What strains for breeding a german genetic?

[endgegner]

Sorry I don't understand the question. F3 generation depends on the selections you make in the F2 generation... You mean an open pollination of the F2?

I have used the term F3 wrong. I actually meant when you back cross the autoflower F2 with the autoflower P.

 

[ResinReef]

At f2 the autotraits going to show up.
from that point u go crossing auto with auto , to reach 100% auto after generation F4/F5
if you continue to cross F2 auto with non auto. u will have a line ongoing with few auto phänotypes but mostly non autos.
Autoflower phänoF2 with autoflower(P)will be 100% autoflower.
But you have to remember , in reality your not going to bx because autoflowers are gone after one generation.

 

[endgegner]

shantibaba was talking about autos? can you link me to this podcast please?

Yes, the podcast is correct, it starts at about 1:33:00.

Here is the video again, but with the timestamp:

Shanti also said "several generation" and later on "probably 3". And he calls it "field breeding". And after 10 generations you get about a 70% match of the parent plant trait in your bred autos.

Shame on my for falsely repeating his part about the split, but his main point came correctly. You gotta do field breeding and cross a shit ton of generations

 

[goingrey]

I have used the term F3 wrong. I actually meant when you back cross the autoflower F2 with the autoflower P.

Well the generation doesn't really matter. Depends on the genotype only.

If you cross an autoflower (gg) to autoflower (gg) all children will be autoflower: gg x gg = gg, gg, gg, gg.

If you cross "carrier" plant (Gg) to an autoflower P (gg) you get 50% auto, 50% carrier: Gg x gg = Gg, Gg, gg, gg.

F1 generation has the carrier genotype only . The F2 generation has all genotypes (25% photo, 50% carrier, 25% auto).

 

[endgegner]

Well the generation doesn't really matter. Depends on the genotype only.

If you cross an autoflower (gg) to autoflower (gg) all children will be autoflower: gg x gg = gg, gg, gg, gg.

If you cross "carrier" plant (Gg) to an autoflower P (gg) you get 50% auto, 50% carrier: Gg x gg = Gg, Gg, gg, gg.

F1 generation has the carrier genotype only . The F2 generation has all genotypes (25% photo, 50% carrier, 25% auto).

Thank you for the explanation. Now I have got it. But is it really 100% or a slim chance of a photo period strain showing up?
But this way you only have to go for an F3 (auto F2 x auto F2) or an (auto F2 x auto P) to get get regular autoflower seeds.

 

[goingrey]

Thank you for the explanation. Now I have got it. But is it really 100% or a slim chance of a photo period strain showing up?
But this way you only have to go for an F3 (auto F2 x auto F2) or an (auto F2 x auto P) to get get regular autoflower seeds.

Correct.

 

[endgegner]

Correct.

Perfect, you helped me refreshing some deep buried biology knowledge.
But is it really a 100% chance to get autoflowers or is there an odd 0.1% - 1% (or whatever) chance to get some photo period offspring?

 

[goingrey]

Perfect, you helped me refreshing some deep buried biology knowledge.
But is it really a 100% chance to get autoflowers or is there an odd 0.1% - 1% (or whatever) chance to get some photo period offspring?

Well mutations happen and could result in a photo plant I suppose. I don't know about the likelihood but would guess well below 1%.

 

[ResinReef]

what shanti does is the difference of "breeding" and the lottery of pollenchucking ( f.e i am doing)
if you have a picture in mind where you want to go to, or if you want to resemble a strain with automatic
traits and not losing the traits you are looking for, just to make something 100% automatic

 

[revegeta666]

I think it was this one:


He only has two or three, so it won't be hard to find it, if you look for it.

Thank you very much!

some Leb 27 V2 from a HFH batch from 2012

That looks mouthwatering! Do you make any hash with your lebbies?

 

[Schande des Waldes]

Hi folks,

Ive got a plan for breeding a plant that suits german weather conditions. But breeding isnt any of my strengths.
But im motivated as hell.
The plan in detail is. creating a future german landrace. or wild cannabis.
since eu and germany have strong laws for endangered species. so lets craft 1 of those.

this is like a backup plan if they revoke the legalization or anything like that.
i hope its not to hard to follow me.

Ultra Early Love (photosensitive)
Sudden Flower (automatic)
This are good strains you can use for your project. Both are for outdoor only. Crosses with UEL flowers fast. I am on 49°N. Where are you?

 

[Grow44DE]

49°4'N reeferman seeds?

 

[ResinReef]

Thank you very much!


That looks mouthwatering! Do you make any hash with your lebbies?

Hi,
yes i made a lot of dry sift during that time with the outdoor material.
Mostly with a 150 micron pollinator . most leb27 stuff i got was more on the blonde side.
this year i got myself a graveda rosin press and will be going to look out , what i get returned from the skuff

 

[Schande des Waldes]

49°4'N reeferman seeds?

Repro from http://proseeds.co.uk/

 

[Synthracer]

Ultra Early Love (photosensitive)
Sudden Flower (automatic)
This are good strains you can use for your project. Both are for outdoor only. Crosses with UEL flowers fast. I am on 49°N. Where are you?

+1
perfect for outdoor breeding projects in germany. Also the Baglung Nepali, it's a great tool for earlier flowering, robustness/resistance and brings in some colours. The Purple Satellite was also made with Baglung Nepali and performs great here in germany.

 

[Schande des Waldes]

+1
perfect for outdoor breeding projects in germany. Also the Baglung Nepali, it's a great tool for earlier flowering, robustness/resistance and brings in some colours. The Purple Satellite was also made with Baglung Nepali and performs great here in germany.

This is right. I had both 2023. Early genetics.

 

[Lebanizer]

You wrote "a semi-auto is a confusing misnomer as it's really just a regular photoperiodic strain just like any other but with a little (useless) twist: under stressful conditions, it flowers undependently of day length. What stressful conditions ? Usually stuff like being root bound."

I don't agree with that, because its not the stressfull condition that triggers flowering.

It's still the day length that triggers flowering, only sooner then most other photoperiod strains.

So the only thing what differentiates them, is that they start flowering earlier in the season. Which seems very usefull to me. In fact it's exactly what you need as a northern grower.

No insult intended.


The part I agree with is that stressing it, can cause certain problems (like with any other plant). But it's not needed to trigger the flowering.

I'm growing in the north and overall semi-auto's work better for me then ruderalis auto's. Overall the semi-auto's get bigger and are much better suited for the climate here at lat 53. So personally I wouldn't write them off for German growers yet.

I've never written anywhere that root restriction is needed for flowering. That's a misunderstanding and misreading of your own. I did say that semiautos are standard photoperiod strains and I did say that whenever and if ever, certain stressfull conditions happen -root restriction is one example- this can trigger flowering eventhough the plant hasn't switched to a short daylight regimen (indoor ou outdoor if you grow in pots) which is a feature that doesn't happen with non semiauto photoperiodic strain under the same conditions. If I'm still not being clear enough : it's possible to create an NL bonsai mum in 16/8. Don't even think about it with a Lebanese landrace (the one from TRSC in my case) !

 

[Lebanizer]

Well but how does it work? i dont even have a clue how they do autos.
are there male autos? where can i get those?

Well the autoflowering feature is imparted by ruderalis genetics. So you'll have to include that in your breeding project at some point. You don't have to start with a pure ruderalis, you can start with an auto hybrid but 90% of what is on the market are fem seeds in the case of autos. So if you taje that route, you'll have to mix your favourite fem auto with a photoperiodic strain and then through Mendelian selection (the auto gene is recessive) breed your way out of the fem lock in order to get reg auto seeds that you can then reproduce forever.

Also, although they are rarer, some breeders offer regular autos as well.

However I think it totally makes sense to start from pure ruderalis if you're serious and dedicated about your project in order to breed the strain that is tailor made for you from your prefered landraces.

Autos used to suck in the 90s but a lot of tremendous improvements have been made since then and it's now totally possible to have first class grade A cannabis from autos. Don't forget autos will allow you to have buds that ripen when conditions are at their best (most intense sun, better temperature) in your climate.

Last but not least, I'd like to remind you that there's an entire subforum dedicated to that very topic there. I suggest you give it a look. Tons of info.

 

[ahortator]

I agree with Roms says in the 2nd page. Just take a nice strain you like, sprout many seeds and choose those who can finish earlier or in proper time. After a few generations you will get something adapted to your climate.

 

[bouc]

Hi folks,

Ive got a plan for breeding a plant that suits german weather conditions. But breeding isnt any of my strengths.
But im motivated as hell.
The plan in detail is. creating a future german landrace. or wild cannabis.
since eu and germany have strong laws for endangered species. so lets craft 1 of those.

this is like a backup plan if they revoke the legalization or anything like that.
i hope its not to hard to follow me.

Hi, cool project, i have something similar cooking for a neighboring country.
But where in Germany ? You need to take your local climate into account.
I'd say that autoflowering (so you can ripen with big dli even with low sun intensity, during the summer solstice) and a leaf mutation such as abc ( or any you see different enough from the classic shape, to avoid thiefs and noisy peoples who don't like this crop) are a must.
I would start looking into landraces from similar weather regions.
Khalifa have a siberian ruderalis, i assume it is quite adapted to continental Europe in general but i have never grown it.
Maybe make a thread on your project? Would be super cool to watch it unfold
Best of luck friend!