Miraculous Meds
Well-known member
Ha! I was looking for pics of the plant. U meant the plant container. lol Anyway that is impressive and nice to know the potential of such a small amount of medium. Thanks for sharing d9!
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a ppk for a 6 plant limit
- Thread starter delta9nxs
- Start date
Snook
Still Learning
I have never heard of your changing out rezs or flush what changed?
EDIT: or talk about controlling PH.
hi, tino! i've tried most common bit sizes 1/8" and under and like 3/32" to 1/8" (2.5-3 mm) the best. drill the hole at least 1/2" or 13 mm up from the bottom to keep debris out of it.
I have never heard of your changing out rezs or flush what changed?
EDIT: or talk about controlling PH.
well, i still don't but i think it's a good idea to maintain the ability in a commercial setting.
not everyone agrees with "no flushing" or not changing the reservoir out between growth stages so i want to design the ability to do so into the system. it makes it more versatile.
each grower develops there own personal cultural style and techniques. has a unique educational background and understanding. has different environmental conditions. different strains on both different time schedules and perhaps nutrient needs.
but, i think you could run a huge facility with plants at every stage of life from one bulk tank filled with 600 ppm solution.
route the lines from that out to independent pulse reservoirs and their accompanying plant group so that each group operates on it's own uptake schedule dictated by their stage of life.
or run the entire show except for the clones and seedlings on one bulk tank and one recirculating pulse reservoir.
all of these plumbing scenarios are valid and have been used and proven to "work".
which one you use is dependent on your operational plan. do you want to grow and harvest them all at once? or do you want 10 rooms with flowering plants in each one a week apart. plus a separate veg system so that you can "power veg" in preparation for flowering?
the ppk is a playable system. it is adaptable to any growing or harvest scheme.
forkup
Member
Greetings fellow ppkers! Good to see you back in business D9. I hope your health issues are behind you! It looked like everyone had quit posting which I see now coincided with your move so I quit coming around until I decided to check in last week. I took the time to read this thread to catch up and here I see another awesome new design along with more discussion. I'm glad to have other ppkers to relate to again!
In the past couple of years give or take I've managed to design and build out a few different ppk systems and have had a lot of fun and luck with them all.
I have a cloning/preveg tub setup similar to the one above based on the 27 gallon black tub with yellow lids that accomodates up to 15 quart cups.
A 4 plant 3 1/2 gallon bucket setup that works well for veg or a full closet grow.
An 8 plant setup based on a kiddie pool designed to fit into a 4' tent.
I currently run a 8-12 plant power veg setup I've replumbed after seeing the new hose tech. It feeds a dual 8 plant tree setup again based on 3 1/2 gallon buckets top and bottom with plants tied to vertical screens in a hall configuration similar to D9s old run a la Marlo. I've ran dozens of plants thru it from apollo 11 to urkle, sativa to indica, with very few yielding under a pound and have had the occasional 1 1/2 pounder. My best was 44 1/2 ounces! I've been well pleased.
Each system has been solid and dependable, easy to run for new growers with low maintenance. What else can you ask for
In the past couple of years give or take I've managed to design and build out a few different ppk systems and have had a lot of fun and luck with them all.
I have a cloning/preveg tub setup similar to the one above based on the 27 gallon black tub with yellow lids that accomodates up to 15 quart cups.
A 4 plant 3 1/2 gallon bucket setup that works well for veg or a full closet grow.
An 8 plant setup based on a kiddie pool designed to fit into a 4' tent.
I currently run a 8-12 plant power veg setup I've replumbed after seeing the new hose tech. It feeds a dual 8 plant tree setup again based on 3 1/2 gallon buckets top and bottom with plants tied to vertical screens in a hall configuration similar to D9s old run a la Marlo. I've ran dozens of plants thru it from apollo 11 to urkle, sativa to indica, with very few yielding under a pound and have had the occasional 1 1/2 pounder. My best was 44 1/2 ounces! I've been well pleased.
Each system has been solid and dependable, easy to run for new growers with low maintenance. What else can you ask for
Snook
Still Learning
Luvya brother..
please put them in the plants in ppk's thread in this section! thank you!
RamCTD1027
Member
Hi guys,
I know we want to keep this discussion to the construction and use of PPK but I thought this may be useful to other users growing in PPK with turface as the medium.
I am experiencing what I think to be Ca deficiencies with young plants (5-6wks) vegging in turface. I am using RO water and feeding Jacks+Calnit at 1.2EC (600 ppm at 0.5 conversion) and 1/0.67 ratio. It was my understanding that the Jacks+calnit at this EC should have enough Ca in it.
Once user suggested the issue could be linked to turface, which is something I had not considered. Another user suggested a pH issue, which could be a possibility, however, i remember D9 stating he doesnt pay too much attention to pH and my pH sitting at 6.0-6.1 didnt appear to be a problem until I looked at the nutrient availability chart I saved from the forum long ago.
The reason I am putting this in here is because this seems to be a place where there are many users who use turface as the medium and jacks+calnit as for their nutrients.
What do you guys think?
If you would prefer I not put this info in this thread, mods feel free to remove it.
I know we want to keep this discussion to the construction and use of PPK but I thought this may be useful to other users growing in PPK with turface as the medium.
I am experiencing what I think to be Ca deficiencies with young plants (5-6wks) vegging in turface. I am using RO water and feeding Jacks+Calnit at 1.2EC (600 ppm at 0.5 conversion) and 1/0.67 ratio. It was my understanding that the Jacks+calnit at this EC should have enough Ca in it.
Once user suggested the issue could be linked to turface, which is something I had not considered. Another user suggested a pH issue, which could be a possibility, however, i remember D9 stating he doesnt pay too much attention to pH and my pH sitting at 6.0-6.1 didnt appear to be a problem until I looked at the nutrient availability chart I saved from the forum long ago.
The reason I am putting this in here is because this seems to be a place where there are many users who use turface as the medium and jacks+calnit as for their nutrients.
What do you guys think?
If you would prefer I not put this info in this thread, mods feel free to remove it.
Attachments
Snook
Still Learning
the only time they look like some deficiency was hapnin, was when the EC/ppm pen was out of calibration and I was feeding too strong and poorly proportioned Jacks+. otherwise, maybe light burn.. use the ph pen to check the ph of the ro, just in case it needs new filters.. turface is very nice to work with... toss the chart it will make you crazy..
/ accidental double posthttp://www.growweedeasy.com/sites/g...deficiency/hydroponics-ph-chart-marijuana.jpg
yea, you'd 1st have to decide what chart you wanted to follow. There are lots of them out there. I wouldn't put too much stock in them.
This ones shows the complete opposite in regards to Ca.
This ones shows the complete opposite in regards to Ca.
Miraculous Meds
Well-known member
Its not the turface, ph, or nutrient. Too many people here to confirm that those parameters work.
Whats ur hi/lo temp and rh?
Id bet without seeing the issue, that its vpd, or the mediums too wet.
RamCTD1027
Member
Thanks for the replies so far guys.
I made a post in the infirmary with more details and pictures but I'm getting better/more realistic answers here.
Temp and VDP are a concern right now. I have 10 plants on a 2x4 table inside a 4x6 tent while I finish the flower room (should be done this weekend). Temp has been all over the map with an average in the 70s and RH sits in the 40s so I know VDP is not ideal but that should be fixed this weekend. I did stop by the grow this morning on my way to work and the temp in the tent was 67...with a south-facing building, I know that will increase as the day progresses.
As far as water/nutes go, I am using RO with brand new filters that were flushed properly. Like I said before, I'm using jacks+calnit at the 1/.67 ration and an EC of 1.2 (600 ppm at 0.5 conversion). To keep the plants alive, they are on a 2x4 table being fed ebb and flow for 1 minute 3x per 24hrs with a 400w metal halide hung horizontal on 24hr with a 6in fan pulling through the light. Roots are exploding out of all the pots, however, I did notice that when I pick up some of the pots and mildly agitate and tilt the pot, I can get water to pour out of the drain holes. Possible over-watering?
There are 4 strains on the table. One strain is exhibiting the issue pretty bad and I noticed one other strain shows the same spotting but very mildly. The two other show no signs of the problem.
I should note, I did inspect for bugs. I removed some of the damaged leaves and inspected for any signs of live bugs and eggs. I only had a 10x scope but I did not see anything.
What should be my course of action? Assume nutes are fine and focus on environment? Remove one feeding to help dry out the pots?
Please refer to my post in the infirmary for additional details and pictures. I am on my phone now but will add pictures later when I get home from work.
Thanks for all the help!
I made a post in the infirmary with more details and pictures but I'm getting better/more realistic answers here.
Temp and VDP are a concern right now. I have 10 plants on a 2x4 table inside a 4x6 tent while I finish the flower room (should be done this weekend). Temp has been all over the map with an average in the 70s and RH sits in the 40s so I know VDP is not ideal but that should be fixed this weekend. I did stop by the grow this morning on my way to work and the temp in the tent was 67...with a south-facing building, I know that will increase as the day progresses.
As far as water/nutes go, I am using RO with brand new filters that were flushed properly. Like I said before, I'm using jacks+calnit at the 1/.67 ration and an EC of 1.2 (600 ppm at 0.5 conversion). To keep the plants alive, they are on a 2x4 table being fed ebb and flow for 1 minute 3x per 24hrs with a 400w metal halide hung horizontal on 24hr with a 6in fan pulling through the light. Roots are exploding out of all the pots, however, I did notice that when I pick up some of the pots and mildly agitate and tilt the pot, I can get water to pour out of the drain holes. Possible over-watering?
There are 4 strains on the table. One strain is exhibiting the issue pretty bad and I noticed one other strain shows the same spotting but very mildly. The two other show no signs of the problem.
I should note, I did inspect for bugs. I removed some of the damaged leaves and inspected for any signs of live bugs and eggs. I only had a 10x scope but I did not see anything.
What should be my course of action? Assume nutes are fine and focus on environment? Remove one feeding to help dry out the pots?
Please refer to my post in the infirmary for additional details and pictures. I am on my phone now but will add pictures later when I get home from work.
Thanks for all the help!
ramct .....Some run the mix 1 to 1, 1 cal nit to 1 hydro.
i was not, i was doing the .66cal nit to 1 hydro ratio as well. i posted it in a my " who switched to jacks " thread i started. delta chimed in an stated goto 1 to 1. Atleast i think it was delta9, i will check an edit if i am wrong.
i was having issues with things not greening up an occasional cal spotting.
i count tablespoons with my rez, simple, i start with x amount for tap, then add my 500ppm an work up to 800ppm jacks & calnit
vdp is important, very important, you get the vdp correct an alot of issues never arrise. things will go smoother. i am for 65-70%rh early veg into early flower, back down to 60% rh early mid flower, then shoot for 50% by day 50. keep enough air moving an you shouldnt have mold issues.
another thing...... in early stages its tough to tell how much light is to much light. we wanna throw as much light at them usually to speed them up, but in alot of cases early on the root system is not developed enough to deal with high energy. the plants wanna work faster then the roots can deliver, an they will eat them selves in the process.
try 1 to 1. im having good results currently.
bsafe
i was not, i was doing the .66cal nit to 1 hydro ratio as well. i posted it in a my " who switched to jacks " thread i started. delta chimed in an stated goto 1 to 1. Atleast i think it was delta9, i will check an edit if i am wrong.
i was having issues with things not greening up an occasional cal spotting.
i count tablespoons with my rez, simple, i start with x amount for tap, then add my 500ppm an work up to 800ppm jacks & calnit
vdp is important, very important, you get the vdp correct an alot of issues never arrise. things will go smoother. i am for 65-70%rh early veg into early flower, back down to 60% rh early mid flower, then shoot for 50% by day 50. keep enough air moving an you shouldnt have mold issues.
another thing...... in early stages its tough to tell how much light is to much light. we wanna throw as much light at them usually to speed them up, but in alot of cases early on the root system is not developed enough to deal with high energy. the plants wanna work faster then the roots can deliver, an they will eat them selves in the process.
try 1 to 1. im having good results currently.
bsafe
as mm said, it is not the turface, ph, or the calcium.
that pattern of spots on the leaf, starting in that place, you can see them emanating out of the veins, are indicative of low o2 in the root zone.
anoxic conditions are occurring at least part of the time. it looks to me that you are hand watering conventional pots. if so, change your schedule.
turface is a superb hydroponic medium, the bonsai hero on your thread in the infirmary is not acknowledging the huge cultural differences between hydro and hand watered containers.
all the ph charts are screwed. like the one you show, most depict elemental uptake absolutely stopping on one element while not quite starting on another. then they go on to tell you to "let it drift up and down so that your plant can get everything it needs".
you do have "ideal" ranges for uptake of each individual element. but they don't all occur between 5.8-6.2.
the plant will still take up all the nutrients over a large range of ph. it will just vary in availability.
but there is no way you have a true deficiency in turface using jack's.
by the way, there is a huge hydroponic tomato greenhouse in turkey that runs everything at 4.6 ph as there is a nice band of overlapping uptake that occurs there similar to the band around 5.8.
you might consider shoving a wick up into your medium with a screwdriver and elevating the pots so they drain all the excess water immediately.
editing to say that if you are hand watering turface you need to either screen it for fines or cut it with something like perlite or rice hulls to drive up air filled porosity.
RamCTD1027
Member
Again, I can't thank you guys enough for all the great info.
Right now, I am in conventional pots but I am not hand watering. They are on an ebb and flow table and being fed 3x per day at a 1min flood interval using traditional ebb and flow watering.
I am beginning to suspect it is low O2 in the root zone. The roots are exploding out of the bottom of the pots, however, when I lift a pot and mildly agitate it and tilt it towards one side, water pours out that drain hole.
I didn't screen the turface, however, I did wash the shit out of it. I used almost 40-50gal of water to 1 bag of all sport to clean out all the fines. Should I screen it as well?
I have tomorrow off from work so I plan to finish the room, ppk set up, and transplant the plants into their 7gal homes. Should I screen all that turface or just rinse the hell out of it?
Again, I appreciate all the help. Turface is new to me. I have a lot of experience with coco but I see the benefits of ppk and turface and I'm motivated to make it work.
Right now, I am in conventional pots but I am not hand watering. They are on an ebb and flow table and being fed 3x per day at a 1min flood interval using traditional ebb and flow watering.
I am beginning to suspect it is low O2 in the root zone. The roots are exploding out of the bottom of the pots, however, when I lift a pot and mildly agitate it and tilt it towards one side, water pours out that drain hole.
I didn't screen the turface, however, I did wash the shit out of it. I used almost 40-50gal of water to 1 bag of all sport to clean out all the fines. Should I screen it as well?
I have tomorrow off from work so I plan to finish the room, ppk set up, and transplant the plants into their 7gal homes. Should I screen all that turface or just rinse the hell out of it?
Again, I appreciate all the help. Turface is new to me. I have a lot of experience with coco but I see the benefits of ppk and turface and I'm motivated to make it work.
most traditional ebb and flow set-ups use hydroton as it has such a huge air filled porosity that it won't support a perched water table. so it will drain freely and completely after each watering event.
you are using a substance that retains the pwt but you are not doing anything to get rid of it after each event. so you are keeping the bottoms a little too wet for a little too long. the fact that you still have roots breaking out means that it is not too bad yet.
i would screen or cut the turface. i'm getting away with not doing it because the cement mixer removes a lot more of the finer material than hand washing.
back in the original thread i tried a bunch of different media mixes. i think maybe it's time to revisit some of them and maybe try some new ones, too.
i grew nice plants in the ppk in coco, perlite, rice hulls, even bark and some lava rock. the red kind.
i'm thinking about a mix of pumice stone and coco fiber now that i've decided to go back to a wave type pulse. probably somewhere around 90/10 pumice/coco.
i liked perlite/coco at about the same ratio.
