2024 US Presidential Election

[Microbeman]

Thats complete bullshit. But you cant blame mexico for americans drug use

my words - your keyboard

 

[xtsho]

One of the reasons NIDA and others recently added to the reasons for the decrease in fatal drug overdoses included people using Fentanyl realizing the potency and adjusting for it.

A comment by the head shrink/Doc at the Liverpool Project in the early 1990s had to do with no one properly educating addicts about all sorts of valuable information, such as how to properly clean and sterilize a glass syringe for reuse if/when new and clean isn't available.

Yet we wasted how many $millions on Nancy Reagan's "Just SAY No" bullshit.

Imagine a clinic teaching addicts or users how to properly regulate a Fentanyl dose? The Puritans would flip out, but it would save lives.

How would they know the potency of what they had to begin with? That's the problem. The potency varies from batch to batch.

And I highly doubt these fentanyl addicts can be taught anything. They're so far gone that they continue to use even after having bone showing from open sores and limbs being amputated. Many are too far gone. Their brains are irreversibly damaged. They're like the kid that huffed paint back in school that ended up in a mental institution.

Your solution would not work unless the supply was controlled and all the same potency. But you would probably have no problem having the government supply addicts with fentanyl of known potency to prevent overdoses while creating a class of permanent addicts using government dope.

 

[audiohi]

It'll be fun to revisit this post in a year.

 

[moose eater]

How would they know the potency of what they had to begin with? That's the problem. The potency varies from batch to batch.

And I highly doubt these fentanyl addicts can be taught anything. They're so far gone that they continue to use even after having bone showing from open sores and limbs being amputated. Many are too far gone. Their brains are irreversibly damaged. They're like the kid that huffed paint back in school that ended up in a mental institution.

Your solution would not work unless the supply was controlled and all the same potency. But you would probably have no problem having the government supply addicts with fentanyl of known potency to prevent overdoses while creating a class of permanent addicts using government dope.

Fentanyl is so cheap and available that the way people used to cut good coke is not as prevalent with Fentanyl.

Even teaching people to slow down and test it with smaller shots or snorts would be more than a little helpful.

But as I wrote, NIDA and others have already, in part, attributed a decline in fatal ODs to the sensitizing of users to the potency.

What gets dicey is when some unscrupulous asshole cuts his smack with it, and no one knows factually that it's in there. So, there's even a reason in that scenario to reduce initial loads of heroin, too.

Education, education, education... will achieve far more than some mercenary fascist with a badge wagging a finger at someone who already doesn't respect them.

And you're absolutely correct, this becomes much more manageable with LEGAL, PHARMACEUTICALLY DISTRIBUTED DOPE!! Like in Liverpool.

Yet again, to reiterate a third or fourth time, one of the reasons given for the decrease in lethality of ODs is already cited as involving awareness of the potency of Fentanyl on the parts of users.

We -already- KNOW the War on (Some) Drugs has failed. And we've known that for a LONG time if we were paying any attention at all.

 

[moose eater]

How would they know the potency of what they had to begin with? That's the problem. The potency varies from batch to batch.

And I highly doubt these fentanyl addicts can be taught anything. They're so far gone that they continue to use even after having bone showing from open sores and limbs being amputated. Many are too far gone. Their brains are irreversibly damaged. They're like the kid that huffed paint back in school that ended up in a mental institution.

Your solution would not work unless the supply was controlled and all the same potency. But you would probably have no problem having the government supply addicts with fentanyl of known potency to prevent overdoses while creating a class of permanent addicts using government dope.

By the way, the symptoms of abscesses, etc., is often far more related to improper syringe use/maintenance/sharing/infections than to Fentanyl. And even beyond that, more related to improperly made meth too.

 

[RobFromTX]

Everyone makes their choices. If these people had common sense they wouldn't be shooting up anything.
If I lived on skid row I'd spend all my panhandling money on blue dream and goldfish crackers

 

[moose eater]

How would they know the potency of what they had to begin with? That's the problem. The potency varies from batch to batch.

And I highly doubt these fentanyl addicts can be taught anything. They're so far gone that they continue to use even after having bone showing from open sores and limbs being amputated. Many are too far gone. Their brains are irreversibly damaged. They're like the kid that huffed paint back in school that ended up in a mental institution.

Your solution would not work unless the supply was controlled and all the same potency. But you would probably have no problem having the government supply addicts with fentanyl of known potency to prevent overdoses while creating a class of permanent addicts using government dope.

You -really- need to park your presumptuousness and look at that Liverpool Project video again. Your assumptions about outcomes are not necessarily reality based.

 

[xtsho]

Fentanyl is so cheap and available that the way people used to cut good coke is not as prevalent with Fentanyl.

Even teaching people to slow down and test it with smaller shots or snorts would be more than a little helpful.

But as I wrote, NIDA and others have already, in part, attributed a decline in fatal ODs to the sensitizing of users to the potency.

What gets dicey is when some unscrupulous asshole cuts his smack with it, and no one knows factually that it's in there. So, there's even a reason in that scenario to reduce initial loads of heroin, too.

Education, education, education... will achieve far more than some mercenary fascist with a badge wagging a finger at someone who already doesn't respect them.

And you're absolutely correct, this becomes much more manageable with LEGAL, PHARMACEUTICALLY DISTRIBUTED DOPE!! Like in Liverpool.

Yet again, to reiterate a third or fourth time, one of the reasons given for the decrease in lethality of ODs is already cited as involving awareness of the potency of Fentanyl on the parts of users.

we already KNOW the War on (Some) Drugs has failed. And we've known that for a LONG time if we were paying any attention at all.

The decrease in the amount of overdoses is due to Narcan which has become readily available and is distributed for free. You can even get it in the mail for free if there isn't a clinic near you giving it out.

Narcan is the primary reason that the overdose rate has dropped. It's done nothing to stop the addiction. It just keeps them alive. It's nothing more than a bandage.

Here's the Alaska link:

Alaska — NEXT Distro

nextdistro.org

Opioid Overdose Response Kit​

Included in the kit:
– Naloxone nasal spray, two doses
– Gloves
– Face shield for CPR rescue breathing
– Fentanyl test strip
– Xylazine test strip
– Instructions
*Training required, please use the Google Chrome browser. Completing the Opioid Overdose Recognition and Response Training is required to receive kits via mail. The online training takes about 15 minutes to complete.
Limit of two naloxone kits per order.

 

[armedoldhippy]

trump recognized the golan heights as israeli land when it's been historically recognized as syrian.

"historically", Syria can go piss up a rope. why do you think Israel took it? Syria used the heights to lob artillery into Israel. play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

 

[xtsho]

You -really- need to park your presumptuousness and look at that Liverpool Project video again. Your assumptions about outcomes are not necessarily reality based.

The only thing not reality based is your assumption that you know more than everyone else. You don't. You might convince some stoners on a cannabis forum that you're the smartest guy in the room but you can't and won't convince me or many others posting in this thread.

The Liverpool Project you speak of has nothing to do with USA in 2024 where you can get a dose for a couple dollars.

You just want to try and prove everyone else wrong and give yourself a cookie. You fail to face the reality of today. Some project from 1990 is irrelevant. Your solutions are not viable. Teaching an addict how to measure out and test dope accomplishes nothing. Your solution seems to be to legalize fentanyl and let the government hand it out. That's not a solution.

 

[moose eater]

The decrease in the amount of overdoses is due to Narcan which has become readily available and is distributed for free. You can even get it in the mail for free if there isn't a clinic near you giving it out.

Narcan is the primary reason that the overdose rate has dropped. It's done nothing to stop the addiction. It just keeps them alive. It's nothing more than a bandage.

Here's the Alaska link:

Alaska — NEXT Distro

nextdistro.org

Opioid Overdose Response Kit​

Included in the kit:
– Naloxone nasal spray, two doses
– Gloves
– Face shield for CPR rescue breathing
– Fentanyl test strip
– Xylazine test strip
– Instructions
*Training required, please use the Google Chrome browser. Completing the Opioid Overdose Recognition and Response Training is required to receive kits via mail. The online training takes about 15 minutes to complete.
Limit of two naloxone kits per order.

View attachment 19077860

The decrease was a national trend, supported by NIDA's statements as well as others, and was due to more than just Narcan.

I already posted the source days ago. You apparently didn't read it, and/or simply disregarded it for whatever reasons.

You're hell-bent on it not working, without having any substantial knowledge either of the Liverpool Project's successes, or of Portugal's successes, which had/have much less structure to them than in Liverpool.
.
I'm dealing in facts and you're dealing in negative suppositions and presumptuousness, for whatever your reasons are.

How's the criminalizing of drugs working out for you so far?

 

[armedoldhippy]

We -already- KNOW the War on (Some) Drugs has failed. And we've known that for a LONG time if we were paying any attention at all.

yup. drugs won that war BILLIONS of dollars ago. but those addicted to the money being wasted in the lost cause aint pulling their heads out of the public trough of their own free will. they'll have to be forcibly removed...

 

[Cannavore]

"historically", Syria can go piss up a rope. why do you think Israel took it? Syria used the heights to lob artillery into Israel. play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

they bombed settlements, illegal settlements. settlements which likely killed the previous inhabitants.

 

[moose eater]

The only thing not reality based is your assumption that you know more than everyone else. You don't. You might convince some stoners on a cannabis forum that you're the smartest guy in the room but you can't and won't convince me or many others posting in this thread.

The Liverpool Project you speak of has nothing to do with USA in 2024 where you can get a dose for a couple dollars.

You just want to try and prove everyone else wrong and give yourself a cookie. You fail to face the reality of today. Some project from 1990 is irrelevant. Your solutions are not viable. Teaching an addict how to measure out and test dope accomplishes nothing. Your solution seems to be to legalize fentanyl and let the government hand it out. That's not a solution.

Yep, my years as a licensed clinician and my family member's 20+ years running a methadone program and a needle exchange, doing a harm reduction gig, are absolutely no match for your cynicism ad presumptuousness. Got it.

During legalization plenty of prohibitionists told us cannabis couldn't work here like it did/does in Holland because "Holland is a much more homogenous culture." Which was laughable unto itself, and pointed to them clearly having no clue about Holland's INCREDIBLY diverse population.

Your post above distinctly has that similar tenor.

Your drug war is, has been, and will be a failure. I guess you prefer it that way?

And there are many paths to addressing this issue that rest between Liverpool's and Portugal's approaches. You refuse, for whatever reason(s), to even consider ideas, yet you lack any substantial experience in that business or profession. Looks like foolishness with a knee-jerk added in for flavor.

Sorry that your presumptions and phobias affect so many others with the end-product of continued failure.

I personally like positive successes when I can grab them. But to each their own.

Portland and San Fran let loose with a free-for-all, then held their hands up and screamed, "SEE!! IT DOESN'T WORK!!"

As I've asked before, never getting any answer, why do you think anyone would do that in that way?

 

[Cannavore]

 

[armedoldhippy]

they bombed settlements, illegal settlements. settlements which likely killed the previous inhabitants.

the Six Days War started when Israel launched a pre-emptive strike after being alerted to the fact that 3 neighboring Arab countries (Jordan, Syria, and Egypt) were mobilizing for war. i'm sure that you would have preferred that they sit on their hands until actually under assault by numerically superior forces, huh . Israel did not begin expansion until they won the Six Days war. they quadrupled the land mass under their control by winning. those settlements Syria was shelling were in Israel...which is why the Golan Heights now belong to...Israel. what do YOUR history books say ?

 

[Cannavore]

the Six Days War started when Israel launched a pre-emptive strike after being alerted to the fact that 3 neighboring Arab countries (Jordan, Syria, and Egypt) were mobilizing for war.

so, israel steals a country in 1948, the neighboring countries band together to fight back, and israel preemptively attacks them. lol.

 

[moose eater]

the Six Days War started when Israel launched a pre-emptive strike after being alerted to the fact that 3 neighboring Arab countries (Jordan, Syria, and Egypt) were mobilizing for war. i'm sure that you would have preferred that they sit on their hands until actually under assault by numerically superior forces, huh . Israel did not begin expansion until they won the Six Days war. they quadrupled the land mass under their control by winning. those settlements Syria was shelling were in Israel...which is why the Golan Heights now belong to...Israel. what do YOUR history books say ?

Do you think that a country that had already established its desire to take others land (1948 and forward), with a clear history of lying for political self-serving reasons, might embellish that 'preemptive' justification, similarly to GW's bogus claims about Iraq?

I do.

 

[Brother Nature]

Haven't been in this thread for a while, but damn if the “progressive democrats” aren’t sounding exactly like 80’s era Reagan level republicans up in here…

 

[right]

Haven't been in this thread for a while, but damn if the “progressive democrats” aren’t sounding exactly like 80’s era Reagan level republicans up in here…

Don't worry they are just trying to reach a broader voter base if elected. Their deeds won't match their promises