Blumat auto watering

[Dave Coulier]

I have a couple of questions for the seasoned pros over here. Thanks for all the info amassed thus far! I could not have wrapped my head around this and gotten this far to go ahead without the essay of information and everyone's contributions. I am pretty much ready to pull the trigger and buy everything I need. I just want to get a confirmation to a couple design ideas and overall plan from some people who have been in a similar mindset and applications. I have a limited budget for the planned upgrades, and a couple ideas where to spend it, and even more upgrade possibilities then I like to admit. However.. here is what we can/will work with.


For starters, the garden to be watered will be situated on a 4x8 ebb and flo table. Currently lit with 3x600w cooltube fixtures. An upgrade idea here would be to add a 3x3 table beside the 4x8, and buy two light rails, two trolleys, two push-bars, and 3 parabolic 4' fixtures with mogul extensions to travel across the room and back. (around summer time a scale down would probably be in order)

Anyways.. imagining ~60plants on the 4x8.. They will be planted into coco with an undetermined amount of perlite added. My understanding is that 30% seems to give greater results with a moister setting on the sensors (closer to DTW or small runoff), than straight coco with the same moisture settings. Pot size for the 60 plants is between [2ltr 5.5" square pots] or [1 or 2 gallon smartpot/root pouch]. Talk is in the air of canopy management stress and labor, so maybe 40 on the 4x8 with [2 or 3 gallon smartpot/rootpouch]

You can add a better amendment than perlite to your media. Calcined Clays are a superior alternative in so many ways. It costs more, but the benefits make it a must-have in my garden.
Want an all natural organic water crystal, that can also release nutrients if pre-charged with them? Thats calcined clays for you.

You never want to approach any type of run-off with blumats. Go towards the drier side and you'll have much more white fuzzy roots. Get the medium too wet with blumats, and you can pretty much guarantee you'll wipe out your roothairs very quickly as there is no dry down period with blumats.

I often times would tweak the knobs to let more water through my blumats, now lately Im finding Im tightening the knob just a little each day until I get the media to the moisture level I want. Im losing far fewer lower leaves to abscission and yellowing now that Im leaning towards the drier side. Roots are fuzzier and whiter too.


For clarification, the fabric root pruning pots are leagues above traditional pots in terms of root manipulation/pruning help with the constant root level moisture controlled by sensors vs. wet/dry cycles in a traditional closed wall structured pot if I am not mistaken?

Fabric Pots are nice and all, and Ive used them both in my garden, but I prefer the plastic pots after much personal experience. You can still get a nice constant moisture levels with plastic containers. Wet/dry cycles occur from watering practices. It has nothing to do with the containers material. Although fabric bags will help you out allowing the media to dry faster if you over-water.

One downside of fabric bags is that I am unable to lift the rootball out of the container to inspect it. Its nice to be able to lift the rootball out and inspect root health and better gauge moisture levels in the media from top to bottom.

You'll still get good results with fabric bags though so they're by no means a bad choice. My Durban Poison-D is in a 3 gallon fabric bag and is doing excellent, but I still prefer good ole regular plastic pots.

Now the grow beds some of you other Blumat Users are using really intrigues me alot and Ive always wanted to do blumats + beds...

Now this is where my confusions/concerns/hesitations come in: reservoir/supply line sizing pressure requirements. There is a 40gal low-pro available under the table, to be plumbed to a top-up-timed 5gal bucket at 4.5' above the ground, with the pots/sensors 1.5-2' above the ground. I was leaning towards two 1/2" through-hills at the bottom of the bucket to connect a "U" shaped loop of 1/2" tube around the table back up to the res with petcocks to allow for disconnect when full of water and not draining the supply line. Can't forget the "T" in the middle of the loop for purging, going to petcock and plumb it back to 40gal. How many plants can this idea support when plumbed directly from 1/2"poly to the 3mm drip line.

Im sorry but I can't be of any help here. My Reservoir/setup is so simple and basic I feel like a hick compared to what some of you guys got going on just for reservoirs. Same 8mm and 3mm lines that were provided with the patio kit, and a lone shut off valve. Nothing more than that for my little setup. Ill post a pic at the end.

I hope someone else can be more helpful in that regard.

Off my 1/2" hydrostore poly tube, I was interested in the kentsystems quick connect couplings (QC). I believe this is the simplest and most flexible option with a lot of plants: tubing connections are as follows.


[1/2"polytube]-> [3mm shut-off female QC]x[3mm open-flow triggering male QC] ->[3mm drip line attached to sensor]. approx 3$ per QC coupling pair if I am not mistaken.
Otherwise, to save some dollars for another upgrade.... I imagine 3mm->3mm hose union barbs in the 1/2" and the barb caps as goof plugs instead of QCs. Cost is now ~50cents a pair. Is this groovy?


Anyways, I think that is is for now. I hope this is not too far off from a ready to go concept. I am pretty ansy to buy the parts and set it up to get some life back! If anyone here notices any thing flawed or to be improved, please do not hesitate to critique and insult, or praise. (doubtfull)

Oh how you will love getting so much more free time now. Every plant you put on a blumat, the more freedom you are gaining yourself. Experiment with some CRF + Blumats, and you'll have even more free time and even healthier plants.

Genes.

Ghetto

Fabulous

 

[alegria11]

hey lapides any photos to share of them blumats =) hos it working for ya?best wishes

 

[Lapides]

hey lapides any photos to share of them blumats =) hos it working for ya?best wishes

To be honest, I really only take pictures of my plants. But the 'recycled' link in my sig are all plants grown with blumats.

 

[Genes]

@Dave.C - Thank you so much for your detailed and prompt reply. I am definitely looking into the calcinated clays, props. I'll be honest, I have some work to do with that as I have never looked into it before. Love to learn new things though! Im going to be tht guy... could I ask .... Is there a product you would recommend specifically and/or any mix rates tried and true for you? I will also take your word on the plastic pots, thanks for simplifying that decision. I still may go a little bigger though. Appreciate the confirmation on moisture levels, I was leaning that way with the gut, glad to hear its not crazy. Thanks again! As for your reservior- whatever works, it works! Keep it simple seems to be doing the trick for you, and that photo suggests your plants enjoy your touch and attention to detail. I will happily take your advice with consideration as they seem to be living proof, ...and that color! AH! just breathtaking. respect.. dont let her go




Now, I guess all you other blumat'rs are off enjoying your new found free time! I can't say I don't blame you, but if you find it in your busy schedules to take a minute to come help a blumat newb out - I want to be part of the club eh

Is there anyone running off of 1/2" poly that can let me know if they have run into any issues, or hiccups I may need to take into account? Got my pricing back, pretty much deciding how many sensors and my tubing situation. The QC pieces are expensive and not sure about returns.. just waiting on some sage advice to go ahead, and will definitely provide some updates /pay it forward once I get moving to help anyone else in my boat in case anyone was worried.

Genes.

 

[Organabis]

Hello new member here, I'm going to get a set of blumats for my pots and was wondering if or how often blumats malfunction and why it would? Also, will blumats work with top dressing kelp, castings or whatever it may be?

 

[Jhhnn]

Hello new member here, I'm going to get a set of blumats for my pots and was wondering if or how often blumats malfunction and why it would? Also, will blumats work with top dressing kelp, castings or whatever it may be?

When top dressing, watering carries the nutrients down into the soil. I don't think it will work well w/ blumats. In larger pots, the soil at the top is dry around the edges because water from the dripper disperses downward in a broad cone. Occasional aerated teas work well. add them just like normal watering. The blumat shuts down when you do, starts dripping again when the moisture level drops back to normal.

Simple teas are easy but some people do get deep into it. I put 1/4 cup castings in a couple of gallons of water, aerate vigorously for 12-24 hours & pour it on. Same w/ kelp meal.

I get gnats, so I add 1 tbsp/gal gnatrol to the tea & apply once a week for 3 weeks when I transplant to the final pots. I haven't eradicated them but it keeps them very scarce for the duration.

 

[heady blunts]

jhhnn---

try steinernema feltiae (nematodes). beneficial insects ftw. also great for thrips.

 

[heady blunts]

Hello new member here, I'm going to get a set of blumats for my pots and was wondering if or how often blumats malfunction and why it would? Also, will blumats work with top dressing kelp, castings or whatever it may be?

welcome to icmag!


blumats DEFINITELY work for living soil and top dressing, as long as you have active soil biology and a good mulch layer. if you leave your soil surface exposed then you will get a dry crusty layer on top and the top dressings will not cycle ime.

blumats malfunction because of "vapor lock" or improper setup/placement.

vapor lock is when air bubbles get into the airline and create a blockage. water stops flowing trhough the drip lines, the soil dries out, and the cones empty. this fucks up the pressure inside the cone, so the diaphram that controls the pinch valve on the drip line stays wide open. then something nudges that vapor lock air bubble out of the way and suddenly you have unrestricted water flowing out of the drip lines.

improper setup would be not following the minimum distances recommended by blumat. that's both for head pressure (how far above the drip points your reservoir rests determines pressure), and that 8cm distance from the carrot to the drip point (so the carrot won't dry out). also important is to use the proper number drip emitters to use for your container's diameter (based on container diameter, not container volume).

placement is the last thing. when you put down the blumat carrots in the soil they must be distributed evenly so that the entire container is well watered. if you place them asymmetrically you will get dry areas that eventually lead to flooding.

if you install them correctly, they will almost never fail (almost never because you have to assume they will fail and prepare for a flood regardless of how well you set them up).

as a first time user you should be prepared for a flood at any time. just make sure your drip trays/ pond liner can hold more than the volume of your reservoir, and make sure you have a wet/dry shopvac handy.


HTH!

 

[Organabis]

welcome to icmag!


blumats DEFINITELY work for living soil and top dressing, as long as you have active soil biology and a good mulch layer. if you leave your soil surface exposed then you will get a dry crusty layer on top and the top dressings will not cycle ime.

blumats malfunction because of "vapor lock" or improper setup/placement.

vapor lock is when air bubbles get into the airline and create a blockage. water stops flowing trhough the drip lines, the soil dries out, and the cones empty. this fucks up the pressure inside the cone, so the diaphram that controls the pinch valve on the drip line stays wide open. then something nudges that vapor lock air bubble out of the way and suddenly you have unrestricted water flowing out of the drip lines.

improper setup would be not following the minimum distances recommended by blumat. that's both for head pressure (how far above the drip points your reservoir rests determines pressure), and that 8cm distance from the carrot to the drip point (so the carrot won't dry out). also important is to use the proper number drip emitters to use for your container's diameter (based on container diameter, not container volume).

placement is the last thing. when you put down the blumat carrots in the soil they must be distributed evenly so that the entire container is well watered. if you place them asymmetrically you will get dry areas that eventually lead to flooding.

if you install them correctly, they will almost never fail (almost never because you have to assume they will fail and prepare for a flood regardless of how well you set them up).

as a first time user you should be prepared for a flood at any time. just make sure your drip trays/ pond liner can hold more than the volume of your reservoir, and make sure you have a wet/dry shopvac handy.


HTH!

Thanks for your help Heady. A few more questions if you dont mind. I'm not worried about flooding since it will be used in a soil bed. How many do I need for a pot thats 60" diameter? Its only about 12 inches high. Do you recommend a blumat soil meter also?

 

[Lazyman]

I'd probably use 5 or 6 blumats, that's a 5 foot diameter pot.

 

[Organabis]

I'd probably use 5 or 6 blumats, that's a 5 foot diameter pot.

Thanks.

 

[Organabis]

Which blutmat kit is the best and the one I'm looking for? There are planter kits, deck kits, pump systems, pressure kits and all that. I need it to water a 5 foot diameter pot with no drainage.

 

[heady blunts]

there's some basic info to get you started. you can modify those designs with extra gizmos like more shut off valves and quick connects and hard feedline or whatever.

 

[heady blunts]

patio kit is 12 blumats and comes with fittings to make a dead res.

the deck kit is 40 i think and it comes with a pressure reducer (see item D in the first image in above post) so you can hook it right up to the faucet and not worry about pressure. the downside is if you have a flood it just keeps flooding until you discover it, vs the finite amount of water in a reservoir.

 

[FlowerFarmer]

Could also be looked at as a upside. The upside is if you build your setup to accommodate drainage/runoff you won't lose the entire garden in the event of a run-away. Might be a problem for those paying for water, but on a well I'd prefer the plant stay wet/potentially drown rather then all my blumats go dry and need re-dialed (if not all killed due to lack of water)

With a rez all it takes is a single run-away while you are out of town and you'll bleed the rez dry through the 3mm. I was amazed at how fast I lost a 55 Gal rez through an open 3mm line.

 

[Eighths-n-Aces]

Could also be looked at as a upside.

IME blumats run way better on he pressure regulator. the slave drippers function better and they are easier to get dialed in.

that said, if you don't have your shit squared away as far as drainage and overflows opting for the pressure regulator is playing with fire and if your water quality sucks it could cause you problems.

FWIW you can put together a basic system to deal with the overflow/flood issue pretty easily, and it costs about the same as setting up some of the self topping upper rez systems when you consider the cost of the pump.

both systems work great and both have their downsides

 

[Jhhnn]

Thanks, Ace. Nice to see you here. The blumat regulator is designed to feed 500 drippers so it's capable of pretty high flow. If you pop an 8mm line it goes wide open trying to create pressure so it'll flood very quickly. There's a lot less pressure behind any gravity system so that effect will be lessened. There's more time to notice the problem before it gets out of hand.

I think indoor growers would do well to restrict flow rate to the regulator to suit their needs or maybe use a different regulator that just won't flow as much water. That's true, I think, even with disaster control systems. I stumbled across these on ebay, may have to give one a try-

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Low-Pressur...ring-System-/281684740878?hash=item4195b80b0e

It should flow enough water for my modest needs & it'd be nice to be able to move pots vertically w/o having to adjust the blumats.

 

[Eighths-n-Aces]

nice find Jhhnn!

that gadget looks like it would do the job! it's a little cheaper than the blumat pressure regulator and i like the idea o having a gage to read instead of just hoping that the regulator is running like it should be .......... but to be honest you had my attention when i read the chicken nipples thing nice to have that WTF brain cell fire off this early in the morning

FWIW i haven't had any issues at all with the 8 mm line SO FAR. but i agree that it would make one hell of a mess really fast if you hadn't planned for it. i've never tested my system to see if it could keep up against a broken 8mm because i never really worried about one breaking but maybe i should. it'd be one less thing to worry about

 

[stoned40yrs]

I have no idea why anyone even uses that stiff junk 8mm line. Soft flexible 1/2" black hydro line is inexpensive and you can stick the barbs that blumat sells anywhere along the line and not have to screw with fittings. There are also more than two reasons these blumats can runaway and drain your res. The top part of the sensors can go bad which is why blumat has started selling the tops separate. The ceramic bottoms don't go bad. I've had two tops go bad this year.

 

[Jhhnn]

I have no idea why anyone even uses that stiff junk 8mm line. Soft flexible 1/2" black hydro line is inexpensive and you can stick the barbs that blumat sells anywhere along the line and not have to screw with fittings. There are also more than two reasons these blumats can runaway and drain your res. The top part of the sensors can go bad which is why blumat has started selling the tops separate. The ceramic bottoms don't go bad. I've had two tops go bad this year.

People use the curly 8mm line because it comes in the kits. It's a pita with pots & short 3mm lines but probably wouldn't be as bad in beds where the curl can be laid flat.

Irrigation systems & hardware are also a whole new world for most of us. Internet shopping doesn't help, either, because we can't touch it & we've never seen it working in person, either. So we start from scratch, build on experience until we get something that works for us.