The New & Improved [ROLS MEGATHREAD].

[VerdantGreen]

....
i always wonder what's the explanation for the critical mass of living soil, quess it's has to do something with proper ecosystem but details of it. and yeah bigger is better until it gets too deep and no oxygen is available?

others may have different takes on this. Microbeman is the guy to ask really -
but ive always thought of it as an equilibrium thing. the larger the size of an ecosystem - the more stable it tends to be.
i doubt there is any hard and fast 'cutoff point' - just that as your pot size gets smaller the harder it will be to keep a balanced soil that is going to keep your plant happy up until harvest.

with indoor gardening there are many limiting factors, amount of light, space, ventilation etc etc.
it seems pointless to allow soil volume to be your limiting factor when its very cheep and easy to provide your plant with a decent sized pot to grow in.

VG

 

[soursmoker]

yup

 

[W89]

Von what strains you now growing?

 

[BlueJayWay]

i doubt there is any hard and fast 'cutoff point' - just that as your pot size gets smaller the harder it will be to keep a balanced soil that is going to keep your plant happy up until harvest

Small pots fill up fast with thick white roots in a healthy living soil!

no-till containers I've flowered in 2gal to 45gal and everywhere in between - the larger the container the longer use you will get out of it. The larger the container the more you can get into a 'plug n play' type setup.

I get the best results in my 45gal no-tills. Waterings are infrequent and gives me more leeway with over or under watering, often just using the sprayer to remoisten the topsoil.

With that said, most of the garden is in 2nd and 3rd cycle 5gal buckets and 3rd through 5th cycle 18gal totes - excellent results with both but the no fuss aspect of the larger 45gal smartie is invaluable, to me, and that's the direction my garden is heading.

 

[DARC MIND]

45gal smarties
check

 

[Coba]

sourcing locally for me, is a necessity for a lot of stuff... the retail nurseries, wholesale nurseries, farm and feed supply stores around here all call bone meal, blood meal, and seaweed extract water... organics. You should see the look on some faces when I ask about crab shell or fish bone meal.

being resourceful is key, and most of the time I can find stuff for cheap if not totally free... it's not that I'm cheap either. I'd still do it this way even if I could afford to have pallets of the best of the best hand delivered to my front door... I still get a satisfaction out of using my back and hands, that I just don't get any other way.

I still buy stuff though, just not the over-priced, watered-down, pretty pictured, game-changers that cater exclusively to the naive. howsoever naive I still may be...

and now, some dirt porn...

 

[MrSterling]

So glad to see the thread rolling along! Also good to see new faces. Hoping to see some more old ones too.

 

[Gascanastan]

Let us not forget that this is a ROLS/No-till thread,there should be no highjacking from gardeners NOT incorporating a real living soil...chemi,hydro,or otherwise who post big fabulous shots of gardens that DO NOT utilize these naturally based horticultural/agricultural 'organic' methods specifically for growing cannabis we've collectively hammered out here and behind the scenes for a few years now.

This is real gardening,photosynthesis,soil,plant,this is not 'veganics' or any other 'learning to grow in the Space Shuttle' type method..that's BS to those of us who know better.

I'm not saying that science is useless here at all,only that THIS particular collective way of cannabis gardening has a boundaries as to what is acceptable within the realm of a natural system we can actually incorporate into the indoor cannabis gardening environment. From that natural/organic perspective it also has ties in the overall conscience awakening of our degrading global environment and how marketing/consumerism is propelling that.

This is also medicine,and that's a whole different ball of wax outside the soil. Let us not mention the health impacts of the un-natural based ways of existence the human species has suffered from in the last 100 years....and why choosing to take an organic/natural approach to a material that we consume on a high level makes sense.

This is growing cannabis indoors in soil that is alive and needs to be treated in much the same manner as if you've taken on a household pet that eats and drinks.

The collective mentality here in this thread is still on earth with dirty hands and feet in the soil no matter how 'stoned/high' we get in the process as to best listen to the cues that were here millions of years that we evolved right along with.

If anyone of you ROLS guys has the time,maybe explain the differences in the way we source materials to use compared to the cannabis gardener of yesteryear.


For me and many others this was a personal evolution beyond currently accepted cannabis gardening belief,which has fallen into the realm of fantasy and myth based old wives tale assumptions that were passed on from our predecessors in the cannabis cultivation movement.

Welcome to 2013...it's not 1975 and we don't hang our plants upside down with hot rags wrapped around the roots to 'get the THC into the flowers' anymore......the same can be said about depending on bottled fertilizers and additives,ph meters,cal/mag,defoliation,etc,etc,etc,etc. All the gimmicks and just plain bad advise from folks with no background based in horticulture.

Years and years of products and BS marketed for cannabis gardeners who were born into this world with inherent roots in agriculture and presented with a mind boggling set of troubles (that don't really exist unless you let it exist) before getting the chance to simply plant a seed and allow natural processes to take care of it....along with that inherent human ability to care for living plants and soil on that inherent agricultural level.

In a properly assembled ROLS/No-till garden the quality of materials and amendments used by these 'ROLS/No-till' gardeners is often of the highest quality available anywhere on earth.

Assemble the components correctly and hand it back to her~


Written under guidance from Blue Orca x NL#5/Haze

Gas

 

[RanchoDeluxe]

Damn....way back here on page four! Back of the class for me.

BJW or anyone rocking no-tills, do you guys have seperate veg rooms?

I'm running two 1800w flower rooms and a 1200w veg room. I'm thinking of turning the veg room into another flower room. I think I would just veg under a 6 bulb T-5 for the two weeks of waiting for cuts to root and another two weeks of actual veg...then straight into the no-tills. I have alot of 30gal smartpots I acquired for free. This system seem like it would be much easier to employ. Concerned about losing any weight in the long haul w/out having an 8 week veg room.
RD

 

[Neo 420]

others may have different takes on this. Microbeman is the guy to ask really -
but ive always thought of it as an equilibrium thing. the larger the size of an ecosystem - the more stable it tends to be.
i doubt there is any hard and fast 'cutoff point' - just that as your pot size gets smaller the harder it will be to keep a balanced soil that is going to keep your plant happy up until harvest.

The volume and the height of the containers matters. If memories serve me correct MM stated 5 gallons (volume) and 14 inches (depth) as good start points.

 

[FunTimesIndeed]

I do tiny little 3 gallon no-tills by starting grasses, peppers, whathaveyou a couple of weeks before the chop. After the chop I let the weeds grow for a couple of weeks until the stump slides out and new clones are ready. The containers are periodically top dressed with compost, harvest waste, yarrow leaves and EWC slurries.

Running in sub irrigated planters, I water with protekt from below and with a few botanical concoctions from above (kudzu FPE, dandelion FPE, fresh aloe, kelp tea, alfalfa tea).

For soil I run peat, locally made Demeter certified compost and lava rock amended with crab meal, garden-tone, kelp, rock dusts, neem, and alfalfa.

That's the whole damn plan right there. If someone wants to give this a try today, most garden boards would be better starting points compared to the way indoor cannabis is usually produced. What were talking about is simple. Go and make a compost pile, pick up some aeration bits and a bail of peat (or better make some leafmold) and go for it. No bullshit excuses--(i live in the city, desert, a hostel)---you can run a worm bin in a condo in Tokyo. If you've got space to grow you can stash a cubic foot or two of soil somewhere. Everyone should have a worm bin under their sink.

It's cheap as hell. For the cost of some lame ass bagged soil and the nutes you will need to go with it you could be done shopping for life. No bullshit excuses.

You'll look back at your grow store days with a mix of laughter and shame...

 

[W89]

-(i live in the city, desert, a hostel)---you can run a worm bin in a condo in Tokyo


LOL

 

[John Deere]

I'm planning on 2 totes and I'll just rotate them between my under-the-stairs veg area and my flower cab. I'd prefer smartpots but I'm leaning towards totes since they'll be easier to move around. A couple more items I want to add to my soil before committing it to no-till but I'm close.

Here's where I'm at right now. Making some seeds.

 

[unthing]

you can, but do you want to?

 

[growingcrazy]

This is for you gascanastan: You cannot give Reputation to the same post twice.

I tried..

I agree with everything you posted. Grow great soil, grow great plants.

Simple...best ingredients in, best product out. The single most important part of my indoor cultivation is taking care of my soil bed. The bed is the most integral part of the whole system.


We really need to go through all of these multiple page threads and dissect the information and re-organize into a manner that is easily accessible to use as a quick reference guide and a learning tool for those really interested in changing the way most people will look at growing and possibly there outlook on everything around them in there day to day lives..


GC

 

[W89]

I'm planning on 2 totes and I'll just rotate them between my under-the-stairs veg area and my flower cab. I'd prefer smartpots but I'm leaning towards totes since they'll be easier to move around. A couple more items I want to add to my soil before committing it to no-till but I'm close.

Here's where I'm at right now. Making some seeds.

View Image

View Image

What strain mate?

 

[VerdantGreen]

The volume and the height of the containers matters. If memories serve me correct MM stated 5 gallons (volume) and 14 inches (depth) as good start points.

i think for no-till you would need at least that.

but for recycled/re-amended organic soil i have done grows in containers as shallow as 5"

not by choice, but because some of my cabinets are only about 2' tall!

Cherryjuana

VG

 

[W89]

I like the look of that mate!

 

[John Deere]

What strain mate?

mandala satori

She's a leafy bud bitch but I love the smoke. Very creative.

 

[dogfishheadie]

took me forever to find where I copied this to, really need to start saving my notes better and or not so high. hopefully this will help with whatever is in the works for a guide. the information is pretty overwhelming and having a go to guide would be the bees knees.

on the subject of notes. i know CC really praised evernote for pc / mobile note taking solution, all sorts of tools etc etc. the only thing I question about it is the lack of security features, there's not even a password required to open the app on the phone once it's running. i couldn't imagine the feeling of losing my phone and the off chance someone looks through my notes with scheduling, feeding cycles, recipes and all other sorts of incriminating evidence.

any other programs out there to help keep you organized?


oh and the info..

Hey folks (specifically newbs to ROLS),

I have read this entire thread as closely as my amateur skills have allowed me, and I have created a very terse compilation of notes, based exclusively from this thread. Meaning anything said can be sourced somewhere in this thread. There is such an extensive array of valuable information here I feel it warrants a summary of key terms/ideas, mainly for any newbs who have joined the boat late and who would like to source information quickly. If one person finds value in them other than myself, then it's worth posting

*Disclaimer*

These are my notes. As such, please take them with a grain of salt. Rather than rely on the specific claims I make in my notes or the figures I use, I recommend using them as an index of terms that can and should be searched for to help you locate specific topics quickly and efficiently. Also, these notes by no means cover all of the topics discussed. Unfortunately, they only touch on topics that are of specific interest to me. For example, you will find nothing regarding breeding, of which there is plenty discussed in this thread. I haven't tested many of these suggestions, and I haven't tested most on a long term basis. Remeber, these notes are coming from a newb!

Without further ado...

ROLS Notes


-Kelp has so many trace elements that it improve plants immune system against disease, insects, weather. Foliar is the most effective. Foliar roots during transplant. Growth max or growth plus are good brands. Foliar in the morning. Apply 1/2-3/4 cup of kelp meal to 1 c.f. of potting soil everyrecycle. Do not use liquid kelp as these products have far less benefits than raw kelp meal.

-Alfalfa has many trace minerals as well as n-p-k-Ca-mg, sugars, starches, protein, fiber and 16 amino acids. Use on top of soil sprinkling lightly or 1 cup per 1 c.f. soil mix or 1 tbs per gallon ACT. Excellent foliar feed. Use alfalfa seed tea early in flower to reduce internodal spacing.

-Aloe juice - simply crush the leaves and collect the juice. Aloe foliar @ 2 tbls per gallon water once every 3 days. Unprocessed Aloe must use within 20 minutes due to decomposition. Supplement with worm castings and casting teas. Great for rooting clones. Great for PM resistance along with neem, kelp and alfalfa. Excellent in rooting clones just add 2 oz per gallon water. 2 tbls per gallon foliar spray. Apply 1-3 times a week. Soil drench and foliar are identical.

Vermicompost
-use coffee beans for N. ph is about 6.9 for used grounds.
-leaves and straw for bedding.
-add grit like sand or limestone or eggshells for worm digestion @ 1% total mass
-red wriggler can live 0-30 degrees celsius. Optimal temps 15-25
-up to 20% worm biomass
-use citrus peels and onions with caution

-Fish bone meal - replace every other recycle for 5 cycles, then add every 3-4 cycles. Use 1-3 cups per 6 gallons depending on other high N sources such as alfalfa. High in phosphorous.

-Sphagnum peat is not inert it is alive! Look specifically for sphagnum.Holds 20x water to weight. Aerates heavy clay soils. Speeds up composting. Decomposes slowly over several years as opposed to compost which completely decomposes after a year.

-Stinging nettles and comfrey are a powerful pesticide and fungicide. Dice and purée 2 cups of comfrey or stinging nettles and let sit in water for no more than 3 days. Folier as well as soil drench.

-Rice hulls are a superior substitute for perlite. Perlite floats to the top of the pot. Also try lava rock.

-Leaf mold takes 6 months to a year to decompose. Speed the process up by throwing in high N stuff like compost, alfalfa meal. Use 2 quarts per cubic foot of soil. Great for moisture retention and aeration.

-Spider mites - control with neem foliar spray and rosemary oil spray. 10% rosemary oil to 90% water. -cardamom - grind 1/4 cup then place in hot water. Let cool. Go spray spider mites. Lavender tea. mite magnet - live Basel plants.

-Heat stress - use barley seed extract tea, same method as other enzyme seed teas.

-freshly rooted clones - couple days before transplanting add 1 tbs kelp meal , 2 tbs alfalfa meal, 1 gallon water bubble for 36-48 hrs for a boost in growth.

-Mineralization - azomite , gypsum (home depot) limestone and glacial rock @ 32 tbs per c.f. (total)Go to a landscape supply and load a bucket of all the rock u want! Try to go for volcanic rock dusts, as these contain silica.

-Thrips - ladybird larvae eat thrip larvae. Electric bug zapper. Bacteria called spinosad. Monterey garden insect w/ spinosad. Entrust 80w. Nematodes. Mums. Gerbera. Only foliar spray spinosad. Foliar with aloe and protekt. 1/4 aloe 2 tsp protekt per gallon solution. Know thrip life cycle.

-Cilantro pesticide- buy a bunch of organic cilantro. Place in food processor. Throw in 1 gallon of clearwater. Sit for 36 to 48 hours, no more. Strain. Add 1 cup of strained cilantro tea to 15 cups of water. Add quarter cup of Aloe Vera juice. 1 teaspoon pro-tekt. 30 minutes before lights out spray and soak everything. Leave ventilation on. Apply every four days for four applications. Use in conjunction with spinosad.

-Silica - use every watering and foliar spray up to harvest. Great pest and disease control. Protekt and agsil 16h are good brands. Agsil is greater value for your money. 148 grams agsil to 1 litre water = protekt. Silica is an emulsifier (i.e. use with neem oil)! 2 tsp protekt to 1 g water.

-Organic cloning gel - 1 g water, 2 tbs aloe Vera, 1.5 tbs Ful-power, 1.5 ts Protekt. Shake. Soak jiffy pucks for several hours. Use rooting product as well.

-Water retention - saponins. Horse chestnuts have a lot of saponins.

-Foliar - once a week, with something. Stop half way through flower. Always use Ful-Power to half harvest. Use Protekt till harvest.

-Neem - 1/4 cup per 1 cf every re ammend. Foliar-4 tsp per gallon. Emulsify with protekt. Ensure that water is at least 75 degrees fahrenheit when mixing final solution, otherwise it will clump - useless.

-Biochar. Hardwood charcoal. Smash to bits. Prevents yellowing via slow release of nutrients. Optional: place in compost pile. Allow up to 10% total soil volume. Cowboy charcoal from whole foods. Take bag of char, add 1/2 gallon EWC, 2-4 cups fish or guano or alfalfa or comfrey, soak a week in ACT, strain and add to soil.

-Enzyme tea -2 tablespoons of seeds (1 oz.) The choice of seeds is non specific. Almost anything works. Soak for 12-18 hours in mason jar. Drain that water and throw away it’s full of growth inhibitors. After a day or so once sprouted, add 1/2 gallon of water to the sprouts for a 36-48 hour soak. Strain and use 1 cup of this to 1 gallon of water as soil drench. Observe 'praying' leaves. Chop seeds for worm food. Do not store these teas.

-Coconut - scraping coconut paste from a young coconut. Enzymes, auxins, elements, etc. 1 coconut can do 20 plants. 1 oz coconut water to 15 oz water foliar spray clones. Benefits are too numerous to list.