The Haze discussion thread

[Donald Mallard]

What you saying by taking someone else's work is what sam and tom and every seedmaker out there has done.

Sam takes O Haze seeds from G and makes O Haze seeds and people seem to forget sam didnt make Haze either
or tom hill if i not mistaken takes wernards Haze and does same thing
tod
etc
etc

You show me where someone made it for full scratch ?
even the orginators are questionable as you can find that someone else made claim to some of the first ever strains.

What about you with your C5 mango X's , basicly using all of Neville's work and then dissing him constantly ? , is it just me or is it crazy some of these guys who dis Neville constantly but use his work on a regular.
where your O Haze x Sk1 X's
Or what about tod mcormick
you look at his website and whole line near 50 strains and its Nevil Haze x O Haze x Everything
not O Haze x everything
ON Haze x everything
why is that ?

because Neville Schoenmakers ( RIP ) was the Haze master and nobody has come close.

Me and every other seedmaker uses someone elses work to carry on in his own direction and of course still give credit to the originator of the work your using

yes i see that ,
and yes i can name a few that took landrace varieties and made something from them ,
from scratch ,
sam for one , with his skunk ,
my mate moon unit with his zoidfuel ,
thats all i know for now but its a start ,

tom hill did maintain deep chunk also, which is a landrace,
probably others i cant think of off the top of my head but they are around ..

and yes i did use nevil and shantis work to make some stuff ,
i certainly havent been patting myself on the back saying ive done something wonderful on my own though ,
or that it is my work , on the contrary , i have given credit to the folks who did the original work ,
and taken none myself because the selection i did was a minor part ,

a bit like nevil really with his haze selection , which was also a minor part because he started with something good ,

see what i mean ??
(also its unlikely i will sell any commercially,, i just share them around with friends and some folks here and we all grow it locally where i live )

so yep your correct most folks use others stuff ,
or as sam put it , we stand on the shoulders of giants ,
just some folks demand more credit than others ,
and often the people who did the real work,
get very little credit as harvestreapers post points out ....

 

[Mimpi Manis]

The idea of modesty as a an agreeable character trait does seem to have gone out of fashion. Replaced mostly by hubris? I always thought credit where credit was due was just good manners? I wonder what some of those dedicated and savvy old timers (those that are left) in the back blocks of Thailand and Afghanistan et al would make of all this self promotion built off their legacies? Any first hand stories to be had from that angle Mr Duck?

 

[ArtOfSelection]

i personally think plant breeding has parallels with music creation..........a musician /breeder simply HAS to borrow and steal from others to create something new ...it's a progression, an advancement on what has come before ...........what the best breeders/musicians have in common is an innate knack to pick winners, to recognize a hit ...take some newer most respected breeders' chimera/bodhi/karma ..they all found their best breeding stocks in other peoples work..often in very small seed selections or clones ..but they have a great skill in matching genetics and in selection ...karmas most renowned breeding stock originated from a few packs of rez seeds... a proven and reviled informant ... some of the most popular big name strains of today are simply selected phenos from poly hybrid grow outs or random unintended pollinations .....as in music .the pioneers come in many forms, and from many many generations,. all playing their own unique part.... neither Sam nor Nevill created/invented haze ...nor did the haze brothers ..nor did the generations of landrace farmers who made available the component genetic material but rather all collectively playing a massive part in the creation of the haze we all know and love ...my 2 cents

 

[TheDarkStorm]

yes i see that ,
and yes i can name a few that took landrace varieties and made something from them ,
from scratch ,
sam for one , with his skunk ,
my mate moon unit with his zoidfuel ,
thats all i know for now but its a start ,

tom hill did maintain deep chunk also, which is a landrace,
probably others i cant think of off the top of my head but they are around ..

and yes i did use nevil and shantis work to make some stuff ,
i certainly havent been patting myself on the back saying ive done something wonderful on my own though ,
or that it is my work , on the contrary , i have given credit to the folks who did the original work ,
and taken none myself because the selection i did was a minor part ,

a bit like nevil really with his haze selection , which was also a minor part because he started with something good ,

see what i mean ??
(also its unlikely i will sell any commercially,, i just share them around with friends and some folks here and we all grow it locally where i live )

so yep your correct most folks use others stuff ,
or as sam put it , we stand on the shoulders of giants ,
just some folks demand more credit than others ,
and often the people who did the real work,
get very little credit as harvestreapers post points out ....

I guess you guys didnt know nevil used to sell oaxacan and thai...he did actually work those from raw land race seeds to were he wanted to to get the best seed....was also one of the first people to use and work the auto trait....making autos and incorporating the trait into to some lines to speed up flower and trigger time......I guess people think some of the last stuff he made he just took plants other people had worked and used those....yes in initial testing those clones were used....but later he worked those lines far into his own direction an used selections from those to make some of the best stuff.....ther is also a private mazar line that came from nevil...it was worked by him.... used in the northern lites line aswell.....those who have come across it in pure form agree it is one of the best indicas around......

 

[TheDarkStorm]

Smoking fire.....haze on....

 

[harvestreaper]

Yes all from usa but usa holders could also of made the seeds and spread them all over the world making them famous , but they didnt Neville did.
sam had chance and did make millions of seeds in his dutch/uk outdoor greenhouse projects same times as Neville , and sam sold to posi , flying dutch etc etc etc , they just didnt make as much noise or reach as many people as Neville did.

we all got diffrent values ,,in the same way selection breeding and marketing are diffrent from each other ,,,theres no confusion with old farts like me who lived thru that era ,,was a diffrent world back then ,,today imo we can all be thankful to ALL those before us who gave us these wonderful genetics to do with as we see fit weather its creating from scratch using others work its all good as long as were honest with our pedigrees the next gens will have the abilty to breed them on properly in the directions they choose

 

[harvestreaper]

"from holland by an Australian ,"

pretty bonkers really isnt it hr ,
kinda like a movie and we are only really seeing the crew who brought it to the big screen ,
they are getting the credit when theres a whole set of folks behind the scenes who really got it all going in the first place,
kinda puts a bit of a different perspective to it ....

it takes a lot of people to get some things to fly,
we should remember that when we look at the end products ,
credit is due to a whole cast and crew , not just the guy who put it on the screen ...

yes indeed it should be noted the ozzies made a huge noise neville and shanti ,,enjoyed both there products ,,yes it baffles me donald i see people growing fantastic genetics that are clearly world class growers yet they squabble like children how is that possible if you high on the good stuff ,,,lol what ever happened to credit to all for what they did no more no less with no drama lol these threads about the breeding and the plant not who we like /lookup to most ,cmon people its a bad advert for haze lol work together and take the haze up a few levels by breeding from your best an crossing to others best as people like jonnychicago and mad mac are demonstrating
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkSJN5FnMuY

 

[harvestreaper]

the dreadlock pheno you liked hempy ,,coming along ok with light dep,,, so far expressing very diffrently under the uk skies

 

[star crash]

I'm referring to that structure. I do not like plants that grow like this. Ill pass.

The Demon Latcher

 

[CosmicGiggle]

............ Sam never created Haze so why you acting like he did.

Having a discussion is one thing attacking a persons reputation and credibility is very different.

............. yet here we are once again, Sam vs. Nevil.

 

[harvestreaper]

pheno 5 from todds around 11 /12 weeks ,,rotten fruit onions, rootbeer sounds orrible but its good lol

 

[Hammerhead]

The Demon Latcher

Looks like something we grow for fun. To much time picking off calyxes. To much stem for me. Ill pass..

 

[B.T. Herb]

............. yet here we are once again, Sam vs. Nevil.

that at this point assumes the form of a seance.

 

[CosmicGiggle]

Well luckily the good thing about this thread is the 'signal to noise' ratio, a lot of really great sativa info comes through along with the original beef, which is why the thread's still here!

 

[sbeanonnamellow]

"from holland by an Australian ,"

pretty bonkers really isnt it hr ,
kinda like a movie and we are only really seeing the crew who brought it to the big screen ,
they are getting the credit when theres a whole set of folks behind the scenes who really got it all going in the first place,
kinda puts a bit of a different perspective to it ....

it takes a lot of people to get some things to fly,
we should remember that when we look at the end products ,
credit is due to a whole cast and crew , not just the guy who put it on the screen ...

Some people feel the rain, others just get wet.

I have been going through wringer emotionally the past few years and lately it has been hitting HARD. Someone shared a gratitude meditation link with me the other day and I feel a part of me that I really like breaking through again. Shining!

It's living with gratitude and your post is an example of that. Seeing the airplane flying not all by itself but with the help of everyone involved in it's process. Everyone from the mechanic to the pilot to the dude who painted the lines on the runway and the crew who installed the lights. The generations of farmers who have been steward for the plant before us. The spouse or partner who encourages our passions in life.

Teamwork makes the dreamwork.

Some of my favorite stuff has come from down under, some has come from holland, and some has come from the states. Humans are the constant, not some arbitrary line made up by men alive before we were even born. The earth is abundant with biodiversity and a range of climates in which cannabis will flourish and thrive. Much love

 

[RingtailCanyon]

Blow my head clean off! I know what your thinking Tom, was it 5 generations or was it 6?
I wish legit haze seed was a little easier to obtain. Shit man.
Tom please be a man of the people. Make some more good seeds and set up some paypal. Tomazon.
I’ve had to resort to making my own haze from parts and pieces. Punto rojo, Laos, Manipuri
I gots to know!?

 

[@hempy]

............. yet here we are once again, Sam vs. Nevil.

True but how did we get here cosmic i dont see hempy driving the Bus .

 

[CosmicGiggle]

True but how did we get here cosmic i dont see hempy driving the Bus .

It's hard to tell who/what is driving that bus HEMPY but if it were to turn around and retrace the route it would lead straight back to MNS Forum and beyond.

........ something about 'the Long and Winding Road', you know.

 

[star crash]

Well luckily the good thing about this thread is the 'signal to noise' ratio, a lot of really great sativa info comes through along with the Original Beef , which is why the thread's still here!

 

[sbeanonnamellow]

LOL a classic