is there any substitute for Canna Nutrients that still offers that sweet, full flavour??

[Hiddenjems]

When you’re using a 2 or 3 part nute, one of which has the pk with little n, why buy more pk instead of just changing your base nute mixture?

 

[Hiddenjems]

This is gh late bloom, but it’s typical of the ingredients in any 2 or 3 part bloom formula.

So why by a separate pk when you can just use more of this part in your mix?

 

[NorCalSkunkLord]

Magnesium sulfate: 10:12 Mg:S

Flora pro; 4:9 Mg:S

Where is the extra S coming from.

These are garbage chemical fertilizers. They use Nitrate and nonsense trace mineral profiles for 90% of the grow, then try to clean it up at the end. Nitrate has to be converted. The "finisher" has the trace minerals required to convert the excess N. When you see plants that are yellow + mauve colored, they have excess Nitrate that is not being converted.

Excess Nitrate (faded plants) = extremely low quality crops. Yet people keep growing with Nitrate and random trace mineral profiles that make less than zero sense, instead of literally any other option,because it's more profitable.

 

[Terppalooza]

I mean in theory it wouldnt be to hard to get something similar. with basic ingredients. the total ppm. of the canna formula seems to be 177, 143, 110 ppm so just mix up some other cheeper ingredients to get there.. that being said i think 143mg p seems ridiculous. since some study show that anything more then 60ppm P may be plenty or even too much

 

[Terppalooza]

This is just a 3 second example of what a canna clone could look like.... look at the price difference (16x cheeper). off course not a perfect match but im sure getting very close to a perfect match, wont be hard..

 

[LostTribe]

Masterblend or the other jacks alternative. I had better results than canna ab.

https://www.icmag.com/threads/cheap-nutrient-line-for-commercial-and-home-grows.377753/unread

 

[weedemart]

View attachment 18956282 This is just a 3 second example of what a canna clone could look like.... look at the price difference (16x cheeper). off course not a perfect match but im sure getting very close to a perfect match, wont be hard..

You need more ingredients to make it perfect but you are on the right path

Cannabis growth is driven by nitrogen. I'll let you figure what the others ingredients you need.

 

[Terppalooza]

You need more ingredients to make it perfect but you are on the right path

Cannabis growth is driven by nitrogen. I'll let you figure what the others ingredients you need.

It's a quick example. I made a program to clone the formula. You just select what nutrients you have lying around it will try to match you the best fitting match. In this case this was the best fit it found, for the fertilizers I already have here

 

[weedemart]

It's a quick example. I made a program to clone the formula. You just select what nutrients you have lying around it will try to match you the best fitting match. In this case this was the best fit it found, for the fertilizers I already have here

Not bad for a quick example but with this formula you would end up way way above canna E.C and your P.H will be out of whack in few hours after the irrigation because of the imbalance between anion and cations.

Too much calcium nitrate
Too much MKP
Not enought acidity; hints monoammonium phosphate,ammonium sulfate,ammonium nitrate( i dont think you can source it tho)

a good target for ammonium is 10% of overall nitrogen

and pick dtpa iron over eddha. eddha is so tightly bind that it's not as effective as dtpa. even edta is fine but less reliable.

But personally I would go with premixed brand like masterprod plant for micro.

 

[Terppalooza]

You need more ingredients to make it perfect but you are on the right path

Cannabis growth is driven by nitrogen. I'll let you figure what the others ingredients you need.

Not bad for a quick example but with this formula you would end up way way above canna E.C and your P.H will be out of whack in few hours after the irrigation because of the imbalance between anion and cations.

Too much nitrate calcium
Too much MKP
Not enought acidity; hints monoammonium phosphate,ammonium sulfate,ammonium nitrate( i dont think you can source it tho)

a good target for ammonium is 10% of overall nitrogen

and pick dtpa iron over eddha. eddha is so tightly bind that it's not as effective as dtpa. even edta is fine but less reliable.

But personally I would go with premixed brand like masterprod plant for micro.

Why to much nitrate. Would you not want to avoid ammonium?

 

[LostTribe]

It sounds like you need to find something premixed. This is not the way to go about it.

I'd say stick with what you know and use what you've got or been using. ie canna or maybe the lucas gh 2 part micro and bloom. You can sup with an mpk and it would be similar to canna just use the boost.

 

[weedemart]

Why to much nitrate. Would you not want to avoid ammonium?

not too much nitrate, too much calcium nitrate.

Why?

Because if you use only calcium nitrate as source of nitrate you will have way too much calcium in your feed resulting in accumulation,it will mess with ph and compete against other elements.you would benefit from using other sources of nitrate.

Use calcium nitrate to reach calcium requirement then use a mix of magnesium nitrate and potassium nitrate to reach your nitrogen needs then start dial other elements.

For ammonium, you cant avoid it unless you plant in a acidic medium/soils.
Ammonium-free fertilizer are known to raise pH overtime.
Ammonium is the strongest cation , it will have a huge effect on lowering ph overtime.<

Need to understand the role of each element and the cation/anion balance to make a good mix.

in a good mix you want;

(part A)
calcium nitrate
potassium nitrate
magnesium nitrate

(part B)
monopotassium phosphate
ammonium sulfate
chelated micro mix

with a pinch of potassium sillicate(part C)

 

[Terppalooza]

It sounds like you need to find something premixed. This is not the way to go about it.

I'd say stick with what you know and use what you've got or been using. ie canna or maybe the lucas gh 2 part micro and bloom. You can sup with an mpk and it would be similar to canna just use the boost.

Why stick to premixed. They are overpriced. And honestly completely fucked up npk ratios in my opinion. I for one have been having great results with my own mixes. Much better and more consistent then brand name premixed fertilizers

 

[Terppalooza]

not too much nitrate, too much calcium nitrate.

Why?

Because if you use only calcium nitrate as source of nitrate you will have way too much calcium in your feed resulting in accumulation,it will mess with ph and compete against other elements.you would benefit from using other sources of nitrate.

Use calcium nitrate to reach calcium requirement then use a mix of magnesium nitrate and potassium nitrate to reach your nitrogen needs then start dial other elements.

For ammonium, you cant avoid it unless you plant in a acidic medium/soils.
Ammonium-free fertilizer are known to raise pH overtime.
Ammonium is the strongest cation , it will have a huge effect on lowering ph overtime.<

Need to understand the role of each element and the cation/anion balance to make a good mix.

in a good mix you want;

(part A)
calcium nitrate
potassium nitrate
magnesium nitrate

(part B)
monopotassium phosphate
ammonium sulfate
chelated micro mix

with a pinch of potassium sillicate(part C)

i appreciate the reply. you have any pointers where i can gain a better understanding of the cation/anion balance???

 

[Hiddenjems]

It sounds like you need to find something premixed. This is not the way to go about it.

I'd say stick with what you know and use what you've got or been using. ie canna or maybe the lucas gh 2 part micro and bloom. You can sup with an mpk and it would be similar to canna just use the boost.

This is what I’m talking about. When doing Lucas you don’t need a bloom boost. Your part 2 is literally bloom nutes. If you want pk just change the ratio of what you’re already using.

 

[weedemart]

Why stick to premixed. They are overpriced. And honestly completely fucked up npk ratios in my opinion. I for one have been having great results with my own mixes. Much better and more consistent then brand name premixed fertilizers

i appreciate the reply. you have any pointers where i can gain a better understanding of the cation/anion balance???

Except if you are commercials at large scale , you dont need to make your own mix , except for educational and research purpose. It can be really a pain to weight and mix. Most salt are hygroscopic and it become useless to weight them. Premixed are the easy way for hobby/med grower that seek quality at cheap price.

Nitrate, Ammonium and pH in hydroponics - Science in Hydroponics

 

[Terppalooza]

Except if you are commercials at large scale , you dont need to make your own mix , except for educational and research purpose. It can be really a pain to weight and mix. Most salt are hygroscopic and it become useless to weight them. Premixed are the easy way for hobby/med grower that seek quality at cheap price.

Nitrate, Ammonium and pH in hydroponics - Science in Hydroponics

i mean honsetly i make a stock solution every two weeks. fill it into bottlws and use it liek canna. just that my entire formula is in 2 bottles. so i do less work every day and mix for an hour every two weeks. its very easy and stress free. but now the big benifit is gainign a deeper understanding whats going wrong being able to adjust to individual plants. and having assued consistency once you have gotten your mix on point. for near no mobney atleas in contrast to. premade mixes! i do still see the benifit for everyone who relies on their grow to bring them weed and nobody else. its about optimization

 

[Terpyterps]

If you are after awesome taste and smoke/vape, I would recommend to go for organic soil or organic coco. I used to be all-in hydrodude, but once I tried organic soil using Plagron organic line I got stuck with it because it was delicious tasting bud and was not much lower yields either. You can run Plagron line using just Alga Bloom basically, maybe add some Green Sensation at the end as PK and carbon boost. I guess it’s the simplicity that got also my attention. Just check that your soil is pre fertilised if you go just with those two products.

At the moment I run Greenhouse Powder Feeding organic line, it is meant to be used as top dressing or mix in soil, but my plants have been loving it. On top of that I use just Plagron Green Sensation from week 2 or 3 of flowering and EM-1. So i just give plain water and every second week Enhancer that has beneficial bacteria and fungi and EM-1 that has all those others goodies. So simple, finally I don’t have thousand different bottles and PH/EC meters and their calibration liquids etc.

At the moment I run some autos and started them in BioBizz light mix and added 1.5g/L soil the greenhouse powder feeding grow and bloom, worm castings and bio char at 10% from volume added together and top dresses them with 2g/L bloom when they started pre-flowering and from week twoish I started to add Green Sensation at 1/3 dose once I a week and slowly rising the dose till they are matured enough to slowly mature till they exhaust all the nutrients.

Got some Strawberry Gorilla, Gorilla Glue from Fast Buds, Mimosa from 00 Seeds and Sticky Orange XXL from Sensi Seeds. Next run will be photoperiods that are now in the veg in the same tent. There are some good strains also coming, like Golden Pussy and Orange GroovyeBX from Grateful Seeds and Sunset Paradise from Paradise Seeds. Running all this in 2x4 with two Mars Hydro TS-1000 LEDs.

But best way to improve your smoke is to steer away from salt based nutrients and go with organic. Hydro grown buds are also good, but you just have to run your grow with minimal input of salts and let them flush well and cure them well. When running organic nutrients you free so much time and effort to make your buds taste good and you are not going to have big impact on your yield, it is just bit slower than hydro.

Less is more always with salt based nutrients, always.

 

[stiff]

Cool @weedemart Thanks for the heads up regarding athena. Well we cant get Jacks in eu so do any know of other brands. Btw @Cannamatrix is adv. Hydro clean then?

There's hakaphos..check it out! Exactly what you're after

 

[Terppalooza]

There's hakaphos..check it out! Exactly what you're after

hakaphos, haifa, yara!! are all great there are many more tho!