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About cloning...I'm using the X-stream cloner modified with a little humidifier in it (mist maker - single membrane) 15 minutes ON - 15 minutes OFF.
It produces a lot of heat, so the water reaches 30ºC. No trouble for the roots due to high oxygen environment.
It produces a lot of heat, so the water reaches 30ºC. No trouble for the roots due to high oxygen environment.
Here using the old x-stream irrigation system. They call this areoponic...well...it's not exactly the same thing of using a mist maker. Pictures clearly show the why.
Having a lot of pressure in the x-stream irrigation system, water sprayed on roots keep them in a single mass, slow them down and exposing them to rot, avoiding little root's hair growth.
Not saying it doesn't work, but it's more expensive, need more maintenance, more difficult to clean, more noisy, not so effective...so the mist maker method is waaaay better!
Having a lot of pressure in the x-stream irrigation system, water sprayed on roots keep them in a single mass, slow them down and exposing them to rot, avoiding little root's hair growth.
Not saying it doesn't work, but it's more expensive, need more maintenance, more difficult to clean, more noisy, not so effective...so the mist maker method is waaaay better!
Airpots are good too for this kind of hydro setup. I usually take clones rooted like this
Placing it in the vegging box
I use a 1000 liters pump for 8 pots in a single 120x120 box. It is enough to have enough pressure everywhere.
For flowering I did my math and for a perfect pressure I need 800 liters for each tray. On a 3-trays setup I use 2500 liters pump and it works good.
After few days, while in the flowering room plants are being chopped, the new clones are ready to be moved.
Placing it in the vegging box
I use a 1000 liters pump for 8 pots in a single 120x120 box. It is enough to have enough pressure everywhere.
For flowering I did my math and for a perfect pressure I need 800 liters for each tray. On a 3-trays setup I use 2500 liters pump and it works good.
After few days, while in the flowering room plants are being chopped, the new clones are ready to be moved.
I let 'em grow with 2x110W fluo panels. I have to say they really like this kind of light. It's no intense and with a good spectrum and not so much heat, just perfect.
Once moved in the flowering box they just need a couple of days at 18/6 and they're ready to go...
Tinfoil is needed to avoid algae growth on trays but also to create a layer, where the climate is different.
Scrog nets are used just to train a little bit the branches and give the plant a better form to fill the box
Once moved in the flowering box they just need a couple of days at 18/6 and they're ready to go...
Tinfoil is needed to avoid algae growth on trays but also to create a layer, where the climate is different.
Scrog nets are used just to train a little bit the branches and give the plant a better form to fill the box
When it's time to clean and set it ready again, having big clones just ready for the flowering it's a great advantage because of the less work needed. No transplants, just moving pots from a box to another.
Fabric pots let the roots pass trough with no trouble
You can see them under the spreader mat.
Fabric pots let the roots pass trough with no trouble
You can see them under the spreader mat.
About sprouting seeds...I like the towel method, so I can check out those didn't germinate, let 'em dry and then moist again.
Once I got a root like those in the next pictures, I gently take them with clean hands and put on a moist coco and perlite medium,than covering it with some more coco, and that's it. No pressed medium. It has to stay aerated while keeping some water.
To keep seeds safe, I previously put the moistened medium in the oven and let it reach 65ºC in the inner part and wait 15 minutes. At this temp. proteins should be fucked off, saving exceptions .
Once I got a root like those in the next pictures, I gently take them with clean hands and put on a moist coco and perlite medium,than covering it with some more coco, and that's it. No pressed medium. It has to stay aerated while keeping some water.
To keep seeds safe, I previously put the moistened medium in the oven and let it reach 65ºC in the inner part and wait 15 minutes. At this temp. proteins should be fucked off, saving exceptions .
Yo guys, I would like to get some suggestions from you.
Would it be good to add 30% of perlite to the clay pebbles I use for my hydro system? It would be 30/70.
How about using 100% perlite in a recirculating hydro setup?
Perlite costs less, it's not so heavy like clay but I never tried it really.
So, any suggestion guys? Someone got a chart with the main datas about clay and perlite and their interstitial spaces?
Would it be good to add 30% of perlite to the clay pebbles I use for my hydro system? It would be 30/70.
How about using 100% perlite in a recirculating hydro setup?
Perlite costs less, it's not so heavy like clay but I never tried it really.
So, any suggestion guys? Someone got a chart with the main datas about clay and perlite and their interstitial spaces?
Hi bro!
With interstitial space do you mean the space between one perlite piece and one clay ball? To know how tight it will be between theese two for a good airflow between them?
I had a chart where i saw the differences of some quality in perlite, clay, rockwool, coco and another material made for house isolation(some glass stones) If you need! (Oxygen, moisture and others things)
I think that clay is a good sub, better than coco for your system for example.. but
Perlite has an irregular shape, all the pieces are not equal, perlite is weak so working with it too hard, it could make some extra sand.
Perlite is smaller, so it could fill the spaces between the clay pebbles and give more area for the roots to grow on easier.
If we use only perlite, the pot will be heavy because more surface are wet, because of the less empty spaces between the pieces (more surfaces in contact with the solution).
So, a 9L pot with clay could retain 3L water, when a 9L pot with clay pebbles could retain 1.5L water.
Using more perlite, actually you will need to water not that often, up here the example of the 9L pot, plus that the air gap are less than in clay so here is also why the pot will take more time to be lighter again.
A full perlite probably is not that "wow", but a perlite + clay could be something of more interesting for what you need. Lighter to toss, probably some benefits for the roots, especially If you want a more uniform moisture in the pots.
I’ve seen also big perlite stones but they are not worth much as the clay
Edit
I’ve checked out the chart and like i said, the perlite will hold more water than clay and less air after the drainage
Anothe thing that i think to, is the problem when the Temps will be high in summer. With or without chiller, If the sub will be wet for a longer period, then the moisture in the sub will change temperature by the prolonged contact with the hot air near in the room. So a higher % of perlite could work fine for you If you change from recirculation to drain to waste.
Ps. Thank you for everything bro!
With interstitial space do you mean the space between one perlite piece and one clay ball? To know how tight it will be between theese two for a good airflow between them?
I had a chart where i saw the differences of some quality in perlite, clay, rockwool, coco and another material made for house isolation(some glass stones) If you need! (Oxygen, moisture and others things)
I think that clay is a good sub, better than coco for your system for example.. but
Perlite has an irregular shape, all the pieces are not equal, perlite is weak so working with it too hard, it could make some extra sand.
Perlite is smaller, so it could fill the spaces between the clay pebbles and give more area for the roots to grow on easier.
If we use only perlite, the pot will be heavy because more surface are wet, because of the less empty spaces between the pieces (more surfaces in contact with the solution).
So, a 9L pot with clay could retain 3L water, when a 9L pot with clay pebbles could retain 1.5L water.
Using more perlite, actually you will need to water not that often, up here the example of the 9L pot, plus that the air gap are less than in clay so here is also why the pot will take more time to be lighter again.
A full perlite probably is not that "wow", but a perlite + clay could be something of more interesting for what you need. Lighter to toss, probably some benefits for the roots, especially If you want a more uniform moisture in the pots.
I’ve seen also big perlite stones but they are not worth much as the clay
Edit
I’ve checked out the chart and like i said, the perlite will hold more water than clay and less air after the drainage
Anothe thing that i think to, is the problem when the Temps will be high in summer. With or without chiller, If the sub will be wet for a longer period, then the moisture in the sub will change temperature by the prolonged contact with the hot air near in the room. So a higher % of perlite could work fine for you If you change from recirculation to drain to waste.
Ps. Thank you for everything bro!
Last edited:
Yo bro, interesting point about the water retention, but you should consider the dissolved oxygen in the nutritive solution is the first source of Oxygen in my system, or at least that's my thought.
So changing the water/oxygen ratio in the medium should not be an issue I guess, or at least I'm gonna try it, maybe 4 pots with mixed medium like 70% pebbles and 30% perlite, and other 4 pots filled with 100% perlite, with just a top-layer of pebbles to keep things steady.
At the end I'll check roots and their health and see what's the better solution.
So changing the water/oxygen ratio in the medium should not be an issue I guess, or at least I'm gonna try it, maybe 4 pots with mixed medium like 70% pebbles and 30% perlite, and other 4 pots filled with 100% perlite, with just a top-layer of pebbles to keep things steady.
At the end I'll check roots and their health and see what's the better solution.
TLB
Active member
Buddy why not just use spreader mat like NFT? You already have trays, you know how to use rockwool, it will cost less, less effort for plants and for you too (I know u like to keep fit but I know how heavy 50L clay pebbles bags are), fast grow, big yeld. You would have a nice root carpet. I don’t remember if we have ever talked about it and if you already tested NFT, anyway just ask.
Buddy why not just use spreader mat like NFT? You already have trays, you know how to use rockwool, it will cost less, less effort for plants and for you too (I know u like to keep fit but I know how heavy 50L clay pebbles bags are), fast grow, big yeld. You would have a nice root carpet. I don’t remember if we have ever talked about it and if you already tested NFT, anyway just ask.
Always welcome in here bro
I changed to this system after growing rdwc. Never tried NFT really.
Roots will fill the tray creating a carpet, do that carpet have enough oxygen in all of its points?
I mean, would be poor oxygen spots somewhere? I guess it would be better with a EF system at this point, but maybe it would work great the same.
Using only a small piece of RW for each plant like you suggested, would be very effective for space, weight, costs, no pots at all. Just some RW and some spreader mat.
I'm really going to take this in mind bro, it could be the next try, thanks for it.
@CalMag, thanks bro. Aero is one of the best way and yes it would be very easy for the rooted clones being moved in the flowering chamber. No medium at all, just water. But at now I can't see the way I can do a good work with the current setup I'm using. Most probably i will switch to aero in the future to do a serious work.
Thanks guys
TLB
Active member
Part of the roots carpet will be directly in contact with air, the thin water film will provide oxygen dissolved in the water so basically you will not have ‘blind’ spots. An air pump will be necessary in mid flow for roots falling directly in the water at the end of the tray. Beware of hydrogen peroxide, don’t use it.
NFT is not popular between cannabis growers but I would def give it a try, it could really suit your way to grow. Clean work, fast, no pests, big yeld, is it enough?
NFT is not popular between cannabis growers but I would def give it a try, it could really suit your way to grow. Clean work, fast, no pests, big yeld, is it enough?
