The Myth of Objective Reality

[southflorida]

but the percepts are based on the inherent structure of the objective reality. As I said before it's dialectical process. Yes we are limited by our own bodies and to have a full direct understanding of reality we would need to be god like or omniscient.

This is where you are confusing primary with secondary, and assuming that secondary IS primary.

We DON'T perceive the primary reality, our self-mind interprets it, and provides us with an interpretation (image, sound, taste, etc) and also provides us with a meaning (good, bad, dangerous, bitter, etc).

Once this occurs, we are provided with an effect, an emotional charge that steers us toward some kind of action. To run, to stop, to spit something out, to laugh, to cry, to be afraid, to be angry, etc..etc.

The interpretation starts after our senses receive incoming DATA (reality) and transfer it through our nerve endings to our self-mind.

So, as you see all of these are SECONDARY processes.

The thing that is primary, that is first, that is original and authentic is the DATA that is perceived by our senses, the perception is not what something actually IS, but only appears to us inside of our self-mind, inside our imagination.

That DATA may not be what something actually either, because obviously something is providing that DATA...right?

This is why my point is that the PRIMARY reality is not-known.

And the objective REAL REALITY is something we never perceive, and have no way of perceiving since our senses are in-direct processes, sort of like radar.

It's like saying that the beep on the radar is what something is, while in reality it is only a perception of the plane by the radar's interpretation process.

That's why I think your post is based on arrogance because, in a way, you're asking, "why aren't we Gods and experiencing reality directly?"

Actually, I have said many times that we are Consciousness, and are experiencing reality directly, only our attention is focused on what we perceive.

Our self-mind is a survival mechanism and is always at effect from the constant DATA that is bombarding it on a moment-to-moment basis.

The direct experience of reality never goes anywhere or disappears, there is simply NOTHING there and because of this we ignore it.

My previous statement: "Reality is SOCIALLY MEDIATED and occurs through the DIALECTIC INTERACTION of our PERCEPTS and CONCEPTS." Is not a summary of what you said but rather an explanation of how the world works.

Again, you continue to be solipsistic which means you're not recognizing a reality beyond our conceptions of it.

That is how the world SEEMS, to work, and things are almost NEVER what they seem.

I'm recognizing that there is a primary reality that comes before our perceptions and interpretations, and that all that we see, hear, feel, taste, etc, are secondary processes, and NOT what something actually is.

Do you have an understanding of phenomenological epistemology south? It says the reality has inherent structures that speak to us universally.

Let me put it another way. Why do we call a certain strain "Watermelon Haze"?. Why is it that someone who has never heard of or experienced this strain upon first encounter always say, "wow, that smells of Watermelon" Is that based on illusion or imagination or is it based on the reality, i,e, inherent characteristics of the strain itself? Please explain.

What you are describing here is simply inventions of the human mind.

These are all simply concepts that we as human beings have made up, and they have been passed down to us through culture and society where we grow up.

This imagined, illusional reality is shared. We are inside a multi-player game, like WOW, for example, where what we perceive is pretty much the same for all the players, but each player has control over his personal virtual player.

So, in this virtual world, every player would smell the Watermelon Haze, and the programmed DATA would be interpreted by his mind as "watermelon."

===========================

The problem with grasping what I'm pointing at is the concepts inside our minds, the beliefs and assumptions through which we interpret the world.

We confuse our beliefs and assumptions with the truth, and this is the root of all of our problems and confusions.

To grasp something for what It IS, you have to first enter a state of not-knowing, where you realize that you don't really know what anything IS.

Otherwise all that you will see is your beliefs and assumption that your self mind uses to interpret any perception. This obviously includes what you are reading in this forum.

================================

To go deeper, and ask what is the nature of our reality, this is the thing that is truly interesting.

The reality that is occuring in our moment-to-moment experience is created through DISTINCTIONS that Consciousness is making.

These DISTINCTIONS are what constitute our whole world, and everything in it. There is absolutely NOTHING in our in-direct experience that is NOT a distinction.

If SOMETHING is distinct from what it is not, it is a distinction.

These differences ARE what our virtual world is created from.

Distinction is a function of Consciousness.

But, just like the true nature of Consciousness, the true nature of a distinction is NOTHING.

Consciousness is absolutely everything and infinitely nothing, or absolutely nothing and infinitely everything.

Nothing and Infinity are the same, they have no beginning and no end.

And they ARE the true nature of this experience.

Nothing, Infinity, Consciousness, Awareness, the Present Moment, Being, What IS, are all the same thing, and none of them actually exist...or to be more correct their nature is nothing.

This does not mean they are separate from the experience that we are perceiving and interpreting on a moment to moment basis.

There is simply NOTHING that is NOT Consciousness.

Consciousness is simply aware AS everything there IS.

Every DISTINCTION is Consciousness aware AS that distinction.

So, basically we are simply confused about who we really ARE.

We ARE Consciousness, and every distinction that we perceive is US Being Aware AS that DISTINCTION in our awareness.

But, this can't be believed or assumed, it has to be made directly conscious, otherwise it will all be denied by the self-mind, who's only job is to help you survive as the false-conceptual-self that you believe and assume that you are.

The funny thing is that this false-conceptual-self that you believe that you are IS also Consciousness being aware AS the false-conceptual-self.

===================================

You might have to read that a few times to grasp what I'm pointing at, and ignore your current beliefs and assumptions while you are reading it, otherwise you will simply interpret what I'm writing through them, and then all that you will grasp are those same beliefs and assumptions that you have recorded in your mind...and NOT what I'm trying to point at.

 

[stihgnobevoli]

I don't Read your S**T SF

You Talk Excessively


(Really.All your Doing When Whittled Down is Moaning.Remind me not to book a Holiday To South Florida.Weather must be Terrible!..) LOL.

Told you already What is Is. (Of Reality,perception etc)

i really like these kinds of threads, people sharing THEIR OWN ideas about things we can all equally measure/test on our own.


but it's funny sometimes...i mean i'm no one special but i assume that like everyone else, i click random threads that show in the what's new section, i only post on the threads i'm interested in or if someone needs some help or correcting bad info.

... i never really understood why people would go out of their way to expend energy to think up a post, write it out, and then post it, and come back later. to check on a thread they don't like...

lol.


also how can you tell ANYONE "what is IS", who the fuck are you?

Morgan Freeman






anyway back to southflorida, which has lovely weather btw. everyday is the first day of spring/summer. i like when you write these threads, you need to start sending me PM's when you start one. i hate coming in late and 7 pages deep. i can't read and respond like i want to. ain't nobody got time fo dat. wish i did but i don't.

i'll just respond to the first part and some of what i've read so far.

i see what you're saying that we are perceiving only what our senses tell us and we make it up in our minds what that means since we are not our bodies, we are therefore not our organs/senses either. what are we then, or rather as i've found myself wondering from a very young (too young?) age..."what" is this? or more concisely. why? ...the question...and the answer?

i disagree about the positive negative thing though. if you think about it, everything is positive and negative. distinction. which is 1 thing or ...is it 2?... hmmm...

i think about what my senses tell me, which i think may in fact just be thoughts, all of that which is not really thought? is it? they say the pituitary is the true self, seat of the self i believe i've heard if i'm not mistaken. or mrsbarbie

but since we are not our bodies or our organs or our thoughts then we are not the pituitary or in it, so where are we? what is we? why did we become ourselves? how did we know?

i see what you're saying about the whole allusion and perception thing, and i can conceive it, but i've never really tried to really take it in/ accept it. not till now. i mean we really don't know and have no way of knowing anything...LOL... really. no matter how much we investigate in either direction, religion or science which i btw think have value if people would get together and share ideas instead of trying to wield their knowledge to gain power. very shameful. we are all stuck on this planet together as one entity which can be collectively called the earth (ok i'm rambling now, lemme see if hittin the blunt will get me back on track)

anyway. since we are just going to interpret it with our senses which we should know based on the scientific evidence, i don't just mean falsifiable experiments, i mean your own experience which even if made up is still yours. whatever that means.



and for some reason writing that last line made me remember writing this before, or maybe i just thought i wrote it before?

anyway back to the place i was reading before

 

[southflorida]

anyway back to southflorida, which has lovely weather btw. everyday is the first day of spring/summer. i like when you write these threads, you need to start sending me PM's when you start one. i hate coming in late and 7 pages deep. i can't read and respond like i want to. ain't nobody got time fo dat. wish i did but i don't.

i'll just respond to the first part and some of what i've read so far.

i see what you're saying that we are perceiving only what our senses tell us and we make it up in our minds what that means since we are not our bodies, we are therefore not our organs/senses either. what are we then, or rather as i've found myself wondering from a very young (too young?) age..."what" is this? or more concisely. why? ...the question...and the answer?

yes...without doubt, all we have is our OLD beliefs and assumptions.

Obviously there is no way to have an insight if we believe and assume that we already know everything about a certain topic/domain.

The state of not-knowing is always the first step toward an insight and grasping the truth in relation to anything, including a direct experience and consciousness of the TRUTH itself.

i disagree about the positive negative thing though. if you think about it, everything is positive and negative. distinction. which is 1 thing or ...is it 2?... hmmm...

I think trichrider brought up positive and negative.

From my perspective, positive and negative exist in our self-mind that has to interpret every perception and provide us with a negative or positive emotional charge, in order to help us survive.

The self-mind is a SURVIVAL-MECHANISM-PROGRAM, and that is all it ever does. It helps us to survive as whatever we identify with as our "self".

i think about what my senses tell me, which i think may in fact just be thoughts, all of that which is not really thought? is it? they say the pituitary is the true self, seat of the self i believe i've heard if i'm not mistaken. or mrs barbie

but since we are not our bodies or our organs or our thoughts then we are not the pituitary or in it, so where are we? what is we? why did we become ourselves? how did we know?

Well, who we really ARE has to be something primary, something original, something that is authentic, and not a CONCEPTUAL-SNOWBALL...right?

To say it out right: We are Consciousness/Awareness ITSELF.

And everything we are aware OF is also us, because Consciousness uses DISTINCTION as a function in order to create this multi-player virtual reality game.

This does NOT mean that as Consciosuness and as DISTINCTIONS we have the same NATURE.

As Consciousness, our nature is infinitely nothing and absolutely everything.

As the stuff we perceive with our sense in our awareness, we are DISTINCTIONS. These are also Consciousness, they just have a different nature. Distinctions are not what IS, but what appears to BE.

Think about it: If Consciousness is ONE STRUCTURE, in order to evolve it has to break itself up into pieces (that is what DISTINCTIONS are) and force these distinctions to interact with each other.

This can only be done through SURVIVAL.

If we weren't focused on surviving as our "selves" - there would be no evolution, we'd just simply wouldn't give a fu*k about anything or anyone, we would have no desire to interact and cooperate on a mutually beneficial level...right?

Social Survival is what forces us to evolve and this is where 99.9% of our attention is focused on a moment-to-moment basis. The 0.1% Physical Survival is also important, but as a rule, we seem to take care of this on auto-pilot. But, if it ever becomes threatened, physical survival obviously becomes our primary concern.

The interesting thing is that in some situations, like in war situations, people's identities are more important than physical survival, but this is an exception to the rule.

i see what you're saying about the whole illusion and perception thing, and i can conceive it, but i've never really tried to really take it in/ accept it. not till now. i mean we really don't know and have no way of knowing anything...LOL... really. no matter how much we investigate in either direction, religion or science which i btw think have value if people would get together and share ideas instead of trying to wield their knowledge to gain power. very shameful. we are all stuck on this planet together as one entity which can be collectively called the earth (ok i'm rambling now, lemme see if hittin the blunt will get me back on track)

anyway. since we are just going to interpret it with our senses which we should know based on the scientific evidence, i don't just mean falsifiable experiments, i mean your own experience which even if made up is still yours. whatever that means.

and for some reason writing that last line made me remember writing this before, or maybe i just thought i wrote it before?

Not-Knowing is our only door-way into directly experiencing reality.

Without experiencing a state of not-knowing and staying completely focused on being present, here and now...all of our attention is focused on surviving as a false-conceptual-self.

This means we are totally focused on moving toward what we want, and moving away from what we don't want.

This is SELF-SURVIVAL at work.

If you notice, both of these movements are toward what IS NOT, they are NOT being present here and now.

Self survival is being aware that you have survived in the past, even if just a moment ago, and focusing on the fact that you might NOT survive in the future.

This is what causes ALL of our suffering and struggle in life.

Being present, here and now, and in a state of not-knowing causes no suffering and no struggle.

What is there to struggle with if everything is exactly as it is?

One suffers ONLY when he compares something that is an ideal in one's mind and compares this to what is occuring in the present moment, and finds the present moment LACKING in comparison to the ideal in one's imagination.

I currently think this is an absurd way to exist.

My current viewpoint, is it is more beneficial to be happy with what IS, and to actually live in the present moment, here and now, with both, body and mind!

Thanks for your interesting post, and the funny-ass image of the troll.

 

[offthehook]

I am practising this state of mind alot in my daily life.

Still, projections of a past and future do serve a purpose too besides it's core survival, even if it's just to only entertain one self.
I noticed much of what we are doing on this planet is just ment to entertain.
Any thoughts on the entertainment side of it SF ?

PS. I do read all your long ass post (lol) rather carefully and in accordence to my own reasoning and observations I found them fairly flawless.
Still, I am aware that everything we write down are just assumptions. It is real hard for us to know if something realy IS.

Your experience on LSD was rather funny btw. I thought of these 'aliens' conspiring on you by having you on LSD, so now you could never be sure of what you just saw, lol
Ones, while competely sober at my rock, I saw an airplane light flying steadily from left to right, then all of a sudden taking off like a comet's flash up into the cosmos & with an accelleration rate not known to man made aircraft.
I'll never figure what it was, and by now am at peace with the experience & without the urge for further inquiery.

 

[Ickis]

southflorida please explain the following scenarios. I think it will help me understand this concept.

How can 1,000,000 non colored blind people be shown a red rose and all say they saw a red rose if each one creates their own reality of what the rose looks like?

How can a tire fly off a car at a race track into the crowd and everybody runs or ducks?

How can a group of people all walk towards a cliff and all manage to stop right at the edge before they fall off?

 

[stihgnobevoli]

because they are all experiencing the same thing at the same time, but their own version of the fine details change with each individual perspective. but a "tire" still flew off a "car" towards a "crowd" the definition of each quoted word will be different from person to person (see plato's forms) but the stuff in the middle is the same for all. like what, i think it was BOG, said earlier about the superbowl.

i've always been of the opinion that everyone must be seeing something completely different from everyone else. we all have the same... um... whats a good word... source to work from but we tailor it for our own needs. sort of like flavors of linux, or more easily understood, like different templates/stylesheets/gui front ends, for the same underlying structure.

i say apple for instance and we all have an image of what an "apple" is in our heads. there is an ultimate solid definition in this "reality" of ours, a defined set of constraints for an apple to live in. all of our apples will fit the idea of what apple is, but all of our apples will be different. one will be the most red apple ever, one the most green, one the most perfectly symmetrical apple "shape" , one will barely be able to be called an apple by some standards yet all these varying apples to each of us according to our ideal of what an apple is will be accurate but they will all be different since we all interpret our information differently. we all have the same info to work on. the same underlying source code, but each of us have a uniquely customized version of the desktop.

this is how we can all see the same thing, which is in itself different for us all, and yet the same in the end.

i got something for your brains.

this is essentially platos forms theory, but i have been made to think this way based on my own disappointment with people in general arguing over pointless shit because of a differing perspective. but the question is. would i have ever thought of it in that way if plato hadn't thought of it first? do i only believe that way because i read about plato's forms? wouldn't my ego have the capability of absorbing someone else's ideas into my own and then making myself think i came up with it on my own before i read it from plato?

hive mind are we.

 

[southflorida]

I am practising this state of mind alot in my daily life.

Still, projections of a past and future do serve a purpose too besides it's core survival, even if it's just to only entertain one self.
I noticed much of what we are doing on this planet is just meant to entertain.
Any thoughts on the entertainment side of it SF ?

I think it's all entertainment for Consciousness...it is all alone, it is ONE, isolated, and wants to have some fun....how?

Presto...press a button, create a virtual game with seven billion players and NO fuc*ing rules provided.

How's that for entertainment?

PS. I do read all your long ass post (lol) rather carefully and in accordence to my own reasoning and observations I found them fairly flawless.
Still, I am aware that everything we write down are just assumptions. It is real hard for us to know if something really IS.

I'd say it is impossible. We can't know what something IS, we can only directly experience it. We are directly experiencing it now, but all of our attention is on what we are perceiving, because self-survival is constantly filling our awareness with "effects."

As a "self" we are always at effect of everything we perceive.

Your experience on LSD was rather funny btw. I thought of these 'aliens' conspiring on you by having you on LSD, so now you could never be sure of what you just saw, lol
Ones, while competely sober at my rock, I saw an airplane light flying steadily from left to right, then all of a sudden taking off like a comet's flash up into the cosmos & with an accelleration rate not known to man made aircraft.
I'll never figure what it was, and by now am at peace with the experience & without the urge for further inquiery.

I exist in a state of not-knowing, so just like BOG, I know nothing

 

[Eighths-n-Aces]

lets talk about something with a solid answer!!!!

like if green or orange is a cooler color, or if kanye west or justin bieber suck harder, or if the chicken or the egg came first,or if jesus took his first science quiz while bar hopping through the universe on a UFO piloted by really stoned but really anal retentive aliens who where working for the government.

i'm sure there are simple answers to these questions ..............

 

[southflorida]

southflorida please explain the following scenarios. I think it will help me understand this concept.

How can 1,000,000 non colored blind people be shown a red rose and all say they saw a red rose if each one creates their own reality of what the rose looks like?

How can a tire fly off a car at a race track into the crowd and everybody runs or ducks?

How can a group of people all walk towards a cliff and all manage to stop right at the edge before they fall off?

The best way to grasp this is to compare our life with a multi-player virtual reality game. Just like in World of Warcraft, you are give your own player with its own powers and weapons, etc.

You are an individual entity in the game, but all the OBJECTS in the game are the same for every player.

The DATA that the computer is interpreting is the same.

This is what is occuring in our moment-to-moment experience.

We are all interpreting DATA with our senses and our self-mind is creating an image that is the same for all the other humans that are part of this ONE experience.

If Consciousness is ONE STRUCTURE, then every human beings is an element of this one structure, and perceives the same things.

Obviously the meaning we attach to any interpretation is different, and there are many things to take into account, including language, education, etc, but still, if there is an OBJECT, like a bus, or a train, as mrcreosote has mentioned a few times that is travelling toward us, it is better to move out of its way, because in this "imagined reality" if this "imagined bus" hits you, you will die inside that "imaginary world."

What is hard to grasp is that our entire world is in our imagination.

There is NO physical world as we believe and assume.

This is what is hard for most to grasp.

And this is ONLY because of false beliefs and assumptions.

 

[1TWISTEDTRUCKER]

This
shit is SOooo DEEP, BUT kinda fun to ponder as long as you realize it just DONT MATTER.
I believe it does the brain good to actualy try to grasp concepts so foreign.
I am STILL in the minotity in the pole, but I am Hanging in there.
Im not trying to convince My self or any one of any thing.

The different ways Others are trying to make sence of these concepts, are VERY
interesting, and give Me new insight.

Gotta admit this is just the kind of thread I would of just scanned and either made a flippent comment in and left to never return, or just not ever returned to, just 5yrs ago, but I have been away for awhile, and in that time(mostly recently), I have been doing a lot of searching, and re examining ALL asspects of My Life.

Keep it coming,,, I AM LOVING it!!!!

TWISTED,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,OUTIE....

 

[1TWISTEDTRUCKER]

lets talk about something with a solid answer!!!!

like if green or orange is a cooler color, or if kanye west or justin bieber suck harder, or if the chicken or the egg came first,or if jesus took his first science quiz while bar hopping through the universe on a UFO piloted by really stoned but really anal retentive aliens who where working for the government.

i'm sure there are simple answers to these questions ..............

It IS as SIMPLE as picking a story and STICKING to IT

Twisted

 

[BushyOldGrower]

South Florida has presented his thoughts well.

Respect to you sir.

I don't think I said anything about the superbowl.

Are you Buddhist? Since I am still learning many difficult concepts like time, this doesnt seem that far fetched really.

But if a dream why not realize that the dream is reality? It really doesn't matter which way the electrons spin. What matters are the ways we work our dream.

Aren't we a collective consciousness after all? Don't you see how we all change our minds about something at the same time?

Bows in humility? Bushy

 

[southflorida]

because they are all experiencing the same thing at the same time, but their own version of the fine details change with each individual perspective. but a "tire" still flew off a "car" towards a "crowd" the definition of each quoted word will be different from person to person (see plato's forms) but the stuff in the middle is the same for all. like what, i think it was BOG, said earlier about the superbowl.

i've always been of the opinion that everyone must be seeing something completely different from everyone else. we all have the same... um... whats a good word... source to work from but we tailor it for our own needs. sort of like flavors of linux, or more easily understood, like different templates/stylesheets/gui front ends, for the same underlying structure.

i say apple for instance and we all have an image of what an "apple" is in our heads. there is an ultimate solid definition in this "reality" of ours, a defined set of constraints for an apple to live in. all of our apples will fit the idea of what apple is, but all of our apples will be different. one will be the most red apple ever, one the most green, one the most perfectly symmetrical apple "shape" , one will barely be able to be called an apple by some standards yet all these varying apples to each of us according to our ideal of what an apple is will be accurate but they will all be different since we all interpret our information differently. we all have the same info to work on. the same underlying source code, but each of us have a uniquely customized version of the desktop.

this is how we can all see the same thing, which is in itself different for us all, and yet the same in the end.

i got something for your brains.

this is essentially platos forms theory, but i have been made to think this way based on my own disappointment with people in general arguing over pointless shit because of a differing perspective. but the question is. would i have ever thought of it in that way if plato hadn't thought of it first? do i only believe that way because i read about plato's forms? wouldn't my ego have the capability of absorbing someone else's ideas into my own and then making myself think i came up with it on my own before i read it from plato?

hive mind are we.

The first step is to be present, here and now, and simultaneously be in a state of complete not-knowing.

And then look at objects that you are perceiving and ask yourself this question:

Except for a name and a use for any object...besides these two things...do I really know what this object IS?

If you seriously do this and be completely honest with yourself, you will notice that we simply don't know what anything IS fundamentally. All we can say is that it is some object, but what it really IS, is unknown.

This shows how much we live in a conceptual world.

In fact, we live 100% in a conceptual world, in our imagination.

There is NO objective world as we believe and assume.

 

[southflorida]

South Florida has presented his thoughts well.

Respect to you sir.

I don't think I said anything about the superbowl.

Are you Buddhist? Since I am still learning many difficult concepts like time, this doesnt seem that far fetched really.

Thanks BOG.

No, I am not a Buddhist, or anything else.

I have simply always been interested my whole life in understanding the human condition. I guess I always wanted to know who I really am. From around 14 years old (i'm 43 now) I started to DOUBT what I was being told by the culture where I was growing up.

This was in South Florida...btw...but, for my first 9 years of life I live in Soviet Union. My parents immigrated to USA when I was 9.5.

As far as time, by the way, there is ONLY the present moment, the here and now, and never anything else.

Past and future are concepts, they are what we imagine in our mind, and are never focused on the present moment, on what IS, but are always focused on what is NOT.

But if a dream why not realize that the dream is reality? It really doesn't matter which way the electrons spin. What matters are the ways we work our dream.

Aren't we a collective consciousness after all? Don't you see how we all change our minds about something at the same time?

What's really important is to grasp that all of this is occuring in our own imagination, and that we are responsible for everything that we are creating.

For example...what is fear? what is anger? what is desire?

What if I told you that all of these emotions are 100% conceptual and created through our own conceptualization, our own thinking, inside of our imagination.

If you want, and interested, I can break down these three emotions, and you will clearly see how responsible we are for creating our moment-to-moment experience.

This one sample might create some amazing insights.

 

[1TWISTEDTRUCKER]

What is Anger???
I thought I knew, until reading most o this thread,,,, but I only know how anger manifest itself, with outbursts and emotions, until this.

I am in a HUGE life change, how to control MY SELF, and accept that I CAN NOT control the out comes of the injustices that I see daily, that cause Me to Go OFF.

Just looking at this from a different angle is starting to work its way in to My rather sizeable Mellon.

THANKS; 1TT

 

[BushyOldGrower]

You would be surprised if you did study Buddhism.

I discovered these insights and then I discovered Buddhism.

Why is mediocrity an option?

 

[BullDogUK]

Jumping in a bit but my 2 cents:

To understand anything we have to make three base assumptions:

1. That the universe exists
2. You can learn something about reality
3. Models with predictive capabilities are more useful than models without predictive capabilities.

We can sit here for eternity discussing whether or not we can know if everything is just a figment of our imagination or not, however the fact that the assumption that it isn't allows us to predict certain things (i.e. Superbowl was mentioned earlier, if the world is real we'd assume that x number of people also saw the exact same thing - hey presto! what do you know they did!).

I think instead of arguing whether or not everything is real, it's more interesting to ask how can the failures of our nervous system alter perception of reality. Look at the numbers of people who genuinely believe in a personal, intervening God for example Essentially, our minds have not evolved to cope with many of the areas we are now investigating, the sorts of distances, sizes, speeds and spans of time involved are just beyond any kind of comprehension and do not act in ways that we would intuitively assume they would.

 

[southflorida]

You would be surprised if you did study Buddhism.

I discovered these insights and then I discovered Buddhism.

If we are Consciousness, this means we can be directly conscious of reality, of the TRUTH as-it-is, we don't need any kind of organized movement or religion to help us with this.

Where else are we going to become directly conscious if it is not in our own consciousness?

Buddhism is a good option in the beginning, but it is like a ladder. Once you climb the ladder to the top, you have to get off it.

And that is where you are on your own, Buddhism can't help you become directly conscious of the truth, only YOU can do that.

Why is mediocrity an option?

That is simply a joke in relation to that saying that mediocrity is not an option.

Those kinds of ideals actually bring a lot of suffering, because a lot of people and the results they produce are mediocre.

If this is how it is, why can't being mediocre be an option for them?

 

[southflorida]

What is Anger???
I thought I knew, until reading most o this thread,,,, but I only know how anger manifest itself, with outbursts and emotions, until this.

I am in a HUGE life change, how to control MY SELF, and accept that I CAN NOT control the out comes of the injustices that I see daily, that cause Me to Go OFF.

Just looking at this from a different angle is starting to work its way in to My rather sizeable Mellon.

THANKS; 1TT

First let me Cover The Structure of FEAR:

1) the first component of fear is an "unwillingness" to have a particular experience

no matter how it arises, there is always this component of conceiving something uncomfortable or painful that we are unwilling to experience

this unwillingness is not a separate activity, or causal activity, it is fear, or to be more correct, a component of fear

when we are afraid, it is possible to recognize this unwillingness taking place in whatever forms it occurs

and, if you can eliminate this unwillingness in your awareness, be completely willing to experience whatever you're resisting, no fear can take place!

Think about anything you're afraid off, and become willing to experience it. Fear will be eliminated.

2) the second component is the possibility of a "future."

A possibility of future has to exist in order for fear to take place.

Fear never takes place in relation to the present, only in relation to the future.

This is hard to grasp for most folks, but if you observe closely to what is actually occuring in your awareness, you will notice that whatever is occuring as fear in the present is in relation to the possibility or notion of the future.

Have no possibility of a future in your awareness and you cannot be afraid.

It's not that you wouldn't be afraid, it's that you couldn't be afraid!

Interesting...huh?

3) The third component is conceiving an unwanted "scenario."

It is somewhat a combination of the first two, but a new element is added.

This component is generating a scenario that something unwanted will occur in the future.

It is a conception that whatever you are unwilling to experience will happen in the future.

If you don't create this scenario (conception) in your awareness you will not be able to generate fear.

4) When these three components are put together in our awareness, we have fear, the sensation or physiological reaction that manifests as a specific negative "feeling."

This emotional charge is the fourth component, and it is what most people think fear is.

But, even this part is conceptually created in your thinking, because in order to send this emotional charge, your mind has to create unwillingness, possibility of a future, and a scenario of an unwanted experience.

The last part, the physiological reaction is interpreted by your mind as an emotional charge that lets you know how to react and behave in relation to whatever you perceive in your experiences.

Since all your perceptions are also created by you and are based on your beliefs and assumptions, we can see that we are creating our own experiences and emotions.

We are GENERATING fear ourselves.

This means we can STOP generating, and we won't be afraid.

===============================================

I will continue with Anger in the next post.

 

[southflorida]

The Structure of ANGER:

1) the first component of anger is the possibility of a past

anger is always about something that has passed, and exists only in relation to the past.

someone threw a rock at your house window, breaking the glass. it already happened, and now you're angry.

you're not afraid because it's not something that might happen in the future, you're angry, because it already did happen...and it hurt!...either physically and/or emotionally.

2) the second component of anger is hurt or pain.

just like with fear, in anger there is always something that is resisted, not accepted

given that this experience has already taken place, the rejection of this experience shows up as hurt

conventionally this is rarely noticed, and most people go right to anger and never get that it is based on the fact that they are feeling hurt

perhaps one of the main functions of the anger-reaction involves ignoring or avoiding the pain and the hurting

now, if you stop being angry and feel the hurt that the activity of anger wants to correct or eliminate what happens?

you wouldn't feel the anger. why be angry? you already feel the hurt

now what is the hurt about? glad you asked...

3) the third component of anger is the revealing a sense of incapacity

this component is not always easy to grasp, but it is taking place

imagine for a moment that you are completely capable in relation to what happened

for example, as soon as you see the broken house window you can snap your fingers and the window would magically fix itself, returning to its condition before the rock went through it, would you be angry? probably not, why be angry if there is no pain, the window is fixed as if nothing happened?

but, since life doesn't work that way, we feel incapable in relation to what occured, and we want to get rid of this sense of incapacity and the resultant hurt produced by the event that has occured.

which leads us to the next component.

4) the fourth and last component of anger is regenerating a sense of capacity through a destructive intent or feeling-reaction

with anger we feel we are now taking some sort of action, at least internally

and what is the purpose of this action?

it is an attempt to feel capable once again, to restore a sense of capacity to one's self

anger allows one to return the sense of being fundamentally incapable of life back to its buried place in one's psyche

everyone knows how to destroy and feels capable of doing it, and this is why this is the usual path we take

of course, creating something would also work, but it takes too long, and what if we fail?

Destruction can be immediate, and it is the easiest thing to do

we don't have to destroy something or someone physically, it can be even done in our mind, the most important thing is to feel capable!

Once again, just like with fear, eliminating any component of anger will completely eliminate the anger.

If there is no concept of the past, there is no anger.

Likewise, if you do not create hurt or pain about something, you cannot be angry.

Further, if you can become conscious of the core feeling of incapacity that founds the anger and transcend this self-mind disposition, you won't need action (internal or external) to restore a capacity, and so there will be no anger.

So, as with fear, it is clear that we are creating emotions inside of our awareness. It is not the people or the circumstances.

It is our interpretations and the meaning we provide these interpretations with.