MASSIVE OUTDOOR GROW

[Julian]

damn bro..its gonna take a year to get through this whole thread..but thats cool..need that time to learn anyway..in my imaginary plot..plan to start with bout ten females to get the feel..then look at more

A year?.......brother....you've only got 8 months for the entire outdoor forum

Don't think about numbers.......in the end, depending on approach, means little....lot of ground between 10 2lb'ers and 10 AF/mini's.....(plus budgeting for loss, error, X Factor, etc....)

Big joke is always any batch, anytime, with anyone, anywhere has always been followed by "Fuck man, you were right, we should have done more" ....I've never done one in my life in which such wasn't said... (And it's always one of the first things I tell people early in season.......that the statement above will be said by end of season....I should start betting on it

some tips ...i dont like GPS n wouldnt use it either...i dont even trust shredders..if map info MUST be written down..old bookie trick ...use rice paper n keep a small bucket of water close if anything happens just throw rice paper into water...i find this more effecient ...faster...than burning..just gotta be carefull if ur out in the rain

I've been known to use rolling papers for notes and burn em up into ashtrays....very convenient.....As above...I sometimes map out things.....but, after a couple glances, burned to memory, (plus, as earlier, things get added to plots as year goes along, so, that kind of throws a wrench into that anyway.....initial rounds.....(main), then, add to plots where there is room till end of season, so.....as earlier.....lot of my pics will see different things, heights, etc....because things were added as we went along, etc.....

also..many may post from their phone..the cell companies WILL turn info over to LEOs....so leave the phone at home when going to plots if u feel your hot or just anal like myself when thinking about security n CYA...just turning the phone off is not enough..they can be remotely turned by leos..some newer phones have GPS

Removing battery is fine.....should always have phone (in case of emergency).......I actually had an interesting problem recently, but, can't really go into details as quite a few from beyond the initial circle know about it/heard about it, etc......(funny story about getting stuck...as in stuck ....as in fuckin really stuck )

(We should have known better anyway.....)

pleasure to be here

back to learning

Enjoy........Some issues here and there occasionally, but, only people too small to understand we all have something to offer, all offer something different, all from different experience and perspectives......

This is merely mine....Glad of interest and use.

WoW
I've only read up to page 47 & so far it's one of the most enthralling reads on the site.

At this point I've a few questions, but I'll hold off on asking till I read some more.

Very kind of you to say....just offering what I can things maybe of interest to someone......Will answer whatever I can.

 

[ExEcutioner]

Great great thread Julian. Thank you.

Ive read the entire thread and have gained much, much information.

I have a question for you. I haven't grown a mature plant from clone yet .
What kind of differences as far growth, bushiness, and yield etc. are there, if any, between growing the same strain seed vs clone grown outdoors given a full season.

I am under the assumption that a plant that is a clone will have more tops, and yield more than that same plant left untoped grown from seed.

Thanks Julian,

 

[Julian]

Great great thread Julian. Thank you.

Thanks man. Kind of you to say....

Ive read the entire thread and have gained much, much information.

Glad to offer what I can, and of interest...

I have a question for you. I haven't grown a mature plant from clone yet .
What kind of differences as far growth, bushiness, and yield etc. are there, if any, between growing the same strain seed vs clone grown outdoors given a full season.

I am under the assumption that a plant that is a clone will have more tops, and yield more than that same plant left untopped grown from seed.

I highlighted the above points, specifically directly above......ie: Clone vs. untopped seed plant.

I think would depend on the cut....(The specific cut, branching, etc)....

I think seed outperforms clones, sure many would agree (sure some might not). Think the real value of clones come in the specifics....(special individual, uniformity, but, I don't like due to the latter..(uniformity).....any and all issues with something specific will be carried over...

You know...my preferences earlier/elsewhere.....cutting lead time, different individuals, problems limited due to all individuals, etc, and, I still get my special things for ps out of it, etc....




I had a lot of stuff to add, but, thought I would wait until I get next round of pics because illustration of points I think needed to accompany my points (Had some very interesting moments and thoughts recently on rounds .....Really helped my mood......)

Also been discussing with someone a switch in nutes and program...(AN outdoor line.....thinking of committing to 1,000 kilos for next run........which comes out to an increase of 2-3/couple p's to pay for itself...

Pics of the "worst/lost batch" .......haven't visited in 7 weeks......and.......seems far from "lost"

(Last time there, 3-4 footers, yellow as a vette, so eaten by insects almost transparent, like a screen.........I think pictures needed to see current (Going to look through last several rounds to see if any pics taken before so can be matched........before/ and after, etc....)

 

[blackone]

My experience is also that seedplants are stronger than clones. They have a strong taproot, and the structure of the plant is also different. A seedplant is definitely more beautiful.
Clones from the best phenos of a given strain are typically better than the average seedplants though - especially because you can dial it in very well after a few grows. This applies mostly to indoor.

 

[Julian]

My experience is also that seedplants are stronger than clones. They have a strong taproot, and the structure of the plant is also different. A seedplant is definitely more beautiful.

Vigor.....strength......I've always believed such, and, had recent example as to just how much....

Clones from the best phenos of a given strain are typically better than the average seedplants though - especially because you can dial it in very well after a few grows. This applies mostly to indoor.

Well, out also....lot of people do,and, if I maintained as 24/7/365 consistent veg spot, would probably also.....

I'd agree, depending on what your running to start with....always a variation on most things as far as individuals....

One reason (of many) that I do like is when I run a lot of things, lot of different planting times...I get a good mix to the overall view of the spot....(ie: Different heights,different structure, different leaves and profiles,....changes the "look" of the spot.......I like that.......

Note: To anyone with a fair budget?.....
Take a helicopter near your spots....... You'll never plant the same (Been up and by them in last couple weeks........Not the first time I have, but haven't in several years and glad I did...I needed it

(Ideally, you use them already, know them, get a feel, etc (pilot).....tell em looking at some land, want to take a look but you have to steer him so as you can see but he won't........ie: somewhat guiding with them.....)

You'll never plant the same.....best couple hundred you'll ever spend

Plus, would give those who haven't a different perspective(s) as above....in many ways...(and a lot (most) of people love it.....)

 

[Julian]

Note:
I would think no one outdoors right now isn't monitoring their 14 day forecast daily, but, if your not, right now, full extended 2 week, morning and night displaying in many regions some textbook behavior as far as why one should always be aware of daily extended..

(I'm still keeping an eye on season overall so I can make sense of it .......still wondering what's to come and how it's going to play out but happy so far lately, and continue to be..... .........Just wondering where he frosts are going to come into play.....2 week has been changing daily for the last month...and continue to....(so far for the better)...

 

[Hindu Killer]

Common to form, very interesting Julian. Just burnt a leafer, and am decently stoned mind you. Could be lost in this thread for awhile. Hows that go ..? Some walk it, some talk it! Peace!

 

[Julian]

Thank you brother......glad of interest....

Read and liked your also btw..........best of luck to all, we're coming down to final run here.....Weather looking cooler than normal for many regions....hoping i work for everyone who it applies to........

Almost there......(I will have things coming down within next week or 2..to continue for maybe next 6 weeks, and, I for one, am really waiting to wrap this season up........far too much for me (everything combined......) Really need a break, if at least just for a week or so ).....

Had a conversation, so, some more notes on the above (Helicopters): If one doesn't feel confident about taking it by ones locations, then just take a ride elsewhere...Just as when we drive and see land and get ideas, so will you when flying over...fields.....seeing clearings..........holes in canopies, etc, etc...

Statement stands, regardless...one will never plant them same once they go up and cover some ground....(as long as thinking and analyzing when in the air......every second.....plants...spots...cover, etc....)...

( Girls love to go up too btw so...good way to score some points, something unique, etc Not the same trip....they like city trips better, but, just hrowing that in )

We're almost fuckin there....

Almost there.......

A safe and successful season to all.......

 

[Hindu Killer]

Funny you mention that helicopter stuff J! Knew of a group that worked the midwest years back. They would plant heavy, then fly it and inspect from the air(planes). Long story short....a barn was on fire the FD arrived to find it full of bud in variouse stages of drying. One pile was over a ton! The police went out to the field on the property and found thousand of stalks still in the ground. It can be done if one has the nerve and balls to handle it all.
Ever heard of the police/eradicaton teams...leaveing cameras or setting up on the plots??

A thousand kilos we think alot alike J!

 

[Julian]

Funny you mention that helicopter stuff J! Knew of a group that worked the midwest years back. They would plant heavy, then fly it and inspect from the air(planes). Long story short....a barn was on fire the FD arrived to find it full of bud in variouse stages of drying. One pile was over a ton! The police went out to the field on the property and found thousand of stalks still in the ground.

Never heard of it , know nothing about it, and claim no responsibility for any ownership, in full or in part, and no responsibility for any training of anyone involved.

I would though say inspection must be done on the ground. If one is too skittish to walk in (and has a major role), then, you have to settle for pictures delivered. I wouldn't think it wise for management to be afraid to walk the fields.....I would think such would create a serious problem with partners and workers, and, frankly, if he case, they have no business doing it in the first place....

Everyone should go up to observe if they have a chance.....the feel...what you see (and do not) how things look (can get a lot of ideas also)...

Like I said..... You go up, your planting will be changed no matter how well you think you did...(At the very least, even if 100% satisfied.......you get more ideas )

Note: Long term outdoor growing at any level (let's call it 20lbs a yr even....75k a yr more or less...year after year..........

Couple hundred dollars one time to ensure such.....protect such...improve such?.....Well....that's what is called "The best money you will ever spend"..........the return on it being a hundred to thousand or more fold

Plus......will enjoy it .......and will again

(Not to mention.......we sit, and see, and listen day after day after day to many people speak of them.........to which my obnoxious reply is: "Really?.......even been in one"?

Then how does one know?

See what I mean right?

Ever heard of the police/eradication teams...leaving cameras or setting up on the plots??

It can be done if one has the nerve and balls to handle it all.

I reversed the above statements....

Yes, I have.....and I know procedure well......but, one has to keep one thing in mind...

They have to find it first.....

Quick story:
I of course have trained numerous people, and brought numerous people in on numerous things....

Do you know the average persons (even here) response is always along the lines of "That's crazy, you'll get caught"...

One should always be reminded.....Law Enforcement is not an all knowing, all seeing mystical entity....with the equivalent of an crystal ball which they peer into and "know" any and everything....

Not to mention many do locations which they are certain have never had air traffic......

Let's look at it from a different angle: A location, with numerous spots, which has had no traffic the entire late summer and early fall. There are many such places that exist....

They know if they are told......and the minor chance they find at random....

I told someone recently: Buy a farm.........an sit and look up an look around next 5 years........Any planes?......any birds? (helicopters)......any people walking your fields?.......

Means for 5 years you could have just done whatever you wanted.....(fuck 5.....on good year enough to set most up for life if you go heavy......)

As with anything....it's about working smarter...not harder (well, little of both......)

US Law Enforcement........I could tell you a story .....

They're incompetent.......(to those of them reading this......maybe I'll share that story at some point to make you see exactly how much you are...story about a potential informant who offered to give them everything, and they turned him down and ignored him..and he was killed shortly after.....(Everything.......beyond what most can imagine........down by the border.......boats, planes, tons, banking,distribution....Everything....)

He was ignored.....targets found out and killed him.........(speculation that information fed to targets by law enforcement.....)

Know your location......I've never done a spot that someone involved wasn't there 24/7 for years......

Not every inch of every state is flown......not even close...

What you can, when you can, where you can, how you can

A thousand kilos we think alot alike J!

Well......AN sells that line in kg's.....usage would probably be 3kg's per plant, so, per 1,000 (plans) would probably be 3k kg's.....

Some rough overview numbers.......
A ton (1,000 kg's) of AN's outdoor line is about $10k. At $3k per (my range) that would mean if it produces an extra 3lbs...it's been paid for.....I hear from some an increase in yield should be expected......much more significant than .1%, (whatever) etc........so...

Now.....if it can't produce an extras couple p's from thousands of outdoor plants?...Well.....then maybe I will sell them my recipes

(Have to talk to them in detail and find out exactly what is in their dry mixes....If MJ specific?....well......should be all there......I figured I would consider it.......haven't bought and paid for anything yet.....)

Yeah, I figure ton might only feed 350-700 (3-6kg's per plant per season), so.......Maybe try it on one round somewhere (like....1,000 or something)....As above.......if a difference...sure would be obvious....

(But then I am also of he school that I would hate to run it and have it dramatically outperform and wish would have run it on all........)

1,000 large ones?.....if it can't increase yield by 10%+ it's worthless........We'll see.....talking about a lot of things with a lot of people right now about a lot of changes.....

(Ton isn't what it sounds......and, considering procurement and the risk (AN, large amounts)...someone running much less could grab one and use for 2 seasons, etc.....This season I must have gone through double digit tons of supplies....Ton is only 50 bags of manure or compost....(100 plants)....Ton of dry mix only enough to feed couple hundred for season.....etc......Ton of worm castings absolutely nothing...so....it's all relative.......

 

[Julian]

Another point illustrated regarding long term planning above.......

When one is after 7 figures in a small period of time.....what is "reasonable"?

What are "reasonable" measures?......

What is a "reasonable" amount of time?

Let's say........2MM in 36 months.......Cash......

Very real........not an exaggeration.......and, to someone with adequate skills and resources, a successful run makes it a certainty......

Successful...

Obtaining a property and beginning accumulation reasonable steps.......

Maintaining a clean property a reasonable step.......

Observing the location for 2.5yrs also a reasonable step......

One would assume if in the time frame of 2.5yrs no traffic has been seen.....that chances are it will not....

The angles are endless of how to ensure safety and success.......

Every little bit counts...........all the little bits add up.......

Target is to turn as many aspects as possible in your favor....

Lot of approaches and strategies have been addressed.....all very real, all very possible.......able to be utilized by almost anyone, anywhere, anytime with the skills and resources to do so.

We grow.........

These are not some magical unreachable objectives......

We grow.......we bring them in......year after year...

The only issue is a slight change of numbers...

Choppers.....
The number one fear and enemy of every single person in this forum...

How many have ever been in one?

Answer would surprise since the number one single enemy.

They send them to "school"........Is there anyone here who thinks they would need "school" on spotting plants?

 

[vod]

Choppers.....
The number one fear and enemy of every single person in this forum...

Not every country has choppers looking for weed.

 

[Julian]

(Thank God ) meaning U.S. of course.......forgive my lack of global solidarity...I sometimes forget about the lucky ones... ....

But, moot point, because every square inch of US not covered anyway ...

 

[FirstTracks]

J.: good info in the last few posts. Always informative reading

 

[Julian]

J.: good info in the last few posts. Always informative reading

Thanks man........about the time of year my fanaticism really starts to kick into high gear........wrapping up one (4-6 weeks left) and kicking over into next season mode, etc....(Although, frankly, I am once again near "Fuck it" mode ....whatever........)

AN correction above btw....as I was thinking and playing with weighs and amounts when going through that thought process and pricing different things.......

AN outdoor line is $4,700 per ton without any shipping tacked on (if necessary)

$10k per 2 tons.....(At first I checked how much a ton but then figured I could commit 10k, and how much could I get for 10k, etc, etc......)

Doesn't seem that unreasonable to me if a superior product.....(More than I currently pay....by quite a bit.....but, "in whole scheme of things"....eh....not an outrageous amount........especially if is truly a superior and complete mix.....)

(Suggested dosage/treatment is 1lb-1kg per plant (sq. meter), 5 times throughout a season (Call it 5kg's per plant, which still seems a little light to me), and, plain to see could easily go 5 tons per 1,000 large plants.....($25k per 1,000 plants.....which, again, "whole scheme of things"....$25k per 1,000 nothing significant......)

Anyway.......Hope all are well......My 2 week ends at Sept 13th .....and the next 2 week ends at end September...........

Almost there.........almost.....Hope all are well, and all are safe......and all bring it in.....

 

[Saibai]

Heh, thats one dimension I'm glad I don't have to think in, the view from overhead.

They have to find it first.....

Lol, exact-a-mundo

One should always be reminded.....Law Enforcement is not an all knowing, all seeing mystical entity....with the equivalent of an crystal ball which they peer into and "know" any and everything....

True, true...another good point.

 

[Julian]

Heh, thats one dimension I'm glad I don't have to think in, the view from overhead.

Ah..Ohayo Sabaisan...Genki desu ka

The mere thought offers endless possibilities ...

Lol, exact-a-mundo

True, true...another good point.

Both things that many overlook sometimes....How many people here have had successful runs?.....if you totaled every single person, every single year, what would the cumulative runs be?...(US )...In the thousands?.......plant counts in the hundreds of thousands or even millions?.....

There you go for starters.......thousands of runs and possibly millions of plants done successfully....

Law Enforcement overall is not a field where one will see the highest IQ's of any industry....

After all.......how little intelligence must one have, to have to settle upon a 40k a year job finding plants if anything else was available and within their reach?....

ie: Limited intelligence, limited options, seeking power over others due to insecurity and inferiority complex's.... DEA starting salaries not much more than a bagger at a grocery store (or a assistant manager at a Quick Mart? Thinking of "Clerks" ....

Of course, I do have more respect for such as a whole and never underestimate.....but, I know they're always here, so......a little teasing sometimes makes them crawl out of their holes ...

Sabaisan.......how's your season?....How long to go?......How's it working with the monkeys?

 

[HOVAH]

Im gonna be using Miricle Grow and a Floralicious next season... everything from SENSI-STAR to AMNESIA-HAZE loved it ...... no, its not organic but you cant argue with the results and ease of use.....

 

[Julian]

Im gonna be using Miricle Grow and a Floralicious next season... everything from SENSI-STAR to AMNESIA-HAZE loved it ...... no, its not organic but you cant argue with the results and ease of use.....

I've used Floralicious quite a few times.......I was under the impression it was organic based.....(if only by the weight, feel, smell, etc).....

Thanks for adding that btw, because no sooner had I read that then thought about the above (5 ton sample run)..........dumping 5 extra tons of chemicals.....I try to be environmentally friendly if I can....I guess that wouldn't be, now would it ...

I'm always switching things up due to review, revision.......feeling lazy that day , etc.....and, was thinking yesterday, seems this year, when stopping anywhere to take a look, not watering base.......dumping slightly extra strong mixes in between plants...throughout plots......(same with top feeds somewhat.......maybe due to pondering working the same spaces in the future, etc.... ...Seems to be working out fairly well though...rains come in, dilute a little..(sill would be a good feed.....) I always try to schedule visits before rains coming in if hitting them with a top feed......(Does little good to do it after they have already come in.....)

Feeling a little revitalized about the season in general....(Surely a little having to do with sad location making a remarkable comeback...pis to come soon , but, without the "before" pics......really no one able to even begin to imagine how bad they were...(So bad I wrote if off and assumed was a loss.......up until recently was figuring was just a "gravy" batch/location.......took it off my mental end of season estimates.....

Almost there......(I know, I say that every day around this time ......every day closer is a good day .......)

Hope all is well with you btw........what are you going to do about op?(s)....did you get anything more from your guy?.......have you been swayed one way or another fully?

 

[Lex Dysic]

any opinions on the time release Osmocote products??

http://www2.yardiac.com/long.asp?tgs=20651799:6665620&cart_id=&item_id=10101

I was thinking couple walmart bags of osmocote + bag of water crystals/gardentrowel in one hand....

3-4 walmart bags of seedlings/clones in other hand.

Suburb/city ops ==> no heavy equipment
nothing that can't fit in the back of 35L givi top case on a dual sport....and carried quickly and easily in...with nothing coming out except empty walmart bags in one pocket and spade in other.