What's snypes cloning method,, sounds good,,,I like over kill
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Can the genetics be saved from plant with fusarium/pythium/stem canker?
- Thread starter Loc Dog
- Start date
I lost 29 out of 30 trying to salvage $2K in genetics from ignoring rule number one about starting with perfectly healthy mothers. I had mothers dying from botrytis and lower stems were rotting.
Snype's Guide To Cloning In Rockwool Or Aeroponics With 100% Success Rates!
Snype's Guide To Cloning In Rockwool Or Aeroponics With 100% Success Rates! This guide is to help out fellow growers who don't have perfect success in Rockwool or Aeroponics. Because of the data that I keep, I know how to have 100% success rates with my cuttings. I haven't lost 1 cutting for at...
www.icmag.com
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Snypes process was a good read,,,I have a few point tho
I don't think he understands tissue culture tech, ,he calls the callus that forms on the stem "root nubs",, that's not a big deal but u can tell he's not read some literature,, Anyways
I also don't think he understands the pressure principle,,,when he says that he wipes the condensation off the lids I can tell he's not understanding that one key principle is to make the pressure at the top of the prop higher than at the bottom,,that is why I suggest keeping the cubes pretty dry and the top of the cuts and the lid of the props kinda wet,,,
I love his antibiotic application,,that's a fukin genius move,,,I've considered using ppm (plant preservative mixture) ,,,but his antibiotics are very interesting
He's absolutely right about healthy mothers,,,he's absolutely right about sterilizing everything,,,
I'm working atm so can't go into more detail,,but I love his approach,,,I think he could actually go further,,,that guys a good dude tho,,,
He doesn't mention dunking,,,I think he would benefit from a hypochlorous acid dunk,,,few other things too ,,but his pretty good ,,I like the guy
I don't think he understands tissue culture tech, ,he calls the callus that forms on the stem "root nubs",, that's not a big deal but u can tell he's not read some literature,, Anyways
I also don't think he understands the pressure principle,,,when he says that he wipes the condensation off the lids I can tell he's not understanding that one key principle is to make the pressure at the top of the prop higher than at the bottom,,that is why I suggest keeping the cubes pretty dry and the top of the cuts and the lid of the props kinda wet,,,
I love his antibiotic application,,that's a fukin genius move,,,I've considered using ppm (plant preservative mixture) ,,,but his antibiotics are very interesting
He's absolutely right about healthy mothers,,,he's absolutely right about sterilizing everything,,,
I'm working atm so can't go into more detail,,but I love his approach,,,I think he could actually go further,,,that guys a good dude tho,,,
He doesn't mention dunking,,,I think he would benefit from a hypochlorous acid dunk,,,few other things too ,,but his pretty good ,,I like the guy
Ca++
Well-known member
I have not heard of this pressure principle, or seen any equipment to make it happen. Got a link, as it's not sitting well with me. I guess it's some new idea.
In the 10 years since that thread, we have also learnt not to trim leaves in half. Not only is it opening a pathway for infection, but tests have shown it's considerably bad for success rates. Though he seems to be having no problems at all.
Looking at the feed rates in the EZ, I guess the amounts given for wool are going into 2 gallons. It left me guessing though. Which distracted me from the rest of the article.
It's a good result, but labour intensive. I'm happy to do a hack job, and come back to see what rooted in 10 days. I can afford to take a few more, for losses, as it's good practice to take twice the number needed anyway.
I really must have a crack at meristem though. It was actually what to feed them with that has stopped me in the past.
In the 10 years since that thread, we have also learnt not to trim leaves in half. Not only is it opening a pathway for infection, but tests have shown it's considerably bad for success rates. Though he seems to be having no problems at all.
Looking at the feed rates in the EZ, I guess the amounts given for wool are going into 2 gallons. It left me guessing though. Which distracted me from the rest of the article.
It's a good result, but labour intensive. I'm happy to do a hack job, and come back to see what rooted in 10 days. I can afford to take a few more, for losses, as it's good practice to take twice the number needed anyway.
I really must have a crack at meristem though. It was actually what to feed them with that has stopped me in the past.
The pressure principle Is my own term,,because ive been cloning in my own little world, I have my own thoughts that not many people have,,,here are one of my thoughts,,,
When we are cloning,,do you think its water vapor that stops the cuts wilting or is it pressure?,,,obviously the cuts need to absorb water to stop wilting and they absorb this through the tissue because they don't have roots ,,,but do you think the pressure created by the vapor has nothing to do with it?,,,
does increased pressure have any impact on rooting?,,,my answer to my own question is yes,,Pressure impacts rooting independent of water vapor,,the higher the pressure the quicker the roots
I've been meaning to do an experiment with a pressurised container, but I've never got round to it
When we are cloning,,do you think its water vapor that stops the cuts wilting or is it pressure?,,,obviously the cuts need to absorb water to stop wilting and they absorb this through the tissue because they don't have roots ,,,but do you think the pressure created by the vapor has nothing to do with it?,,,
does increased pressure have any impact on rooting?,,,my answer to my own question is yes,,Pressure impacts rooting independent of water vapor,,the higher the pressure the quicker the roots
I've been meaning to do an experiment with a pressurised container, but I've never got round to it
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That is about 14 years old. Not sure why banned.
Wish I had taken pictures. Greyish mold on outside of stems above coco bottom 1 foot of plant. Could be some other gray mold rotting stems. Tried taking very tops and cloning with 1 of 33 surviving. Wanted them out of house since looked hopeless and worried about health with so much mold. Had been spraying a lot to try and kill spider mites, which were immune to everything including 2 no pest strips in 5 X 5 sealed tent after 3 days and were not even phased. They were running around like on meth. Never saw them run before.
May have been brownish, but appeared in mother room at same time flowering plants had bud rot from trying to kill spider mites using fogger.
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Just wondering if anyone has used ozone water treatment??
I hear its better than hydrochloric acid and is inactive in an hour??
I hear its better than hydrochloric acid and is inactive in an hour??
I do now see the light..
Seeds is a russian roulette of infection rate, as most parent stock by my guesses is infected, and most seed now showing to carry infectious particles of viroid on their outside..Bleach be your best friend germinating seeds, fresh media, fresh pots, keeping drainwater away from each other for plants etc..one tool per plant or proper disinfection protocols. Clones always lose over time, as they all infected by the time we cloning them, already..it is just a slow downhill slide from there. Something that was a classic decades old, revived and clean of virii, viroid and systemic pathogenic bacteria and fungi, will completely shit on most modern stuff with varying degrees of viroid load. Though the first run from seed and maybe the second you will see amazing bud from the modern but it always goes downhill slowly from there...the pattern now in hindsight is pretty obvious..And yes sorry guys not read the pages long discussion, just in a page back..but yes genetics can entirely be saved from fusarium/pythium/stem canker, but if it is, then most likely infected also with hlvd in my experience and then it will cost you and there is only very few doing it. And you better be testing the "clean" material for months after to make sure unless its from one of the proper places who are not BS artists or flybynites...you have to go invitro..or seed too you can as troutman says but either way it will involve lots of testing. and time and hence the cost if you outsource. But the layman only really has access to seed, though there are those who do invitro at home, its the clean up protocols that are not accessible, so seed is the only way possible for laymen. But it is not possible without lots of testing.
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They are now seeing in study on low end under 10% to high end low 40% I think transmission to seed depending on whether mom and pops are infected, and also to what degree their viral load is when the pollination occurs.
Lowest infection rate of seed was with clean mom and dirty dad, but the mom was infected by the pollination and by time of harvest of the seed, viroid had travelled throughout the plant to every bract and even uninfected seeds carried infectious viroid on the outside. So prebleaching seed and rinsing with wetting agent in the water and sufficient agitation, is imperative. I'd guess that the vast majority of seed producers parent stock is infected. That is from what we have seen PCR testing plants grow from seed from vendors across europe and the states. Every elite clone handed around in clone form we tested was dirty. Every european clone nursery and tissue lab we received material from, was dirty.
Shits way worse that what most think. You only really see how bad it is, growing out material verified clean, from invitro..
What would the real difference between peroxide and ozone in solution? completely ignorant here in that respect, would you know bro?
Also, in terms of treatment for what? Viroid? Pathogenic fungi and microbes in the root zone? For the latter, I use peroxide and all the good microbes, in first in my supply water treating the dams, 10ppm and then once testing peroxide flat with teststrips, dosing microbe brews...and then tank dosing with peroxide so its almost flat by the time it reaches drippers, and the soil I keep alive with a host of added microbes/fungi..runoff is flat for any oxidizers, the media very much alive..But for viroid..I doubt anything like that touches sides..maybe over time if nothing new added to the system, accelerated decomposition due to RNA-Ase enzymes from biological metabolites, but for effective knock down on surfaces 10000ppm bleach needed and then needs good few seconds of exposure, 60 recommended. But sure you are up to speed on that. In media it is not though to be any effective means to break the viroid down, and it is well stable in water. Acids or bases will denature it, as well oxidizers, but from what I know peroxide, peracetic acid, clorine dioxide not effective enough or too corrosive at effective concentrations, and bleach the only viable option. You can use HTH for that at scale, I prefer calcium bleach anywhere where weed will be over sodium bleach anyday. I do not know of the effectiveness of ozone for HLVD, I'll look at other viroids, I have literature on that somewhere on my desk..
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Diggy_Soze
Active member
Cannabis does not need callous to produce roots.
Callous implies the cells are undifferentiated, but those plants are actively producing roots. It’s perfectly accurate to say those are root nubs popping straight out of the side of the stem.
Great info,,
I was of the mindset that the root differenceateion happens after some very few undifferentiated cells form first,,,
now that you say it ,I do remember seeing roots popping directly out of a stem with no calus formation,,
Watched video and saw someone using dichlor to sanitize seeds since it weakens much faster than bleach. No idea how strong the solution was.I do now see the light..
And yes sorry guys not read the pages long discussion, just in a page back..but yes genetics can entirely be saved from fusarium/pythium/stem canker, but if it is, then most likely infected also with hlvd in my experience and then it will cost you and there is only very few doing it. And you better be testing the "clean" material for months after to make sure unless its from one of the proper places who are not BS artists or flybynites...you have to go invitro..or seed too you can as troutman says but either way it will involve lots of testing. and time and hence the cost if you outsource. But the layman only really has access to seed, though there are those who do invitro at home, its the clean up protocols that are not accessible, so seed is the only way possible for laymen. But it is not possible without lots of testing.
Can cuts from a plant that is likely infected with mold be soaked in some nutrients to give it enough strength to be healthy until roots form. Thought I read that using anything but pure water would cause problems. The tops do not look 100% probably from mold cutting off flow of water and nutrients to top of plant.
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Stop supporting brands that care more about $$ than they do about the plants. Don't be fooled by the hype. Finding/asking the right people is not hard.
Crazy Chester
Well-known member
Good question. I'm pretty sure I read somewhere not too long ago about research that was done showing it's best to clone right after feeding the mother plant. If that's the case - why not soak the cuts in a weak nutrient solution before cloning?
That was what I was thinking, like 300 PPM. Have 4 from one plant and might try 2 with and 2 without. Saw a product recently called lalstim, that is supposed to help cells retain water, to keep them healthier.
My clones go straight into a jiffy gelcube, if you squeeze the water out of one of those jiffies the EC is like 2.0 or something...But I feed my clones a full strength nutrient solution anyway...Only ever gave me better results to have food available as the first roots emerge, in the recipe you want to give it.
If you want to feed a plant and it's got no roots, foliar feed it. Foliar feeding mothers day or two before making cuts also helps, including an extract of southern hemisphere kelp also greatly helps with the huge IAA dose that the plant converts into IBA and assists rooting over the next few days. Know what you are doing with a foliar feed too, one can burn plants if one doesnt follow basics of foliar feeding.
But If your plant is not infected with systemic pathogenic fungi, or virii or viroids, you don't need rooting hormones, food.. nothing, just stick the cut in a glass of water and it will root. It's the #1 factor IMO now in hindsight, aside from the basics of not drowning a clone and not letting it dry out, though glass of water im not exaggerating.
If you want to feed a plant and it's got no roots, foliar feed it. Foliar feeding mothers day or two before making cuts also helps, including an extract of southern hemisphere kelp also greatly helps with the huge IAA dose that the plant converts into IBA and assists rooting over the next few days. Know what you are doing with a foliar feed too, one can burn plants if one doesnt follow basics of foliar feeding.
But If your plant is not infected with systemic pathogenic fungi, or virii or viroids, you don't need rooting hormones, food.. nothing, just stick the cut in a glass of water and it will root. It's the #1 factor IMO now in hindsight, aside from the basics of not drowning a clone and not letting it dry out, though glass of water im not exaggerating.
