STOP USING JAMAICAN BAT GUANO

[guest2012y]

WOW....Is Headband Mad L. after a ten strip?....some similarities there.
No wonder guys like MM don't bother posting anymore...I suggest a bunch of folks search his threads and read what he's been saying in his 900 posts.
I can't believe the stupid shit I'm hearing here in this forum lately....wow,all hail ignorance.

 

[DARC MIND]

capt.c1
word!
toohi
no disrespect but i dont no what u agree to disagree on, maybe it was
good advice is better achieved through education and understanding then with blanket recommendations; but i have been aware plants can be grown with out poop and never claimed they cant.

for those considering manure for composting or growing
http://newfarm.rodaleinstitute.org/features/2006/0606/toxicpoop/frymanross.shtml
this article may help choosing ur sources &
heres also another good read on health concerns with hazardous materials in commercial fertilizers
http://njaes.rutgers.edu/pubs/soilprofile/sp-v16.pdf

Generally, the most serious cause of heavy metal
contamination results when industrial byproducts
are recycled into fertilizers.

in the article ull see some info on rock phosphate & cadmium but thats common with acid treated phosphates, super rock phosphate and or hard rock P.
HTH

 

[guest2012y]

Even Mad L. was intelligent.....go back and read through his thousands of rants and postings...then after that read through his former self Maryjane's posts.
Hell..why not read through Clackamass Coot's posts if you even want to read through anything about anything.

 

[toohighmf]

Verdant: to make organics work, wouldn't organic chemistry be essential? As I said before no one is going to like my take on organics. It is a fact that none of us are totally correct, and we will all have our opinions. of course microbeman is going to disagree. he Hollowed out R2D2 and turned him into a tea brewer! Clackamas Coot has a pretty good grasp on organics, organic chemistry and understands the table of elements. funny, that my sig is "wrong". you are the only one to point this out. Could you possibly be a little biased towards organics? could all of you be?

This was about Jamaican bat guano. not my opinion of why I think organics are dangerous in herb. I did mention that that the particulates in in bat guano has caused many illnesses amongst its users and farmers. if you want to breathe shit dust and die, be my guest! can't say I didn't warn ya. I will leave this thread now and go back to my hydro world where life is clean, smells better, and no shit to deal with. can't beat an army of Organics advocates! good growing to you all! I promise to not let the door hit me in the ass on the way out.

 

[NUG-JUG]

Verdant: to make organics work, wouldn't organic chemistry be essential? As I said before no one is going to like my take on organics. It is a fact that none of us are totally correct, and we will all have our opinions.

This is the age we all now live in. An Orwellian time where opinions masquerade as facts.

 

[guest2012y]

Again I say that it's time to take the term "Organic" into this century.
The whole definition needs to be refined and then it would stop all of this BS banter back and forth between people.
I've used bat shit for 15 years,and always wear a mask...Help me Jeeezuz,I'm dying.... I've since stopped using the Phos.guano. in preference to fish bone meal.
I'd run my fruit up against any Hydro-chem nugs any day in a blind taste test where at least 20 people puff it,and I'd lay a healthy ass wager down that most would prefer the product over chem.
In fact,over the years I've done taste tests using regular people as test subjects. If organic gardening really sucked that bad,why would after 20+ years of gardening and personally witnessing at least a hundred gardens and grow styles would I still be doing it....not even the old folks are dying due to any complications with weed either chemi or organic. It's just a matter of personal choice and what you and your peeps would rather be puffing....as well as minimizing consumerisim and ecological wastefulness that comes from refinement,packaging,shipping,etc.

 

[VerdantGreen]

Verdant: to make organics work, wouldn't organic chemistry be essential? As I said before no one is going to like my take on organics. It is a fact that none of us are totally correct, and we will all have our opinions. of course microbeman is going to disagree. he Hollowed out R2D2 and turned him into a tea brewer! Clackamas Coot has a pretty good grasp on organics, organic chemistry and understands the table of elements. funny, that my sig is "wrong". you are the only one to point this out. Could you possibly be a little biased towards organics? could all of you be?

hi again toohigh, yes i am biased towards organics, just as you are biased against it. but what i post are facts and not opinions (unless i state its an opinion (imo )), there is a difference. as i told you before, your take on organics is a confusion between the two very distinct subjects of organic chemistry and organic gardening. (the reason why it was called organic chemistry is because many years ago scientists believed that these compounds could only be made by living organisms but they have since realised that they were wrong)

and the siggy thing, what can i say other than what i have already said. organic compounds are the building blocks of life so to say that plants can thrive without them is just plain wrong. minerals have to be solid and usually crystalline so not many elements (including those you have listed) can be referred to as minerals. the only elements that are minerals afaik (i majored in geology) are copper, graphite, diamond, sulphur, silver and gold. and saying that they are not organic (in the chemical sense) when you are making a point about organic horticulture is misleading. organic gardening is about how the elements are delivered to the plant's roots - not the elements themselves.
to presume it must be right just because i am the only person to point out is wrong is a bit odd - has anyone gone out of their way to tell you it's correct?

VG

 

[NUG-JUG]

Again I say that it's time to take the term "Organic" into this century.
The whole definition needs to be refined and then it would stop all of this BS banter back and forth between people.

I agree, but it's hard. People view organic as just another consumer choice. It needs to be made into something more. What are the costs of growing with chems..not the cost to your wallet..the real costs. Like you said, packaging, transport, etc. This also applies to canned organic methods like faux farm. Yea hydro is easy, clean, and productive...on the surface. In the end it's just ornamental. Like plastic food or something. Sorry this is sort of off topic.

 

[SecretGardener]

This is the age we all now live in. An Orwellian time where opinions masquerade as facts.

like macro evolution

 

[toohighmf]

hi again toohigh, yes i am biased towards organics, just as you are biased against it. but what i post are facts and not opinions (unless i state its an opinion (imo )), there is a difference. as i told you before, your take on organics is a confusion between the two very distinct subjects of organic chemistry and organic gardening. (the reason why it was called organic chemistry is because many years ago scientists believed that these compounds could only be made by living organisms but they have since realised that they were wrong)

and the siggy thing, what can i say other than what i have already said. organic compounds are the building blocks of life so to say that plants can thrive without them is just plain wrong. minerals have to be solid and usually crystalline so not many elements (including those you have listed) can be referred to as minerals. the only elements that are minerals afaik (i majored in geology) are copper, graphite, diamond, sulphur, silver and gold. and saying that they are not organic (in the chemical sense) when you are making a point about organic horticulture is misleading. organic gardening is about how the elements are delivered to the plant's roots - not the elements themselves.
to presume it must be right just because i am the only person to point out is wrong is a bit odd - has anyone gone out of their way to tell you it's correct?

VG

I know I said wasn't going to respond to this thread, but because you are so knowledgeable about organics and I respect you, I'm just going to say one thing. The info I posted was pulled from wiki when I googled something to the effect of "health risks of organic fertilizers". this is not my opinion. it's wiki's opinion, which (no offense to you) is a bit more factual than a bunch of pot growers "opinions" or hypothesized "facts".

I will not get into my sig.. though you are correct, no one has agreed! again, organic science and organic growing go hand in hand. it is why I brought them up. some people argue for the sake of arguing. I know you are not that guy, and either am I.

Can we please get back on topic. the proverbial beating I am taking for being a salt fert dude is not contributing to this thread at all. This thread was about the ecological damage guano mining is doing to Jamaica. 1 person before myself mentions the health risks involved with guanos and all the organophiles wen't "apeshit" pun intended. not trying to stir the pot, I'm trying to smoke it!

If I handed you a nug of organic grown pot, and I handed you a nug of the same strain grown w hydro salt ferts, I seriously doubt any of you could distinguish the difference. It's not all ferts. grow-how has a lot to do with it.

On that note. I would appreciate it if I was left out of the conversation, before this thread becomes another hydro vs organics thread.

 

[mriko]

Any news on the "Sea-Bird" guano? Is there ecological devastation associated with the Sea Bird?

Yes there is. Last year i watched on TV some doc about some formerly French island (if i remember correctly), which name i can't remember, which had been heavily dug out for guano. About 90% of the island surface had been excavated, in some places til the very rock or coral base.

I haven't read the whole thread yet, so maybe someone already mentionned it, but there's another high threat on environment we growers are partly responsible for. The disappearing of peat bogs, swamps and all life linked to these ecosystems.
This is for those who grow in soil mainly, when buying some growing soil, choose one which doesn't contain peat ! blond, brown, black or whatever avoid using these. There are growing soils which don't contain any peat and it works just fine (I'm using some for this season's grow).

Swamps & peat bogs are the natural cleaning & purifying stations for waters from the rivers, before they reach the sea and are the living place of many a species. Plus they hold huge amounts of methane which is even nastier than carbon dioxide, in terms of climate influence. These places are disappearing in many many places at an alarming rate and a lot of it is due to the horticulture-agriculture industry & hobby.

Again, growing soild without peat can be found, alas they are far less common than the other ones, but with a bit of search, it can be found.

Growers of the World, Say NO to Peat !

Irie !

 

[Microbeman]

I think in Canada there have been considerable steps taken to reduce the impact of peat harvesting. One good recommendation is to keep using it (keep your soil alive)

http://www.peatmoss.com/hortprog1.php
http://www.nativeorchid.org/dorisBogs.htm

Note that when too hi was confronted with producing some legit citations, he/she retreated. Sure I'm biased for natural growing but only because it is better, cheaper and safer environmentally. I've grown using chemical hydroponics but really did not like it. BTW, I'm not a supporter of guano. I wish everyone just used (vermi)compost.

 

[statusquo]

I definitely agree with Verdant toohighmf. Organic in the chemistry sense (i.e. Carbon) is a different definition than the organic we use. You are arguing semantics. Also your statement in your signature is most certainly, incorrect. Carbon is the backbone of living things, i.e. organic things, and there is no way an organism of any kind could live without it.

For the record I do try and grow organically but am not a zealot about it and do use some non organic methods, especially in veg.

 

[toohighmf]

and I use vermi tea in bloom. you can agree with verdant. he's a smart guy. technically you are arguing with wiki, not me. I just stated what I read.. of course Carbon is the building blocks of EVERYTHING. I get it. thank you though! Are we gonna get back on topic or are we just gonna talk "shit"?

 

[Japanfreakier]

I thought shit was the topic

 

[toohighmf]

pun intended again! lol. can't spread anymore +k to you, godzilla

 

[NUG-JUG]

and I use vermi tea in bloom. you can agree with verdant. he's a smart guy. technically you are arguing with wiki, not me. I just stated what I read.. of course Carbon is the building blocks of EVERYTHING. I get it. thank you though! Are we gonna get back on topic or are we just gonna talk "shit"?

Why do you just use a vermi-compost tea in bloom?

Correcting someone isn't talking shit. I don't think anyone here is attacking you just constructive criticism if you will. Thanks for being cool about it though.

I think anyone who reads this thread and continues to use guano either didn't really read it, or doesn't care. I've used guano, and I still have a bag of Indonesian. I'm going to use it up, then cut the shit.

 

[toohighmf]

because it eats up built up salts in my wool and I don't have to flush until the end... it's a nice root tonic as well. who was corrected? Who is right? who is wrong? no one will ever know, because everyones answers are completely subjective. why be pissed about it? just a conversation. does this thread need closing or do we want to argue about bat shit?
y'all have a swell evening!

 

[statusquo]

Nobody is attacking you as a person. We are attacking your statements/arguments. Also, we are not discussing opinions; verdant and I are relaying facts. Therefore the material is not subjective but as previous posters have mentioned, thank you for keeping things civil.

In regards to guano, this is referring to specifically Jamaican bat guano. I seem to remember reading similar problems in regards to other types of guano. Does anyone have any sources to convince me to stop using guano altogether?

P.S. If you really got what we were trying to say, I feel like you wouldn't be maintaining your current position. Also, no the thread does not need closing....

 

[headband 707]

Nobody is attacking you as a person. We are attacking your statements/arguments. Also, we are not discussing opinions; verdant and I are relaying facts. Therefore the material is not subjective but as previous posters have mentioned, thank you for keeping things civil.

In regards to guano, this is referring to specifically Jamaican bat guano. I seem to remember reading similar problems in regards to other types of guano. Does anyone have any sources to convince me to stop using guano altogether?

P.S. If you really got what we were trying to say, I feel like you wouldn't be maintaining your current position. Also, no the thread does not need closing....

Okay bro that would be ALL bat shit lol bats don't care where they come from their shit is toxic everywhere no matter what country you get it from!!! peace out Headband707

Look more importantly you don't need bat shit to grow your weed so what is the big******* deal here ffs?? get over it LOL LOL
thats me end of this bat shit LOL LOL and oh yeah LOL LOL