The gauges are very accurate.
I pulling to -10/-15.
I am not using after chillers.
This thing is FAST!!!
14 pounds of butane in about 1.5 hours!!
That doesn't seems very fast, what are you comparing it too?
The search for a proper recovery pump..
- Thread starter HighStateToke
- Start date
That doesn't seems very fast, what are you comparing it too?
P
popcornhemeroid
GW you got one of these?
[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=52217&pictureid=1410263&]View Image[/url]
I broke mine in yesterday!
Not sure if its the holy grail of recovery pumps BUT.....
Here is what I think of it........
Its sexy!
It works great!
Its fast!
Its quiet-ish.
Fast compared to what? I did not time the thing... Next time I will.
BUT Ive run my system with 2 appion's, then I switched to 2 diablos. Its faster than 2 appions or 2 diablos.
noise, It is more quiet than the diablos!!!! which are quieter than the appions.
now price, Its expensive. For the performance per dollar I could have bought 4 diablos for the price which I think would be faster.
BUT......
I want a second one to run TWO!
forgive me if it's not ok to ask but with a pump like that (which ill probably never find in Canada anyways), what size extractor are you running, atm I am running a 5lb BHOgart slowly doing upgrades to it, having a lot of difficulty sourcing the parts I need. and what's wrong with te CPS TR21? currently running an appion g5 like most others but also would like to upgrade that if it's even an upgrade.
15# recovered in about 30 minutes with a Haskel and 25' x 3/8" heat exchanger. I can't recommend enough that anyone serious about extracting start begining the upgrade process.
Instead of chasing the latest pump from china get your recovery system pneumatic. It will last longer and you can actually talk with professionals. Not to mention Haskel has answered every request to date from our industry.
3 phase is not required. Thcland is running his Haskel off 60 amps single phase. He said it was under 8k, Haskel included.
Instead of chasing the latest pump from china get your recovery system pneumatic. It will last longer and you can actually talk with professionals. Not to mention Haskel has answered every request to date from our industry.
3 phase is not required. Thcland is running his Haskel off 60 amps single phase. He said it was under 8k, Haskel included.
Im already saving and deciding what compressor to run, save a few G's and get the cheaper or go big and get the screw compressor that will defiantly last longer..... Decisions decisions..... 15# in 30 min is freaking awesome! That would speed up my day so much. I wonder how the haskel would do on the MKIII? I still use that for under 300g runs. Only 25' of after coolers huh? Do you still just keep you tank at room temp? I've switched to a setup similar to yours and am LOVING it. Keeping a full 100# tank at room temp and feeding through 50' of -10F glycol chilled coil is getting awesome yields and potency results. Along with great looking stuff, right now i have 2 g5's feeding through 50' of 3/8 sitting in a -10F freezer surrounded by glycol, then the 100# tank just sitting next to the freezer.
What a relief, thanks for posting up Mendo420!
Speed seems to high on you guys' list of priorities, so I'm going to repeat my previous suggestion you look into using a residential AC condenser to initially drop your temps off the pump. Energy input is energy input, whether it be from the pump or just using ambient air to suck off the heat. You're paying 100% for the energy input from the pump via the wall socket, but with an AC condenser your just paying to run the fan, the actual heat loss to the ambient air is FREE!!! Why not use the free stuff before paying up the ying yang for a higher capacity pump or chilled condensers?
"Air conditioner condensing units work by turning vapor refrigerant to liquid refrigerant. There are three important steps that will happen to the refrigerant as it passes through the condensing unit.
First Step: The hot vapor coming from the compressor must be de-superheated to the vapor saturation point. De-superheated? De-superheated is removing a sensible heat from the refrigerant, lower the refrigerant temperature.
Second Step: In the middle of the condenser, there should is mixture of gas/liquid refrigerant. This is where the refrigerant vapor should change to 100 percent liquid refrigerant.
Third Step: The refrigerant temperature should be below the liquid saturation point, sub cooled."
http://www.central-air-conditioner-and-refrigeration.com/air_conditioner_condenser.html
Seems simple, you'd just bypass the internal pump and any flow restrictors.
Speed seems to high on you guys' list of priorities, so I'm going to repeat my previous suggestion you look into using a residential AC condenser to initially drop your temps off the pump. Energy input is energy input, whether it be from the pump or just using ambient air to suck off the heat. You're paying 100% for the energy input from the pump via the wall socket, but with an AC condenser your just paying to run the fan, the actual heat loss to the ambient air is FREE!!! Why not use the free stuff before paying up the ying yang for a higher capacity pump or chilled condensers?
"Air conditioner condensing units work by turning vapor refrigerant to liquid refrigerant. There are three important steps that will happen to the refrigerant as it passes through the condensing unit.
First Step: The hot vapor coming from the compressor must be de-superheated to the vapor saturation point. De-superheated? De-superheated is removing a sensible heat from the refrigerant, lower the refrigerant temperature.
Second Step: In the middle of the condenser, there should is mixture of gas/liquid refrigerant. This is where the refrigerant vapor should change to 100 percent liquid refrigerant.
Third Step: The refrigerant temperature should be below the liquid saturation point, sub cooled."
http://www.central-air-conditioner-and-refrigeration.com/air_conditioner_condenser.html
Seems simple, you'd just bypass the internal pump and any flow restrictors.
Attachments
lol start calling up AC manufactures and see how much for an all stainless ac condensor. Making one out of SS might be viable but would require knowledge of a lot of things i don't have. I would love to have an all SS radiator and coils all cooled by ambiant air but i think theres more to it then that. I dont know about residential units but the mini slplit in the warehouse used quite a bit of power only being a 28k btu. A LOT more then my glycol filled freezer that cools my coils.
A6 is right. Wtf are you talking skyhighler? Free? You said it yourself your paying for electricity and in an ultimate equation of energy, the compressor takes a shit load of electricity.
28k btu? That's huge dude. Did you typo that number? I had a 18k btu and it was 240v, 8 amps on each leg, sucked up mad power using it for heat exchange in a glycol bath.
Yes. Get a second after chiller. The chillers reduce tamp and pressure, it's best to T your lines into the tank after the chillers reduce you temp and pressure.
I just have the tank and coils on ice, with two tr21s. I never weighed anything to be precise but I brim my 12x12 collection pot. I know what 24#s looks like in it from distilling and on a run I use more. Gw told me once I'm over washing and I bet he's right. I need to do experiments and dial in at what point in the color change to stop. Anyways... I'll say I'm moving atleast 25#s in an hour and 15 minutes.
I think those numbers for the cmepol are good for not having any liquid cooled coils and only the stock air cooled ones. Lets get some ice bath coils on that beast mendo420? !?! I'm dieing to know these things!
28k btu? That's huge dude. Did you typo that number? I had a 18k btu and it was 240v, 8 amps on each leg, sucked up mad power using it for heat exchange in a glycol bath.
Yes. Get a second after chiller. The chillers reduce tamp and pressure, it's best to T your lines into the tank after the chillers reduce you temp and pressure.
I just have the tank and coils on ice, with two tr21s. I never weighed anything to be precise but I brim my 12x12 collection pot. I know what 24#s looks like in it from distilling and on a run I use more. Gw told me once I'm over washing and I bet he's right. I need to do experiments and dial in at what point in the color change to stop. Anyways... I'll say I'm moving atleast 25#s in an hour and 15 minutes.
I think those numbers for the cmepol are good for not having any liquid cooled coils and only the stock air cooled ones. Lets get some ice bath coils on that beast mendo420? !?! I'm dieing to know these things!
The main power draw on AC units is the compressor(which would not be used). Most outdoor units(not mini splits but standard residential ducted systems) pull anywhere from 3-8 amps(just the fan, no compressor)depending on the fan motor and size.
The 28k BTU is a beast of a mini split lol. we went over board but can cool the entire warehouse and grow room with some energy to spare lol. I dont use it to cool my coils lol, its to cool the warehouse. My chest freezer filled with glycol keeps the coil cold. start the day at aroud -10F and end the day at around 10F. Not to bad, im lazy and have been avoiding buying dry ice. Even at 10F im still getting a great looking product
ya im making another cooling coil thats smaller then my other one so i can fit in the middle of the other coil as my freezer can only fit 4 8" coils in it once they are in thier 10" containers. Then each pump will have its own chiller.
How would the butane be cooled without the use of the compressor? Fans, radiators and coils with ambient air wouldn't cool it much i would think, Specially in the heat of summer. Like i said im not an AC tech and dont really know how they work other then the basics. Isnt a residential AC just like a mini split but uses the houses air system instead of a stand alone?? Also 8 amps on what 120v or 240v, huge difference in power consumption. Watts would be a better thing to measure power by since thats how your charged not how efficiently your running it...
EDIT: The ac is only 24k btu, my bad lol
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Ductless...ft-Complete-Kit-DA24-H/205881737?N=5yc1vZc4m1
ya im making another cooling coil thats smaller then my other one so i can fit in the middle of the other coil as my freezer can only fit 4 8" coils in it once they are in thier 10" containers. Then each pump will have its own chiller.
How would the butane be cooled without the use of the compressor? Fans, radiators and coils with ambient air wouldn't cool it much i would think, Specially in the heat of summer. Like i said im not an AC tech and dont really know how they work other then the basics. Isnt a residential AC just like a mini split but uses the houses air system instead of a stand alone?? Also 8 amps on what 120v or 240v, huge difference in power consumption. Watts would be a better thing to measure power by since thats how your charged not how efficiently your running it...
EDIT: The ac is only 24k btu, my bad lol
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Ductless...ft-Complete-Kit-DA24-H/205881737?N=5yc1vZc4m1
I have never ran across residential AC unit that were 120v. Amp draw is a good indicator of motor life and you can match it to the nomenclature. Also have never ran into folks using watts for their measurements in the professional world. Amps are always used. Our recovery pumps would be doing the compressors job if someone tried to make a coil. The compressor is not cooling at all, just compressing. The compressor actually generates a lot of heat in AC. All of the heat dispersion is coming from the coil and the fan. Mini splits are not ducted and use an inverter to power everything with dc keeping the power down. Mini splits are more efficient then standard central air AC.
Ahhh, as i said im not an ac tech so i wouldn't know they all come in 240v lol. In power consumption watts is what ive always seen but yes in the professional world when installing stuff, watts dont really matter, amps do, which i get and understand. Obviously if you know you know the other.... if you know the volts lol, which is where i was lost.
Very sorry but Im still not seeing how res a/c thing would work. After the hot butane comes out of the recovery pump it would go where to be cooled? The ambient cooled radiator/coil setup? Then back to the tank? I understand how an A/c works but im not getting how a residential ac unit would work as a cooler in the compressor was replaced by the recovery pump. Sorry if im just having a dumb moment but i dont think this would work at all.
Are you just suggesting using and air cooled "radiator" type thing to initially take away some temp from the pumps, then a cooling coil and then the tank? My pumps already have those in them lol(g5's). A bigger one would work better i guess? Im just gonna assume im lost.
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No worries. I wasn't the one suggesting this tech just clarifying how AC units work. Basically it is a giant coil with a fan blowing across it. Just like the appion setup but larger and more efficient. Due to the large amount of surface area and the fins put on the coil it scrubs heat remarkably well. I think a residential AC unit deals with more heat then our process and can keep up even in the summer. It would be interesting to see a stainless one with a bottom drain and an explosion proof fan for cooling. Wouldn't be cheap though!!
Snake11, bless your heart!
"Are you just suggesting using and air cooled "radiator" type thing to initially take away some temp from the pumps, then a cooling coil and then the tank? My pumps already have those in them lol(g5's). A bigger one would work better i guess?
Yes, you may not even need a cooling coil anymore, or at least one that actually uses up much dry ice or whatever.
I could go and examine the label on the fan on my 3 ton unit outside, it's just a few screws, but why would it draw anymore current than any other fan with similar blades at the same rpm?
Those condensers are optimized for bringing the vapor back to liquid using just ambient air in a huge range of climates, you're getting a heap of coils and fins with a beefy ducted fan for cheap.
With summer rolling in, keep an eye out for discarded condensers, most people just replace the whole thing when the compressor goes rather than rebuild just the compressor, and it's the one component you don't need. You also need to nix the relay/contactor, bad sparky, and should no longer be necessary, just plug in the fan direct with your own switch. I'm just saying I think it really is this easy to give it a try, and see how effective it is... thanks for giving it a hash out.
"Are you just suggesting using and air cooled "radiator" type thing to initially take away some temp from the pumps, then a cooling coil and then the tank? My pumps already have those in them lol(g5's). A bigger one would work better i guess?
Yes, you may not even need a cooling coil anymore, or at least one that actually uses up much dry ice or whatever.
I could go and examine the label on the fan on my 3 ton unit outside, it's just a few screws, but why would it draw anymore current than any other fan with similar blades at the same rpm?
Those condensers are optimized for bringing the vapor back to liquid using just ambient air in a huge range of climates, you're getting a heap of coils and fins with a beefy ducted fan for cheap.
With summer rolling in, keep an eye out for discarded condensers, most people just replace the whole thing when the compressor goes rather than rebuild just the compressor, and it's the one component you don't need. You also need to nix the relay/contactor, bad sparky, and should no longer be necessary, just plug in the fan direct with your own switch. I'm just saying I think it really is this easy to give it a try, and see how effective it is... thanks for giving it a hash out.
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I wouldn't use a used one as there are a lot of chemicals that could possibly be in there. Depending on what refrigerant was used previously the unit could have hydrochloric acid leftover from compressor burnout.
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With a column smaller than the 4x36 I can see this pump exceeding expectations. The last 3# were slower than the first 15#, and you could watch the first melting off the column. A heated jacket or a alley diameter would greatly increase speed.
We are running 125# at room temp through a 50' x 3/8" coil on di acetone. The 25' x 3/8" after chiller is on di Alky.
Stoked to hear your loving your setup! I am equally pleased, I just love being able to weight and document exact amounts of solvent bring used.
Il post pics later tonight in the Haskel thread, I'm in love with this pump! It was moving do much solvent through the after chiller my 5' tall tank was frosted up halfway down. Never saw anything like that with dual tr21's
build our own....
If I read Sky correctly we are to get the inbound solvent cold. I love dry ice and IC69's. Spreadsheets will tell us how long in what length tube for what temp and such. So what is the down side of having commercial AC cooling the antifreeze?
My solvent is in great stainless steel IC69's, The IC69's dipping in eco friendly antifreeze chilled by I don't give a....
What is bad about that?
I really need a chiller.
The pump would work way faster.
After running the extractor a few times now with the new pump.
My tank pressures are WAY to high.
The ice just cant cool the tank fast enough.
I'm going to get one ASAP!
A6 Grower where did you get yours?
Thanks!
The pump would work way faster.
After running the extractor a few times now with the new pump.
My tank pressures are WAY to high.
The ice just cant cool the tank fast enough.
I'm going to get one ASAP!
A6 Grower where did you get yours?
Thanks!
Everything you need to know about coils is right here...
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=291618&page=12
so mendo420...did you or did you not break the cmepol? I'm confused?
Watts = volts x amps. You can measure either way you want. I said it was 8 amps on EACH leg. 2 hot legs is 240V. So 8 x 240 = 1920 watts.
You can have all the coils and fans you want, your not getting much colder than the ambient air temp you can throw some mister lines in there and that will get anywhere from 20 to 30 degrees below ambient.
Get a bad ass kenmore freezer with the express chill option. They do -20F all day and with the express chill on it will bust -30F for 72 hours. With the 5 year master warranty I got a 22 cubic foot one for less than a grand. I can make about 25 gallons of ice in 2 days. I have 11 5 gallon square containers in it and I cycle them to keep my constantly on ice. I originally got it to do subzero but I'll do that upgrade next year, as well as a bunch of others.
For the size that freezer is gold when you look at the price tag. I've looked at two stage and three stage cascade freezers and they are mad money. So - low sells some. For that size the one that does -40F is like 8 grand. The one that goes to -85F is half the size and is like 14 grand.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=291618&page=12
so mendo420...did you or did you not break the cmepol? I'm confused?
Watts = volts x amps. You can measure either way you want. I said it was 8 amps on EACH leg. 2 hot legs is 240V. So 8 x 240 = 1920 watts.
You can have all the coils and fans you want, your not getting much colder than the ambient air temp you can throw some mister lines in there and that will get anywhere from 20 to 30 degrees below ambient.
Get a bad ass kenmore freezer with the express chill option. They do -20F all day and with the express chill on it will bust -30F for 72 hours. With the 5 year master warranty I got a 22 cubic foot one for less than a grand. I can make about 25 gallons of ice in 2 days. I have 11 5 gallon square containers in it and I cycle them to keep my constantly on ice. I originally got it to do subzero but I'll do that upgrade next year, as well as a bunch of others.
For the size that freezer is gold when you look at the price tag. I've looked at two stage and three stage cascade freezers and they are mad money. So - low sells some. For that size the one that does -40F is like 8 grand. The one that goes to -85F is half the size and is like 14 grand.
