New Experimental Organic Hydro Technique!

[RipVanWeed]

Solar,

These plants are clones taken from the previous grow, as I review notes I see that they were planted in dirt about 2 months ago. They were slow to initially grow roots as I took my cuttings after 2 weeks of flowering. I'm pretty sure the temps should have been higher for quicker rooting. Anyway, about 2 mos. in dirt under t-12 floros.

Buckets were bubbled for 7 days before I slipped the 6" potted plants in.
I had this trip planned so knowing it would be better to wait another week, I went ahead early so I could observe for a coupla days before leaving.

All newer growth has no problems, so I'm leaning towards sticking to the plan and only add water for now. I'll be rigging up some vertical screens tomorrow.

RipVanWeed

 

[Citizen024]

Nutrient

Nutrient

Well, it is a bit disconcerting to see plants having some issues in this system. However, it may yet come to self correct. I am excited to see what happens.

How about amendment the micros and some macros, then used bottled nutrient for the actual feeding N/P/K?

It does lean me towards considering a water in nutrient solution. Well brewed finely powered teas and bottled more "raw" organics. Roots Organic products maybe. They make a lot of single nutrients (0-4-0) so it is easy to give a mix custom.

Just a consideration, I know DM tends to lean away from these products for good reason.

I would go with my new best friend Pura Vida even, but it is so completely digested already I don't see it being of much value to the microbes, versus more raw thick ones that will feed the bio system better.

 

[rrog]

Is it burn or not enough nutes? Looking back over your first pics Rip, you had some leaf yellowing happening when you first popped them in it looks like.

One thing, if the old root ball + dirt is still the primary nutrient supplier, it's likely there are no beneficial microbes near the root surface. Maybe the old dirt (in the root ball) pooped out and new roots haven't yet advanced out of the root ball and into the OBBT organic layer?

 

[RipVanWeed]

I'm curious about the amount of growth. As a new grower I have little reference, but looking back at my last generation, I didn't see the kind of jump that's happening here.

The side by side pics I posted were from the same spot on the floor, the pics are in scale? Anyway, I did top and prune the backsides 3 days before transplanting and this is a vertical grow so the height is more controlled.

I realize that I need to flip to flower sooner rather than later, which is good, the electric bill this month will be substantial!

I guess I may have come across as more alarmed/concerned than I am. I think that with all the new growth looking good the plants are telling me they endured a stressful intake of nutrients but have now adjusted and are taking off.

Could someone direct me to info on starve/feed/flush? I want to get my head fully around this.

Comments on the rate of growth?

Thank-you, RipVanWeed

 

[rrog]

So you're feeling OK about them at this point?

I'm the least experienced person here, I'll readily admit, but that looks like a hell of a lot of growth in such a short time. Again, no expert here but it might be that the huge growth caused a short term deficiency in a particular nute.

I'd bet that in a week you'd see them even fuller and less yellow.

 

[Citizen024]

Well now that I really took in the story of those plants, I am guessing they will come around in the next week. The soil they went in with wasn't colonized like the medium, so it will take a bit for it to really get up to speed. And it doesn't breath as well as the medium, something to consider. Plus whatever they have been through previously.

This will serve to convince me of the self correcting nature of bio systems even more if a plant in soil and not so happy can be corrected simply by the work of the microlife. More the reason to get to building one!

I believe I have gone from having a 1000 things to do, to only 987.

Venting Time!!!!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
My current round is looking like this:

New intake system, the last stand of a couple mites, PM control, incomplete drips systems (which means LOTS of hand watering, and far more nutrient shift then I like to see in my coco!!!!!), a transplant from clone to veg to finish . . and another bunch of clones to cut.

Plus a girlfriend, Aikido classes, and a full fledged daytime M-F business to run.

Phew. .

And my co-op partner has been gone for a week and a half. .

Fuck me man . .

 

[rrog]

RipVanWeed started his plants in soil then transplanted. That's what I intend to do as well. Here's the plan:

Start 6 seedlings in 24/0 for 4 weeks. Switch all into 12/12 for a week and see who's female. Take the 3 best females and put each in their own 5 gallon OBBT. 5 weeks from start to finish. Insert them into a saved hole in the big 5 gallon OBBT, like RVW did. Then flower for 2 months or whatever.

Start the 6 seedlings smaller containers. Our pal OrganicMeds suggested "... an organic soil with a bit of Blood & Bone, EWC, Perlite & lime."

Would a quart size container work? I'd like the smallest I could get away with during veg, then release them into the big 5 gals

Could I make a little 6-pack of mini-OBBTs to get the plants up to 5 weeks old? That would be so perfect.

 

[solarpowered_ca]

I am trying 2 methods. The first which has been under 12/12 straight from 3 weeks cloning, is motoring and looking very vigorous and healthy. These were not cloned by myself but else where in nets and clay balls in a water system and transfered into OBBTs.. Currently i am 2 weeks into a new set of clones ( angeldust from growdoc) and these are smaller cuttings placed into soil taken from my OBBTs mix earlier on that was left over . These are in a small root trainers in a small cutting unit that mists up well. These are looking better than the first clones and are very virdent. The later will be the way I will continue as they will suffer less shock at transferring into root trainers ( 4 " ) and straight into OBBTs 3 weeks later , straight into 12/12 lighting. I am growing with a small perpetual harvest of 6 plants in 6 pots. I have 2 other pots that will complete the cycle of 9 weeks grow> 1 week dry> 2 weeks for the soil to regenerate and a clone place into and placed back under lights.
I use the fert mix that DM recommended when initially mixing up your mix. I pour 3 litres of water over the soil and this soaks thru the whole mix. For the first week that the clones were place into the OBBTs I gently watered with about half a cup of water around the plants every day for 3 or 4 days . Then for the second week I drained 500 mls of mix from the drain at the base of unit and watered the plants every second day for that week.
Now Im into the 3rd weeks of growth I fertilised with Guano Bloom and Meta K ( no time to burn up a corn cob ) also for the second OBBT I used Earth juice catalyst and Earth juice Bloom for a comparison . I will follow this schedule with one Earth juice range of organic ferts for 3 and Bat Guano /meta K for the other 3 .
When I watered with my first Bloom ferts last night I drained the tanks and found only 500 Mls of veg tea in the OBBT. I mixed this into 2 1/2 litrs of water with the above ferts in so that for the first 4 weeks of growth there was still some veg grunt in the mix. When i reach week 4 I will start into the drain / water / fast week and alternate with Bloom ferts every 2nd week till last week of flush /fast /dry. Thats the plan .

 

[rrog]

I am digesting this excellent post. You're very kind to post all of that for me (us).

So lemme see if I understand this.

You're preferred method is to use standard issue "OBBT organic layer formula" in a small 4" root trainer. The angeldust clone was placed directly in the organic material in a Clone hood (cutting) unit.

You left the clones for how long in the 4" trainers?

Did you have to move up to a larger container before the final OBBT? What size container?

Thanks so much

 

[Citizen024]

Sounds good Solar. Can you get pics up at some point?

 

[solarpowered_ca]

I have small clones and placed them into 4" root trainers containing OBBT mix. My unit is a small plastic cutting unit that cost $10 . It contains a base tray for water to collect in. Another tray for the root trainers with a plastic hood . This mists up real good . I spray every day a light mist . Its sitting on a heat pad under a 8 watt fluro lamp that is sold in Vet shops .All this on 18/6
3 weeks later I transfer these small clones directly into OBBTs .
Under 12/12.
they flourish especially as i have two lights in my grow area. the 400 hps and a Flurolamp 230v 130w 6400K side by side. The flurolamp is purely experimental but have found that placing this above the 2 new OBBTs that have just been placed in the grow room for the first 2 weeks seems to help wonderfully in their growth and establishment in their new home. They will stay under this light for 3 weeks till the new clones arrive in the next 2 OBBTs when the 3 week old clones move under the 400 hps next to the 6 week plants . They all recieve light from the 400 however there is less direct light upon the clones from the 400 and more of the blue rays interspersed with the 400. I believe that this is a gentle way for the new clones to harmonise and rapidly become happy in their new envoirement. I am contemplating replacing the 6400 fluro with a 2400 red specrum for the 3rd week b4 they move directly under the 400 to make room for the 2 new OBBTs .
They would do fine straight into the 400 , although I havent tried this .
So I dont repot the clones into a larger pot then veg and again transplant into OBBTs. The less shock the better I feel for my meds .
If i were wanting to utilise DM /LLs suppercropping method I would still go straight from clone into OBBT but place the units into a veg chamber and supercrop for 3 months or so .

 

[rrog]

Thanks for the additional detail Solar. I'm going to look into some containers. If you can take a clone three weeks in a 4" root trainer, I could look at something a bit bigger for my 5 weeks from seedling.

I'm surprised they can go so long in so little medium. And I am 100% behind the transitioning ease.

 

[solarpowered_ca]

I am going to source out some smaller square/ rectangular containers that would hold 16 -20 litres. As the round pots are not what I found so easy for my set up. I can switch them over after the next grow b4 the incubating cycle

 

[solarpowered_ca]

Yes the clones were approx 75mm (3") with 2" above soil and 1" into mix and they are doing fine. There has been virtually no height growth just root development in a slow but steady fashion. I am using only an 8 watt light .
Initially I had thought it may be wise to take the lid off and veg them for a couple of weeks but have decided to utilise the fluros in the flowering chamber and drop them straight into 12/12.

 

[rrog]

I'm thinking I'll need quart size pots to hold my 6 unsexed seedlings for 5 weeks of veg. Anyone have a comment if that's about right?

 

[SilverSurfer_OG]

Hey guys and gals

My biobox is bubblin away to good effect. My Buddah is way ahead of the other girls with her bud formation and overall vigour.

I am loving this style of growing... thanks heaps DM and LadyL!!!

Also lovin the sound of your big table Citizen. Keeping em in seperate tubs and all sharing the res sounds like the business... Aikido is very cool. One of the ultimate forms of self-defence.

I transplanted my other Blue Mystic, pot and all into the biobox (which by the way i think sounds more catchy than OBBT ) Had to fill in the space which i dont think my RB will quite make. My other BM i had to rip out is now much happier and showing no signs of a deficiency...

 

[rrog]

Holy buds, Batman! They are looking fantastic. And you're pleased with the OBBT technique. Such great news. Thanks for taking all that time to post pics and comments. We are all loving your grow

 

[LadyLargely]

Hehe, looks like peeps here where flipping out over an apparent nutrient deficiency a little premature. OBBTs (like the sound of Bio Box BTW) are very good at looking after themselves. Build it right and there is not a whole lot the gardener can do to fuck it up.

Not sure how your Blue will do on the other side cooped up in that pot. I know you think you are using up space that the Buddha can't use, but I think you'll be surprised by how much root mass a lone OBBT plant can generate. I won't be surprised if your other Blue starts to struggle, especially if you have removed the divider.

On the plus side you have finished sexing and will soon be hitting the first stage of Budswell. I hope you are ready! Be sure to have materials for phosphate-heavy teas at the ready because you will be needing lots of that soon. And don't skimp on the potassium! DM and I both like a nute ratio of 1/3/2 for the heavier bits of flower.

 

[SwitchAvenger]

You guys have no clue how many times I've read through this and the other thread. I'm playing a waiting game until Friday and it's driving me nutz. I've pretty much got a shopping list made up with where to get everything. But i had a couple questions with materials i could find around me. My main concern is really just getting started. Being 100% organic can go either way for me too so with that being said I'm shooting a list of crap and brand is see if there is any issues i need to look for with the brands at hand
What i have found so far;

Mulch Block Coco coir
MG perlite (i have it already)
MG Blood meal
Espoma kelp meal (it contains Ascophyllum nodosum, and is available at lowes)
Pennington's fast acting lime.

Now for Epsom salt, and any kind of regular epsom salt will work? and is there any particular Vermiculite i should be in search of? I'll also found this stuff while looking around it's made by green light, it's called super bloom 12-55-6 you can get it at lowes btw.
http://www.starnursery.com/show_details.php?root=2&sub1=32&product=579
it's in a powder form and weirdly enough the the link to the product as more info then the actual company's website

I also found a local organic place that has Indonesian bat guano, and i can burn down some corncobs for ash.

I'm pretty much following the ingredients verbatim except i don't have compost available to me so if i read correctly regular organic soil will work instead?
Sorry for going nubish let me know if what i found is kosher

 

[rrog]

From my notes from both DM and LadyL:

50% coco,
25% compost/worm castings
25% pearlite/vermiculite

The 25% compost with castings is "also a good strong bagged organic soil. You might mix as much as 50/50 worm-castings/bagged organic soil." LadyL

That (castings) ratio is considered "hot" and I'll likely back of the castings myself. LadyL

Regarding Vermiculite:"Horticultural Vermiculute! This is the coarsest, chunkiest version of it you can buy. It is rougly the size of ordinary pearlite" LadyL

Regarding Epsom Salts: [80% sulfur 20% magnesium] from DM

"...Horticultural Vermiculute! This is the coarsest, chunkiest version of it you can buy. It is rougly the size of ordinary pearlite LadyL