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Maria's Subtropical Outdoor Guerilla Grows with Connoisseur Genetics (Perpetual Journal)

Normannen

Anne enn Normal
Veteran
Thanks for your fast reply!

I just reviewed my journal here.
ThaiMadness girls first showing pistils around Nov 25, and would prob have been pollinated then already.
That's 3+ weeks ago.
The seed I picked out already had a hard shell on it, and was itself quite solid/hard.
But other seeds have obviously just been pollinated quite recently.



Sure, that's very true.
Assuming I stash each plant individually.
And some girls I plan to pollinate with two fathers -- ThaiFrican and NHxMM.

I need to carefully note my pollination date(s): December 10.

I usually harvest but leave the pollinated branches on the rest of the plant in the ground.
Though, these are long sativas, and if I pollinate maybe next weekend, they may still have another 4-6+ weeks until harvest, so can just cut and hang the whole plant to dry, they take the seeds after that from each branch.
careful, cause by then they will probably fall off when you hang the plants upside down, it's how i end up with a lot of unknowns in the corner of my dry room xD
 

Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
careful, cause by then they will probably fall off when you hang the plants upside down, it's how i end up with a lot of unknowns in the corner of my dry room xD

Oh yeah, thanks man, didn't think of that problem! Great reminder, really. Well, I could cut them down all together, but just dry the seeded branches on a tray or in a hanging paper bag, something like that. Still have a bit of time to plan for this, fortunately, but need to get onto it.

Thought about hanging inside a bag laundry bag, the mesh kind that goes into the washing machine. It would catch any seeds or even calyxes dropping, etc. Like a cheap version of a drying tent. I need to set up a rack or something. Some of these houses have rooms with some fixtures in the ceilings, just enough to hang something from. Totally open to the wind and fresh air, but also not in the sunlight. Temps will be fairly cool, just the humidity is a concern. Open sativa flowers should save the day. I've dried colas in far worse environments, haha.

I must say, I am very very happy seeing my larger SSSTN girl today. The photos don't do her justice. She's got a shape that is just going to turn into a beautiful perfect small but fully sativa bud machine. Seems like all the SSSTN journals here are just lovely plants. OJD has hit this cross one out of the park, for sure.
 

Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
Despite your adventures, I see that it is progressing well😊 very beautiful plants outdoors, I would like to learn to play with pollen...

Thanks for stopping by, @badass-eu !

Playing with pollen isn't too difficult.
But do be a little bit careful, as you don't want to pollinate the whole of your plant when she is in deep flowering stage.

I learned most of the theory from the classic Robert Clarke book Marijuana Botany. It's a bit old, but the theory is still very valid. There should be copies of it online if you Google it up.

Here I'm just 'pollen chucking' as I have so few plants that I can't do any selections.
Pollinate all the females with a few males, and after I smoke the rest of the female flower I can decide which seed-mothers I want to use for my next grows.

Collect the pollen carefully, and apply at the right time to just a single branch on your selected mother plant, adding a tag. Then wait until maturity to harvest the seeds. Store for a few months in a cool dry place. Then you're ready to use those seeds to grow some children of your mother.
 

Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
Day 69 -- from sprouting!

6 days since last picture update and visit.
Had some pretty cold weather for here.
A couple of days where overnight down to 9C and during the day it's just 11C or so.
Very wet and cloudy, barely any sunlight at all.
So no need to water anything today at all.
Though today it's just cloudy with a bit of sunshine through thick clouds.

The gate is still blocked, so went once again through the jungle around the wall.


Building Two:

1 X Super Silver Sour Thai Nevil (fem) = Swiss Thai Nevil 1 clone X SSSDH OJD cut Reversed (10-12 weeks?)
In a big 20L pot.

She's still putting on a little more height, and showing a very open sativa frame.
She's maybe 65cm-70cm tall (26"-28").
Last time leaflets just single, but she put on a few more with two then back to one again. (Why??)
PXL_20231223_023313161.jpg


Just really love the shape on this girl.
Full and open, let the light through and wind can keep her dry inside if it rains.
And then those lower branches with that classic out and up growth.

PXL_20231223_023318263.MP.jpg


That's the Big Miss SSSTN, obviously.
Little sister Little Miss SSSTN in behind in the first picture, so here she is in all her immaturity.
PXL_20231223_023343508.MP.jpg


I did another round of pollination on Big Miss SSSTN with Mr ThaiFrican, on the same branches.
Hopefully instead of 15-20 seeds from the cross I can double that.

We'll get to the NH x MM in a minute, but let's just say Mr NH x MM Grail looks like he may have dropped a tiny bit of pollen, as a few of the Big Miss SSSTN other branches have huge calyxes with dropped pistils.
Though, this is hard to say at this point, as Thai cultivars often have big calyxes anyway.
Just have to wait and see.


Fun, fun, fun!

Love and hugs,
~MJS
 
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Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
Day 69 -- from sprouting! -- continued ...


Building Two:


4 X Grail Project NH18 x MM pheno 1 (reg) = (NH18 x MM pheno 1) x (NH21 x MML Male) (12-16 weeks)
In a 15L pot.

Here's the NH x MM Grail Family:

PXL_20231223_023402087.jpg


Let's call the girl on the left Miss Grail (NLD pheno), with her pretty classic sativa bud shape and spacing.
And the girl on the right Miss Grail (indica? pheno). Can't call her WLD, as the leaves aren't wide, but the inter-nodal length is very tight, making for a single plant-bud.
They are both about 25+cm tall (10"), very short!
In the middle is their brother Mr Grail, also showing a NLD pheno. Remember he's been topped aggressively to give space to his sisters, otherwise he would be much, much taller and larger.

Miss Grail (NLD pheno):
PXL_20231223_023414127.jpg

She's also got purple/red on her leaf-stems.
Not much going on here right now, but she's still putting on her stretch.

Miss Grail (indica pheno)
PXL_20231223_023407594.jpg

This lady is just going to end up a single lump of a bud!!
Only vague concern is if she gets too dense and the problems that may bring in a wet environment ...

Quite a bit of trichome development already on her.
PXL_20231223_023503447.jpg


PXL_20231223_023508982.jpg

Oh my! I can see this better at home, now, than on-site.
This is looking very tasty indeed!

I also pollinated her again with Mr ThaiFrican on the same branches down below.
So dense in there it was hard for me to see how many seeds forming from the first round.
She really doesn't have 'branches', just that single stem and buds forming.
Grown larger, I'm imagine that she could make some huge chunky buds, for sure.

Also, as with Miss Big SSSTN, it looks like Miss Grail (indica pheno) was also lightly pollinated by Mr Grail (NLD pheno) as well.
Maybe 10-20 seeds here and there, which is fine with me!
All I need to know is that apart from the ThaiFrican pollinated branches, all other seeds are from her brother.
Effectively a NH x MM F3 (yeah, I know, not quite, but you get the idea).

And other course, the father, Mr Grail (NLD pheno):
PXL_20231223_023417696.jpg


His time is now up, and I cut him at the base.
Took off most of his flowers (not many!) and am drying them out now for pollen:

PXL_20231223_031137056.jpg


Some of those anthers are pretty immature, so may not get much.
Doesn't matter, as I'm about 90% sure he's already pollinated his sister(s) and Miss Big SSSTN.


Building One:

2 X Thai Madness (fem) = Swiss Thai Nevil 2 clone x (NH21 x MML clone Reversed) (11-14 weeks?)

Let's just show some pics of these two girls with lots of seeds growing in there.

PXL_20231223_024838557.jpg


PXL_20231223_024843044.jpg


When I harvest these seeds, ideally I should separate them.
But they were both so small and stunted, that I can barely comment on what phenos they would be if growing out properly.

-----------------

Everything's going well.
Yes, some very cold weather, and I'm sure they didn't grow much in that time.
But they are not shocked or burned by the cold, and seem just fine.

Winter solstice just passed, but the end of January is less than 11/13, six weeks from now.
Maybe the two tiny ThaiFrican girls and Miss Grail (tight pheno) will be finished by then.
And end of Feb is 11.5/12.5, more than 10 weeks from now.
Let's see!

Back to 20C+ temps very soon, with some more sunshine, though of course, it's not summer but the middle of winter!
Warmer sunny days are just a bonus at this point as far as I'm concerned.


Namo Shivaya!

Fun, fun, fun!

Love and hugs,
~MJS
 
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Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
I want to ask @ojd if he has any thoughts on the chunky 'indica' pheno of the (NH21 x MM) X (NH36 x MM) Grail project girl?
Just the NL from the NH coming through?
Her inter-nodes are very tight, but other than that she doesn't have indica bud formation (to me, at least).
 

ojd

CONNOISSEUR GENETICS
Vendor
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I want to ask @ojd if he has any thoughts on the chunky 'indica' pheno of the (NH21 x MM) X (NH36 x MM) Grail project girl?
Just the NL from the NH coming through?
Her inter-nodes are very tight, but other than that she doesn't have indica bud formation (to me, at least).
Hi

There was no x like that , you mean the NH18 x MM x NH21 x MML ? , I'm not sure at all ? , not seen 1 Indica pheno from anyone else ?.

Maybe it's your not ideal climate for these extremely wild Sativa's? , making it express and indica heritage ? , have no clue ?.

Shame your climate not great to really express the strains to there full potential but glad you can make some seeds and run them in summer season instead
 

Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
Hi

There was no x like that , you mean the NH18 x MM x NH21 x MML ? , I'm not sure at all ? , not seen 1 Indica pheno from anyone else ?.

Maybe it's your not ideal climate for these extremely wild Sativa's? , making it express and indica heritage ? , have no clue ?.

Shame your climate not great to really express the strains to there full potential but glad you can make some seeds and run them in summer season instead
thanks for the reply

yes, i meant the nh18 x mm x nh21 x mml
system wouldn't let me edit

yes, it's not ideal situation, especially the coir seedling pots restricting the roots
really just a trial run

as for summer, difficult, as anything flowering in sept-oct will get by typhoons
best to run early spring to mid summer, hoping they flower all the way through...
 

Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
should add, a few thoughts about that girl.

i wrote 'indica pheno' but that's just because she isn't a typically 'sativa' type.
but really isn't typical 'indica' either -- no wide/fat leaflets, and she still has a tapering 'spear' shape on her main cola there.
just more like a sativa but with very tight inter-node length.
which possibly suggests that its because her roots are still quite restricted by the coco coir seeding pot.
the SSSTN broke out of the coir seedling pot fairly early, but these Grail plants had a harder time.
could be their root growth patterns, or may just be that the pot was drier -- needs a fair amount of moisture to soften up the coir pot to allow the roots to break through.
i think this is the main reason -- restricted root growth, with the light hours forcing early flowering, not giving enough (any) time in veg to put out their roots before going into flower-set mode.

i used these at home with some sweet basil and tomatoes (they are still growing, but are totally shaded and get hit by all the winds, not happy at all!), but i watered them almost daily in Aug/Sept (?) so their roots broke through faster.
i still quite like them, just for ease of use, but next time (1) use bigger ones, like at least 0.5 L, (2) water/soak them more when young (without drowning the roots!) to soften them up, (3) cut some (big) holes in them before planting out to allow some places for direct root growth.
or, i could just use regular pots are transplant --- it's not like I'm bad at transplanting, see how the ThaiFricans did so well when they were young (until the snails or whatever came along...)

i added some further comments to page 1 post 1 the other day, when i found a couple of OJD's comments about the differences between the two Sour Thai Nevil phenos 1 and 2.
think i should add in the flowering time in days (since first pistils) along with the total days for each plant in future posts.
will have to dig around to check the dates for that....

just some thoughts, journaling the grow.

merry christmas, everyone!
 

Eltitoguay

Well-known member
Quite a bit of sunshine today, though temps are still around 17C or so.
Next few days will go over 20C with more sunshine.
Hooray!
Your temperatures continue to surprise me...: You are still in the same range as the Mediterranean cities between 35 and 40°N here (and below the Canary Islands, just a little further north than you, where your maximum today is practically its coastal minimum...); 35'5°N in our Mediterranean coast:
Screenshot_2023_1225_093541.png

I believed that, no matter how much difference there is in humidity and hours of clear sky, if you are not at altitude, the between 15° and 20° of latitude less than you are further south, should be more noticeable...
(However, I am at such a height and distance from the sea that for next week I will fluctuate between -2°C and 16°C).
Lots of luck, strength and prudence to promote it, and good health to be able to enjoy it.
 
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Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
Your temperatures continue to surprise me...: You are still in the same range as the Mediterranean cities between 35 and 40°N here (and below the Canary Islands, just a little further north than you, where your maximum today is practically its coastal minimum...); 35'5°N in our Mediterranean coast:
View attachment 18937700
I believed that, no matter how much difference there is in humidity and hours of clear sky, if you are not at altitude, the between 15° and 20° of latitude less than you are further south, should be more noticeable...
(However, I am at such a height and distance from the sea that for next week I will fluctuate between -2°C and 15°C).
Lots of luck, strength and prudence to promote it, and good health to be able to enjoy it.

I'm not a continental climate here, and we get almost a direct line of cold wind and rain, etc. from the northern ocean/sea.
And then that wind and rain gets funneled around the mountains, right to where I am here.
For you, it's maybe not just latitude, but "Mediterranean climate" is definitely quite warm and dry, compared to other places of same latitude.
Just about 20 km south of here and a bit inland is a different climate, savannah type, warmer and a fair bit drier.
And even just over the ridge from here, literally 500m away, the wind and rain suddenly drops off.
Then 3 km down the ridge it is still, dry, and warmer.
But here, at least, I have a full sun location, and no people around.
Over that ridge, the city starts!!

These recent temps could well be the coldest of this winter.
As I said, next week is all back to 20C+ daily highs.

I see you spend as much time thinking about the weather as I do -- outdoor growers we are, hahaha!!

I saw all your posts over at MadMac's sativa and sativa hybrid thread.
Impressive.
How is that huge haze drying and curing? Is the purple single-cola girl ready to sample yet??
 
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Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
A couple of days with some sun and a bit warmer temps, low 20s C.
Today, similar temps with some soft rain.
Next 5-7 days similar, temps around 19C-24C during the day, mostly sunny or slightly cloudy, with a touch of rain perhaps on one or two days.
 

Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
Day 76 -- from sprouting!

7 days since last picture update and visit.
Weather has been kind of average, highest up to maybe 23C and lowest maybe 16C overnight.
A bit of sun, a bit of cloud, a little rain.

Building Two:

1 X Super Silver Sour Thai Nevil (fem) = Swiss Thai Nevil 1 clone X SSSDH OJD cut Reversed (10-12 weeks?)
In a big 20L pot.
PXL_20231230_053050057.jpg


She's still putting on a little more height, and showing a very open sativa frame.
She's maybe 70cm-75cm tall (28"-30").
Lower branches also expanding out a bit more.
Closest 'branch' to the camera is the little sister.

Big girl up top:

PXL_20231230_053113935.jpg


PXL_20231230_053058498.jpg


Little flower clusters building up.

PXL_20231230_053104444.jpg

That's the Big Miss SSSTN, obviously.

Some big calyxes on this girl, with good trichome development.
And also trichs on the small sugar leaves.
Aromas are there with a gentle rub, a little fresh/fruity, but nothing unusual.

Little Miss SSSTN is a long way behind, but going into stretch now.
She may end up as tall as Big Miss.
I gave her some LST after these pics, with the usual stem crush and bend down.
The pot is positioned with Little Miss in the front to receive full light, but not blocking Big Miss as she now hangs low.

PXL_20231230_053119580.jpg


Was looking toward a round of pollination on Big Miss SSSTN with Mr Grail.
But my male harvest from last visit was too immature and no pollen resulted.
So forget about that idea, never mind....

Fun, fun, fun!

Love and hugs,
~MJS
 
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Maria Sanchez

Well-known member
Day 76 -- from sprouting! -- continued ...


Building Two:


4 X Grail Project NH18 x MM pheno 1 (reg) = (NH18 x MM pheno 1) x (NH21 x MML Male) (12-16 weeks)
In a 15L pot.

Here's the NH x MM Grail ladies:
PXL_20231230_053501020.jpg


They're grown a little.
Both are showing a little Ca def down low, but there is lots of Ca in their top-dressing, so I think it's a lack of watering that material down into the roots, now solved.

Miss Grail (NLD pheno):
PXL_20231230_053505951.jpg


PXL_20231230_053511848.jpg


She's also got purple/red on her leaf-stems.
Not much going on here right now, but she's still putting on her stretch.
She has a few calyxes that look like she was pollinated by her brother Mr Grail.
Which is good because as mentioned my own plans for that are now off.

Miss Grail (indica pheno)

PXL_20231230_053518056.jpg


PXL_20231230_053522749.jpg


Good trichome development already on her.
Aromas also building up, but again nothing particularly noteworthy at this early point.
She was pollinated on two branches by hand by Mr ThaiFrican, which are doing well.
And I'm very sure also has received pollen by Mr Grail a week+ ago.

-----------------

Everything's going well.
Sure, it's not warm sunny summer or a grow tent.
But the temps aren't going to get much or any colder, and there should actually be more sunshine.
So these ladies can just keep on doing their thing until they are mature!

A good watering lasts for seven days or so in these conditions.
But I gave them a good soaking to work that top dressing down, more P, K and Ca for them.
And just in case not much rain for the next week or two (very little forecast).
It was foggy most of today, but the fog/cloud is just clearing now.

No pics from two tiny heavily seeded Thai Madness girls.
I'm sure they're just fine, and their pot keeps the moisture the best of all.
I a few more weeks I shall just cut, dry, then collect the seeds as a smoke the remaining flower.

Performed a pooja (worship) to Maa Ganga Devi (Mother Goddess of the Ganges/Ganja) today.
May all blessings come to this grow!
May all benefit from this grow!

Fun, fun, fun!

Love and hugs,
~MJS
 
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