organic vs chemweed

[Guest]

refer to a previous link of mine and you will see organics is more about the soil not the plant...organics is about the earth the soil not a rubber tub...its not irrelevant to me...it is to my method of growth though
http://tastyharvest.com/Merchant2/m...Code=2nutrients
Organic vs. Synthetic
Do plants know the difference between a synthetic chemical fertilizer and an organic fertilizer?
All nutrients and plant foods, both synthetic and organic must be converted to a molecular form that plants can utilize. Plants do not recognize the difference between synthetic chemical or organic nutrient sources, however the soil does. Organic fertilizers are exceptional in creating long term benefits in soil. They encourage large populations of beneficial micro-organisms which facilitates nutrients to become immediately available to the plants.
Organic fertilizers help to maintain overall soil fertility by supplying vital organic matter, improving soil structure, and delivering nutrients. Organic fertilizers release gradually over time, which enables the soil to become a reservoir of stored plant foods.
Most synthetic fertilizers are formulated to be fast acting. They typically have a higher concentration of nutrient than do natural organic fertilizers, and are salt or acid based. Because plants can only absorb a certain portion of these types of fertilizers, some residue is left behind in the soil, or is leached out due to rainfall and watering. This can affect microbial populations, decrease soil fertility and contaminate ground water.

First of all, if the whole point of organics is irrevelant to you, then stop argueing.

Moreover, if you search a little bit (just a little I promise) you'll find the Organic Hydro forum... hell I'll even link it for you...

http://www.icmag.com/ic/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=-1&f=70

Enjoy.

 

[Relik]

Organic vs. Synthetic
Do plants know the difference between a synthetic chemical fertilizer and an organic fertilizer?
All nutrients and plant foods, both synthetic and organic must be converted to a molecular form that plants can utilize. Plants do not recognize the difference between synthetic chemical or organic nutrient sources, however the soil does. Organic fertilizers are exceptional in creating long term benefits in soil. They encourage large populations of beneficial micro-organisms which facilitates nutrients to become immediately available to the plants.
Organic fertilizers help to maintain overall soil fertility by supplying vital organic matter, improving soil structure, and delivering nutrients. Organic fertilizers release gradually over time, which enables the soil to become a reservoir of stored plant foods.
Most synthetic fertilizers are formulated to be fast acting. They typically have a higher concentration of nutrient than do natural organic fertilizers, and are salt or acid based. Because plants can only absorb a certain portion of these types of fertilizers, some residue is left behind in the soil, or is leached out due to rainfall and watering. This can affect microbial populations, decrease soil fertility and contaminate ground water.

As said before, an ion is an ion, the plant will not tell the difference. One thing you should keep in mind when deciding wether to go organics or chem, is the consequences of your growing. If you go organics, then your consequences are likely to be positive to the environment, it is a long term benefit. Having a healthy living soil also means you'll need less ferts in the long run.

Chems, well, like you just quoted, "affect microbial populations, decrease soil fertility and contaminate ground water". No positive results here, you've harvested your present crop, not thinking about future ones.

I've already linked you to the organic hydro forum. Did you check it? There is a sticky on miccorhyzal fungi, they innoculate their medium just like we do, bringing it to life. Still, I see no soil in their grows. Not because your hydro growing style doesn't involve organics doesn't mean you can't grow organic hydro.

Organics used to be soil-only. But now that we've understood the principles behind organics, their application reaches new horizons. It's up to you to decide if you're with us and the planet, or on your own.

 

[Guest]

i guess your not getting me...i grow in a closet and that makes organics irrelevant to my method in my opinion...im not trying to save the closet the soil is the reason you should grow organics...thats the reason...hydro growers its really pointless...that is im sure disagreed with by many...but not science...i dont need alink to organic hydro its kind of silly in my humble opinion...there is nothing natural about a hydroponic bubbler with water for medium and a light bulb for a sun...i think its time to stop pretending

 

[Guest]

Music itself has been tested in double blind studies.= No, same results. Vibrations however like giving a plant a shake or good rattle= greater and stronger plants better roots so maybe lots of bass enough to rattle plants could be helpful. The double blind study was done with several types of music.

 

[SCF]

if only we could do a side by side with some taste samples hu? Hydro bucket style, Soilless medium bucket style, and organics bucket style... same strain... same cut.... would be a good experment.

 

[Ganico]

You'd still be smoking weed grown with chemicals though, fuck that. If I grow a damn thing at all it's gonna be organically

 

[Dan42nepa]

i have a feeling this thread will never die..

 

[Guest]

sure and you eat all organic too...you are clueless...nitrogen is nitrogen...play what ever games you want in your own mind...study a little science about something before you just blurt out ignorant statements around it...

You'd still be smoking weed grown with chemicals though, fuck that. If I grow a damn thing at all it's gonna be organically

 

[Guest]

it would have to be same grower with equal experience in both methods...or it would not be accurate

if only we could do a side by side with some taste samples hu? Hydro bucket style, Soilless medium bucket style, and organics bucket style... same strain... same cut.... would be a good experment.

 

[Dan42nepa]

i may do a semi non scientific test down the road with cuttings from the same plant. One is my current organic soil and one in a bubble bucket using non organic nutes. I just dont have the time or money for the nutes right now. Besides my closet is full.

 

[Guest]

Quality, not quantity, that is the point to organics.

Unicorn I have been reading this thread and have a few ideas as to why you are so bent on convincing whomever that chems are superior:

#1: your pot sucks and you are jelous of organic growers.
#2: you have a small ***** and therefore feel the need to grow huge nuggets to make up for it.
#3:You are a follower, chems really are for girls, just follow the instructions and add water.
#4:You can't wrap your head around the idea that soil is alive.
#5:You think bigger is better.

and finally:
#6:you think organics is a fraud fuelled by high priced hippie capitalists who don't know shit.

Am I warm at all?

 

[Suby]

Unicorn go play in the synthetics forum, who are you trying to convince?
Because I've rarely met an organic grower that went back to 3 part ferts.

Better diesease resistance.
Active soil elements in a humic rich environment.
The ability to recycle soil.
Elements are available cheaply or for free to enrich your soil.
Resistance to fungus and pythium even in higher RH situations.
Oraginc soil environements provide better drought resistance and deficiency resistance.
Conditions soil structure to avoid washing out of nutrients from the soil environment.
Benefits from the synergy or mychorizae fungus to extend rootzone capacities and create a more disease resistant rootzone.

Ther are more but you really stuck on this whole ion thing, BTW your fan leaves are overly green and could have used a flush, organic grown plants never store N that agressively, most organic grower look for a light yellow colored fan leaf when harvesting.

Those who never look up are certain their feet set the pace for their lives.

Suby

PS: You swing the word "science" around like you had the first clue as to where science stands, I know I do and because of that I'm sure you don't.
Organic and sustaianable farming have already proven themselves over centuries and in just a short span of 20yrs of non-organic farming these soil are stripped and unhealthy as well as unbalanced.

 

[kush07]

if nature was so perfect...it would have already got rid of us...i agree with the first part...and we are superior...but seeing as i use no soil and grow indoors...the whole point of organics is irrelevant is it not...organics is about soil anybody that thinks different knows not how organics works

If we are supreior to nature then why do we die. Isn't that what nature does, end life and start it anew. Hurricanes, tornadoes, avalanches, etc. are all nature and they are all able to kill us. We are not superiour, we just believe we are and that kind of pig-headed mentality benefits no one.

Also, you say that organics feed the soil only. While partially true, you must remember that the soil feeds the plant. So by feeding my soil I am in turn feeding my plant. I am helping my enviroment in a way that acid and salt could never do. Would you rather have a tomatoe that as soon as you bite into it you taste the fertilizer or would you rather have a clean and sweet taste? Give back to MOTHER NATURE as she has given to you.

Happy Toking

 

[Guest]

when you take away the dirt organics is all washed up...plant breaks down the fertilizer to a molecule level anyway...nitrogen = nitrogen whether from a rotting fish or a synthetic..thats the bottom line...superior to all other animals we are...i was answering someone else and not agreeing completely but sort of...again i dont grow soil organics is stupid for dwc bottom line...learn about organics before you try to wax wisdom when its nothing but shined up foolishness

If we are supreior to nature then why do we die. Isn't that what nature does, end life and start it anew. Hurricanes, tornadoes, avalanches, etc. are all nature and they are all able to kill us. We are not superiour, we just believe we are and that kind of pig-headed mentality benefits no one.

Also, you say that organics feed the soil only. While partially true, you must remember that the soil feeds the plant. So by feeding my soil I am in turn feeding my plant. I am helping my enviroment in a way that acid and salt could never do. Would you rather have a tomatoe that as soon as you bite into it you taste the fertilizer or would you rather have a clean and sweet taste? Give back to MOTHER NATURE as she has given to you.

Happy Toking

 

[Smurf]

There is nothing wrong with ppl growing using synthetic ferts........ That’s how I first started! Gee, having THAT choice was a lesson on it own. For heaven sake it’s all about growing....... not just the garden, but our inner self. I now choose to be more responsible with my practices....... not for short term gain.

To be aware of your environment is one thing....... but to be ‘as one with Nature’ is a whole different circumstance.

Ps. Dirt is something I clean from my boots...... soil is the life of my plants.

Sorry, now I'm being pedantic.
Smurf

 

[Suby]

So i see your just dredge up the same responses to fill the gaps in your 3 bottle train of logic?
So your saying if soil didn't exist hydro would rule the world? lol your a real genius.
Well one day if you come across a perfect outdoor plot for a pot patch you can throw your hands up and say "hydro is better"...but not suited to growing under the big halide in the sky.

No ph pens needed
no ppm scale
no ph up or down needed
power outages don't leave my plants in a tough spot
no reliance on pumps, airstones, water pumps, no tubes...
I can get all the ammendments I need through WalMart
can you say the same to all this?

But know instead you go back to the ion is an ion thing, i'm hoping you have better points to put up against the ones i've posted.
If you had used an organic source of N your plants wouldn't be over-nitrified wich to me eyes they are.

 

[Ganico]

sure and you eat all organic too...you are clueless...nitrogen is nitrogen...play what ever games you want in your own mind...study a little science about something before you just blurt out ignorant statements around it..

Nope, don't eat all organic cause I don't have the space to grow all my own food and at this point. Anything I grow will be organic though, and one of my main goals is to be completly self sustinant in what I consume.


"nitrogen is nitrogen"

Nah, not really. They are generally not the same sources are they? I guess you feel all h20 is the same too, huh? Would you drink water out of a creek that runs next to a giant factory?
You can live off of nothing but plain rice cakes and take a bunch of vitamin pills for your nutrients, but just eating food that contains those would be a lot healthier. Do you understand?

The point is this: overall, organic is better than synthetic, period. In all aspects of life. Can't really argue with it. If you disagree then get a blowup doll, a robot dog, and wear nothing but rayon and polyester. Organics reigns supreme

 

[Guest]

opinion..not fact...i posted plenty of facts

 

[The Bling]

Im smoking some organic outdoor thats 1000x better than the OG kush i had a few days ago the high is more complex so i have to smoke a little more each time i smoke but chemie indoor has me high for 45min to an hour and organic outdoor still keeps me medicated for a couple hours. the only thing that seems to suffer is the bag appeal the colors of weed are never so electric outdoors more earthy which i guess is beautifull in its own right

 

[Suby]

opinion..not fact...i posted plenty of facts

really?
List them quickly because where I stand you've been squawking the same shit since the beginning under the guise of having science on your side.
I was really hoping you would tear me a new one because at this point i'm begging to be proven wrong.
I hope you aren't thinking you've sumed it all up with: an ion is an ion and that's a fact...