White House Drug Czar Speaks to Legalization

[johnnyla]

Glad some of you feel safer. I'm waiting for Obamacare as i am one of millions of medically unsinsurable citizens.

i have an MRI on Friday. $3,800 out the door after cash discount.

wanna know how much two MRI scans cost the insurance companies? $13,600.00

wanna know why healthcare is fucked? because it costs $13,600.00 to pay for a technician and rental/use of a machine for one hour.

God Bless America.

 

[Elevator Man]

Good point - ours is free at point of delivery already.

I had an MRI scan two years ago, and I got really high, took in my own CD to play over the headphones, and had a really pleasant time toying with imaginary claustrophobia issues whilst I was in the tube. The cost of the treatment was not an issue at all for me, and so I was able to marvel at the obvious cost of the machine, the fact that it was one mile down the road from my house, and that I only waited one week for an appointment.

Again, from the information we get in the UK on Obama's healthcare reforms (admittedly skimpy on detail), we can't work out for the life of us why any country wouldn't want something similar installing as quickly as possible, especially in a country with so many obviously needing urgent treatment? It's baffling, from here at least...

 

[SpasticGramps]

Let's face it - the world is better than it's ever been before, and it's getting better all the time.

We shall see my friend. Humans always think we are more evolved than we are. It's a fallacy created by the 2nd Illusion of Prosperity IMO. The first ending in 1929.

I for one think we are much more prone to self destruction and more violent than ever.

If you think the world economy isn't going to melt down in the next couple of years then we'll just have to wait and see who's economic prowess is more refined. Markets are markets.

I totally understand the whole "end is near" deal, but there comes a time when the political science and economics doesn't lie. We've been down this road before.

 

[xfargox]

I'll be very interested in who the Republicans elect to challenge Obama in '12. I hope he's a moderate.

 

[SpasticGramps]

Wanna know what I see coming and it's scary. His name is already in the hat, but he is a blackhorse.

Kind of like Obama was.

3 years is a long time. General Petraeus "Architect of the Surge" lol What a crock of shit.

 

[RetroGrow]

As world population spirals out of control, all systems will break down.
This is simple mathematics, and was worked out over 500 years ago by Malthus. What he knew, we still don't seem to understand. It can't go on as it has. Collapse is inevitable. Perhaps that's natures way.
But politicians all suck, including O'Bama.
I trust him as far as I can throw him.
Imagine: he stands behind laws which put people in prison for doing the exact thing he himself has done.
It doesn't get any more hypocritical or gutless than that.

 

[SpasticGramps]

"Social liberalism is an egalitarian ideology that believes the state should establish rules and regulations to extend personal rights and freedoms to all people."

What is bad about this definition?

Nothing necessarily bad about it. It just called Communism when put into practice faithfully. Doesn't work out that great in practice.

We share polar opposite views on political philosophy and more importantly the human condition.

You believe that government can provide a utopia (Idealist). I believe history is evidence that is anything but the case.

Realist believe their rights come from Nature not government.

 

[Cinderella99]

It's interesting that in roughly the 8th paragraph of the story, the conservative CSM references footnote #8 of Kerlikowske's speech as the most sobering rational for not legalizing. Here, in the latter half of the footnote, it mentions a study of young twins to prove his point that MJ causes psychosis!

What I think is really interesting is how this long awaited White House rebuttal was leaked to the conservative CSM (who had published previous recent articles against legalization). I mean "leaked" as in selectively chosen to scoop the story since it was a closed door speech... It's almost as if Kerlikowske walked out of the closed door meeting and handed his pre-printed transcript to the CSM, who has already made their anti-legalization stance clear, and then gave them his (only?) followup interview...

 

[Strainhunter]

Wow things said in there are chilling indeed!

 

[Elevator Man]

As world population spirals out of control, all systems will break down. This is simple mathematics, and was worked out over 500 years ago by Malthus. What he knew, we still don't seem to understand. It can't go on as it has. Collapse is inevitable. Perhaps that's natures way.

Nature and humanity are not a mathematic progression, and Malthus was talking out of his ass on sustainability - though given the means at his disposal, that's not surprising. Where is the evidence that 'all sysytems will break down'? I don't see anything like that happening - quite the opposite, in fact. Most healthcare worldwide is vastly better than 100 years ago, even with the overpopulation that is causing the problems. Many world issues are magnified beyond credibility - like SARS and Swine Flu, for example - according to the reports two years ago, half the world should be dying by now.

What Malthus couldn't know is that information, technology and science have vast potential for labour-saving, food-production and general well-being, and that index is rising all the time. Though an afternoon using a horse-drawn plough should have convinced even that doubting Thomas that a new technology had instantly and dramatically improved the efficiency and rate of food production.

Show me anywhere on earth that was demonstrably 'better' 100 years ago than it is now. And I don't mean some dream of a Gaia-fantastical matriarchal love-fest that tribal cultures are meant to live in before they get wired-up and 'ruined' by modern life.

Granted, many politicians are doing a pretty feeble job to improve matters, but that's largely because much of the public is even feebler, and is happy to sit on the fence carping about how crap everything is - whilst still typing out more stuff on their networked, world-available personal computer at 3am, smoking high-grade cannabis they grew themselves etc. What a nightmare existence, eh?

 

[bombadil.360]

each time I read or hear someone go on about "revolution", I vomit in my mouth a little lol...

"revolution" is just a fancy name for what happens when a new set of corrupt wanna-be leaders desires the political power. that is all there is to a "revolution".

 

[rootfingers]

I'll be very interested in who the Republicans elect to challenge Obama in '12. I hope he's a moderate.

I would give almost anything to see Palin debate Obama. What a night that would be.

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

I would give almost anything to see Palin debate Obama. What a night that would be.

Joe The Plumber + Sarah Palin for President in 2012 !!!


and when they lose, we can make them an offer to do their own sitcom...

 

[o.sparkles]

"The drug czar’s remarks are worth notice for two reasons. First, they provide needed talking points for those who oppose legalization but who can’t seem to make their message resonate in the face of a well-financed, well-organized pro-marijuana effort. Second, they help clear up confusion about the White House policy on legalization"

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.....as compared to the government funded crooks that lie about MJ and keep it illegal by financially manipulating the highest echelons of social and cultural order to do so? Better funded than the energy and textile sectors that are in the politician's collective pockets?

HA fucking HA.

What a joke....a bad bad joke.

 

[o.sparkles]

each time I read or hear someone go on about "revolution", I vomit in my mouth a little lol...

"revolution" is just a fancy name for what happens when a new set of corrupt wanna-be leaders desires the political power. that is all there is to a "revolution".

Every time I see someone scared to revolt my soul withers up a little. We have NO OTHER recourse. Revolutions don't have to be usurped by corruption, just because they always have. Are we defeated before we even try? Yes, because we have been programmed to do so.

Today's revolution has to be symbolic at first. People have to cget back a sense of civic duty. If you were to create a social-government site where people could Facebook about bills and laws we would have numbers to combat and sway government policy with. For example, when fat-cat lets-vote-ourselves-a-raise assholes try to push legislation through that Americans don't want we can show poll numbers. We would have a forum for real change. Get ideas flowing. Think American Idol meets Facebook meets US government and you have an idea what I am talking about. We have the tools and ideas, let's put some heads together. Change is possible, more possible wth communication. We should ALL be voting on everything. We don't NEED representation in this modern age. Congress wants you to ignore that fact and feel helpless or they WOULD BE OUT A FUCKING JOB.

Please, let's not be so jaded to think that revolution is passe. Slavery is the option. Living in jail cities as fodder for the powers that be is your option. Either be happy with the time you have left with your TV or please....do something.

 

[bombadil.360]

Every time I see someone scared to revolt my soul withers up a little. We have NO OTHER recourse. Revolutions don't have to be usurped by corruption, just because they always have. Are we defeated before we even try? Yes, because we have been programmed to do so.

Today's revolution has to be symbolic at first. People have to cget back a sense of civic duty. If you were to create a social-government site where people could Facebook about bills and laws we would have numbers to combat and sway government policy with. For example, when fat-cat lets-vote-ourselves-a-raise assholes try to push legislation through that Americans don't want we can show poll numbers. We would have a forum for real change. Get ideas flowing. Think American Idol meets Facebook meets US government and you have an idea what I am talking about. We have the tools and ideas, let's put some heads together. Change is possible, more possible wth communication. We should ALL be voting on everything. We don't NEED representation in this modern age. Congress wants you to ignore that fact and feel helpless or they WOULD BE OUT A FUCKING JOB.

Please, let's not be so jaded to think that revolution is passe. Slavery is the option. Living in jail cities as fodder for the powers that be is your option. Either be happy with the time you have left with your TV or please....do something.

I'm not jaded... I just know the reality of so-called revolutions, first hand.

if you really want things to change for the better, the only hope is whether each individual makes the proper changes within so that the world without is not the shit-hole that it is today because of the things people today have within.

be good.

 

[cannagrower]

Glad some of you feel safer. I'm waiting for Obamacare as i am one of millions of medically unsinsurable citizens.

i have an MRI on Friday. $3,800 out the door after cash discount.

wanna know how much two MRI scans cost the insurance companies? $13,600.00

wanna know why healthcare is fucked? because it costs $13,600.00 to pay for a technician and rental/use of a machine for one hour.

God Bless America.

Actually, Johnnyla, if you paid $3800 after a cash discount, I guarantee the insurance company paid way less. How do i know? I'm a bookkeeper that has done a lot of temping (temporary as in kelly girl or what ever you want to call it).

done many stints at hospitals and doctors offices. In order to accept a particular type of insurance (blue cross, aetna, golden rule, whatever your flavor) the provider also has to accept payment of the "contract amount." Which is much, much less that the billed amount, usually a percentage. The discounts I would see amounted to 35%, 65% and 75% (depending on services rendered, more expensive services required a much higher discount) - meaning that is how much the insurance companies would knock off the billed amount before paying the doctor or hospital.

Typical policy will have $1000 deductible (outta your pocket), $5000 stop loss (you pay 5k then insurance co picks up 100% after), 70/30 copay (insurance pays 70% you pay 30%)

In your example, $3800 MRI - deductible of $1000 leaves 2800 for the insurance co. of the 2800 you pay 30% for a total payment FROM YOU of $1840. Leaving $1960 for the insurance co.

Assuming the contracted discount is only 35% (could be more) your insurance co pays $1274.

 

[SpasticGramps]

The hospitals way over bill the insurance companies> The really only pay maybe 1/3 of the bill.

Now if you don't have insurance the hospital often tries to charge you the full amount or almost always more than the insurance company pays.

It's really f'ing sick.

The broader topic at hand.

We are basically SOL IMO. We the people have little power to influence Mega Corp Washington.

 

[RetroGrow]

Show me anywhere on earth that was demonstrably 'better' 100 years ago than it is now.

That's easy: everywhere.
100 years ago, the earth was clean and healthy. The air we breathe was pollution free. The oceans were pristine. Fish weren't full of mercury. Polar ice caps weren't melting. Species weren't going extinct at the highest rate ever as they are now. The worlds forests were not being wiped out as they are now, so we can use the land to grow more soy to feed more cattle, to feed more fat people. The destruction of many countries/cultures by massive "immigration" by those who are overpopulating the earth. A prime example is your own country, Britain, which is being over run by muslims, as is France and the rest of Europe. Since the countries of Europe are not reproducing themselves at a sustaining rate, it is only a matter of time before Europe as we know it ceases to exist, and British law will be replaced by sharia law. Maybe you should view this short film:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU

Here in the U.S, the southern part of the country resembles a third world dumping ground. As more refugees pour over the border, the quality of life here is diminished in ways too numerous to mention in this forum. The people pouring over the borders aren't pioneers settling a new world, they are leeches looking to suck the blood of this country as they exploit our social services.
100 years ago, the world was relatively safe. We now live in a world where total destruction is just the push of a button away. There are enough nukes to fry everything a thousand times over.
Biological weapons that can wipe out all life have proliferated. One mistake, or one rogue government could release these horrors upon us, and it would be the end of everything. Imagine that: all life could be wiped out in a moment. This is "progress"?
I think not.
Just as been demonstrated with animal populations, when a certain critical population level is reached, regardless if everyone has enough food/water, aberrant behavior of all types increase: violence, murder, cannibalism. The simple fact is, people, and animals, need their space-something we have run out of in the last 100 years. World population has more than doubled just in the last 50 years. It took hundreds of thousands of years to get to 3 billion population, but only 50 more years to get to 6 billion. You don't have to be a mathematical genius to see where this is going.
I could go on and on, but suffice it to say that all systems have and continue to break down: environmental, cultural, economic systems all disintegrating.
This is inevitable, and cannot be fixed without a diminished population. More people means more problems. And the populations that are increasing the most: third world, poor, uneducated, malnourished are the ones who endanger our "way" of life the most. The world is too crowded. It's as simple as that, and as long as our so called "leaders" continue to ignore the problem, it's going to get worse. We should not be helping third world countries to destroy us. No aid should be given to them without a stringent population control program is in place.

 

[Anti]

Stringent population control doesn't work.

Just like animals, in the face of an abundant supply of food, human populations respond by creating more humans.

Just like animals, in the face of declining supply of food, human populations respond by creating fewer humans.

The problem is that we as humans (led by our religious institutions which tell us that the planet is a gift from sky-daddy) believe we are beyond nature.

So when we see that there are more mouths to feed, we simply raze more forests, cultivate more human food to feed our increasing population.... and create more humans. It's a an example of what is called positive feedback.

You can think of it like this:

You have a thermostat that senses the temperature in the air. With the thermostat set at 70 degrees farenheight, the furnace will kick on once the ambient temp. reaches 69 degrees. That's called negative feedback.

What we're doing is something like having a thermostat set at 70 degrees, and when it reaches 70 degrees, the furnace kicks ON. And when it reaches 71 degrees, the furnace kicks ON. And when it reaches 72 degrees... etc. This is positive feedback.

As we consume ever-more resources in order to support our growing population, this in turn fuels the growth of that population, requiring ever-more resources....

(And it will be the death of us, unless we change tactics.)