Advancing Eco Agriculture, Product Science

[GWillis]

Red: of course you know your stuff.. We were in the same pickle at 160 yds. decided to supplement some prospector with malibu to shave costs.
Slow: my boron is lower than reds at this stage do recommend a top dress of it to push up the levels?

 

[slownickel]

Red: of course you know your stuff.. We were in the same pickle at 160 yds. decided to supplement some prospector with malibu to shave costs.
Slow: my boron is lower than reds at this stage do recommend a top dress of it to push up the levels?

Gwill. For sure! I just don't trust Logans numbers, especially Boron. They are all over the place.

Red, can you make a comparison of labs regarding B? Are any of your tests from Logan and Spectrum comparable?

 

[EastBayGrower]

We bought 200 yards of the Oly's at almost $300 per yard delivered!!!! They wanted EVEN MORE money for the same mix with Malibu. Went with the Oly's for simple economics and still paid too much. I've seen tests on the Malibu and yes it has much better trace levels than Oly's and less Al, so you'll certainly get more distance out of it in a water only situation. But its still crazy high on CEC, CO3, N, and K. And all that early N and K makes for explosive growth, which wows growers that don't know better, but you end up with hollow growth and insufficient roots and with no further inputs, just water, you will stall just as well, albeit maybe a month after the Oly's.

I should also mention that there are considerable inconstancies. Larger than basketball chunks of unmixed compost and unbroken-down carbon was found in there, huge chunks of rice hulls not mixed in. Some of the totes that didn't get used immediately and stayed closed were growing all sorts of deep rooted grasses and had visible weed contamination in the mix. Quaker grass, common reed, or crab grass came up like crazy and it was encouraged to just continue mowing it in. Turns out those grasses are major copper and zinc bioaccumulators and should of been pulled asap. I don't think that came in the Oly's compost.

yeah, its not the first time ive heard of BAS oly compost totally throwing the coots out of wack, one of the most important things making the coots is finding suitible compost imo.. i started testing my compost/ewc, once you know those levels its easy to calculate to how it will mix with the peat, which has a fairly consistent levels of nutes...

best of luck.. and remember you can always cut with a bunch of peat and build up nutes levels again

you gotta remeber that th peat will have only 60pds/acre K and P, so you really want a compost with high K and P, atleast thats my perspective when im using peat to make a coots mix from scratch

 

[Johnny Redthumb]

I struggled to get B above 1ppm on the logan tests. Looks like Spectrum is showing a bit more, but I have been slowly adding Boric Acid at about 5g per 1000sq ft. and the different tests are about a month apart. Inconclusive.

 

[slownickel]

I struggled to get B above 1ppm on the logan tests. Looks like Spectrum is showing a bit more, but I have been slowly adding Boric Acid at about 5g per 1000sq ft. and the different tests are about a month apart. Inconclusive.

Have you been applying boron foliarly? That is a must in your situation.

 

[Johnny Redthumb]

Have you been applying boron foliarly? That is a must in your situation.

Absolutely. Albion B at 2mL per gal.

 

[slownickel]

How many plants can you spray with a gallon so as to make a calculation???

 

[oct]

While we're over here talking how to fix hollow stems....

 

[_tessarecting]

IG is chock full of these gems

 

[slownickel]

Love to see what was harvested from those stems!

 

[reppin2c]

Just seeing the letters BAS doesn't sit well with me. My sweet corn crop is a staggering 3 foot tall in a BAS mix and purple to boot. I purposefully never amend that soil just so it pisses me off every year as a reminder.

 

[Johnny Redthumb]

How many plants can you spray with a gallon so as to make a calculation???

Minimum 1 gallon per plant. Takes about 20-24 gallons to do the whole 3000 sq ft greenhouse.

Just seeing the letters BAS doesn't sit well with me. My sweet corn crop is a staggering 3 foot tall in a BAS mix and purple to boot. I purposefully never amend that soil just so it pisses me off every year as a reminder.

Haha. Awesome. My sentiments exactly! Except my bread and butter pot plants are in it, so the pissed off is running deep this year.

 

[GWillis]

Slow- haven't really had time to read through much of astera's thread to understand the beef but i can tell there is some... For what its worth we worked with him on a second year re-amend at another garden.. Much lighter mix a variation of a tom hill style that had been pretty far off after yr 1. That garden is performing magnificently there may be a solid handful 8 to 10+lb plants in that garden in 200gal closed bottom smart pots and the 300 gal are looking like they will average 7-9 with ease if we close out the season right (big IF)- I will post pictures in the next day or so. He never recommended his fertilizers and in fact added i would do better locally price wise on inputs rather then using his. That said I appreciate and respect both of you so far neither have lead me astray and by no means am i trying to stir the shit pot. Just thought it was worth stating. We will run spectrum tests with your package at the end of the year at both gardens and with the same sample sources run them through logan to compare.. hoping we can hire you to consult .

Red And reppin: Im sorry to hear your soil was so bunk! Though it has not been amazing, our mix seemed very consistent... we went through all of it by hand laying it into our sites. Not sure about you reppin but red if the mix was that inconsistent visually it seems there should be some re-compensating on jeremy's part..? whats your plan with that soil next year?

 

[slownickel]

Slow- haven't really had time to read through much of astera's thread to understand the beef but i can tell there is some... For what its worth we worked with him on a second year re-amend at another garden.. Much lighter mix a variation of a tom hill style that had been pretty far off after yr 1. That garden is performing magnificently there may be a solid handful 8 to 10+lb plants in that garden in 200gal closed bottom smart pots and the 300 gal are looking like they will average 7-9 with ease if we close out the season right (big IF)- I will post pictures in the next day or so. He never recommended his fertilizers and in fact added i would do better locally price wise on inputs rather then using his.

Beef? Ya think? hahaha.

Mr A. burned his bridges with the company that filled the orders. LMAO.

 

[GWillis]

Slow- I will add that we didn't do everything he recommended.. we backed off the phos a lot to feed in flower instead and added no sodium.

 

[GWillis]

I see that sucks.Again I know nothing and want not to be a shit stir. thank you for all of your helpful insights on IC! you have inspired me to learn much much more!

 

[slownickel]

I see that sucks.Again I know nothing and want not to be a shit stir. thank you for all of your helpful insights on IC! you have inspired me to learn much much more!

Might I suggest going to the soilandhealth dot org library and downloading a free copy of Victor Tiedjens, "More Food from Soil Science".

That is a book worth reading!

 

[Mate Dave]

Watch the nova crop control stuff again. The plant works just like the soil. Once you saturate it foliar or no it ain't taking anymore.

I would be willing to guess those lower ph beds are not the ones that have hollow stems...they can exchange H for base cations ie they can take up foliar Ca whereas the ones with higher ph probably cannot. This is espe cially true if your soil ec is where you like to run it.

You are leaving no room for the plant to correct. It is fine to run highish cec if your mix is dead nuts on. But if it isn't you aren't allowing the plant to choose

Nice analogy.

 

[Lightweight]

I'm enjoying following along with this thread. I believe my soil is pretty dialed in. My plants are growing like crazy. I've been consistently foliar spraying Nutralive A and B and Tainio products. I need to fertigate more regularly (I guess), but my pressure tank needs fixing so I have to use the neighbors water and it's a hassle, but things are going good especially considering I had a late start in this spot with soil that wasn't dialed in and this has been an incredibly wet summer. Really ridiculous amounts of rain on the regular plus a few bonus tropical storms have made it a memorably wet summer. I'll be sending in some soil samples again in the near future, but things are cruising along well so far with these two exceptions which I would really appreciate some veterans' input:

I just wanted to get a confirmation that this is leaf septoria and not some deficiency or something. Leaf septoria is somewhat common in my area, especially in damper areas or when it's been as wet as it has been.


And I have no idea what this deficiency is. It's at the top new growth of a finicky Dream Beaver. I have 3 different Dream Beavers going and the other two have been good. This one has been throwing out twisted or misshapen leaves pretty much it's whole life. It's structure and growth have been fine otherwise.


Thanks for all the input again. This thread and all the paths it has led to has helped this to be the biggest and best grow I've had so far.

 

[slownickel]

LW,

The bottom one kinda looks like Boron toxicity.... Kinda looks like the vein stays green.



https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=214956