Whats up with my roots?

[MacGyver420]

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[40AmpstoFreedom]

Well I am happy to report Met 52 works. If you guys want to get rid ofem for good and not deal with all sorts of chemicals that most likely won't work I suggest you get some of this stuff. 3-4 pieces in a solo cup 1/4 tsp per gallon of medium. Love it.

 

[inreplyavalon]

Well I am happy to report Met 52 works. If you guys want to get rid ofem for good and not deal with all sorts of chemicals that most likely won't work I suggest you get some of this stuff. 3-4 pieces in a solo cup 1/4 tsp per gallon of medium. Love it.

Thats good to hear bro. Glad your garden is on the up and up and these buggers are on the way out.

I have given lots of plants the met52 in the last seven days, but too soon to notice how the met52 is affecting them. Did you add it to plants that had aphids, or just use it as a preventative?

 

[40AmpstoFreedom]

Both

 

[Abja Roots]

I've been growing in coco for three years, and only started having problems recently. In the past 6 months I've torn down two crops and thrown out dozens of plants. I'm still not sure what the issue is. In the meanwhile I've switched my mother plants into an organic soil mix.

I have not seen any flying bugs in my room. I didn't see anything on the roots. Certainly not the infestation in one of the previous posts. I use Azamax regularly in veg. I used to use Spinosad, but stopped using it about a year ago. I do use gnatrol, to prevent fungus gnats. I usually add it a day before I dump my reservoir.

I wondered if it was from the summer heat, which got up into the mid 80's in parts of my room. When I flushed the plants the ppm's were quite high for me. Almost 2500. I normally feed very low.

I wondered if it was the coco. I'd used Botanicare brand coco for a run, rather than my standard coco. Which is just a generic store brand from the area. Both are loose style coco-peat.

I've got some clones in rockwool, with nice healthy roots. They'll be ready to be transplanted soon.

I'm going to transplant them into my pure coco peat, no perlite, and add my standard nutrient mix of H&G Coco A&B. I water them in at 4ml/G and ph 5.8. I'm going to go back to using Spinosad(I doubt it can hurt). I think I'm going to add drip clean, when I add the gnatrol, right before I dump the resi. I'm not sure if you're supposed to use it an a recirculating system(does anyone know)? I'm hoping that this will be enough.

I'm hesitant to add all the root additives. I have used SubCulture B & M and Roots Excel before. I've never used Sensizyme or Hygrozyme.

If anyone has any opinions please chime in. This has been a huge headache for me lately. I love my coco and swear up and down by it. I will be more conscious about watering them in. I will stop putting a layer of perlite at the bottom of my pots, which was an adaptation that I made after the initial run which had issues. I am also swapping my lights(although it's not necessary in the winter where I live), from bare bulb to air cooled. I've also considered switching to DTW from E&F which I love.

Help. I have much respect for you 40 and InReplyAvalon. At least I don't feel like as much of an idiot. I had not considered that it could be a coco epidemic. I might get some Met 52 preventatively.

 

[Green lung]

what did you use on the aphids Granger2? nematodes?

its been almost 2 weeks ive been using the roots excelurator; also using subculture b & m -- and watering only when the pots are nearing bone dry. plants are finally recovering; the ones i transplanted are finally starting to green back up and they are growing new roots;

heres just a couple pics; you can see the old dead overwatered roots and the white new fuzzy root growth - this pictures are from the plants i did not transplant;letting the ones i transplanted get few more weeks rooting.

Good deal Mac just be careful not to underwater, in those pics it looks a bit dry. if you get coco that dry in flower you see alot worse of problems compared to veg. Just keep her moist, not dry but not water logged and heavy either.



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[40AmpstoFreedom]

Definitely a CoCo epidemic and don't feel bad a tornado blowing down your grow isn't your fault either. Nature is nature. I know some cats running 30k+ who lost entire crops, got nothing to do with 'skill'...

I'll shoot you a pm GL with killingem.

 

[inreplyavalon]

ABJA so sorry to hear this problem. Parts of it are really reminiscent of what i have been going through the last 1/2 year. Its strange how problems can call into question our basic knowledge of growing. I started to question everything from my watering ability to some unknown rogue pathogen, and when it turned out to be Aphids it was a sort of duh moment. It took me a very long time to find any bugs in my coco. I had to look several times over the course of a few weeks.
What do your roots look like magnified 30x? When looking at your root ball unmagnified do you see any white looking substance that looks almost like accumulated salt? You got my attention and i hope i can help

 

[Abja Roots]

Thanks inreplyavalon and thanks 40. I've gone ahead and contacted the vendors of the Met52. I'm still using my azamax and spinosad, but I can't see how this could hurt.

It really is humbling to feel as though all your years of experience are worth nothing. Like 40 said. The end result won't even cover the electric bill.

I have scrubbed, cleaned, dumped and swapped so many things that I couldn't figure out the issue. I am hoping that with this final addition of the Met52 and a closer eye on my watering, all things will be solved.

I am making doubly sure that all my plants are extremely well rooted before transplanting. It's crazy, because they look fine while I'm vegging them in rockwool, but shortly after going into the coco, they seem to go to shit.

I have seen a buildup that looks like salt, which was why I thought maybe it was a heat issue, or that maybe I needed to switch from E&F to DTW. Possibly even add drip clean. It doesn't make any sense though, because it worked perfect for three years.

Thanks again guys. I'll keep posting and let you know how it goes.

 

[inreplyavalon]

I have seen a buildup that looks like salt, which was why I thought maybe it was a heat issue, or that maybe I needed to switch from E&F to DTW. Possibly even add drip clean. It doesn't make any sense though, because it worked perfect for three years.

Thanks again guys. I'll keep posting and let you know how it goes.

Most folks will see a white waxy, moldy substance in the coco before they actually find root aphids. Not saying you have them, but it is an indicator. I thought i had "white Root Mold" for months but it was really just the residue left behind by the aphids.

 

[Granger2]

I'm not sure I'm up for a grow journal. Too busy. Here's what I did. First, in panic mode, I watered everything with Spinosad and a half dose of Coco Wet. Then, after a couple of days, still in panic mode I immersed each root ball with pot in Safer's insecticide soap @ 5TBL/gal. This was too strong. I would use 1 or 2 TBL/gal if I were to do it again. It caused root damage that finished off some of the more damaged plants, and the rest took a long time to re-root. I flushed a few days later with water to get rid of the soap. At that time I had my next crop in std. green 6" nursery pots, and a bunch of rooted cuttings that were in 9 oz cups and needed transplanting badly. I foliar fed twice which saved several of them and sped recovery in all. The recovery was painfully slow because of the need to re-root. I used Roots Excellurator each time. The plants were taking forever to dry out.

I watered with Spinosad and 1/2 dose of Coco Wet again. Then applied beneficial Nematodes. Slowly the plants returned. I transplanted the 9 oz cups into 6" nursery pots with 20% perlite, and the 6 survivors of what was meant to be my next crop into 3 gal EJ AeroBags, 15% perlite.

Everything began to green and grow. What I had to do was to turn my mothers into the next crop, and I will take cuttings shortly for new mothers. Last Friday I transplanted the rest into 3 gal bags. I only had 20 so 9 went into 1 gal white EJ Aero bags in straight coco. It'll be good for comparison. I'm sure I'll need to water the 1 gal more often than I would like, but I'll learn from it.

No sign of Root mofo Aphids [fingers crossed tightly].

I have an old hand-me-down dig cam and will try to post some pics occasionally. The 6 plants that were first to go into 3 gal are close to 4 feet tall w/pot with no leaf on the bottom 18-24 inches. Virtually all the damaged foliage has been sloughed and replaced. I've been pruning for height and will probably be forced to do so again after the stretch. This will I'm sure affect production, but will be unavoidable.

Ahmo have to get me some of that there Met 52. My guess is that I can prevent future problems with RA's [rat's asses] by using Met 52 and nematodes. The todes persist in the soil, controlling any soil insects unless they starve to death, which would be a good thing. The cost of control using todes and Met would be nominal, seriously labor saving, and non toxic.

Here's what I've got.
Strain Inventory-
Sensi Star male
Bubblicious - Nirvana
Jack Herer - Nirvana
C-4 - Chimera
Fruity Chronic Juice - Delicious
Acapulco Gold - Barney's
Cheese - Big Buddha
Flo - Dutch Passion
Hash Plant – Sensi
[2 phenos? bought 2 seed, luckily both females]
Vanilla Kush - Barney's
Blueberry - Dutch Passion
Red Diesel - Barney's
Northern Lights #5 x Haze - Sensi

Sealed room 11'4"x 7'4", CO2, A/C, Dehumidifier
3 stalls 3x3x6.5, 600w HPS each, air cooled
1 stall 2x4x6.5, 360 watts of fluorescents for mothers,
veg, etc.
1 stall 2x2x3 nursery for rooting, germination, etc.

I'll report as time allows, and hopefully it'll be mostly good news. -granger

 

[Abja Roots]

I've ordered my Met52 and will be waiting for it. In the meanwhile I'm hesitant to put my next batch of clones into my standard coco mix. I will continue to treat everything with spinosad and azamax. I more than likely am going to mix up my pre-amended soil mix and transplant the clones into that. The mothers I put into my soil mix look great so far.

I did notice though, that my coco in the flower room had been getting way too dry. For some reason the timers were three hours off. So the plants were getting way too dry under the lights, before the pumps turned on. I've been sick the past ten days and was out of town for a week before that, so I'm not sure how long it had been going on for. I'll salvage what I can from this crop, but am looking forward to making a fresh run on the next one. Some of the plants look good, but most look kind of haggard. None look as good as they possibly could. This is a whole new batch of untested clones though. Not nearly as good as the last cut of Sour I was running.

Live and learn my friends. Like I said before. I have massive respect for those who can pull down huge crops consistently year after year. The most I've ever managed to go without any hiccups is maybe 3 or 4 crops. Something always comes up.

I'm sure that a large part of the issue, is allowing the coco to dry out too much. Especially in mid-flower. Not good at all.

 

[Abja Roots]

So today I was checking on my clones. I veg my clones on an e&f table, on top of a black plastic tray so that the roots get air pruned. While looking at one table, which looked great, I saw nothing. The other tray, which had been starting to show some issues with a few plants, showed some small white insect like things crawling around. Very small. Like a grain of rice or a bit smaller. So I dunked them all in a spinosad mix. I also added some spinosad to the resis. I'm now just waiting for my met52 to arrive. Should be here in a few days. Does anyone know if I can grind it up and apply it with a watering, if it's too late to mix into the soil?

I realize I need to remember to be more proactive with any possible infestations that may be occurring. It's mono-culture and this is where a tiny problem can become huge. Thanks so much guys. It helps knowing that there are others out there going through similar issues, even if they might have different causes.

Still I'm excited to be back at it, and taking it on the offensive. I love this and even though it frustrates me sometimes, I never want to stop loving it.

 

[40AmpstoFreedom]

So today I was checking on my clones. I veg my clones on an e&f table, on top of a black plastic tray so that the roots get air pruned. While looking at one table, which looked great, I saw nothing. The other tray, which had been starting to show some issues with a few plants, showed some small white insect like things crawling around. Very small. Like a grain of rice or a bit smaller. So I dunked them all in a spinosad mix. I also added some spinosad to the resis. I'm now just waiting for my met52 to arrive. Should be here in a few days. Does anyone know if I can grind it up and apply it with a watering, if it's too late to mix into the soil?

I realize I need to remember to be more proactive with any possible infestations that may be occurring. It's mono-culture and this is where a tiny problem can become huge. Thanks so much guys. It helps knowing that there are others out there going through similar issues, even if they might have different causes.

Still I'm excited to be back at it, and taking it on the offensive. I love this and even though it frustrates me sometimes, I never want to stop loving it.

Curious were they like maggots? Cuz I never saw aphids like the ones shown on roots here, I had tons of the things in the bottom of my flood and drain tables like you describe tiniest pieces of rice you can imagine like maggots. This was the only thing different from your typical aphid description the adults looked exactly like adult aphids in the pictures with hard shiny black bodies and wings. This is why I described them as maggots in the earlier stages in this thread and had to correct what I said because I just figured that there were aphids that had maggots and aphids that had those little insect crab looking things for 'children'. Wondering now if there are actually different kinds with different growth stages with you describing same thing.

The met 52 has completely driven them off now my new run is looking great and the last one finished only 4 out 45+ plants were affected by the aphids but they were affected severely.

 

[MacGyver420]

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[Ottoman]

if those little white maggot things looked like this than they're were only fungus gnat larvae obviously not as big an issue as aphids.

Aphids will look like this covered all over roots

Now knock on wood I have never had to battle root aphids but have been reading how many folks are having issues with them so I am been reading up to become more educated, I hope I never have to battle those things, best of luck to everyone....

 

[MacGyver420]

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[MacGyver420]

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[Granger2]

Mac,

That's what mine look[ed] like. Same color. Good luck, amigo. -granger

 

[Abja Roots]

Got my Met 52 today. Going to be adding it from now on to all my new transplants into coco. I'll have to mix it into the top layer of my plants that are already potted.

It says to use 1/2 grain per rockwool cube. So I'll be doing that as well.