question for sam the skunkman on the original haze

[Nexus7]

Maybe I'm not the only one to believe in the presence of the Thai (but for me ot-haze also has Thai, maybe he is only Thai-Colombian without an Indian? I don't know, I never raised him properly to know it)
Just my point of view.....

For sure. OTH has Colombian Gold as it's parent - a thai/colombian cross. Ace seeds website mentioned OTH was a Colombian-Thai dominant haze, lacking Mexican and Indian influence, before the phylos DNA testing was completed.

I guess one of the Haze Bros. crossed the above Colombian Gold aka OTH with a Colombian Punto Rojo to make O-Haze.

So Sam what's the oldest O-Haze plant or seed you have available for testing? Or have you just an IBL many generations removed from the original source?

Would be nice to see where O-Haze, Haze 19, THH and Haze A&C fit on the phylos family tree to ...

Peace,

N7

 

[mexcurandero420]

and than this frankincense talk... oh dear... what's so special about the high? Nothing... it's only the smell to impress other people

High MM

The aroma is unique, but the Purple Haze from the early 90s with the nag champa aroma would let you feel if you were chased by ghosts.Like with food, everybody has his/here own taste of the high and aroma.

 

[leet]

MNS Nev's Haze piney/catpiss/lemon/spicey/frankincense from 97 seed, my old clone that I had to let go.. Mistakes are forever The high is very psychedelic, similar to mushrooms or LSD. It will fill a room with frankincense/catpiss/pine resin/oriental candy shop smell and it will leave you unable to understand people.


This is unlike most NH cuts found in Amsterdam and most definitely very different to the almost narcotic A5 but also C5 clones. It's very electric... almost shaky electric.. extremely tachycardic and definitely not clear.. but HAZE, it will leave you in a state of paranoia lost trying to figure your way to soberness

 

[MadMac]

MNS Nev's Haze piney/catpiss/lemon/spicey/frankincense from 97 seed, my old clone that I had to let go.. Mistakes are forever The high is very psychedelic, similar to mushrooms or LSD. It will fill a room with frankincense/catpiss/pine resin/oriental candy shop smell and it will leave you unable to understand people.


This is unlike most NH cuts found in Amsterdam and most definitely very different to the almost narcotic A5 but also C5 clones. It's very electric... almost shaky electric.. extremely tachycardic and definitely not clear.. but HAZE, it will leave you in a state of paranoia lost trying to figure your way to soberness





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a great phenotype for sure...
today's Nevilles Haze looks most different ;-)
and yes you miss them always later...
thx for sharing
M

 

[MadMac]

High MM

The aroma is unique, but the Purple Haze from the early 90s with the nag champa aroma would let you feel if you were chased by ghosts.Like with food, everybody has his/here own taste of the high and aroma.

got it... ;-)
if i find it i'll pass a cut to you personally ...
then we will have a big smoke with something to compare like THH
and a pleasant day @ the sea ;-)
i will do that you know it...
so fingers crossed for frankincense pheno...
M.

 

[bigherb]

Hey bigherb,

Whats up bro ? Well I have smoked Original Haze and yes there is frankincense in there too. I know they are similar, they smoke pretty much the same, but I still do believe that NH is more potent than the OH and the frankincense is more prelevant in the NH than the OH.

As far as the Haze story, I have no idea mate. We only know Sams story and Nevils story which are not really contradicting. It is only contradicting that Nevil said they were from a seedbag labeled 69' but Sam never disputed the fact that this wasnt true. Sam doesnt remember exactly what seeds these were and we have no reason to dispute that the seed Nevil got wasnt labeled as such. Also Sam doesn't remember if he gave him a female or a male clone, Nevil says he might have had a female clone and if it was, it was crap. That's what these people say.

I believe Sam had lots of haze seeds he had collected and labeled with years. He sold seeds that were labeled 67-68-69-70+ in the 80's so lets say at least 11 years and if it was 85' ( I remember he said 80s dont remember if he mentioned the exact years ) we are talking about 15 years old seed , maybe even more. Which sounds spot on for the seed germination Nevil had ( 7 out of 1000 ). He might have thought that these were the oldest seeds he had and he would probably wouldnt germinate them or he thought the later seeds were better so he sold the old seed, or he needed money when he moved to holland, who knows mate. Don't forget Sam wasn't there from the beginning of the haze thing, the guys were growing and collecting seed for many years before Sam met them and then he had access and also contributed to these seeds... thats the story. It doens't necessarily mean that Sam was there in 69... Nevil is claiming that Sam probably didnt even smoke the 69 Haze and he only knows the haze from 74 and later.

Now I don't know the story behind the Original Haze brothers, I only know what Sam said and Nev said and for me their stories match perfectly and dont contradict themselves.

Either way, I am not here for the stories but for the good buds and yes I believe the Seedsman Original Haze I smoked is similar yet different to the Nevilles Haze, I find the Original haze clearer and less potent than the Nevilles Haze and I find more frankincense in the Nevs Haze. Maybe there is a better plant in the Original Haze but so far I havent tried it/found it. I do find the Original Haze I smoked very special though and I wouldnt mind AT all to have it in my garden. Just sharing my experience...


For all I know Nev and Sam could be the same person or the DEA or pals to expertly market their strains. Stories are good for people that dont have anything better to do but they are just that, stories.


Peace
l33t


PS Who is this Holland source you speak of ? It doesn't matter what someone believes, you either know or you don't know and just speculate..

Leet

Sup Unc I miss these convos

I don’t recall you sharing your Original Haze experiences. What source / seeds stock was the OHaze from ?

There might be some post you missed in recent years , Sams has shed abit more light in his lastest Haze post ( years ago lol )

66-67-68 Have no significance to Haze , it was thousands of seeds not a thousand. Yes it’s possible there were some 69 seeds but I don’t think likely , IMO Sams used seeds from 69 that he got from R.L he crossed in 76 then gave these seeds to Nevil . Also I believe burning bush may have relations to Nevil seeds as those were his words

A story is just that . I’m interested in the truth which I believe I was told long ago hence my True origins article

I thought you were familiar with my article ( it’s posted in this thread or you can google it) there were no guys collecting seeds . G had Punto Rojo and that is what birthed Original Haze Nothing else

Soo either Sams labeled those seeds by a selection number or Nevil lied

Sams didn’t smoke Haze till 71 and didn’t grow it till sometime later . R.L was not around for the first year or soo and G the originator says he never gave Sams seeds . It would seem unlikely Sams had a bunch of 69 Haze seeds . I believe he collected seed threwout the years and might have gotten seeds from R.L before he disappeared

I’m from Brooklyn we don’t say names which is why I said source. If you were there you know if not you can form an opinion with all the info on the net or take Sams word who is the closest source .

1luvbigherb

 

[bigherb]

thx master haze
well i will show you the differences if there any between all the true haze... no hybrid fuckup...
thx for always great and easy explanation...

how often did you repeat the story?
and still some rushing in this thread and repeat the bullshit... haha
so funny sometimes... and everybody knows the true story lol
i know some dutch friends who hold the org. haze A & C lady's...
since the 90' when New selected the haze from cuttings he got from Sam! they gonna kept intact in holland...

i'll don't want to go into detail... but you'r the only one who tried to find the truth... all other just blah blah blah... non of them read what is written and proofed long time...

and than this frankincense talk... oh dear... what's so special about the high? Nothing... it's only the smell to impress other people...

to me only the high count...whatever smell she has... doesn't matter... the high is what makes a strain...

btw. i was in the netherland in the 90'... i never did like the Nevilles Haze... it's too dark... and the comedown is indica like... not my stuff
i've tried last year a Neville again... great plant great bud's but not my high... Tom Hill Haze is much much better... also better than the most o-haze .... and o-haze is long gone... TFD O-Haze is a hybrid...
Tom did until now the best selection to me... the high from some is absolute outstanding... long lasting... some are really psychedelic ...
and it's not a hybrid as some still want to say...

i'll ask myself all time if some of these bigmouth have ever grow a haze till end... these knowitall sucks often and make real discussions impossible ... if you ask show me a picture... then they leave the discussion or come back with bullshit ;-)
there are still just a few who finished a haze properly indoors...
i only listen to this people... because you have to finish a haze to talk about ...
thx
M.

Much Respect brother

Yes I’ve told the story often , several ways many times I’ve repeated the same things . Sams said my story is Correct with exception of some minor details , soo that should have Stamped things long ago

Once again I’m curious which Sams Haze you have ? Are you referring to Tom Hills Haze?

As for Frankincense, No it is not just the smell / taste . The High was very special. It made you reflect, it made you very conscious of yourself and everything around you . All of a sudden things were more clear , you see the truth in everything. It made me Smile , happy just because. I’ve described as above the clouds , But a rush of hit by a Mack truck . Frankies Is the Best Washington Heights Haze my Grail , the closest I’ve experienced is Neville’s Haze very similar taste / smell. But not the same power / effect

I have to F2 Nevs from 2011 , I also would like to explore more Tom Hill Haze F2 from Hazy lady but I think indoors is necessary in New York. I’d love to cross both , I also need to cross Nevilles Haze to thunk

1luvbigherb

 

[MadMac]

Much Respect brother

Yes I’ve told the story often , several ways many times I’ve repeated the same things . Sams said my story is Correct with exception of some minor details , soo that should have Stamped things long ago

Once again I’m curious which Sams Haze you have ? Are you referring to Tom Hills Haze?

As for Frankincense, No it is not just the smell / taste . The High was very special. It made you reflect, it made you very conscious of yourself and everything around you . All of a sudden things were more clear , you see the truth in everything. It made me Smile , happy just because. I’ve described as above the clouds , But a rush of hit by a Mack truck . Frankies Is the Best Washington Heights Haze my Grail , the closest I’ve experienced is Neville’s Haze very similar taste / smell. But not the same power / effect

I have to F2 Nevs from 2011 , I also would like to explore more Tom Hill Haze F2 from Hazy lady but I think indoors is necessary in New York. I’d love to cross both , I also need to cross Nevilles Haze to thunk

1luvbigherb

thank you hehe
well @ moment i'll have here the 25 THH ... to repro and selection to find the acid pheno... that fit's your description of the high from it ;-)
yesterday I've put some original seedsman o-haze in the ground and 10 o-haze from Sam's last batch repro in 2011... have 10 more... got also one old TFD o-haze girl that i hazed with the resin on stem THH male... outcome is also great... i'll wait now for pic's from friends outdoors in good condition... they just started... i used the male for all my best landrace cut's i've found over the years... outcome is amazing... all much better than the mother... it's all true what Sam and Tom etc said about the haze... i was not expecting to get my hands on these old o-haze gems... but two good souls provided and convinced me to make the best out of it... now i keep the 25 cut's of my repro THH and study them... let the o-haze grow... make maybe first a repro and study them too... maybe later bring the best together ... think i will spend the next years with the haze... will use the best boy's for my landrace crossings... still have so many in my fridge
the best o-haze i've had until today is the one from TFD... end 90'
but still you have to grow them twice or more to really do her justice indoors... bought 3 packs from TFD the last decade... all where hybrids... and not good @ all... showed TFD the pic's because i'm close to A'dam and often there ... got free packs as excuse...
so happy that i get fresh blood now and two lines to compare... seedsman did a good job in keeping the gem's ... it's a shame there gone...
you should soon sprout some THH from Hazylady... she had used a rar resin male... and you will see that THH is best for indoor!
and i hope you get the acid pheno... that brings you back in the 90'
many thx & keep it up!
M.

TFD O-Haze x Nevilles Haze... i used the best Nev male for the O-Haze girl...

TFD O-Haze x Tom Hill Haze.... same here ... the best THH boy from 8

 

[harvestreaper]

so is oldtimers haze related to sams haze stock ??forgive me if you already said an i missed it

 

[Thule]

It would seem something Oldtimer's related went to the makings of Original Haze. It was in California at the time so it's very plausible.

 

[Guest]

I much preferred the o haze over the nevs myself as in my opinion the high on the o haze is more clear and a longer lasting up than nevs.
The o hazes i tried from TFD gave such a happy high it was unreal.

For reference some TFD o haze seed from early 2000 very small dark and round seeds.
You may have to click the pic for a better image its a old pic.

 

[harvestreaper]

It would seem something Oldtimer's related went to the makings of Original Haze. It was in California at the time so it's very plausible.

interesting ,,,thanks for the reply

 

[harvestreaper]

I much preferred the o haze over the nevs myself as in my opinion the high on the o haze is more clear and a longer lasting up than nevs.
The o hazes i tried from TFD gave such a happy high it was unreal.

For reference some TFD o haze seed from early 2000 very small dark and round seeds.
You may have to click the pic for a better image its a old pic.

ive got some haze mist somewhere same pack as in your pic i might see if they pop after your reports of happy weed, my fav old haze cross from posi was super powerful feelgood weed left a big impression on me

 

[Guest]

ive got some haze mist somewhere same pack as in your pic i might see if they pop after your reports of happy weed, my fav old haze cross from posi was super powerful feelgood weed left a big impression on me

The haze mist is up there mate she makes for some fine smoke.

If i remember right The o haze packs changed at some point in the early 2000s as the original packs said a optimistic 8 to 10 weeks of flower and were later changed to 12+

 

[Guest]

yep i got some from Charly and Ace later... interesting expression also... but it flowers longer than o-haze... and you have to dig deep into to find a special one that fit's your needs... thought about crossing with her but ... too long flowering... and too much work afterwards to get a good result... o-haze is better ... seedsman was the last who sold o-haze... lot's of interesting phenotypes where found... like JohnnyChicago flat stem or Yaxu's seedsman o-haze outdoors and some other that have showed it here and there... to me the ot-haze is sometime before Sam worked with the haze... there is some relationship but it misses also maybe the thai and the south indian??? to me yes... that makes the difference... that brings me back to THH ... tom got a cut from Posi labeled haze#19 ... that was the one he picked from a bunch... he started with one cut... and selected toward the thai leaning side hence the leaf's ... i have some pure thais now running and you can really see some similarities... and finally Nevilles Haze is not a pure haze... it's a hybrid...OT-haze o-haze and tom hill haze are the only pure i know.

12 THH girls from cut... for testing
View Image

THH flower with seeds
View Image

View Image

View Image

one of the 13 males i used... it's a very potent dude
View Image

get hazed
M.

I agree mate the ot1 haze takes forever to finish and i think is not as nice as ohaze although some crosses we made with a ot1 male to afghani#1 and blue satalite mums produced some excellent plants.

 

[leet]

Leet

Sup Unc I miss these convos

I don’t recall you sharing your Original Haze experiences. What source / seeds stock was the OHaze from ?

There might be some post you missed in recent years , Sams has shed abit more light in his lastest Haze post ( years ago lol )

66-67-68 Have no significance to Haze , it was thousands of seeds not a thousand. Yes it’s possible there were some 69 seeds but I don’t think likely , IMO Sams used seeds from 69 that he got from R.L he crossed in 76 then gave these seeds to Nevil . Also I believe burning bush may have relations to Nevil seeds as those were his words

A story is just that . I’m interested in the truth which I believe I was told long ago hence my True origins article

I thought you were familiar with my article ( it’s posted in this thread or you can google it) there were no guys collecting seeds . G had Punto Rojo and that is what birthed Original Haze Nothing else

Soo either Sams labeled those seeds by a selection number or Nevil lied

Sams didn’t smoke Haze till 71 and didn’t grow it till sometime later . R.L was not around for the first year or soo and G the originator says he never gave Sams seeds . It would seem unlikely Sams had a bunch of 69 Haze seeds . I believe he collected seed threwout the years and might have gotten seeds from R.L before he disappeared

I’m from Brooklyn we don’t say names which is why I said source. If you were there you know if not you can form an opinion with all the info on the net or take Sams word who is the closest source .

1luvbigherb

Right. To be honest my friend I long left the search for the truth for haze and I never really cared about the stories anyway, I mean they are nice but usually I am too busy with my life and creating my own stories than speculating and reading other stories, there was a period of my life where I had nothing better to do but to decipher what Sam and Nev said. Not because I wanted purely to know the origins of haze but I found it entertaining on many levels and of course thanks for all the conversations we had, it was and is always a pleasure to talk about stuff like that with you.

Also to be honest I don't believe anything that Sam says anymore, he didn't remember when we asked before , how did he remember now ? He had no idea about the seeds back then or what he had given to Nevil, he clearly said he didnt remember. This guy doesn't remember what he said yesterday. He contradicts himself way too much to take him seriously.

My search for the haze truth was not about what is haze exactly but where can I get the best haze and discussing breeding techniques with Sam and Nev( is fun). Also it's funny to see their characters unfold and how everyone tries to take credit and stuff like that. But when it came to Haze I came to the conclusion, after smoking both OH and NH, that they are ( very ) related but the NH had the better hazes or it's bred better.

I have tried the Original Haze a couple of times in Amsterdam and also in Vancouver,BC from dispensary. The Vancouver,BC clone is from Seedsman and produces frankincese, I know because I lived there in 2015-6 and I smoked it a lot. This was the best Original Haze I've ever smoked but it wasn't as trippy or psychedelic as the NH.

Now I feel my search with the Haze was done when Sam said he couldn't remember what he had back then and what he gave to Nev and Nev said his story. To be honest I don't trust anyone as I wasn't there and I only care for the seed. For all I know these people were involved with the DEA, we know rumours how they got their dutch licenses... it's all dodgy and mafia people to me and everyone is pointing fingers. Im not pointing a finger at someone specifically or claiming someone is a snitch, just saying most of these people involved were involved in dodgy things.

Sam was saying the other day how we wants to give 1k to people no to have children to avoid overpopulation but he has two himself. How about we give him 1k and kill himself or his children ? It would be a good start. I can't say I like most of these guys a lot. I don't mind getting banned again.

But kudos to these people for passing and creating the seed. But I don't think they did anything special. We have greek bagseed unbred sativas that produces frankincense and its as good as the hazes.

It's nice to see you taking this as far back as possible but I don't really care anymore, thanks for sharing though !


Have fun my friend!
l33t


PS MadMac says

"i know some dutch friends who hold the org. haze A & C lady's..."

There is no HazeA and HazeC ladies, there are two a5 and two c5 plants though if thats what you mean . The NL5HazeA(1), the Nl5HazeA(2), the NL5HazeC(1) mom of SSH and NL5HazeC(122) Mango. Which ones you mean ? I think Nev mentioned there is also another c5 floating around which is unrelated to 1 and 122 in holland. These are just nl5haze seeds selected by Nev though, far from pure haze, very similar to SSH and the mom of NH. If you want good haze high without the narcotic dark NL5 aspect you have to select the haze dominant plants in NH, the mostly hazeC plants which have pine smell. It's around 1 in 10 females but not all are the best. The a5 and c5s are not good if you want pure haze high, but more like commercial coffeeshop SSH bit stupifying thing.


This is how it should look like, this is from current MNS seed and I haven't flowered it yet so I don't know how it smokes but that's how my old girl looked and that's how it should look

 

[Guest]

leet on that evil haze.

 

[MAHA KALA]

And you can get 16weekers that are as cerebral as the OH only more potent.

absolutely not true! my 16 weeker of NH had ceilling after while of smoking it, not as cerebral as OH. never.

 

[MAHA KALA]

and than this frankincense talk... oh dear... what's so special about the high? Nothing... it's only the smell to impress other people... thx
M.

exactly. totally overhyped.. its nice pheno of OH for sure. but not better than choco rootbeer or citric incense.(p.s. Im not talking about uptown haze)

 

[leet]

Is this the 16 weeker you speak of ? It looks very nice and well grown.

It seems we have different experiences and drawn different conclusions, we can agree to disagree

I do believe the Original Haze is clearer if thats what you mean by cerebral, the Neville's Haze is well .. Haze... it's not as clear as the Original Haze. But the Original Haze will never leave me in a state of paranoia trying to get sober and not understand people... It's more clear happy electric stimulating high. This is my experience...