I feel such a failure

[f-e]

This is an outside link to K def. It's so close. Arguably the same. More K doesn't seem to help, though just a day of it isn't really much, It spread more in that day. Is K available that quickly though.. I guess I'm probably not waiting long, but I can see what tomorrow brings.
https://www.growweedeasy.com/cannabis-plant-problems/potassium-deficiency

 

[flylowgethigh]

Can you show some close-ups of the other side of the affected leafs? Cut them off and let the light shine through. I have leafs that the area between the veins is what is being affected. There is general yellowishness, and in spots browned right through. I don't see any bugs in there. Might be the same thing. I cut this leaf off earlier today:



Here is a worse case...

And tip damage like you have:

.

 

[f-e]

I can't really pull a leaf, I only have a couple.

Further reading finds lower feed levels lead to higher sodium uptake. I guess plants prefer proper food (here looking at you K) but will take what they must. This casts doubt on my reduced K idea to actually make use of the sodium. It might be good, but perhaps having enough K is a better way of leaving the sodium alone.

This particular plant is a new seed plant. It's the 45 day roses. The front 3 we see are actually, but this one has always had a hardy issue. It's woodier than a plant should be. Still green, but hard and tough with no desire to stretch out. With just 45 days on the clock it's a third of the way through. I'm thinking it may of demanded K before the rest. When K was just 170ppm, so it took on the sodium. Sodium that just now getting topped up to 'death rate'. My runoff has been below supply so they have been in a position to eat whats available.

 

[f-e]

Is your mix heavy?Run 2-3 grams per gallon gypsum,feed them and let dry down. Looks a bit like Na build-up.

I didn't hear you before. Gypsum went right over my head as a coco grower. Reading about shifting salt from soil, they say sulphur if you have free calcium carbonate, as I guess a lot of mine is, as I'm somewhat a hydro grower. The other thing is shifting out the sodium by swapping it for calcium in the cation exchange. Once the sodium is off, it can be leached. Sulphur.. Calcium.. calcium sulphate/gypsum. You tried to feed it to me but didn't bring the spoon That might prove a task with my drip system, but I add 23ppm with magnesium sulphate which is circa 30ppm sulphur. Which I was concerned is too high as the ratio to Mg is bad.

I must look harder for Ca ppm people use and get the drip clean in hand to read if it's any use for clearing the substrate.

 

[GoatCheese]

GoatCheese I started putting your feed into elemental numbers but guess that's your soil regime. Being in coco makes weeks without feeding impossible, and on your feed weeks you get some from the soil I can't quantify.

From the tent pic, I’d say there isn’t a shit ton wrong with your plants. They look pretty good to me.

Are you using mineral based nutrients? Maybe the issues come from salt build up, in which case a proper flush of the coco with very mild nute solution once a week could help.
BioBizz nutes are organic so I don’t have to worry about salt build up.

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To prevent root rot and to get rid of algae/bacteria in res tank..

When I tried few drip feed hydro/coco grows 15 years ago, I used 30% strong hydroperoxide to prevent root rot and to clean the drip feed-system. If I remember correctly it was 0,5ml/litre of water. But that 30% stuff is so strong it will burn a hole on your skin in seconds if you’ll get some on you, so you have to have gloves on when handling it and safety glasses to cover your eyes, so I recommend using milder hydroperoxide cause that 30% stuff is dangerously strong.
I googled it and on THC Farmer some guy says “I grow in coco and add it to every feeding. About 5 ml of 3% hydroperoxide to every litre.”
I used the hydroperoxide only once a week, not every day like the guy i'm quoting.
Google “hydroperoxide cannabis hydro coco” and you’ll find more info on how to use it and what it does.

You can get it from your local pharmacy. For larger amounts, if they ask what are you using it for, tell them you’re cleaning your fish tank
:
:

Thou that feed chart I posted isn’t the same as for my G13Haze keeper,I give it less BioBizz Grow (nitrogen), i have fed the G13Hz in coco just the same as i feed it when i have her growing in potting soil and so far the plant in coco is doing just fine with the same amount of nutrients. It just started 4[SUP]th[/SUP] week in bloom so we’ll see how it gets on later but so far I have no nutrient issues …fucking thrips I do have bothering my plants!
…and I have fed an auto plant I have going in coco just the same way I would have if I had grown it in soil and it doesn’t have any issues.
When I grow in soil, I veg the plants so long that there isn’t much nutrients left in the potting soil when they go in the flowering tent, so just about all the food they get in bloom comes from the BioBizz nutes. = They will start yellowing in veg unless I feed them with BioBizz.

So if I’d use that feeding chart of mine for coco plants, I’d continue Week 7. with the same amount of nutrients as Week 6. cause that is the maximum I’d give them.

 

[f-e]

Hmm interesting. Just the coco providing quite a bit of food for them to finish.
My weekly flush is an extra tank of the same, until the ec coming out matches the input, and then some more. I will address that by using a tank say.. 25% weaker. It seems my calcium and sulphur are on the high side so flushing is what I have left.

I have some hydrogen peroxide. It's about 12.5% iirc as there is a limit on how strong we can buy it. I have seen 35% food grade on eBay though.
I can't use much as my pump cavitates. Literally fills with air and stops pumping. Taps ok and low doses to provide a bit of oxygen. The cleaning dose is high though. Entire bottles vanish into water butts. Ok I have just 10L a day here but... One sec... It's 11.9% (12% limit) and I need 15ml per liter to actually clean up. 250ml bottle. It's a lot of h2o2 and my pump can manage about 0.5ml a liter I reckon.
I have been looking at a fancy new $35 ali pump with brushless motor and controller. Same Bar of pressure and 12v requirement. Off topic but it would fix my issue. I feel like my mid 20s suited that really clean attitude better though, and with time the biological approach has become more appealing. I'm not talking soil mixes or anything. but coco is organically certified. Bringing me to my hydro feeds. I have thought a lot about organic based solutions perhaps helping with higher numbers. I'm still on Ionic though. Thinking of the soil variant next as it's got that 1-1-2 ratio I have found works best. So I'm not loading in bottles of single elements knowing other stuff must be hiding in them.

I'm poised to put the h2o2 in, but another pump starting to rattle is awkward with all our shops on lockdown

 

[GoatCheese]

Hmm interesting. Just the coco providing quite a bit of food for them to finish.
My weekly flush is an extra tank of the same, until the ec coming out matches the input, and then some more. I will address that by using a tank say.. 25% weaker. It seems my calcium and sulphur are on the high side so flushing is what I have left.

Rather do the weekly flushing with a 25% nutrient solution, not with 75% strong. When i flushed my drip feed coco back then i flushed them with just pH adjusted water, then ran the drippers with fresh nute solution for a while so that the coco gets enough nutrients in it again. I didn’t run into any salt or nute issues. It was with Dutch Advanced Hydroponics mineral nutes. So use milder nute solution for the flushing than 75% strong solution or only pH adjusted water.
-
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I used the hydroperoxide only once a week- week and a half, not with every feeding like the guy i quoted. I forgot to mention that, i’ll go back and edit my post abit. I used it also in DWC bubbler too keep the roots from rotting and it worked great.It can be a grow saver during summer heats in hydro.
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Has your water tank ran dry if your pump is fucked? They don’t like to run out of water or they will break down.

 

[Sunshineinabag]

leh us not forget this cultivar can grow in a ditch successfully if left alone.....

 

[GoatCheese]

leh us not forget this cultivar can grow in a ditch successfully if left alone.....

Yea, true cannabis can take a lot of beating and it can be grown with different feeding styles..
But mineral nutrients in hydro/coco and pH levels + tap water is quite long away from outdoor ditch weed growing in the wild outdoors.

 

[Sunshineinabag]

i feel for fe.......i fear human touch in some regards has made canna like a kid with tons of rare allergies. Lmao my dad would piss in jugs water it down and that was that for feedings besides the odd chock full of nuts coffee (used) grounds discarded at the base of the plants by my mom

 

[GoatCheese]

Hmm interesting. Just the coco providing quite a bit of food for them to finish.

In drip feed systems the coco prolly gets flushed out faster but when you hand water coco with very little run off, the coco will provide nutrients for awhile, not as long as soil but it does store them in the fiber.

Some years ago i grew a Satori in hand watered coco with the BioBizz nutes and three weeks of no NPK nutrients were not enough time for it to use all the nutrients the coco was holding. Mind you that Satori is a light feeder in general. ..and i prolly fed it too much BioBizz Grow too so it had plenty of nitrogen in the coco.
It still would have needed atleast a week+ more to really yellow out. The Satori in soil, which had a longer time without nutrient feed, 5 weeks or so, was smoother smoke than the coco satori, which got only water and TopMax for the last 3 weeks. I grew them side by side.

But drip feed systems are abit different and i haven’t grown with those in 15 years, so i have no idea how fast the yellowing happens in drip feeding with my keeper plants. ..ofcourse it depends how many times and how long you’re running your drippers per day, how fast the coco gets flushed out, i mean. But i'd imagine it takes at least couple of weeks to get a nice yellowing going before harvesting the plants

...there is a huge difference in smoke quality when the plants had a proper fade/yellowing before before harvest.

 

[flylowgethigh]

Hmm interesting. Just the coco providing quite a bit of food for them to finish.
My weekly flush is an extra tank of the same, until the ec coming out matches the input, and then some more. I will address that by using a tank say.. 25% weaker. It seems my calcium and sulphur are on the high side so flushing is what I have left.

I have some hydrogen peroxide. It's about 12.5% iirc as there is a limit on how strong we can buy it. I have seen 35% food grade on eBay though.
I can't use much as my pump cavitates. Literally fills with air and stops pumping. Taps ok and low doses to provide a bit of oxygen. The cleaning dose is high though. Entire bottles vanish into water butts. Ok I have just 10L a day here but... One sec... It's 11.9% (12% limit) and I need 15ml per liter to actually clean up. 250ml bottle. It's a lot of h2o2 and my pump can manage about 0.5ml a liter I reckon.
I have been looking at a fancy new $35 ali pump with brushless motor and controller. Same Bar of pressure and 12v requirement. Off topic but it would fix my issue. I feel like my mid 20s suited that really clean attitude better though, and with time the biological approach has become more appealing. I'm not talking soil mixes or anything. but coco is organically certified. Bringing me to my hydro feeds. I have thought a lot about organic based solutions perhaps helping with higher numbers. I'm still on Ionic though. Thinking of the soil variant next as it's got that 1-1-2 ratio I have found works best. So I'm not loading in bottles of single elements knowing other stuff must be hiding in them.

I'm poised to put the h2o2 in, but another pump starting to rattle is awkward with all our shops on lockdown

Your pump must have the inlet restricted to cavitate cause a little H2O2 is in there. Or it is reacting with some scum in the pump, and making fizz. Maybe take out the pump and clean it of scum, if that is the deal.

Rainwater has H2O2, I have heard of people using it in gardens, and I am tempted as hell to add some to my SIP rez.

Edit: As far as the leaf pics i put up, those are older fan leaves and may have reacted to something that was in the past. I have had root aphids and some little red mites, and I am happy to report no visible bugs on the sticky pads this morning.

How do we add P to the water, or should it be top dressed like with some bone meal or other P rich stuff? Toss a banana in the res?

 

[f-e]

The pumps I use have a very small impeller. Just an S shaped bit of steel welded to the motor shaft. The inlet is perhaps 7mm and this spinning S no more than 13mm long. They can supply about 100 droppers with a bar of pressure, by spinning very fast. This impeller was a design change perhaps 10 years ago. The old design was fine but the new one's pull air out the water if h2o2 is used, and once spinning in air, they can't push water through the drip system. It's a DC pump so rpm isn't limited by mains frequency. This causes a runaway situation where the pump now in air spins faster still, and this pump dies rapidly if run dry. They're near enough silent but just 30 seconds dry and the noise starts, that gives you a month to get it changed. Any wear at all and they start rounding out the bearing.

I have a new spare and an old spare on the shelf.

After my last pic, they got a couple more hours light. a sleep and another hour before the new lower PK tank fed them. In 9 hours I take the pic looking for results. My day of testing isn't 24 hours (I'm looking at myself as an issue). However I looked at that first feed and progression of the fault was still steaming ahead.

On a positive note, I fed at 15 and got 18 out. 3 different. Yesterday I fed with 16 to get 18 out, 2 different. The day before 16 in 17 out. Before, 16-16. That was my weekly flush day. Just 4 days earlier I was 14in 12out. This is very typical. The runoff CF creeping up as the issue manifests. Reducing my EC to balance this can look like 12in 18out. Thing is, that is coming out, not sitting about. It's just about half my feed as the tap is 4. After my last run I wrote a review of my diary with words like toxic in places.

They really liked the increased PK yesterday. Yes my problem is gaining momentum, but bud development was noticeably better. I don't think my feed is high, or runoff volume low, but something such as salt is building up.

Gotta fly..

 

[f-e]

Cutting to the end of the chase, I had a lot of salt.

Tonight's runoff reached 19 (ec1.9) so was coming up 1 a day. A few other leaves suddenly showed. I knew 1.8 is about as high as I can go already, before mag like signs in the canopy.
So, tap water tank+remnants from today gave me 5 (ec0.5)
Pots are about 1.5L
500ml through gave 18
500ml gave 14
250ml gave 10
Filled tank and dosed to 7 (0.7) with calmag and corrected pH
500ml gave 9
500ml gave 8
long wait.. 250ml gave 8
That's 3L through a 1.5L pot. Fairly textbook but it's been years since I did this. I didn't just jug them, 500ml took 7.5 minutes to come through. I took a couple of hours over this.

I tried to limit my bottles but still used a fair few.. In my 10L went 90f(flower)10cm(calmag)15mg(epsom solution)7p(phosphorous)2ps(potassium silicate)1PCD(phosphoric acid) 150-135-250-157-72 including 60ca and 10mg from the tap.

It's day 23 I usually see hairs going brown. Day 27 was the latest when I lowered to 10(ec1.0) to keep the runoff at 15 but lost 25% of the yield. That's what it takes to make them eat it, not for the ec to creep up. Aligning with sodium replacing K.

They are still in that calmag solution for the night and get fed an hour after waking. It won't be quite the calculated numbers, as a few liters is in the tank before the 10L goes it.

This really was school boy error if it's fixed. Historically I pull the plants out, clean up the coco, and plant straight back in it. Here though, The new plants go in already in final pots. The plants coming out have to root balls dried out a lot to aid getting the coco and roots separated with a riddle. There we have it perhaps. Me chasing my tail while the problem gets worse. I need a better separation technique. It's been on my mind a while. Perhaps just a good soak before I use it again. I have been lax..

I really hope this is it. That a deeper flush will get me longer between flushes. The bits all fit.

I will more than say thank you.

 

[f-e]

My tank, 150-135-250-157-72 but I wanted 242K and used a little more as I put in too much down.
GH Nova 153-134-224-154-77
GH is way ahead on the N beside most feeds. I tryed 120ppm though and my leaves acted like I took it all away. Later I can get down to 100 though, and even finish on that. 100 is a more typical number.

Some say the nova burnt their plants.

Edit: GH figures taken from another thread where 10ml was used. Charts say 7.5ml but things change..

 

[GoatCheese]

Yea ,if you get stronger liquid coming out than you put in, then i think your problem is salt build up, which causes nute lock outs.

Just start doing your weekly/regular flushes with something like 20% nute solution or even milder if you don’t want to waste nutrients=money. Do a proper flushing, run the mild solution thru the coco a good while; then allow the pots to drain awhile and then give them a normal strenght nutes thru the drippers awhile to get enough nutrients in the coco.
75% strong flushing solution, i think, is still too strong for that and doesn’t rinse away enough salts from your coco; it rinses some of the old stuff out but brings alot of new salts in as well.
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EC 1.8 imo is quite alot. Most strains i have grown would have been happy with around 1.2.
..esp. Haze hybrids and many landraces /–hybrids need only 1.0-1.2 EC Max. I don’t measure EC with these organic BioBizz nutes but i’d estimate that the the feeding chart of mine is around EC 1.2, if i’d mix the same feeding strength with mineral hydro nutes. It’s not far off, and even that is too much for my G13Haze keeper.

Mandala Seeds recommend EC of 1.0 to 1.2 max for many of their landrace hybrids like Satori on their web site, and it’s spot of for the few Mandala strains i have grown and for many modern strains as well. ...Bluberry, C99, Herijuana, Black Domina, Cheese stuff, my CBD Critical Kush keeper, the two Afghan Kush plants i’m flowering atm. Just about all the plants i have ever grown would have been maxing around EC 1.2 or less.
..I get slight tip burn on one of my Afghan Kush plants with that feed strenght but not much.


You will get much better smoking product with lower EC levels. Esp. low enough Nitrogen level is quite important for how smooth the dry flower will smoke.

I know there’s alot of talk on the grower forums about trying to feed the maximum the plants can take but many times the plant still gets actually over fed this way, imo even if you don't see much tip burn yet. Wild cannabis plants don’t grow nearly as dark green and thick/waxy leaves in nature as they do in may people’s indoor grows. It’s obvious when you look up some photos of wild cannabis plant any where in the world.

Cannabis plant doesn’t need to be pushed with maximum nutrient strength to perform well. When i dropped the relative EC strength i use with my BioBizz nutrients from about EC 1.4 to around estimated 1.2 , like that feed chart i posted, i haven’t seen any noticeable drop in yields and growth rate. But the smoke is smoother. Esp. cause i have started to give them less nitrogen in bloom and have started dropping the N levels sooner.

Plants will also hermie noticeably easier if the EC levels are high. Some of the keepers i have grow few late nanners but they haven’t grown as many of those since i dropped the nute strength and nitrogen levels abit.


-
-

Interesting ..the hydroperoxide- water cavitation effect with your pump. Of course it’s not making your life any easier.
Try to get a new pump when you can, mate. Hydroperoxide really helps to keep the res and roots in better shape esp. during summers and DWC grows. ..nice extra oxygen boost for the root system as well once in a while.
Not for soil growing thou, it apparently will fry some of the good living things in the soil along with the bad, but for mineral hydro growing it works.


It’s a very interesting effect with water and gasses, in general, cavitation. There are cool slo-mo videos about cavitation bubbles on YouTube. Also check out some of the “Water hammer” effect slo-mos, if you’re interested. Some of those are quite weird looking when you get to see how water behaves during a water hammer in a transparent pipe system; how fast the bubbles appear and disappear, the vortexes caused by the water hammer etc.
Water can even emit light/photons during some of the cavitation events. “Far Out”.

I have actually started to think that maybe the cosmos we live in started via cavitation bubble and the shock waves associated with it when it formed and after the bubble collapsed (Big Bang). ..but that’s abit off topic.

 

[f-e]

Warm day today. 22C in Sherwood and they started drinking heavily almost straight after the flush.
Hard to draw a verdict yet. The cf14 tank produced 9 then 13 runoff. So the coco was likely grabbing cations. I got a pic a couple of hours after both feeds and the issue progresses but it is perhaps just this plant going downhill the most. I will pop up both and I got another in frame so you can see it's tip doing something else. This other thing was on a couple of other leaves that really advanced over the last 24 hours. I will get that posted to. This second leaf in the usual photo has some colour loss between the veins that almost looks white. Being so low on the plant that looks kinda like K but there is loads today, and I just flushed. I don't want to think about it until tomorrow really. I will make up the tank in the same way for now. I will put up a general health pic to. They looked sad after a defoliation yesterday but came back hard today. 400w of Kingbrite R-spec over them, and I left on the 10 1521 lamps on the floor for the first time, which might be worth 500ppfd down the middle. So some issues are to be expected.

Pics





The old signs and the new are what I see all the time. The new ones are focused at the tip here but can just appear mid way along one side, like P. The tips a bit dry though here.

Maybe it's salt set in long ago. This plant is the odd one out. I should watch another..


18 days

 

[TanzanianMagic]

F-E,

Don't feel like a failure. Everytime a plant goes south I still feel the same way. However the way to feel like a success again is to remedy what's going wrong. They key is to not get your emotions involved and know that you can always start if necessary.

This is magnesium deficiency/lockout.

This can be from insects - especially mites can cause nutrient deficiency symptoms for the nutrients the plant is using most of at that stage of it's grow. Including magnesium in early flowering.

Then, too many nutrients, too much nitrogen.

Magnesium is antagonistic with: Ca, Cu and Fe. Magnesium is synergistic with K.

https://agradehydroponics.com/blogs/...-affect-others

The medium is coco coir. In my experience, it is best to keep coco pH to 6.0 throughout the grow, until more specialist feeding is necessary - i.e. high PK uptake in late flowering, and micronutrient uptake during ripening. Coco naturally buffers to a pH of 6.0 and keeping liquid nutrients at 6.0 doesn't challenge the pH buffering capacity and prevents pH fluctuations.

Remember that all the nutrients have to go through the roots, so less is often more. Also, with more phosphorus and a bigger and healthier and therefore more efficient root system, nutrient concentrations can be even lower.

 

[GoatCheese]

Since the salt issue has been there for a while and because coco is also somewhat like a sponge/buffer, it holds onto the stuff you pour in it, you might wanna do another flush with a mild nute solution in few days/next day to make sure you get alot of that salt out. flush with large volume going thru the coco.

Maybe do a proper flush with just pH adjusted water to really get those salts moving When you then run the drippers with normal nute solution right after the water flush you’re plants won’t notice a thing but you’d really get those salts rinsed out.
..i’m sure you will see some recovery in a week.


Calm down, bro. Stop thinking and worrying about cations and what ever so much. I haven’t even bothered to read into cations, thou i have heard about it, yet my plants grow just fine in hand watered coco, and i never once even checked the pH during the two months i have been growing my coco plants, veg + early flowering now ..thou i do adjust the nute solution with pH Down every time.

Next run just think about the basics..
- Start doing your flushing with very mild nute solution/water and keep your eye on that run off EC value. With proper flushing the salt build up issue should stay away.
- Try lower EC value of around 1.2. Below 1.4 EC should be fine for many strains. Lower EC feed will also help keeping the salt build up issue away easier with proper flushing.
:
:
About your lights..
First of you have plenty of light coming from the Kingbrite you don’t need any extra on the floor. Also plants are designed to have the light above them not coming from below and they become used to the light angle they grow under. ..some house plants don’t liked to be turned around on a window sill at all cause they become used to certain direction of light. Your Kingbrite leds are more than plenty on their own, don't worry about it.

Second thing ..Do you have a dimmer on those Kingbrites? Imho, the 400 watts could be tad too much for your plants; i see very slights signs of Led radiation damage on your plants; the leaves have a bit of that matte, dried out/dehydrated look staeting to happen, which i also get if my cobs are too much for my plants. How the serration on many leaves is also starting to point up and how some leaves are slightly curled up are also signs the led radiation is abit too much for them atm. It’s not much but i think you’re just past the limit with the 400 watts. When you get to know signs of the LED radiation damage (dehydration), the leaves on your plants will let you know fairly fast when you went over the limit with the dimmer. ...they develop this dried out, matte look and they start to lose their waxy shine and start to feel a bit rough/dry in your fingers, then it's time to back off with the dimmer 10-20 watts and see how they look in few days.

If you can’t raise your lights an extra 25cm then try dropping around 40-50 watts (10-15%) out of those Kingbrite leds. I think you’d see in few days that the leaves will start looking softer/shinier again.

:
:

By the way ..maybe i missed it but what strains are you growing over there?

Not a huge lot wrong in they way they’re budding, thou. Nice tops on those, for sure.

..oh, and the too high EC also shows on the leaf color on those plants, btw; too dark green, so they are getting too abit too much food. I bet those plants would do just fine with around 1.2 -1.4 EC. Try it. You will notice how much smoother the smoke is.

 

[f-e]

F-E,

Don't feel like a failure. Everytime a plant goes south I still feel the same way. However the way to feel like a success again is to remedy what's going wrong. They key is to not get your emotions involved and know that you can always start if necessary.

This is magnesium deficiency/lockout.

This can be from insects - especially mites can cause nutrient deficiency symptoms for the nutrients the plant is using most of at that stage of it's grow. Including magnesium in early flowering.

Then, too many nutrients, too much nitrogen.

Magnesium is antagonistic with: Ca, Cu and Fe. Magnesium is synergistic with K.

https://agradehydroponics.com/blogs/...-affect-others

The medium is coco coir. In my experience, it is best to keep coco pH to 6.0 throughout the grow, until more specialist feeding is necessary - i.e. high PK uptake in late flowering, and micronutrient uptake during ripening. Coco naturally buffers to a pH of 6.0 and keeping liquid nutrients at 6.0 doesn't challenge the pH buffering capacity and prevent pH fluctuations.

Remember that all the nutrients have to go through the roots, so less is often more. Also, with more phosphorus and a bigger and healthier and therefore more efficient root system, nutrient concentrations can be even lower.

Do you think everything I'm showing you is Mag because of lockout?
I have concerns over the amount of mag I'm putting in. The ppm count seems reasonable but the amount I have to put in to get their is crazy. My base ferts just say "with Magnesium" but no value, so I guess it's very low to escape listing it. I put in 18ml of calmag at times, then 15ml of an Epsom mix of the same strength. Over 30ml in a 10L tank.
I will stop posting and read your link.

They are drinking 40% more water. RH has me looking for fungicides but that's another thread.

The tank came in at 15 and runoff 16 so I'm eagerly waiting some some tox signs. It's odd how the stripes went white so I increased the Fe but I have not looked in today yet.

I do have a working recipe I'm happy with, but this grow is about pushing the envelope. 400w covers 1.2sqm comfortably and ~ec1.3 see's a reasonable outcome like the seed producers quote. However I see a limited few weighing up almost 50% more, all supplementing compost it seems. I have found 450w a meter about where things go wrong with an EC around 1.6 supporting that. With N specifically 165ppm will cause some right curling at high ppfd levels while 120ppm see's leaves yellow and drop quickly. Later I will be down to 100ppm, after the main bulking is done.

Back on the Mg topic, I'm planning to pick up some Mono so I can get a bit higher. I don't want to use more Epsom as that Sulpher content is getting out of proportion. Though having spotted the GH feed I must rethink that. Later I like the look of ionics soil but must check the N types. It's a 2-2-4 which is where I'm happy by week 4. More immediately I will lower my general feeding level but not the calcium and magnesium which I would rather raise tbh. It's all baby steps though really. 20ppm less N, 30 less P, 50 less K... only the K will really do much.


I do like the KB lights. My highest run with them was almost 600w with ~ 130-50-250-130-50 and that did 22oz. The EC was about 1.6 most of the time and my lux meter said 40,000-65,000 depending where. I ran like that a few times. Since then it's just P Ca and Mg I'm really playing with, so the salt could be too much Epsom. The drying root balls have salt forming on the top of some so I'm going to look there soon. Maybe I should water sample... At least I can taste it and see what it does to water.

G.O Joe spoke of ashing as a means to get leaves labbed where it's not legal. I do have a couple of avenues to explore.

I can't get a good white balance on my phone. If I push parts to 40,000 lux, high N shows. That might be well into CO2 territory as adding some keeps them happy. I'm keeping to 30-35K lux though, maybe 750ppdf going by what Migro's meter said. A meter on special today at Ali so I got one. We all need known meters to make sense of things. My numbers are useless for comparisons otherwise.

I fully expect to find the upper limits of feed and light, then change my ways. It's what I'm doing here. I think I need my sights on more flushing, and maybe even today. I would like to see the toxic behaviour go then return to really get a feel for how it's working with such a deep flush. Ultimately... what is the toxic bit. Them 22oz runs was when it was all new, and so things have gradually got worse while I battled to find the problem. That's where feeling useless comes into play. Trying to do better by changing everything, but it just gets worse. Salt buildup is the answer I hope.

Another hour and it's picture time