compile bho explosions for fun. You will loose the safety argument based on real life statistics. The stats I've been researching show more bho explosions that meth lab explosions. So either everyone and their momma is blasting tane, or meth heads are more safe than bhotards...

I glass jar all of my water waxes less than 2 days after pulling, in grams, for the dispensaries. It never molds or mildews because I break it up thoroughly. This is much more simple than a combo of vac/heat purging (a common purge method for BHO).

To me, the bottom line is that hash doesn't achieve the same medicinal results as oil concentrates, so the point is moot.

My H2O tests about 5% less than bho, not a big difference in my opinion. Similar... maybe not the same.

 

[pineolene]

Also, in regards to my Titanium piezos: anyone have links to the safety of this? Are we changing the Ti with torch level heat? I know I heat it til its hella red. Are Ti-oxides being formed?

Seems like crucible grade porcelain is the real answer here as 2400f is too hot for crappy glass also.

Titanium can exist in two-forms, a close-packed hexagonal crystalline form (alpha form) and a body-centered cubic form (beta form). Titanium transforms from its alpha to beta forms at a temperature called the beta transus (1). The amount of alpha and/or beta form present in a specific titanium alloy depends on the other metals present, but also depends on the processing conditions used to prepare the alloy.
Ti Nail = Titanium grade 2 materiel
Beta Transus is - 1680 Degrees
Melting point - 3030 Degrees to liquid
Butane torch lighter - 2797 BTU = 2462 Degrees Max

 

[Gray Wolf]

RO water would solve the dead coliform issue. I won't defend unfiltered tap water, that why I use all RO and make all my own ice.
And purging water from hash is super easy. I partly blame bubbleman for teaching the world how to do this incorrectly. Even the term "bubble", that relates to wet hash more than properly dried high quality water wax. Bubbling is from decarboxylation and is minor compared to the melt, unless your hash is wet in which case it will violently bubble then melt.

If you break you water hash up... it dries pretty simple compared to vac purging flammable solvents.
"deadly" lmao. PEOPLE DIE FROM MAKING BHO EVERY YEAR. Zero deaths from ice water hash to date. You don't want to go down this road, I document and compile bho explosions for fun. You will loose the safety argument based on real life statistics. The stats I've been researching show more bho explosions that meth lab explosions. So either everyone and their momma is blasting tane, or meth heads are more safe than bhotards...


I glass jar all of my water waxes less than 2 days after pulling, in grams, for the dispensaries. It never molds or mildews because I break it up thoroughly. This is much more simple than a combo of vac/heat purging (a common purge method for BHO).


My H2O tests about 5% less than bho, not a big difference in my opinion. Similar... maybe not the same.

I wasn't aware that we were arguing about safety brother PL, but if we were, I suspect that the number of deaths per year worldwide from water bound pathogens exceeds all the deaths in the history of BHO extraction.

As just a wild ass intuitive guess, I also suspect that most people on this international forum aren't making hash using RO water and maybe even some brothers and sisters that have never even heard of it.

Might you explain how using RO water eliminates the mold spores stuck to the cannabis plant resins from getting in the hash?

Rather than immaculate conception, how much do you want to bet that that the spores that molded the hash later, weren't there all along and simply found enough moisture to bloom?

You present a perfect case using RO water and perfect drying condition by people "who know what they are doing", against dim wits (bhotards?) doing everything wrong with butane.

How would the discussion go if we compared folks on both sides whom know what they are doing at the top end of the scale and relegate the dim wits on both sides to the lower end? That should leave lots of room in the middle on both sides for those whom are neither dim wits, nor fully educated in the nuances of the processes.

Did you notice above when I said, "We also do ice water and dry sieve extractions, and I was just poking fun at them to make a point about potable water contaminants."?

I am still doing that to point out how fragile your moral high ground is. I am not here to attack bubble hash, and repeat that I think it is great and has its place and uses.

I quote you in, "My (your) H2O tests about 5% less than bho, not a big difference in my opinion. Similar... maybe not the same."

For purposes of this discussion, shall we assume that you are a bubble hash genius, leaving only the question of whose BHO might you be testing it against? Could you share more information on that, along with actual percentages?

Since you see no difference between bubble hash and oil, my second question would involve both the extent of your experience and your intended use.

We are a medical group and most of our product is used as a sublingual or a topical. If you have techniques to share using hash sublingually, topically, or as a suppository, I would be most interested in learning more on a thread that you start on the subject.

I can guarantee that there are zero mold spores or bacteria in my oil products by filtering to 0.2 microns.

If you can do the same, I would also be grateful if you would start a post on how you insure that there are zero mold spores or bacteria in your hash from the plant material.

That would stop us debating bubble hash on this BHO thread and I sincerely do look forward to the enlightenment?

 

[juicepuddle]

Hey PL, I think your right and are deffinatley spreading some knowledge, however we need to consider that a huge percentage of this population is incredibly stupid. I know that many many extractions have gone fine for each one that went bad, because someone did not research or use common sense.

IMO it all comes down to teaching your kids common sense, or doing your best to. As for the health risks of using BHO, thats another debate, and it will always come out to unknown variables.

 

[Hammerhead]

Never make BHO medicated....

Has anyone done a dry ice extraction and then turn that into BHO??? The yield from dry ice seems to out yield water hash??? Im no expert in DRY ICE method it seems that more contaminants would get into the kief from all that shaking.

 

[jump117]

Also, in regards to my Titanium piezos: anyone have links to the safety of this? Are we changing the Ti with torch level heat? I know I heat it til its hella red. Are Ti-oxides being formed?

Spiral filament heating and lighting fixtures are made of tungsten.
Maybe it is better suited for frequent heat and cooling?

Tungsten, also known as wolfram, is a chemical element with the chemical symbol W.

W Melting point 6192 °F 3422 °C.
Ti Melting point 3034 °F 1668 °C.

 

[pineolene]

Okay, lots here and I don't want to miss anything...

I wasn't aware that we were arguing about safety brother PL, but if we were, I suspect that the number of deaths per year worldwide from water bound pathogens exceeds all the deaths in the history of BHO extraction.

Comparing apples to an orchard of orange trees ey? lol @ all water vs bho. That comparison fails so hard. BHO vs Ice water extract is the comparison. If we compared water borne pathogens to all flammable gas deaths that might be not so laughable, but that is not the issue at all is it? The safety winner is clear. Don't make me start posting pics of melted bhotard hands.

As just a wild ass intuitive guess, I also suspect that most people on this international forum aren't making hash using RO water and maybe even some brothers and sisters that have never even heard of it.

And thats where I come in to rize up the ice water hash makers.

Might you explain how using RO water eliminates the mold spores stuck to the cannabis plant resins from getting in the hash?

Water and agitation washes them away, this is based on my actual microscope work and hi-def pics. Mold spores are everywhere homie, in the air you are breathing right now. Botrytis is something else than this, so is PM, and I don't work with damaged material. As I've stated, drying ice water hash is just a misunderstood step that I actively work to correct.

Rather than immaculate conception, how much do you want to bet that that the spores that molded the hash later, weren't there all along and simply found enough moisture to bloom?

You present a perfect case using RO water and perfect drying condition by people "who know what they are doing", against dim wits (bhotards?) doing everything wrong with butane.

How would the discussion go if we compared folks on both sides whom know what they are doing at the top end of the scale and relegate the dim wits on both sides to the lower end? That should leave lots of room in the middle on both sides for those whom are neither dim wits, nor fully educated in the nuances of the processes.

Difference being folks are dying from bho blasting, and not dying from smoking moldy ice water hash. Do you see that? If you mess with bho you can die, loose your house, have your kids put into foster care, blow your hands and face off, and all this has happened this year. If you mess with water hash you can get sick worst case I've found. Prove me wrong, I document bho deaths for fun. Find me a ice water hash death and I'll get you a hashmasta kut curve from aqualab, for real. that's just to GW...

Did you notice above when I said, "We also do ice water and dry sieve extractions, and I was just poking fun at them to make a point about potable water contaminants."?

I am still doing that to point out how fragile your moral high ground is. I am not here to attack bubble hash, and repeat that I think it is great and has its place and uses.

I quote you in, "My (your) H2O tests about 5% less than bho, not a big difference in my opinion. Similar... maybe not the same."

For purposes of this discussion, shall we assume that you are a bubble hash genius, leaving only the question of whose BHO might you be testing it against? Could you share more information on that, along with actual percentages?

Of course. Some of the most well known hash makers in cali are myself and vernon phillips. His cup winning Mars OG bho tests around 55% THC. All of my ice water extracts test about 50%, you can read this in Kush magazine go to page 46, or I can upload some lab results as .jpg files. They've been posted here before, but that caused some haters to do what they do. ie my blackberry kush tested over 52% when I first joined over a year ago.

Since you see no difference between bubble hash and oil, my second question would involve both the extent of your experience and your intended use.

Dissolved resin vs intact resin gland heads. There is the one major difference between tane and ice water extract. Yes, generally bho tests higher than ice water extracts. But I find my "ice wax", or as nikka T calls it "solventless wax", to be a similar smoking experience to bho. They both melt and leave little to zero ash, and both coat your mouth in flavor. Dabs, thats the purpose. I make ice water hash to dab like bho.

We are a medical group and most of our product is used as a sublingual or a topical. If you have techniques to share using hash sublingually, topically, or as a suppository, I would be most interested in learning more on a thread that you start on the subject.

I can guarantee that there are zero mold spores or bacteria in my oil products by filtering to 0.2 microns.

no spores or bacteria unless it finds its way in from the environment after processing. unless there is mold spores (most of which are harmless just throwing that in for sanity's sake) inside my trichomes... my extract is literally washed clean. all that work just to breathe PM spores with every breath... I know, i'm right there with you, its grape harvest time. good thing I'm an organic grower and I love microbes and fungi.

If you can do the same, I would also be grateful if you would start a post on how you insure that there are zero mold spores or bacteria in your hash from the plant material.

That would stop us debating bubble hash on this BHO thread and I sincerely do look forward to the enlightenment?

they already deleted my hash thread... this ain't my first rodeo. as I was saying earlier, I jar my hash <2 days after extraction. It would mold or mildew if still wet and if spores where present. The patients have not reported any mold or mildew. Just outstanding results. Drying water hash so simple really. No vac purge or any of that. Check my 5 star reviews on weedmaps at southbay CRC in San Jose. The proof would be in the pudding (pics + lab test + patient reviews) or so they say. southbay CRC review on weedmaps

thread derail over... sorry about that.