Biopiracy in the search for Landraces.<--on going discussion, please be civil in your choice of words and grammer.

[experienced]

The shitty thing is that most PEople, when i tell them that old Landraces are special, guess what, 99 Percent dont understand shit, they watch with empty eyes when i tell it, but have no idea what im talking about. The only thing they think of is Apple Trees wich are kind of Semi-wild i guess.




I'm not only that but it's been my experience that a lot of folks just don't want to have to put the work in and see 456 grows under their belt before they get something that they think for whatever reason is sexy or appealing. I can tell you firsthand when I had no access to my own homegrown I would be subjected to the local guys that would grow and a lot of times the s*** that would come from Outdoors that look just like basic bagweed without perform the best indoor the college kids were smoking because the college kids had some f****** bottlenecked Indica hybrid that locked him to a couch and left them unmotivated whereas some Vermont farmer New England farmer New Hampshire wherever the case have been back then usually Northern New York Northern Vermont Northern New Hampshire or northern Maine we're supplying a good part of the East Coast when I was growing up with phenomenal outdoor plants that I think were mainly hard to see what the helicopter didn't have a massive odor profile that attracted unwanted attention and had mold and pest prevention in them that made it so that they were easy to grow outdoors with little to no oversight what the f*** do I know though I've only had a relationship with this plant since 1989 I'm an idiot

'Grammer' is spelled GRAMMAR.

 

[Plookerkingjon]

Uh huh

 

[Old Piney]

So Apple trees do naturalize easily .however to get a really good apple from seed isn't that easy .Apples are propagated by grafting select varieties onto seedling rootstocks .Someone does work with seedlings to basically pheno hunt for new varieties to graft .They work not with land races but let's say heirlooms for genetics .Lots of hard work to produce all these yummy new apples varieties

 

[Plookerkingjon]

So Apple trees do naturalize easily .however to get a really good apple from seed isn't that easy .Apples are propagated by grafting select varieties onto seedling rootstocks .Someone does work with seedlings to basically pheno hunt for new varieties to graft .They work not with land races but let's say heirlooms for genetics .Lots of hard work to produce all these yummy new apples varieties

And traveling healthy Apiaries are a certain Wonder for a lot of those apple orchards I've seen

 

[Old Piney]

Oh and we can't forget Johnny apple seed lol

 

[Plookerkingjon]

Washington State and envy apples I tried this season or some of the best apples I've ever tried in my life

 

[[Maschinenhaus]]

The best apples are those that are small and ugly and come from lonely apple trees that look like they are already dead.

Most apples and many other fruits come from plantations with monocultures where you have to drive bees across the country to pollinate them.

I have inherited a farm where my mom has created ancient fruit varieties and herb gardens according to St. Hildegard. Some of the trees look like they survived a nuclear blast and subsequent hurricane, but they are alive and producing damn tasty stuff.

With hemp, it is similar in my opinion, of course, you usually have to adapt any findings first, even crossbreeding is sometimes necessary. The Durban is my best example, a good job by Sensi Seeds, she was once 100% Sativa according to old classification, I grow them for over 25 years in inbreeding. Sure, I experimented with it but the result was never as good as the original.

And what do you think happens when you let a modern outdoor variety go wild, we have a remote military training area here where exactly that can be observed. I've known the wild colony for 18 years and every few years I check there. This was once a deliberately created spot with modern varieties that was forgotten why ever?

 

[Roms]

They probably used cannabis as an aphrodisiac back then I bet

No doubt

The latest research aims to isolate endocannabinoids as essential in the functioning of the organism due to their number being much greater than any other receptor, which would help to explain the systemic and general effects of cannabis and the variety of its therapeutic applications. In particular, they stimulate the release of other neurotransmitters and play a role in sperm fertility.

Pure NLD kills cancer, covid, TANO and satanist yeah

 

[mexcurandero420]

The true landrace days are about over due to accessibility and technology....unless u can fly into to some remote tropical island that has not been affected by the modern world. Go ask some native growers for some of their seed stock. I've got a friend that has some connections with Jamaica and he went there in search of some good sativa landrace....He asked what the seed stock was and guess what the locals said? Dutch genetic!! Well well well imagine that. So much for Jamaican landrace. I can guarantee the same goes for Mexican and Columbian and pretty much everywhere else. Hate to burst your bubble people but the landrace days are pretty much over. I agree with the post a while back about prohibition contributing to the demise. If cannabis were legal during the Golden Years we could have more easily isolated and worked with these fragile genetics. You can thank Reagan and the War on Drugs for that one.

Yes and no.Some African countries you can still get landraces.Colombia also hard to find nowadays, Mexico in some rural areas.South East Asia still have landraces, but that will change with the legalisation like you have in Thailand, although the good old Thai stick has probably disappeared.Early 90s minty Thai was sold in a lot of shops, but not anymore.
In 2009 you could find sweet carrot phenotypes in Parvati, but don't hear it anymore from people who were growing the variety.

 

[Roms]

+1 Mex'

Swaziland Eswatini no big problem too and so on... Nepali, Kashmir, Ethiopia, Madagascar, Venezuela, Namibia, ahaha the list is long...

 

[Plookerkingjon]

Want nothing to do with normal civilization I can't say I blame them

 

[Plookerkingjon]

The best apples are those that are small and ugly and come from lonely apple trees that look like they are already dead.

Most apples and many other fruits come from plantations with monocultures where you have to drive bees across the country to pollinate them.

I have inherited a farm where my mom has created ancient fruit varieties and herb gardens according to St. Hildegard. Some of the trees look like they survived a nuclear blast and subsequent hurricane, but they are alive and producing damn tasty stuff.

With hemp, it is similar in my opinion, of course, you usually have to adapt any findings first, even crossbreeding is sometimes necessary. The Durban is my best example, a good job by Sensi Seeds, she was once 100% Sativa according to old classification, I grow them for over 25 years in inbreeding. Sure, I experimented with it but the result was never as good as the original.

And what do you think happens when you let a modern outdoor variety go wild, we have a remote military training area here where exactly that can be observed. I've known the wild colony for 18 years and every few years I check there. This was once a deliberately created spot with modern varieties that was forgotten why ever?

That's interesting insight I'd like to point out that us Northeastern new england farm boys have to pick apples whether we like it or not and some families up here you might call it a family tradition some Knuckleheads would call it indentured servitude I call it a job where I earned a phenomenal work ethic because there wasn't a spring break for us boys up here without a full-time job being involved somehow made us all better men I'm convinced of it, I've eaten probably 15 different varieties of apples and the Envy apples they're growing out west are absolutely ass kicking

 

[mexcurandero420]

Red Starrenette apple variety from 1830, hard to get only in autumn at the farmers market if the season was good.

 

[Plookerkingjon]

70% fruit daily intake never hurt me

 

[Old Piney]

The best Apple I ever ate was the ones I ate with my buddy ,fresh from my dad dwarf empire apple tree after smoking some home grown when I was about 16 .I guess it's all about the moment

 

[ledo]

Oh and we can't forget Johnny apple seed lol

Look how many “they” found back then vs. how many “they” find now…. Science , experimentation & balls has taken a distant second seat to fear, politics & greed…

I’ve got an empire tree here, so do my in laws… The Old heirlooms store & taste so much better to me; I’ll munch on my golden russets all day long over the honey crisps or golden delicious (russet is a parent of) I also have growing

9-10 varieties just here alone in one tub from my orchard I planted

Peace y’all - talk is cheap

 

[ledo]

'Grammer' is spelled GRAMMAR.

Wonderful contribution ; do the caps mean you’re yelling it too…?

 

[Nannymouse]

The old Prairie Spy's were pretty awesome for our area. The Northern Spy was probably an improvement, though. Not many apples will survive, here. I have toyed with the idea of getting apple seed from those old Russian apples, Antelovka (sp?) would probably do better than Duchess. But, we've started off with a Dolgo, mostly for pollination, but i think maybe it's too early for the others...Barons, HoneyCrisp, and Harolsons (red and green).

 

[ledo]

The old Prairie Spy's were pretty awesome for our area. The Northern Spy was probably an improvement, though. Not many apples will survive, here. I have toyed with the idea of getting apple seed from those old Russian apples, Antelovka (sp?) would probably do better than Duchess. But, we've started off with a Dolgo, mostly for pollination, but i think maybe it's too early for the others...Barons, HoneyCrisp, and Harolsons (red and green).

I think you should try & find an appropriate root stock(s) then build onto that trial & error… I planted @ 24 trees here, 12 varietals on a few different stock (all tested extensively in this area pre me too, I’m lucky to be @ Cornell U and this is apple country here) to see which work best, I’m probably down to 16 trees now but still 12 varietals…

Here’s people I know & trust @ me; family has been at it a long time, extremely well respected and educated in the field - this is their cold hardy focused selections for example, this is where I’d begin if you

Cummins Nursery

Fruit Trees, Scions, and Rootstocks for Apples, Pears, Cherries, Plums, Peaches, and Nectarines

www.cumminsnursery.com

I’ve yet to find a place with more varied stock & selections; season dependent

 

[Nannymouse]

@led05 thanks for the link, i'll look into that. We've been using info from NDSU and their trials to choose fruits for our area, if we need to purchase. Good patches of chokecherries and juneberries on the property, with buffalo berries nearby.

I would love to play around with apple genetics, and develop something new for our area, but that's a young person thing...with apple trees. I would probably not live to see apple seedling mature and do selections. It would be nice to be able to grow from seed, without the grafting.

If i was young enough to do this, and someone stole all that work...i would not be happy.

(desperately trying to get back to the 'biopiracy' theme...)