The Mill's Pride Club

[kp^]

Quick update from me..

My plants are doing pretty good. Temps have been more controlled, but my humidity has been around 25%. Doing what I can to improve to 30%+

Right now I'm training them to have more growth in some of the bare areas. I've tied down the tallest so more growth will come into the center. show below.


Here is some recent pics..

 

[gruvygreen]

Some cab math

Some cab math

Simon, didn't want to leave you hanging thinking you had to do all the calculating for me so I thought I'd post some of the math with a couple of questions.

Left Section - Flower Chamber
Square Ft.
23"W 20"D
23" x 20" = 460
460 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 3.2 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
23"W 20"D 47"H
23/12 = 1.2'W
20/12 = 1.6'D
47/12 = 3.9'H
1.2' x 1.6' x 3.9' = 7.5 cubic ft.

Lower Right Section - Veg Chamber
Square Ft.
23"W 20"D
23" x 20" = 460
460 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 3.2 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
23"W 20"D 30"H
23"/12" = 1.2'W
20"/12" = 1.6'D
30"/12" = 2.5'H
1.2' x 1.6' x 2.5' = 4.8 cubic ft.

Middle Right Section - Mother Chamber - directly above Veg chamber
Square Ft.
23"W 20"D
23" x 20" = 460
460 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 3.2 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
23"W 20"D 17"H
23"/12" = 1.2'W
20"/12" = 1.6'D
17"/12" = 1.4'H
1.2' x 1.6' x 1.4' = 2.7 cubic ft.

Top Section - Clone/Scrubber/Fan Chamber
Square Ft.
47"W 20"D
47" x 20" = 940
940 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 6.5 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
47"W 20"D 20"H
47"/12" = 3.9'W
20"/12" = 1.6'D
20"/12" = 1.6'H
1.6' x 1.6' x 3.9' = 10 cubic ft.

Total Cab = 24 Cubic Ft.

Light Calculations @ 50 Watts Per Sq. Ft.
3.2 sq. ft. x 50 = 160

Not factoring in penetration 150 watts would work, but would bigger be better ...like a 250 watt HPS, or would it be overkill.

I'm using the CFLs with the thought that the amount of watts of CFL should produce the same heat as the same amount of watts of HPS. For example 150 watts of cfl light should produce the same heat as 150 watt HPS.

Ventilation Calculations

Exhaust Area
6" diameter ducting / 2 = 3" in. Radius x 3.1416 = 9.42 x 3" Radius = 28.26 sq. in

Ideal Intake Area double the exhaust area
28.26 x 2 = 56.52 sq. in.

Photo Louver Intake Area
8" x 8" = 64 sq. in.

NOTE: 64 - 56.52 = 7.5 sq. in. Extra intake area

Calculating Required Fan/Blower CFM
I need to move 24 cubic feet of air 4 times per minute.

24 x 4 = 96 cubic ft. per minute 96 CFM

How do I calculate the extra CFM needed to pull through the scrubber?

Cann 33 info from the Can web site:
Dimensions: (with pre-filter)
·Outside Diameter: 305mm/12"
·Height: 330mm/13"
·Total Weight: 11.5kg/25.3lbs.
·Carbon Weight: 7.5kg/16.5lbs.
·Carbon Bed Depth: 50mm/2"
Max Operating Temp: 80ºC
Pressure drop at max cfm: 180pa/. 75wg



Stanly Blower

3 speeds
Low = 190 CFM
Medium = 260 CFM
High = 310 CFM

NOTE: These are estimates from a thread on IC.

I think the Low setting at 190 CFM should be plenty for pulling through the scrubber, exchanging air 4 times per minute, and make up for the extra 7.5 sq. in. of intake that was extra ...creating negative pressure?

How much heat will 500 watts of light make, if I put a 250 HPS in the flower cab, and a 250 MH in the veg chamber, and if my ambient temps are 75 degrees, will the fan pull enough air in to keep the cabinet under 80 degrees?

This is why I'm using the cfls first. I literally pulled them out of ceiling fans and porch lights I already had.

Last, since in my sog I'm looking for just a single large cola, wouldn't CFLs work anyway? Should I be worried about penetration that much?

Anyway, I've been trying to do my homework here, but I'm wondering if the only way I'm going to find out what will work is just to start cutting holes, hooking up ducting, and plugging in lights, and fans. It doesn't seem like there's any real method to calculating everything. Maybe trial and error is the way to go?

Anyone have any thoughts?

 

[gruvygreen]

Some cab math

Some cab math

Simon, didn't want to leave you hanging thinking you had to do all the calculating for me so I thought I'd post some of the math with a couple of questions.



Left Section - Flower Chamber
Square Ft.
23"W 20"D
23" x 20" = 460
460 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 3.2 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
23"W 20"D 47"H
23/12 = 1.2'W
20/12 = 1.6'D
47/12 = 3.9'H
1.2' x 1.6' x 3.9' = 7.5 cubic ft.

Lower Right Section - Veg Chamber
Square Ft.
23"W 20"D
23" x 20" = 460
460 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 3.2 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
23"W 20"D 30"H
23"/12" = 1.2'W
20"/12" = 1.6'D
30"/12" = 2.5'H
1.2' x 1.6' x 2.5' = 4.8 cubic ft.

Middle Right Section - Mother Chamber - directly above Veg chamber
Square Ft.
23"W 20"D
23" x 20" = 460
460 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 3.2 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
23"W 20"D 17"H
23"/12" = 1.2'W
20"/12" = 1.6'D
17"/12" = 1.4'H
1.2' x 1.6' x 1.4' = 2.7 cubic ft.

Top Section - Clone/Scrubber/Fan Chamber
Square Ft.
47"W 20"D
47" x 20" = 940
940 sq. in. / 144 sq. in. = 6.5 sq.ft.

Cubic Ft.
47"W 20"D 20"H
47"/12" = 3.9'W
20"/12" = 1.6'D
20"/12" = 1.6'H
1.6' x 1.6' x 3.9' = 10 cubic ft.

Total Cab = 24 Cubic Ft.

Light Calculations @ 50 Watts Per Sq. Ft.
3.2 sq. ft. x 50 = 160

Not factoring in penetration 150 watts would work, but would bigger be better ...like a 250 watt HPS, or would it be overkill.

I'm using the CFLs with the thought that the amount of watts of CFL should produce the same heat as the same amount of watts of HPS. For example 150 watts of cfl light should produce the same heat as 150 watt HPS.

Ventilation Calculations

Exhaust Area

6" diameter ducting / 2 = 3" in. Radius x 3.1416 = 9.42 x 3" Radius = 28.26 sq. in

Ideal Intake Area double the exhaust area

28.26 x 2 = 56.52 sq. in.

Photo Louver Intake Area

8" x 8" = 64 sq. in.

NOTE: 64 - 56.52 = 7.5 sq. in. Extra intake area

Calculating Blower CFM

I need to move 24 cubic feet of air 4 times per minute.

24 x 4 = 96 cubic ft. per minute 96 CFM


How do I calculate the extra CFM needed to pull through the scrubber?

Cann 33 info from the Can web site:
Dimensions: (with pre-filter)
·Outside Diameter: 305mm/12"
·Height: 330mm/13"
·Total Weight: 11.5kg/25.3lbs.
·Carbon Weight: 7.5kg/16.5lbs.
·Carbon Bed Depth: 50mm/2"
Max Operating Temp: 80ºC
Pressure drop at max cfm: 180pa/. 75wg



Stanly Blower

3 speeds
Low = 190 CFM
Medium = 260 CFM
High = 310 CFM

NOTE: These are estimates from a thread on IC.

I think the Low setting at 190 CFM should be plenty for pulling through the scrubber, exchanging air 4 times per minute, and make up for the extra 7.5 sq. in. of intake that was extra ...creating negative pressure?

How much heat will 500 watts of light make, if I put a 250 HPS in the flower cab, and a 250 MH in the veg chamber, and if my ambient temps are 75 degrees, will the fan pull enough air in to keep the cabinet under 80 degrees?

This is why I'm using the cfls first. I literally pulled them out of ceiling fans and porch lights I already had.

Last, since in my sog I'm looking for just a single large cola, wouldn't CFLs work anyway? Should I be worried about penetration that much?

Anyway, I've been trying to do my homework here, but I'm wondering if the only way I'm going to find out what will work is just to start cutting holes, hooking up ducting, and plugging in lights, and fans. It doesn't seem like there's any real moethod to calculating everything.

 

[sumo]

hey gruvy. I don't know why people like stanley blowers. With a square outlet they seem like the wrong tool for the job. For cheap a Dayton blower would probably be better. It is not a beginner project to combine veg and flower in one cab. The problem would be light leeks into flower chamber. Light leaks won't matter except into flower chamber. How do you know you have light leeks into flower chamber? You have to hire a small person to crawl inside and see. It is hard enough to light proof a cab for normal ambient light. Light proofing against HID lighting next door is expert only. Instead of small person you could cut a peephole that you could peek into looking for leaks then keep peephole covered otherwise. I would have to check it on a daily basis which would drive me nuts.
As the air travelled through your chambers it would heat up and the flower room would be getting preheated air. Colas need light penetration. With cfl's you need an even canopy of chopped and trained plants. You could get one good grow from seed in the flower only cab only to give you some breathing room before you start the whole three chamber thing.
I just don't know of a multi chamber single cab that has been in use for any length of time. I see them being built but just don't see the success postings.

good luck
sumo

 

[Pirate138]

ok guys i am looking for a new cab to convert but need something like the mills pride. i heard the c13 and c22 were discontinued, the c13 seemed a little tall for me anyway. can anyone give me a link or a name of a good cab? preferably one that i can build a veg and a flower section, maybe 36" or a little above. kinda like the pic of the cab 2 posts above mine. where can i get that? whats it called? thanx guys

 

[gruvygreen]

Pirate138 - That's a Closetmaid cab from HD. The dimensions are up there too.

sumo - I'm going to use two sets of louvers. A set for each side. One at the bottom, and one at the top of each the flower and veg chambers. That should let me pull fresh 75 degree air up and across the plants, and lights, and into the top section, through the Can Filter 33, and out the top of the cab.

I'll try to remember to take some pictures this weekend to better explain.

I have 3/8" rubber seal but I still need to tweek here and there. The adhesive isn't very good is all. I'll be lightproffing both sides so I can use both side for flower or veg etc...

Thanks for the advice.

Oh, yeah I know this isn't a noob thing to do, but messing around with the cab keeps me from messing around with the plants.(LOL)

 

[pinecone]

All I have to say is - Simonc!

Seriously folks, Simonc is a great source of information on cab growing and growing in general. He has had many impressive soil grows and has grown a large variety of different strains. He is smart, articulate, and (in most cases) willing to help.

Simonc - I was thinking about ordering some seeds and was wondering what strains you have particularly enjoyed that lend themselves well too the cab environment? I'm have not growing continuously so getting a bunch of good weed out of 20 or so seeds is at a premium.

BTW - my current grow is my worst ever. I nearly killed all my seedlings. I planted the seedlings in some two year old soil that I found in a storage container in my cab. Left in the container was a metal potting spoon-min-shovel (?) that was 85% corroded, and (in hindsight) some of the soil may have been recycled. In any event, I think this soil almost killed my seedlings. I transplanted earlier than I would have liked to and my plants, although healthy, are probably two weeks behind where they should be. Since I've been out of weed for some time this setback hurts a little.

Pinecone

 

[Pirate138]

question for everyone, would one of these resin constructed cabs be ok to grow in? or would a 400w hps in a cooltube be to hot and melt it? heres a link to it.
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=169300-84396-17185453&lpage=none

 

[mysta177]

mang where simon go? Seriously that cat is right 99.9% of the time..0.1% for windage!

 

[smoke1sun]

Might be able to be done, but you would have to think about cutting holes for intake and exaust and such, plus i think they sell cabs about that size that are white already and wood. i have a 400 watt in a cab similar to the mills cabs that get pretty warm in there with a stanley for my exaust. But im not telling you it wont work just some things to think about.

Check these out there at lowes also:
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productList&N=0&Ntk=i_products&Ntt=stor it

 

[Pirate138]

that one is so tall, im lookin for a cab about 36 in tall. but thanx smoke.

 

[pinecone]

that one is so tall, im lookin for a cab about 36 in tall. but thanx smoke.

You are going to have a hard time putting an HID in a cab that is only 36" tall. Your pots will take up 10", you are going to have to allow for at least 5" between plant tops and the lights, and at least 8" to hang the light. This leaves you growing very shot plants.

Pinecone

 

[kp^]

I wanted to post pics of my plants, but having issues with uploading. maybe later..

I had a question as far as going into 12/12. I've got 3 plants under a 400w MH bulb on 24/0 for about 5wks now in a soil mix. 2 are showing female traits while the 3rd is unknown.

How many days, if any do you leave your plants in a darkness until you start a 12/12 period. I hear 3 days, other times Ive heard 24 hours. I'd really like to get an honest answer and a possible reason behind it.

I have forgotten what I have done in my past grows. lol



Thank you, and and peace all!

 

[StealthFarmer]

Hey kp,

Just throw 'em straight into 12/12. I see no reason to leave a period of a couple of days of complete darkness unless you want them to flower faster in which case you will probably lose out on some yield.

Anyways, I recently bought 2 cabs from Home Depot. They no longer carry Mill's Pride where I live but they have Closet Maid cabs which have pretty good dimensions (48" x 20" x 72"). They cost me around 100 bux each.

How do I post pics?? lol

 

[pinecone]

I agree with SF - just switch the light cycle straight away.

Pine

 

[kp^]

To StealthFarmer and pinecone.

thanks for info! I was so confused. lol rep++ to ya both!

Gave em a 3 hour darkness which gave me enough time to find my HPS bulb, take out the MH when it was cool and setup the timer. 12/12 starts TODAY! yay!

These bagseed plants have been really impressed me. 2 of 3 are females.. so happy!

Here they are the other day.

 

[StealthFarmer]

Nice looking plants kp, but whats with all those water bottles around the pots?

Is that to raise humidity? and if it is, does it work? I got some low humidity around where I live, its been about 20% for the last few weeks and if that water bottle thing works I might give it a try.

 

[raygun]

Hey is anyone using CMH bulbs in there cab yet? I have been following the CMH thread and it appears that this bulb is the cab growers dream! Less heat output and a spectrum better than a hps/mh combo! I think i will be ditching my electronic ballest to run one of these bulbs in the near future.

If anyone else is currently running these bulbs please let us know!

 

[kp^]

StealthFarmer, Trying to raise humidly... 2x2gallon jugs + a few gatoride bottles as well.

I cant really afford or allow anything else to use electricty or I'd try it.

Does it work? It's not the best, but it helps some. I've seen an increase of at least 5%.

 

[icough2getoff]

Hey is anyone using CMH bulbs in there cab yet? I have been following the CMH thread and it appears that this bulb is the cab growers dream! Less heat output and a spectrum better than a hps/mh combo! I think i will be ditching my electronic ballest to run one of these bulbs in the near future.

If anyone else is currently running these bulbs please let us know!

I've also been interested in these. I don't know if I want to sacrifice the extra noise of the mag ballast, but if I start seeing some more results from them I might give it a shot.