Hah-hah This is too funny. half of you RIGHT/WRONG people can’t even read. What are you going to do with a study paper ..doodle flying dicks on it?
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is there any substitute for Canna Nutrients that still offers that sweet, full flavour??
- Thread starter Cannamatrix
- Start date
Hiddenjems
Well-known member
I’ve grown literally 10,000’s of plants to finish, and some of the guys in here blow that away. But what do we know?
Have a great time getting rich with your advanced growing knowledge.
As mentioned this thread is very off topic. I wish a mod would clean it up back to on topic posts.
I wouldn’t say this has been off topic because it’s the quality of the harvest that we are talking about. It's what we grow the plant for. Maybe you have just money in mind too often? I'd rather smoke my own.
And what is the point of comparing nutrient lines if people don’t know how to use them the optimal way in the first place.
Quit acting like a kid when someone isn't interested in your views. And this time you have it wrong. Do the side by side grow test and then you'll know that your wrong about it atm.
Your 10 000 plants doesn’t mean anything. Nice number for sure. But it is also a sad number if you grew out that many plants w/o knowing how it works.
10 000 is a sad number to brag about if you have done it the wrong way all along. Right? Hah-ha
You keep tellling me i’m wrong but actually you’re just repeating the exact tthing i wrote already on my first post. I agree plants stop feeding close to the end, i already told you that.. Stop telling me that like i wouldn’t know it already. It makes it seem you don’t read too well.
It’s you who doesn’t know the difference of STARVING THE PLANT and feeding it till the end.
Do a side by side. Talk afters.
Hash Artist
Active member
If you feed the plant right up until it’s chopped it will die with a full stomach-so to speak-and for me that’s no good for quality smoke. Starving may not be the right word because there’s plenty of food still available in the medium. Maybe fasting is better word because I do find it beneficial to cut nutrient inputs for the last couple weeks. Let it use up what is left. After eventually using up all the food within medium it starts to consume itself-the leaves lacking nitrogen input start to go pale, and for some this is showing sign of ready for harvest.
I think the discussion might be going around in circles somewhat.
There are people that believe ash color is important, and believe it correlates with smoke quality and enjoyment, and have carried out experiments to prove the theory over many years.
There are also people that argue ash color is unimportant and that cannabis should receive optimal nutrition to the day of harvest, yet cannot explain the difference in ash color or correlations with enjoyment, saying it’s purely wet weed or uncured weed that burns nasty. These same people ignore the fact that weed can burn white when still wet and like to use the term bro science to dismiss actual experiences.
No point in arguing, the proof is in the plants not the internet. That’s all from me folks.
Peace
There are people that believe ash color is important, and believe it correlates with smoke quality and enjoyment, and have carried out experiments to prove the theory over many years.
There are also people that argue ash color is unimportant and that cannabis should receive optimal nutrition to the day of harvest, yet cannot explain the difference in ash color or correlations with enjoyment, saying it’s purely wet weed or uncured weed that burns nasty. These same people ignore the fact that weed can burn white when still wet and like to use the term bro science to dismiss actual experiences.
No point in arguing, the proof is in the plants not the internet. That’s all from me folks.
Peace
Brother Nature
Well-known member
I have been growing for years and have tried many different methods and styles, I also provide the legal medical industry in my country with a significant amount of product, all of which gets tested and graded, I have never had product returned with poor results. There’s nothing wrong with the methods the amateurs in the previous posts use, I grew that way for years and it was fine. I have since learned from my mistakes and now want to know I am doing the best for the plant that I can and not following old school forum grow methods has been working for me. I have provided info on what I believe accomplishes this but again this has become way off topic and now seems to be more about ego than plant knowledge. Peace out, I’m gonna go burn one before some uppotting…
little-soldier
Active member
not much info here. they didnt even try to test flushing a plant fed with synthetic vs organic. I bet there is a huge difference between the two. Best science is the one you try yourself because you know you are not biased against yourself
Yea or you are just talking without looking at what you are doing. Ash colour is not correlated to nutrition but to post harvest practices.
Moisture content is most important. If the flower is dry it gives white ash. Insufficiently dried flower gives sooty ash.
That also makes sense because a higher water content leads to a lower flame temperature. All that water absorbs heat. At a lower temperature you get incomplete combustion. Incomplete combustion leads to uncombusted carbon compounds, soot, that is of black colour.
Alternativly, adding magnesium and calcium salts post harvest leads to a white ash colour.
Why does correctly finished wet weed burn white after a 3 day dry? You said moisture would make it burn sooty but it doesn’t. Explain this please.
Why does weed that has been overfed burn black when bone dry, even when torched with a Bunsen burner flame? You said properly dried weed burns white.
Why do the plants that are fed more smoke with a blacker ash and taste harsher compared to those that are fed less? Both received same drying time and were bone dry, one burned cleaner than the other. Is this a coincidence? The only difference was nutrition. Is this a coincidence?
Why do tissue analysis results correlate with what I’m saying?
If you can’t answer these questions, repeating the same nonsense that has been said by other people earlier in this thread is just provoking continued argument without adding anything useful to the discussion.
I said I wouldn’t get into this anymore but blatant repetition to try and dismiss the results of actual experiments is not very scientific is it?
Peace
Claiming to be scientific and then just stating you're right is the opposite.
I did something different. I explained the mechanism that leads to a certain outcome. You just spewed some uncontrolled experiments.
Please show me the carbonaceous compound that is black and doesn't burn at 1200 C in an oxidizing atmosphere.
It’s not a matter of right or wrong, I’m not stating I’m right, I’m stating the results of mine and many many others experimentation. You didn’t state anything but theoretical nonsense. What has 1200C got to do with a joint that burns at way less than that?
Do you want me to post the tissue analysis results?
Why are you ignoring what is being used as evidence? Why when we were judging bone dry flowers at the icmag cup did many samples burn black and taste nasty? Ask any of the judges if they thought the flowers were dry enough? Then argue with them that black ash is due to moisture? In fact come to the event and we can all show you the evidence in person.
You didn’t answer any of the questions in my post above, just more provocative nonsense.
Peace
Do you want me to post the tissue analysis results?
Why are you ignoring what is being used as evidence? Why when we were judging bone dry flowers at the icmag cup did many samples burn black and taste nasty? Ask any of the judges if they thought the flowers were dry enough? Then argue with them that black ash is due to moisture? In fact come to the event and we can all show you the evidence in person.
You didn’t answer any of the questions in my post above, just more provocative nonsense.
Peace
THE PEOPLE WHO FEED THEIR PLANTS TILL HARVEST DAY
You guys got me interested.. because, as i already explained, the plants i have had to cut down 4-5 weeks too early when they were still getting plenty of food the shit was just too hot on the lungs to smoke
How do you guys do it?
How strong is your typical feed during the last week? as in EC reading?
How about the NPK profile of that feed?
And ..
How does your indoor bud grown that way compare to outdoor weed?
Kind regards..
You guys got me interested.. because, as i already explained, the plants i have had to cut down 4-5 weeks too early when they were still getting plenty of food the shit was just too hot on the lungs to smoke
How do you guys do it?
How strong is your typical feed during the last week? as in EC reading?
How about the NPK profile of that feed?
And ..
How does your indoor bud grown that way compare to outdoor weed?
Kind regards..
xtsho
Well-known member
I try to never go over 1.6 EC / 800 PPM during the grow. I also cut that back to 1.0 EC / 500 ppm towards the end of flower. I also never use any additives.
For the last couple of years I've been using either GH MaxiBloom 5-15-14 Or a local product called VitaGrow that's a 3 part. Basically it's calcium nitrate, a micronutrient, and MKP. I stopped using the MKP years ago and just use the calcium nitrate 13-0-0 and the micronutrient 3-10-20. I use the low end of the recommendations which is 1/2 tsp of each per gallon which brings me to around 1.6 EC / 800 PPM. That includes the EC of the tap water. I've been feeding this way for years in coco with Blumats "no runoff" or hand watering with slight runoff. When I grow in soil I do the same EC but don't feed every watering. Plain water-plain water -feed-plain water-plain water-feed. Sometimes the last irrigation before chopping is a feed. Sometimes it's not. It just depends on how the cycle turns out or when I decide to harvest based on available time schedule.
I don't go by a calendar or weeks. In fact half the time I don't even know how long they have been flowering because I forget and often don't write it down. I don't look at trichomes. I can tell when to harvest by just visually looking at the buds. Once they're ready to harvest I might still wait a week or more depending on my schedule. Other things in my life take priority over my plants so I get to them when it's convenient. I don't obsess over them. I plant seeds and grow. I end up with more weed than I need and end up giving most of it away. I still have weed from last years outdoor grow.
The only time I get really involved is at the time of pollination and I have to start isolating plants in different rooms. I make seeds every run so for maybe a week they keep me a little busier than normal but once that's done they go back in the flower tent and I only check on them to water/feed. When I run Blumats sometimes I'll go 4-5 days without even opening up the tent. I've been growing for so long it's just another chore.
I disagree with the white/black ash reasons but like you said in one of your posts. It's not worth arguing about.
1200 C is the temperature of a bunsen burner (up to 1300). I also said oxidizing flame. If excess fuel is used the flame is reducing. Under reducing conditions it is unlikely that carbon oxidizes (burns) and then you get black ash.
But the black ash is caused by the experimental conditions of your test, not the properties of the sample. Controlling experiments by using both positive and negative controls is a step to getting a definitive answer.
Why does bone dry weed taste nasty? Well... It's supposed to. That's why boveda packs exist.
Regarding your other questions: you didn't ask questions but said that there are tests that prove your hypothesis (e.g. correctly finished but wet weed burns as I expect it to). But what can I say to that? You didn't post what correctly means, what wet means, how you burned it. Sure I can answer to that question but I'm not in the business of nonsense.
When I did reply to you I expected that you understood that. 1200 C is the temperature of a flame. That's not your expertise and that is fine. But don't tell that science is useless if you don't understand experimental design.
The statement may not be well received because everybody’s got these notions that you need to use exotic material to grow pot. I’ve grown thousands of plants over the last 25 years and the only product that I use is general hydroponics three way along with cal mag and liquid silica… It’s very simple and basic to mix and use if you use common sense you will have zero problems. I think it makes my flowers grow quite well and I’m pleased with the results.
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Hiddenjems
Well-known member
There is going to be a big difference between people running hydro or aero, people using a soilless medium, and growers in soil.
People using recirculating Rez hydroponics, and drain to waste people checking ec of the runoff are going to have more data on what’s going on moment to moment than soil or soilless medium people.
The last week it doesn’t matter if I drain my Rez and use pure water, or if I just top off the Rez with pure water.
Say my ec is 1.5 and my tank is 50 gallons. As the Rez gets near 25 gallons I check it and the ec is close to 3. That means the plants are only taking up water, and are close to finished.
I let my plants run until they stop eating.
People using recirculating Rez hydroponics, and drain to waste people checking ec of the runoff are going to have more data on what’s going on moment to moment than soil or soilless medium people.
The last week it doesn’t matter if I drain my Rez and use pure water, or if I just top off the Rez with pure water.
Say my ec is 1.5 and my tank is 50 gallons. As the Rez gets near 25 gallons I check it and the ec is close to 3. That means the plants are only taking up water, and are close to finished.
I let my plants run until they stop eating.
Thanks for the reply..
Interesting to see that we’re not too far of in our approach
I agree. I think that around EC 1.4-1.6 range is maximum for most if not any cannabis plant. The health of genetics are messed up if they really need more than that.
My NPK profile during the last weeks of feeding is in the same ball park with your Maxibloom .maybe little smaller N ratio compared to P and K than on your Maxi but it’s not too far off.
The hermi plants i cut down early and tried smoking were getting stronger food than EC 1.0 maybe in 1.2-1.3 range but i think 1.0 is still quite potent solution at harvest time.
The way i do it, the nutrient content in soil or in what it leaches out will eventually go well below ec 1.0
I start the 5 week starving by watering the plant with very little runn off so i don’t wash out the food stuff. this goes on for the first 3 weeks of the affair
Then for the smoothest product i rinse the medium quite well to wash out left over nutrients at the start of the second to last week and then repeat that at the start of the last week before harvest. There is a difference in smoothness if i don’t do this and only give them water and topmax for the 5 weeks.
The way i see it. If i notice a difference whether i rinse the medium our few times really well during the last weeks or not then i think others would notice it as well. Small things can make a noticeable improvement.
We shouldn’t be too stuck in our ways. and especially we should go thinking our product couldn’t be any better. I’m not close to being done improving things myself. But starving my plants is the way to go for me. It’s a game changer level improvement for smoke quality.
Ive been thinking of trying Canna’s Bio Flores but lets see. it would cost maybe 50% more than biobizz. Bio Flores costs more and is less concentrated.
I got 2 Ace Ethiopians in new soil i’m trying out. Canna’s Pro soil actually. The plants seem happy.
It’s good to keep trying new things.
Well, thanks again for the write up. It’s nice to see someone making an effort to explain their ways. We’re not that far off. I’d still try do something in new ways if i was you, hah-ha
Cheers
xtsho
Well-known member
I'm not here to name call and denigrate people. We might disagree but there is no reason we can't disagree and still act like adults and discuss things without being adversaries. My philosophy with growing cannabis differs from that of others. It's no worse or better than others. My goal is to make it as easy as possible.
Sure there are things that I could probably do to get a better yield, make it better, but I'm satisfied with what I'm getting right now. I'm not willing to devote anymore time, money, or energy to change what's working for me right now.
I grow and smoke cannabis. I don't live for it. I only smoke 3-4 days a week and then it's a small amount. I prefer lower THC strains. I no longer want to just get "Baked." Years ago it was an income but now it's just a hobby.
The weed I grow meets my needs and those I give it to don't complain. I just packed a bowl with the last of the Kerala I grew last winter. The ash is white. After that I packed a bowl of some Afghan I grew. The Afghan wasn't black but it wasn't white and tasted just fine. Nice and smooth. No harsh taste or feeling like you're going to cough.
Now I've just smoked more weed than I normally do in a couple days just to see what the ash looked like and I'm extremely stoned. The lady is yelling at me to make dinner and all I want to do is lay down and take a nap.
TheGhostoftheNorthside
Member
House and garden aqua flakes
Pure blend pro
Pure blend pro
little-soldier
Active member
tried them and still not satisfied
