Installing a subpanel - need advice

[simpleword]

Okay so if I use 120v receptacles, I would just replace the neutral wire with the other hot?

I really appreciate all the advice you've given me ballastman, you've really helped me out.

 

[Guest]

Yep thats it,put either hot on the siver terminal it makes zero difference

 

[Guest]

Jacksonslade, Sandman, Ballastman.......

Jacksonslade, Sandman, Ballastman.......

You guys are all very good representatives or our community and cause. Spending this much time helping out a fellow member. I just have to give you guys all some props.

I will also be giving each of you some rep. points too for what its worth.


Peace

 

[Guest]

Sandman, and Ballastman---- won't let me. Need to spread it around first but won't forget...

Peace

 

[simpleword]

I agree Bree, everyone has been very helpful.

One last question I forgot to go over with my friend: Do I need to use the box bonding screw?

The sub panel and outlets are now fully wired and finished! All that's left is to connect the sub panel to the 60 amp breaker in the main breaker box. The wire is run under the house and up into main breaker, it's just a matter of plugging wires into the appropriate spots.

I'll probably post pictures tonight to make sure everything looks kosher. Thanks again guys!

 

[MTF-Sandman]

Yes, the box should be bonded to the ground bus...that'll prevent a short from energizing the box (and any metal attached to them) which will trip the 60a feeding the subpanel...instead of just leaving it energized and risking your safety.

 

[Guest]

Post some pics when you finish up if you have a camera,I wanna see.

 

[simpleword]

I sure will ballastman. I have a digital SLR.

I just realized a mistake I made though. I planned on using plug in timers, but I'm using 120v receptacles wire for 240 volts. So that's not going to work. I have been looking at direct wire timers like the wh40 or wh21 and I'll probably go with something like that. I have 3 20 amp breakers, one going to the a/c and the other two go to a double outlet each. I'm assuming there's no way I could use the wh40 for both outlet circuits is there? If not I was looking at just getting two wh21 timers which look like they'd work well. The only thing is that it's a single pole breaker where as the wh40 is a double pole breaker, and I don't know what difference that makes in regards to timers. I know what it means when it's referring to breakers though. Would this make a difference? Here is the instruction manual for the wh21:

http://www.intermatic.com/images/instruction_sheets/158WH11638.pdf

 

[Guest]

I'm a little confused at this point as to exactly what you've done,when you said the wire was pulled to the receptacles,I assumed you already had the WH-40 mounted and wired up as the idea is to come from the panel to the timer and from the timer to a box holding the receptacles.You're not going to like this,I didnt realize you were running 4K in lighting or I'd have told you off the bat to use a 2 pole 30A breaker and #10AWG wire from the panel to the WH40 and from the wh40 to the receptacles.I dont know where my head was at.You can run all 4 fixtures off 1 #10 wire 30A 240V circuit and plug all 4 fixtures into 1 box holding 2 duplex receptacles.Thats the best logical way to do it,not two 20A 240V circuits.Man I just dont know did I tell you to do that.Shit I'm sorry.I'm only talking about maybe a couple feet of #10 wire,and you'd have to get a 2 pole 30A breaker too.Shit.Its too simple I dont know what happened I'll have to go back and look at what the heck I said.I run 3 1K fixtures exactly that way,and there's room for 4 on the circuit.

 

[Guest]

Opinions, opinions...

Opinions, opinions...

I sure will ballastman. I have a digital SLR.

I just realized a mistake I made though. I planned on using plug in timers, but I'm using 120v receptacles wire for 240 volts. So that's not going to work. I have been looking at direct wire timers like the wh40 or wh21 and I'll probably go with something like that. I have 3 20 amp breakers, one going to the a/c and the other two go to a double outlet each. I'm assuming there's no way I could use the wh40 for both outlet circuits is there? If not I was looking at just getting two wh21 timers which look like they'd work well. The only thing is that it's a single pole breaker where as the wh40 is a double pole breaker, and I don't know what difference that makes in regards to timers. I know what it means when it's referring to breakers though. Would this make a difference? Here is the instruction manual for the wh21:

http://www.intermatic.com/images/instruction_sheets/158WH11638.pdf

Yes that wh21 would work, but go with a double pole(wh40) because with a single pole one wire will allways be "hot" at the plug. Yes you can wire more then one "thing" to those timers as long as you don't go over the rated amps of the timer, remember it's only one "timer" so has to be same time frame(on-off). Please, it seems that you want your room to be right, don't use 120v outlets for 240v, use the ones that you can't plug the wrong thing into(240v 20A) by mistake.

Added

ballastman is right about the breakers. If you just bought new one you should be able to take them back and trade for the right one, and get some change back. a little rewireing at the box, one wire from the outlets to each pole(timer or panel) (white-white,black-black to each screw set leaving the ground alone), rock n roll

 

[simpleword]

Okay, I'm going to switch out the 20 amp breakers for 1 30 amp and run it to a wh40 (or is there something I can buy today at home depot that would work?) and then to a box with 2 duplex receptacles. I'm just a little confused on how to wire the second receptacle off of the first one. I know I just run the hots from the bottom screws of the first receptacle to the respective top screws of the second, but do I have to do anything with the ground?

Jackson Slade: I'd really like to use actual 240v outlets but there are two problems:

1. I couldn't find any duplex 240v receptacles
2. I don't know how to wire a new plug in to my lights. Do I just splice the wires inside to a new plug with wire nuts or what?

Thanks for the advice, it's fine that I have to change things, I want to do it right.

 

[Guest]

Word

1) Ya don't think they make them duplex. I ain' seen one anyways. So more Plug ins or tieing the lights together. Use a covered box run two or more cords from your ballasts into it, tie them together into one cord coming out use wire nuts (I like coating them with clear GE calking too but aleast use tape). Just remember Amprage, white wires to white wires, yatta... yatta... yatta.

2) The new male plug ins will just screw together. cut off the old one peal back the coating strip the wires to the gauge right on the inside of the new plug stick them in the holes and tighten the screws. you can "daisy chain" both the recptacles or the lights as long as you follow the amprage rule.

top) Looks like you got the idea, just tie the ground together make a "pig tail" with a wire nut if you want/need. using a small third wire twist the ground wires with it, cap and hook the single wire to ground, dig it?

 

[simpleword]

1) Ya don't think they make them duplex. I ain' seen one anyways. So more Plug ins or tieing the lights together. Use a covered box run two or more cords from your ballasts into it, tie them together into one cord coming out use wire nuts (I like coating them with clear GE calking too but aleast use tape). Just remember Amprage, white wires to white wires, yatta... yatta... yatta.

Okay, so what your saying is to just use two outlets and then splice two ballast power cords together? That would work fine, I didn't know that could be done.

2) The new male plug ins will just screw together. cut off the old one peal back the coating strip the wires to the gauge right on the inside of the new plug stick them in the holes and tighten the screws. you can "daisy chain" both the recptacles or the lights as long as you follow the amprage rule.

top) Looks like you got the idea, just tie the ground together make a "pig tail" with a wire nut if you want/need. using a small third wire twist the ground wires with it, cap and hook the single wire to ground, dig it?

I don't quite understand this step, would you mind clarifying?

If I do go with 240 volt receptacles, how would I wire them together on one circuit? The 120 volt receptacles have the screws to allow me to daisy chain, but not the 240 volt units.

I apologize if I'm being thick here, I just want to understand everything clearly. Thanks!

 

[Guest]

1) Ya don't think they make them duplex. I ain' seen one anyways. So more Plug ins or tieing the lights together. Use a covered box run two or more cords from your ballasts into it, tie them together into one cord coming out use wire nuts (I like coating them with clear GE calking too but aleast use tape). Just remember Amprage, white wires to white wires, yatta... yatta... yatta.

Okay, so what your saying is to just use two outlets and then splice two ballast power cords together? That would work fine, I didn't know that could be done.

2) The new male plug ins will just screw together. cut off the old one peal back the coating strip the wires to the gauge right on the inside of the new plug stick them in the holes and tighten the screws. you can "daisy chain" both the recptacles or the lights as long as you follow the amprage rule.

top) Looks like you got the idea, just tie the ground together make a "pig tail" with a wire nut if you want/need. using a small third wire twist the ground wires with it, cap and hook the single wire to ground, dig it?

I don't quite understand this step, would you mind clarifying?

If I do go with 240 volt receptacles, how would I wire them together on one circuit? The 120 volt receptacles have the screws to allow me to daisy chain, but not the 240 volt units.

I apologize if I'm being thick here, I just want to understand everything clearly. Thanks!

Woring on some pics as we speak if I can get my old camera to work... Left the new one in the car last night... Give me abit...

 

[simpleword]

Okay thanks!

I made this diagram, is this the way I would wire two 240v receptacles to the same breaker?

 

[Guest]

Okay thanks!

I made this diagram, is this the way I would wire two 240v receptacles to the same breaker?

That is a "daisy chain". I knew you had it. Looking good, unlike these pictures... couldn't get the old camera to turn on so... "Web Cam"



This is a 120v male plug, but the inside of all of them are about the same all screws, and green is allways ground. Note the built in cord clamp allways get that kind when buying male plugs



"Pig tail"
Hard to make out but, the two on the left are your ballasts and the left one is the "plug in". Inside a box. Hook all the same colored wires together as "one wire" each, just like you did in your drawing, cap them, seal/tape them, real easy. Now two lights are using one plug. They do make a splice(instead of caps) for this, maybe might find some at DePot and if you seal it(shrink tape) you wouldn't need a box for each split. When using a box use them cord clamps in the knock outs please, people...

 

[simpleword]

Awesome, thanks very much. I understand perfectly. The only thing I don't understand is what kind of box you are talking about.

Thanks again for all your help.

 

[Guest]

Sorry my bad, juction box, with a solid lid. Square or Octagon even one like you put your receptacles in. Just to keep things neat/safe. if you use those splices(get the ones that screw tight, not crimp) you'll have a knot, but if it's done right it's safe alone, without a box.

 

[simpleword]

Great! What did you use for the wire that actually plugs in to the outlet? Did you just cut one wire short and splice the other in to it, and use the remainder of the one you cut as the actual plug? Or did you cut them both short and splice them in to a whole new wire? If so what kind? Just one that matches the gauge of the ballast wire?

 

[simpleword]

Ok here is the subpanel and outlets as they are now. The conduit running over the door is for the AC outlet.

Here is the proposed fix, does this look right to everyone?