ICMAG Administration endorses The Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010

[mrwags]

i don't think it's so much about the anti tax, as it is about the anti regulation intended to monopolize the cannabis industry and the new cannabis related felonies it creates. i don't thin anyone minds having their profits taxed if that gives them legitimacy, but this seem to be heading towards a very few very big producers being given a monopoly to be in the cannabis business.

In the Den I have a post regrading what has ALREADY happened. In the mid 90's I knew of a truck driving who was making a delivery to in his opinion the largest shed he has ever seen. This thing was in his opinion SEVERAL football fields in size. For those of you who don't know it yet,truck drivers are very lonely and very nosy so once he reached his delivery point he started to ask questions.

Come to find out he was delivering equipment to plant,harvest,de-seed package and ship MJ cigarettes. Now I have not been to Cali once they got those vending machines put up but has anyone got a pack out of one and seen who makes them?

The reason I ask is the bill for this shipment was sent to and paid by RJ Reynolds over 16 years ago.


My Dated Penny
Mr.Wags

 

[mullray]

In the Den I have a post regrading what has ALREADY happened. In the mid 90's I knew of a truck driving who was making a delivery to in his opinion the largest shed he has ever seen. This thing was in his opinion SEVERAL football fields in size. For those of you who don't know it yet,truck drivers are very lonely and very nosy so once he reached his delivery point he started to ask questions.

Come to find out he was delivering equipment to plant,harvest,de-seed package and ship MJ cigarettes. Now I have not been to Cali once they got those vending machines put up but has anyone got a pack out of one and seen who makes them?

The reason I ask is the bill for this shipment was sent to and paid by RJ Reynolds over 16 years ago.


My Dated Penny
Mr.Wags

Sounds like a great conspiracy theory Great little ditty though. Fact is if it isn't RJ Reynolds it's going to be someone else. Might as well be R J Reynolds - either way I'll be growing my own. The Oakland licenses look set to be given the rubber stamp - they aren't going to R J Reynolds but instead Med Dispensaries and operators who have been working for the cause for years. and I know what some will say - capitalists blah blah blah. Yeah well, they had the nerve to go for it when others chose to hide in the shadows selling their overpriced black market product (which of course makes them non capitalists???)

 

[igrowone]

Sounds like a great conspiracy theory Great little ditty though. Fact is if it isn't RJ Reynolds it's going to be someone else. Might as well be R J Reynolds - either way I'll be growing my own. The Oakland licenses look set to be given the rubber stamp - they aren't going to R J Reynolds but instead Med Dispensaries and operators who have been working for the cause for years. and I know what some will say - capitalists blah blah blah. Yeah well, they had the nerve to go for it when others chose to hide in the shadows selling their overpriced black market product (which of course makes them non capitalists???)

i'll second the nerve part, and it's going to take plenty of nerve to sink the big bucks in these huge ops
2 years from now, when we will likely be in a post Obama country, i'd think you're taking plenty of risk in creating such a clear trail of activity

 

[binaryfission]

that of course is more problematic
still, that same standard applies with current laws, MJ + kids = problems
if you have kids, good odor control is probably a very good idea for the foreseeable future

this will be destroyed shortly after passage.

I guarantee there is a REAL med patient, with kids who will challenge with a lawsuit. Growing pot is not a danger to a child.

Even if they don't, where is Child Protective Service going to get the money to do all these searches? POlice make their money of arresting non violent offenders. This legislation will eliminate many of those folks. And police budgets. There won't be any cops measuring people's little grows.

PARA_NOID....

 

[pimpjuice]

bye

 

[pimpjuice]

25 sq ft? Isn't that the area that the 2 inch dia stock of the plant enters the ground or soil? Are we counting the underground roots, or the above ground branches in this 25 sq ft area? If so then it would be cubic ft. A 25 sq ft area would be the area that the stock of the plant takes up, like 2 sq inches. So that would be a lot of plants if one plant takes up 2 sq in. of area, right? We are talking about ground surface area, right? Just a thought.

back away from your bong dude, my god

 

[igrowone]

this will be destroyed shortly after passage.

I guarantee there is a REAL med patient, with kids who will challenge with a lawsuit. Growing pot is not a danger to a child.

Even if they don't, where is Child Protective Service going to get the money to do all these searches? POlice make their money of arresting non violent offenders. This legislation will eliminate many of those folks. And police budgets. There won't be any cops measuring people's little grows.

PARA_NOID....

now that you mention it, kind of surprised this hasn't been done yet
surely many MMJ patients with children
but i think passage of 19 would create a legal environment in California that could do just what you said

 

[JJScorpio]

Child endangerment?

Thx. I forgot about that one. Another reason to vote yes.

Right now, if a couple are growing in a 25 sq ft area of their home, and they get caught they can have their children removed and be charged with Endangering the welfare of a child.

But I guess that's OK for some people as long as they can keep selling them 60 dollar eighths.......

 

[vta]

i don't think it's so much about the anti tax, as it is about the anti regulation intended to monopolize the cannabis industry and the new cannabis related felonies it creates. i don't thin anyone minds having their profits taxed if that gives them legitimacy, but this seem to be heading towards a very few very big producers being given a monopoly to be in the cannabis business.

I see your point but I don't agree...totally. 4 is not a monopoly. There is nothing in their deal that makes clubs buy from the 4. So they are not 'guaranteed' a market. Also...Oakland is just the 1st city to do this. Other cities are planning the same thing. After 19 passes...you will see a hundred cities regulating the growing distribution and selling of cannabis. All of which will require permits and such. So while Oakland will only let a few players...soon there will be thousands of NEW commercial business. And I am sure some of those will be owned by IC members

The feds will have a field day with oakland if the 4 city mega-grows think their poised for recreational growing.

The feds don't care about state laws and it's pretty obvious. However, please remember that the Oakland thing is 'not' about recreational cannabis. They are set up for Medical use under 215.

 

[JJScorpio]

And who really gives a shit about these big Corporations growing tons of Cannabis? Don't buy it. As a matter of fact, encourage them to grow more and hope that they just sit on it.....

It's to easy to set up a small area for a personal grow. A few hundred dollars and an afternoons work and you're all ready to go.

 

[Hydrosun]

Hydrosun, one little add in; you talk of Utopian ideals. Try this - Think Globally, Act Locally. Your vote for Prop 19 helps everyone else in the world. That'd be the poor in countries where the death sentence is implemented all too regularly for drug possession, that'd be the people in jails (typically from disenfranchised, poor communities) and that would be the most enlightened and Utopian thing to do, given reality. Or really are you just a self serving, selfish hypocrite who likes to portray a facade of enlightened and envisioned while really just having their own interests at heart -albeit using totally misinformed and flawed rationale to support such hypocrisy?

Just because you use words like, misinformed, flawed, nut job, fear-mongering, hypocrisy, half truths and the like does not mean ANY of my points have been such. You use a lot of buzz words but have not pointed out the impossibilities of my statements or my hypocrisy.

The fact that I use HIDs to grow MJ doesn't mean that it would not grow in my back yard garden. Also HIDs are NOT ILLEGAL, nor are they REGULATED. I can USE my HIDs to grow ANY plant I want and in the state I live in growing MJ is not a crime. Sure it is a federal crime, and it still will be if Prop 19 passes.

Review your posts quoting mine, you seem to get upset at my opinion and then you make your own statement of opinion NOT FACT. Prop 19 does NOT help everyone else in the world.

If Prop 19 did help everyone in the world the day it was passed Thailand would repeal the DEATH PENALTY for weed and NEVER kill another smoker. Well maybe Thailand would do WHATEVER the hell they want irrespective of CA.

You are asking people to vote for bad law that will INCREASE the prison time served of CA growers. You use Utopian arguments such as this will help the entire world, but you state ZERO rational as to HOW this will help the entire world.

Many CO cities have voted to make weed possession a NON CRIME. Those guys in CO didn't need to make ADDITIONAL criminal penalties for weed, they just repealed and refused to enforce BAD law.

When CO cities did this it did not change the world. So your argument is that if CA passes this all will be well with the world. How do you reconcile the fact that CO allows one to possess and not be a criminal AND the state of AK for over a decade has proclaimed the right of all people to grow on their own land for personal consumption?

Why are people still being locked up and killed because of weed if AK and CO allow one to LEGALLY posses weed?

The answer is your "act locally", even if people in Thailand are thinking globally, they are acting locally and did not care what AK or CO did. You think they will care what CA does, I do not. IF the US federal government reclassified MJ off schedule 1 then we may see other countries follow along, but as it stands now places like Mexico and Argentina are well further along than the USA, but unfortunately Thailand still has the death penalty for weed even though weed possession is 100% legal in Mexico and Argentina.

Vote for this bad law if you will but I encourage every Californian to vote NO because this bill creates NEW CRIMINAL PENALTIES that this community should NEVER sanction.

 

[Bacchus]

The Big Corporations are allready growing it in HUGH amounts.....they are the Mexican Cartels.

All the peeps I know in Cali are voting YES. Vote Yes, start the ball rolling. And yes UPS and FEDEX are going to start moving A LOT more packages to the East Coast once this passes.

 

[Hydrosun]

so do you use money? if so then you compromise and work with my government all the time.

These idiotic purely philosophical arguments that you and Jack continue to make are just asinine.

Real world conversation going on here, care to join? We are looking for pragmatic solutions, not new philosophical problems to be scared of.

What is more pragmatic than treating MJ like strawberries or tomatoes grown on ones own land? Alaska through supreme court ruling has LEGALLY RECOGNIZED all peoples right to grow on their own land for personal consumption and the world did not come to an end. There was no need for ADDITIONAL or INCREASED criminal penalties.

Why does Prop 19 need increased criminal penalties? Answer, because it is a bad bill written to enrich the few at the expense of the many.

You need not be scared of my proposed treatment of weed (personal freedom), but prop 19 is not a philosophical problem to be scared of it is an actual real life black and white BAD LAW that will add NEW and INCREASED criminal penalties for this community. NO THANK YOU.

 

[vta]

And who really gives a shit about these big Corporations growing tons of Cannabis?

not me

 

[Hydrosun]

Thx. I forgot about that one. Another reason to vote yes.

Right now, if a couple are growing in a 25 sq ft area of their home, and they get caught they can have their children removed and be charged with Endangering the welfare of a child.

But I guess that's OK for some people as long as they can keep selling them 60 dollar eighths.......

After Prop 19 passes both parents will go to prison and the children will be removed. Prop 19 adds new and improved penalties for adults who have MJ around kids, so your 25' or less still equals prison if you have kids.

Another GREAT reason to vote NO.

 

[Guest 88950]

^^prop 19 is NOT better because it will favor a big-business / big-government system....

open your fucking eyes people, if you care about the freedom of future generations, do not settle for this CORPORATE PLOY

nice side step

i said prop19 IS better for the Masses...........big-business / govt system is not the masses. they are the minority.

care to try again?


you guys argue that Oakland only allows 4 permits and its a monopoly but other cities will start to develop their own guidelines.

anyway, wouldnt the Big Guys draw the heat from the DEA and the smaller growers could operate within the scope of the law.

 

[Kwazee Wabbit]

I saw a police commander with 4 stars on his lapel arguing against prop 19 this morning on TV. When asked why it should be defeated he said that his department would lose the federal money it now gets. Seems like the no voters and the leo are on the same side. It's always about the money. Don't concern yourselves with the innocent souls being incarcerated or their families being left destitute. Don't worry about the thugs smashing your doors down in the middle of the night to terrorize you, steal your property and haul your ass to prison. Just think about the money. That's what's important.

 

[localhero]

And who really gives a shit about these big Corporations growing tons of Cannabis? Don't buy it. As a matter of fact, encourage them to grow more and hope that they just sit on it.....

it would be nice if it was that simple.

what the problem is, is that when big money can set rules such as limiting the number of allowable permits for growing more than 25 ft in any given county, or can make the price to purchase a permit so high as to make it impossible for normal people to afford one...

then you have a situation of a monopolized market with zero competition, no choice but to buy from walmart. why? because with only 25 ft, youre only pretending to grow. could you even share with that space? maybe if you had a 5x5 20 storey tower in your back yard..

ofcourse thats if you werent protected already by 215.

makes me wonder though,

if medium sized dogs can do what they did in oakland, whats to stop the actual big dogs from lobbying away our 215 rights once they monopolize the market and fully control californias BIGGEST CASH CROP. one thing is for sure, theyll have YOUR money to do it

 

[Bacchus]

I saw a police commander with 4 stars on his lapel arguing against prop 19 this morning on TV. When asked why it should be defeated he said that his department would lose the federal money it now gets. Seems like the no voters and the leo are on the same side. It's always about the money. Don't concern yourselves with the innocent souls being incarcerated or their families being left destitute. Don't worry about the thugs smashing your doors down in the middle of the night to terrorize you, steal your property and haul your ass to prison. Just think about the money. That's what's important.

You obviously are not concerned with the "innocent souls" and families being torn apart by the current law. Or the 5000+ murders a year happening because of the current laws.

The NO voters are on the side of LEO and the murdering cartes....

Status quo = a win for LEO and the Cartels.

 

[localhero]

You obviously are not concerned with the "innocent souls" and families being torn apart by the current law. Or the 5000+ murders a year happening because of the current laws.

The NO voters are on the side of LEO and the murdering cartes....

Status quo = a win for LEO and the Cartels.

instead of trying to scare no voters into thinking theyre on the side of leo with this, (pat buchanan is against the wto, same with me, that doesnt make us best friends) why dont you try and prove this statement wrong:

prop 215 offers more legal protections and freedoms than 19.