CMH vs LED vs HPS

[exoticrobotic]

Slightly off topic i know but there is some degree of truth in some conspiracy theories. I wonder how epigenetics will affect the future generations of Cannabis plants.

Cannabis articles and current research seem centred on the medical effects of Cannabis and hence mistakenly centred on non psychoactive cannabinoids...CBD, CBG etc

Any research is great but I want to get hiiiigh while treating my medical issues

Years ago, research on such 'medicinal' (i.e no psychoactive effect) cannabinoids like CBG was scarce as bud contained so little of it there were problems collecting enough for testing.

Nowadays you can easily buy massive amounts of full spectrum cbg oils etc.

At some point big pharma will take over and offer you herb for all ailments but without the high so it will have mass appeal. After they patent it of-course and mess up the rest of the genepool for us stoners.

 

[Crooked8]

 

[snakedope]

If you don't have the capacity or knowledge to deal with the truth, please don't engage indeed haha

 

[Corpselover Fat]

I'm actually thinking of adding some uva to my grow as an experiment. I think I'm going to be doing some cyanotypes and photopolymer prints next winter and you need uv for those (natural uv is not available here in the winter ). I could easily build my own uv fixture to use in the grow and for printing.

If it seems like a good addition I might look into adding some FR or IR. I thought about adding some monos when I assembled my fixture, but it was very expensive so I thought I'd try just the plain white first. It has worked so well I haven't seen a need to add any monos, but since I have a seperate need for uv it wouldn't be a big deal to try it out in the grow too.

 

[Corpselover Fat]

i take a plant from 4 hours darkness in vegg, to multiple 12 hour dark periods in flower because the light intensity and radiance seems to in many cases here, completely reverse node stretch in flower?

Honestly. I'm trying, but I don't understand what you are trying to say.

Never ever I had as short nodes with HPS as I have with LED. Light levels were similar for me. I used a 600w HPS and now I use a 320w led. The HPS produces slightly more light, but I'm sure the LED delivers more light to the plants. The difference is insignicant anyway.

Now I'm no master grower, but I have grown on and off since 2007. These days I try to make by with one grow per year so experience comes slowly. I also like to change things around and try new stuff, because it's a hobby for me.

I've shown this plant often, but it's relevant again. I'm not showing it because I think it's the best plant ever. I'm showing it because it's about a 350g plant in a 120*60cm (2*4') tent. Look at the pot. It's a 30*30cm (one foot) square. Now look at how tall the plant is and you'll see it's barely a foot, doesn't reach the sides and it's still ~350g dry bud. That is some short nodes, eh?



Edit: added a photo of the plant in veg.

 

[greyfader]

after reading all of these comments this morning i found myself wishing we could send smells through the internet.

i'm sitting here smoking a bowl of Bluestar Mayberry breeders cut. it has some of the most powerful terps i have ever encountered. blueberry-rose and so strong it makes people sneeze when it first hits your nose.

like walking by an old lady at the mall who has just doused herself with perfume. makes your eyes water.

the high is outstanding too. i get a nice strong buzz from one small bowl, physically relaxing and mentally stimulating.

great pain relief as well. it is one of the finest strains i've grown in 26 years.

it was grown with 5000k in veg and 2700k in flower. walmart led bulbs.

 

[snakedope]

after reading all of these comments this morning i found myself wishing we could send smells through the internet.

i'm sitting here smoking a bowl of Bluestar Mayberry breeders cut. it has some of the most powerful terps i have ever encountered. blueberry-rose and so strong it makes people sneeze when it first hits your nose.

like walking by an old lady at the mall who has just doused herself with perfume. makes your eyes water.

the high is outstanding too. i get a nice strong buzz from one small bowl, physically relaxing and mentally stimulating.

great pain relief as well. it is one of the finest strains i've grown in 26 years.

it was grown with 5000k in veg and 2700k in flower. walmart led bulbs.

Not dismissing your review, just can't seem to believe it's more powerful then other hid grows, I smelled some nice terps from LEDs, nothing that will stink up the hood though, unlike old days...
LED bud seems to have a threshold that it cannot surpass as the diodes are mostly limited to 200lm +-

 

[CannaT]

When man something know.
He dont need science to say that,he will tell it easily.
There is no worst or better light...there are only stubborn idiots like most of people are.

Radiant heat is what make difference.
1000w hps is operating on around 550C or 1000F
And this thing make big difference comparing to led which are around 30C 86F...

Led light are better in term of light quality and intensity. They lack of radiant heat.
All of us start grow on hids and we take hid parameters as gold standard.

Leds are better if you grow in sealed room or in warm part of world like south spain,tropics,etc...or in European summer months.

In every other situation hid will give you better buds than leds.

Just imagine to be in sauna...no radiant heat 100C its ok to stay there for 15-20minutes.

on sunshine with radiant heat on 40C is life danger for most.
That radiant heat will make more optimum conditions in air cooled grow rooms.

Still my Leds summer grown is easy to compare to autmun hid run which I consider always the best.

Problem with leds if your gr is air cooled is that plants will most of the time will be freezing cold.
So its not like someone said they give higher EC cuz of more light with leds..2.2 EC is not the same in 18C grow medium or 24C grow medium...

Leds are only if you have 100% sealed room. Or whole year or period of year with higher temps constantly than 24C.

Led room for best results needs 26-30C

Hps room 20-24C

If you stick to this parameters you will wont see difference with same cut grown with leds and hids.

Will start soon my summer grow of Jack and White widow under Leds... .

 

[Ca++]

We can actually light up better in every way using LED, but what it doesn't do the same, is the IR

If you feel HID grows better, it's probably not the light.

 

[exoticrobotic]

If you stick to this parameters you will wont see difference with same cut grown with leds and hids.

I'll have to respectfully disagree with that @CannaT

I ran cmh mother during winter/spring and led clones of her during a hot uk summer with temps 30C.

Unfortunately they were not comparable. I got way more bud with the leds but what i gained in yield i lost in potency so ended up smoking more.

Even with smoking more of the led buds to try to compensate there wasnt the satisfaction there was with the cmh bud.

 

[exoticrobotic]

But that was with the general white led with added red ones - maxibright...

I see now led manafacturers are adding more different spectrums leds.

Unfortunately i neither have the $$$ or the general desire to test them again.

 

[Ca++]

So much effort goes into finding what light might influence our plant. Things that might trigger a response. Maybe a little blue. Maybe UV-A or B. Bit of 730 maybe, or some 840.

I can walk into a room blindfolded and tell you if it's HID or LED. Do you think a plant might notice that?

 

[Corpselover Fat]

Just imagine to be in sauna...no radiant heat 100C its ok to stay there for 15-20minutes.

Ot and not very serious: I agree with the point, but 15-20 minutes in a 100c sauna is quite a long time. Most would do 5-10 minutes at a time. How hot it feels depends on how much water is thrown on the stove. Dry heat is easy to bear, but add some hot steam and it gets very hot.

 

[Corpselover Fat]

Do you think a plant might notice that?

No. It's not sentient.

 

[snakedope]

We can actually light up better in every way using LED, but what it doesn't do the same, is the IR

If you feel HID grows better, it's probably not the light.

I'm willing to bet it is..
You forgot to mention the 2nd thing LEDs dont do the same, and that is make 100k lm from 1 source at 1 location (like the sun).

 

[CannaT]

This is Led grown Jack, after bit of cure its first time that I smell bit of mushroom/truffle funk in Jack and its more lemony than orangeish
But that first meaty/hashy/spice smell is still first what you smell after opening mason jar.

You can also grow great weed with leds you just to need to know how. World is math...in math there are always million ways to get to same results. That is also in nature like that. You just need to know some math and thats it.

 

[Koondense]

Tungsten bulbs can provide better radiant heat than hps, they work at around 3000K.
Maybe a led(PAR)+tungsten(IR) combo would be best

 

[Ca++]

I'm willing to bet it is..
You forgot to mention the 2nd thing LEDs dont do the same, and that is make 100k lm from 1 source at 1 location (like the sun).

The energy density of LED is higher than HID.

Both tend to be used in multiples professionally. Which is where we should really look, to filter out the opinion of 1 light growers, who are likely less experienced.

LED can illuminate a plant higher than sodium. The sodium has a huge peak around 600nm with a lack of support from other wavelengths. This causes bleaching that the LED doesn't.

The idea you need all your light in one place, should be easy to look at when expanding from one light to two. Do you see a drop when putting a second 1 light grow beside the first one light grow. Do you regularly see grows with room dividers between lights, to ensure each zone gets just one light. Does practice in any way support your theory.

 

[smirnoff420]

Yup, more light sources or a bigger light source reduces shadows -> more parts of the plants photosynthesize. For a home grower large led panels are an easy way to achieve very uniform light. For a warehouse grower multiple fixtures do the same thing.

Yes. Also make sure to have _everything_ covered with a material that reflects visible light and IR well. Especially the IR reflection is important for LEDs, they don't put out too much of it, you don't want it wasted. A photon that hits something non-reflective is lost (well, converted to heat), a photon that hits something reflective will bounce off and still has the chance of hitting the plants.

 

[chilliwilli]

Tungsten bulbs can provide better radiant heat than hps, they work at around 3000K.
Maybe a led(PAR)+tungsten(IR) combo would be best

Was also thinking if this might work. Not sure if the ir heating paneles would work iirc i read somewhere they have the wrong frequenzy of it.

I remember specific ir bulbs when i was a child. Big dark purple bulbs for heat treatment when u had a sick ear.
Something like this.