TAG - Landing (Resource for True Aero Growing)

[Guest]

PR,
Interesting thread on feeding.

I use PBP F&F along with some AN supplements; carboLoad, B-52,BudBooster, and sensizyne; finishing with Budswell and Indonesian Bat guano.

I am always refining my system to better efficiency. Cost is my control factor. If it is expensive I can make it cheaper real cheap.

The way I saw it, replacing four timers with one timer was cost effective as the timers were due for replacement. Timing is everythng. smile.

Avid

 

[Guest]

Speaking of which...where is Ecotronics with the LOGO 411? He should be breakin' down the TAE controls with his nifty little kit. :smile:

 

[JustATry]

This is what I am ordering next. 8" Cool Tubes! Pics courtesy of Lothar.

 

[guineapig]

i have tried to get in touch with Ecotronics and failed.....the company that is....i love their products and their philosophy but they are hard to contact.....oh well....-gp

oh yeah....podracer....when can I buy your book? Just send it to me wihen i buy the pod.....i don't know which i love more- your glorious sarcasm or your laser-like intelligence....most people fear a great mind....look at Socrates....here's to hemlock....glug glug

gp after seeing podracer's posts-> :jawdrop:

 

[Ecotronics]

i have tried to get in touch with Ecotronics and failed.....the company that is....i love their products and their philosophy but they are hard to contact.....oh well....-gp

Sorry but how this comes? contact me over email or pm I would like how you did try to contact me, there is normaly no trouble at all.

Greets Ecotronics

@ Pod Racer
don't ask me about the logo, I rather would like to ask you how far you are about. Where are the pics of your running logo installation?
And by the way you're asking where i am, I'm there: Rice-corn-grow

 

[Guest]

Running wet test... My Econo-aTAGpod Alpha!



I'll be in TAE tonight!




My pump configuration...pretty simple, no? lol



My clone stock for next month...TW and some others...

My NLxHaze Clones and Cinn,Bubble seedlings...



I wanted to show everyone here, see the node development on this Cinnamon Seedling (about 4 weeks old). You know were the lights are placed by my previous posts..about 2 feet away and one on the side. 6500K 40 watt floros...Full spectrum daylight bulbs. $6 Can't beat it!



No stretching...nice development...nice and squat. Perfect! :smile:
The poor hacked up moms aren't really complaining much.



Butt here, I wish someone would exert some brilliance. The cool tube doesn't need to be glass. It isn't protecting anything, only channeling air...why can't we use a polycarbonant plastic sheet that is like a zillionth thin and heat resistant? You could make a much larger hooded/reflective area and possible have less UV interruption.

Just a thought...I wish someone would work that one out.

Ecotronics, baby... Lookin' sweet always :smile:

The odd thing is I don't need any controls at this point. The room is perfectly cooled and the pod is totally lightproof with lots of indirect ventilation. Its a good thing. When I get to the 1K MH I'll be thinking 'control'. lol

 

[Guest]

Hehehheheeee..eheheheehheeehhahhaahHAhahahahAHHAHHAHA!!!!

WE HAVE IGNITION!

Idling and prepared for take off.



I'm running Botanicare currently with 250 ppms of CAL/MAG plus, Power Plant to 650 ppms, a dash of TAR (ThriveAliveRed) and HG (HydroGuard). PH is 6.0 :smile:

I'll be running floros for a week at this level before switching to 1K MH on next Friday. They have a week to aclimate and start to veg up, then I'll be hitting them hard to grow for the first month packing lots of N.

 

[Guest]

Now all this talk about floros made me realize I had a really great solution to a very simple problem...presto...instant full spec. for life. The entire under canopy can be lit with at least 5,500 lumen. :wink:



Meanwhile... I've also found a neat little trick I might share. I'm such the inventor...I'm sorry (someone probably has already done this years ago...but hey..its new to me).



Anyhow..I aimed my blower at about 45 degrees to create a nice little cyclone of air around the room coming down on the TAG-Pod. My top was a little short so I developed use of an 'air channel' where the air can now move either up out of the pod to cool or through it to cool depending on the air movement in the room. The front has a 'skirt' so air can easily enter the root chamber while the entire chamber is kept dark. That's the reason for the blind as well...



Anyhow...nicely.. check this out... The room temps are 74.8 and my root zone is 66F BABY!!! Awesome!

 

[Purpleseed]

When there is no plants in there it looks like styrofoam pilled up in a corner!
You could get away whit it!
650 ppm when they are that small!!..I could never do that!Magic of organic!
Nice work everybody!
Ecotronic : your stuff rocks! :
And hello to all new comers!

 

[Guest]

Update: Still holding at 66F on the Root temps with 4 sets of twins...loving it!

Yeah..they look small, but they all have nice roots and I'm not flowering yet...just vegging now...You'll see now..watch what happens in 7 days...you'll shit yourself.

Yeah..I start a little high...like I said, I'm organic and in TAE so they will start to bolt in a couple days once they get their comfy seat and doritos lined up.

With RT at 66 (if it doesn't go above 70 in Flower) they will just load that table up with bud. Most of the clones are NLxHaze..which gets huge and mostly Sat dominant on the deep end. In the shallows I have the little indies and seedlings that are unsexed..I have 4 bubble..which I can already tell you 2 are male and 2 are female...I know them that well.

I'm going to end up pulling the 2 bubble males so I put them up front and close. The 2 Cinns are feminized so I gave them center seat in the deep end right under the lamp. They'll grow about 4 cm every 12 hours as the stems will thicken up. I know they don't look ready...but here is a FAG I did with Oasis seedlings that never got above 6" in vegging as I was right on with the spectrum.







And remember...this is FAG - not TAG...TAE is entirely different and more extreme...That is why all these guys get so addicted to growing this way. Its like microwave bud! POP! Its Ready!


JAT - that is why I want to see what these TW do...the Oasis is known to be a low producer like the WWidow..but I got fuckin' huge colas off my TAG.

Now I'm grinning...cause this pod will hold for the grow I feel and its going to run smoother...fingers crossed. So its all training for the gals now. High protein diet and low fat until they are strong and healthy.

 

[JustATry]

You fucker!! You can't be up and running before me.

Oh well, I should be running in the next couple of days. Most of my clones have 1/2" roots and the rest should be ready in a couple of days. It's getting exciting now.

PR - I am going to run TW this grow just to see. I am curious as well. I will have ICE, Trainwreck, and Blueberry x White Rhino, and White Widow running this time. What a mess.

 

[Guest]

Well just some advice, plant the ICE and TW together and the Rhino and Widow together as the first two will be surly over taken by the later two.

I like to veg in my pod first, it sets up a sort of 'layer' of growth from the vegging before going into full flower—again, it is Environmentals that appear to have the most impact in growing so I like the root environment to have tasted the summer season before the fall of flower. Besides..it kicks the ass out of aero cloners...believe it or not...lol


This was a picture I love to post, it is where I cut the top off of a Widow and 2 weeks later took a picture of the same sight and removed all the color from the original so you could see just the TAGrowth. Its nice eh? lol If you look at the bottom you can see where the top cut was made 14 days earlier.



It went on to become this...

 

[Guest]

Better catch up buddy...lol

 

[guineapig]

hey pod....do some strains do better in tag-environments than other strains?.....have you experimented with the land-based strains that are notoriously difficult to tame (vietnamese, Zamal e.g.) or have you limited your research to strains which were designed for the indoor situation such as widows, afghani hybrids, etc....?

"get a pod you sorry sod...." ;-)

 

[Guest]

I find that...well, no...all strains (indoor) that I know of have responded beyond what most have considered excellent. Unfortunately I started in DWC and quickly moved into FAG before diving into the TAG arena, so my personal experience has only been optimal for growing with the exceptions of learning the hard way about leaks, spider-mites, aphids, and light leak hermi issues.

I mean, my knowledge is definitely by the seat of my pants and the cuts on my hands and shins, as well as many many deep nasal cavity pressure washings...my personal favorite.

But my experience is that Sat. dominant strains (Bubble, Skunk #1, NL, Widow, that ilk) do spectacularly in TAG. The nicest is that they are usually finished early and even if you start out with twigs you end up with huge colas.

But like I said...my first experience growing Oasis (during a borg invasion) yielded horribly in DWC. I all but abandoned the strain as I got like 1/8th off two plants after two months (cause they are notoriously slow to veg up). But in my FAG tubs they blew up to 38" and that is the one you see with the giant towers...the stems were like celery stalks...it was freakin' weird.

However, for a strain that doesn't deliver it sunk the ship as the heaviest producer of 5 oz off 3 plants. 3oz off just one, the other two were fucked up as I experimented with sever fan leave removal.

The Skunk #1 as well, I ran them from seeds and some burnt up clones I had made (my first few attempts at mediumless cloning) that everyone kept telling me was third rate bud and not a big yielder. Well...let's just say people are still asking me if I will ever get that Skunk #1 again they loved it so much. :smile:

So, it is sort of hard to say really, except that TAE is by far IMHO the most 'ideal' you'll ever see (or they'll ever see) so any strain will be at its most prolific.

Everyone raved about my shots that I would post as being the most spectacular Skunk #1 they'd ever seen. Which was very flattering.

But I had never grown soil, or attempted growing without as much knowledge as I could get from every source I could find. Most all those pages on OG are just diary pages of my grows, experiments and discoveries that I thought others would enjoy sharing and watching and talking about. Unfortunately it kept turning into a we hate you for not agreeing with us sort of nightmare...like you see here. lol

I just like to grow, that is it. I like to share and discuss, as you see...I'm not running around icmag posting all my fat buds calling people dick sucker or pussy or bitchin' about their attitude. I just do my work, post my results and let the proofs speak for themselves.

Every-once in awhile I get fed up with defending myself repeated from attacks however. Sorry ..all.

But getting back to the strains, I've never attempted outdoor strains or major indie strains other than the ones I have now...which like I've mentioned, in my first attempt at another vertical TAG, they turned out horribly. But that wasn't the fault of the TAE, it was my moving them from one rig to the other as I couldn't stop screwing around and my tubs were leaking all the time or clogging.

See, someone egged me into draining my tubs out..which I had no issue with, then all hell broke loose on my grows. Now I'm back to my original design parameters so I'm happier than a pig in shit as I know what those conditions will yield, now it is only a matter of ignoring them for a couple weeks while they freak out and settle in.

I prefer Sat Dominants as I like more creative euphoric highs and in TAG the plants yield huge colas. Indies might as well...which is why JAT and I were talking about the Trainwreck, its not a very big producer I can see that from first spin...but it might explode like the Widow and Oasis do in TAE so they might get giant and if so...excellent as it is a stellar buzz and they grow faster (you can root and return to flower in 2 weeks...finish in 7) and more robust than just about anything I've seen short of this crazy mutant Widow clone I had that was just insane with growth in aero. She would double every other clones' growth every day and root in 3 days solid. If you read my TAG threads on OG you'll hear it talked about as Clone 8 (god I miss her, I lost her and all my girls on Friday 13th)

The test will be to see I suppose. That's another point that cracks me up about haters as well, they've been doing and knowing all this shit for years but oddly know nothing and have nothing to show as to any of those questions.

...If you want I can supply you with about 1800 pictures and about 160 pages of every possible design, crackpot idea, theory, experiment or demonstration from only the last 2 years. Seems like if everyone was so in the know....where are all the pics and how-to threads? I did weeks of reading...all I found (outside of NASA and my buddies in the know) was bullshit about aerotubes and how 8" tubes are superior to 6" tubes and dipping black tarry root rot mops in H202 was the solution to every emergency. Everything was DO Dissolved Oxygen...remember those days? WTF does DO have to do with Aero? Not a fuckin' thing. That is my point.
I'm not trying to ask for a freakin' metal for my work, I'm just saying its all there...don't call me a liar, look it up. lol

*Nothing to do with you guineapig...I'm coming off another attack on OG where assholes have come into my TAG thread there to get some more attention as no one is paying attention to their dying grows and dying threads. I'm like /\ this close to deleting everything off OG just to see how big a hole it leaves in their aero section, but too many people have been far too considerate and courteous with me—obviously raised indoors. I stay for them and because I refuse to let haters win.

...boy can I ramble at 6 am. I just love pot...and science...and aeroponics...that's all. I think that shows, I think people that get it, get it and get me. It was all just supposed to be fun and games...why it gets ugly all the time I do not understand. There is enough pain and suffering in the world, if I really needed my dick sucked I'd call my buddy up that would be here in a heartbeat—I'm cocky cause I can be, I do it on purpose...I want someone to challenge me, but not insult me. I want to learn something new something exciting...its my turn.

Like my buddy Ecotronics here...can barely understand his english..lol (no offense buddy) but he has hipped me to this entirely new idea of using PLCs for running an extremely smooth TAE...something I could learn...and respect his advice I do and props to him for sharing with me. Was that so hard?

My point is: If Ecotronic claimed to be the inventor and sole manufacturer of THE LOGO device itself, what the fuck do I care? As long as he can show me how to run it and explain to me how it works...I don't give a shit. lol He could be Princess Diana for all I care as long as his math's good. I'm not looking to marry the guy. lol

And...He did, didn't he? He posted a long ass tutorial on his 'contribution' to my thread, even apologizing for going off topic about it. I would kill for friends like that on my threads...kill. lol Who's opinion do I respect? His. Not some flamin' turd.

End Rant..for now.. FYI - there seems to be an excessive depressive biorhythm or something happening currently as this pervasive shit is effecting everyone I know currently. Anyone suffering sever depression in the past couple of days? I need to see if there is a solar flare or something going on....lol

 

[Guest]

You know I was only joking about that....lol



SPACE WEATHER ADVISORY BULLETIN #05- 9
2005 September 09 at 7:32 a.m. MDT (2005 September 09 1332 UTC)

**** ACTIVE SUNSPOT GROUP CONTINUES TO PRODUCE SIGNIFICANT FLARES ****


NOAA sunspot Region 808, which yielded a powerful X17 flare (R4 radio blackout) on 07 Sep, continues to produce significant activity. Over the past 24 hours, this region produced several more major flares to include three X-class flares, which resulted in R3 radio blackouts, and several M-class flares producing R1 and R2 radio blackouts. An S2 radiation storm began soon after the X17 flare on 07 Sep and remains in progress. Active Region 808 is currently located near the southeast limb of the visible solar surface. This region is a large and very complex sunspot cluster, which is still rotating into view. Early indications are that it is almost nine times the size of Earth. Over the next several days this region will rotate towards center disk where solar activity is much more likely to impact Earth. A powerful and very fast coronal mass ejection (CME) accompanied the X17 flare on 07 Sep. The magnetic cloud associated with this CME will not directly impact Earth; however, a lesser impact is expected today which will likely result in G1 through G3 geomagnetic storm conditions. Expect continued significant solar flares from this region as it makes its passage across the visible disk over the next 11 days. Radiation storms in the S3 or even S4 levels are possible. Significant geomagnetic storms are likely, beginning early next week as this region moves towards the center of the visible side of the Sun. Communications groups are already experiencing problems due to this activity. Other agencies impacted by space weather are at increasing risk for disruption. These include spacecraft operations and other space activities, electric power systems, HF communications, and navigation systems such GPS.

 

[guineapig]

solar flares increase THC production...

solar flares increase THC production...

saw the solar flares yesterday as well and thought that was why people are running around like chickens with their heads cut off well you know people around here are like "my cola's bigger than your cola" kind of attitude ya know competition is healthy only up to a certain point and then it becomes UNBEARABLE because everyone even the master-growers are here to learn and spread knowledge not show off and when people get together and imply that you don't know shit or display an attitude of arrogance of course you are going to get even more frustrated and i wouldn't blame you for saying "see ya" to all the haters and get off the web except for the fact that the WORLD NEEDS YOU and your incredible threads more than you will ever know

again let me emphasize that people tend to fear what they don't understand and are absolutely terrified when confronted with a person who seems to understand it all.....i just made that up but it sounds like a great bumper sticker....i would guess that 99.9% of all growers on this site have never even imagined that root structures like the ones you seem to create with the greatest of ease could be created on this planet.....of course what they don't realize is that you have given them the instruction book- all they have to do is read these posts.....

ok..... .....rant is over.....keep posting.....-kind regards, guineapig

 

[madcat]

Many Thanks For you effortsand info

Many Thanks For you effortsand info

I appreciate all the information and your willingness to share.

I have been very interested in aero, mostly because I dont like dealing with media. I have been working in NFT because I have heard horor stories about nozzle clogging. Circumstances require I let things run on auto for a couple of days at a time. I had a big heat issue during the summer months that has since been resolved

My initial questions are:

Do you have a clogginging problem due to Ca deposits, maybe the 30 on 180 off solves and pure RO water solves the problem? That is why I was wondering if you had tried or were using magnetic water treatment that supposidly will prevent scaling / Ca build up. How often do you need to change your prefilters and what size are they?

The other question now is regards root chamber volume and height and nozzle count in relationship to volume.

How long do the 12 - 14 week Sativas go cut to finish?

Have you seen the new fast light rotators, I didnt ask but it looked like they were running around 30 rpm? Very very cool, 2ea 400s cover a 6' diamater circle, 4ea 400s cover a 8.5' diamater suposidly no loss. From what have seen here and heard about the rotators TAG + these could break all GPW records.

P.S. I think we all need to consider adding total watts - total time veg + flower in our GPW claims and revise the standard to G/KWH.

Thanks again

 

[whereisbrianV.]

TT-TAVG (delayed progress)

The TT-TAVG has hit a few bumps in the road and my multitasking has fallen up short. I now have a full Biodiesel production design I am working the kinks out of and my outside cover for my grow room (which is coming out lovely) is working as planed. Parts have finally arrived from all over the country so I have no excesses to not get this thing in full production. A few things will be changed to allow for more space in the room and help with the noise of the pumps and fans. I will try to fit as much as possible under the return sloops and cover the space with sound insulation. Here are all the goodies I have so far.

The large white box is my repeat cycle timer for the valve (6sec ON<). The black boxes are the 24hr timer and cooling term. and a repeat cycle timer for CO2 (for the future, 3sec ON</7min OFF<). I have four-400w MH/MV ballast and one 400w HPS. Only two of the ballast will be used with the other two as back-ups. Two bathroom fans will suck air out of the top of the chamber and return it to the bottom @200cfms and the inline fan will suck air out of the cooling vent for the lights and blow it out of the chamber into a carbon scrubber back into the chamber. So far I have a fully custom grow but I am not satisfied with not using a PLC to get precise control so I will leave myself room to retrofit one into the design. For now I have a lot of wiring and a power box to make all in-between all the other shit I am doing so I will post back in about a week.

Long live the DOA!

 

[Guest]

Thanks you all, that is exactly what I needed to hear.

Its funny how one's mind, when open, can pick up connections that seem more synergistic in nature than obvious. The solar flare idea just entered my mind as it is known to scramble and 'upset' communications networks all over the world. Considering everything that isn't a chemical reaction that happens in your body, especially in the brain, is all electrical. Our brains run on electrical sparks leaping from synapse to synapse, it would make sense if EMF wouldn't 'blackout' communication throughout that network as well.

Maybe being in FL I'm out of the way of all the jackassery bands of solar radiation.

Anyhow, again...thank you all for the supportive words and ...well, just appreciation, guess that is all I wanted to hear...someone appreciates all the fuckin' work I've done. Like I said...those that 'get it' get me. :smile: And the people that do appear to be not only freakin' brilliant, but also exceptionally more intelligent which is what makes contributing fun for me. I love to turn people on and watch them get all excited over learning and experimenting...science is fun! Lame I know...but hey, I'm a tech-hed Martian...what do you want?

Now...back to business.

Guinea - you'll find that using RO is superior on all accounts for any aeroponic application..or hell...DWC for that matter. The RO removes all the Lime and Scale you are referring. The Ca isn't as much an issue as the plants can use that, its the hard minerals that end up adhering to everything and causing a mess.

Clogs are a part of TAG unfortunately that can only be avoided by excessive filtering and/or more expensive nozzles. See, BioControl and a few others have those nozzles that are like $3-1.80 a piece..but they are designed not to clog and for heavy production whereas the XL foggers I'm using currently are for 'cooling' and not TAG specific, but work just as well if you keep them clean and filter your nutes. They also come apart so you can clean them out, which I just did by soaking the pieces in soapy water for about a week while I built the new EconoPod. They all look brand new now.

When I first began DWC I used my Tap water at like 380 ppms....FL is built on a Limestone bed, that is all we are...a giant coral bed, so all our water is highly mineralized...but only about 20% is actually Ca. I used to get massive lime build up on my res and well everything. Now..using RO, I see no residue whatsoever. Its a great thing and a must IMHO.

However they make 'Hardwater' versions of most advanced hydro-nutes, like Ionic (of course...lol).

That is why we all use Cal/Mag Plus as the base for our nutrient solutions, it replaces the 'base' waterline you'd find in nature...run off of rain water with high levels of Ca, Iron and some Mg as well. I mix it up to about 250 or 300 ppms then just add my nutes and they are always spot on Ph 6 or 5.8 depending on the line of products. It only takes about 4 drops of Ph down to drop it as well, rather than 1 oz. with hardwater.

Ionizing hardwater has little effect except to cause the minerals to adhere (electromagnetically) to the surface of anything they are sprayed onto, which is why you get that lime build up and scale.

That really is my only claim to fame here IMO. I just think of the systems as they occur on a macro scale in nature. The entire water system on Earth is designed to cleanse itself regularly by filtering the hard ground water through aquatic plants and rivers and streams to leech out all those impurities, leaving the water clean and 'alive' with ionic potential as it aerates and bumbles down the road supplying life. I just try to encompass as much of those complete systems into my designs and see if I can't 'approximate' or 'simulate' a more ideal synthetic environment for my plants, which is what led to all the exploration into AM bacteria development, gas exchange at root level and all environmental factors contributing to optimal growing.

I didn't approach growing weed as a money making venture or a desire to just get some drugs to get fucked up on, cannabis has had a much more spiritual and profound effect on my life and my consciousness and my desire to grow and perfect my growing style is based on my appreciation and amazement of how incredible these systems and these plants in particular are. I understand the mystery and fear surrounding the 'Tree of Knowledge' which is probably why its such a unique and amazing plant species. My goal was simple. I wanted to find if I could achieve the ultimate rooting and growing environment for my plants. The fact that what I stumbled upon generates huge massive results is only secondary to my true interest in challenging myself to see how far I can maximize the growing potential of plants, which to date has blown my freakin' socks off. :jawdrop: