Where is the biological advantage? Is it out yet?
Advancing Eco Agriculture, Product Science
- Thread starter FatherEarth
- Start date
BYF...this is from me buddy Anderson http://nmsp.cals.cornell.edu/publications/factsheets/factsheet2.pdf
If I drive my C:N ratio tighter than 10:1 in the soil, no matter the source of that N (and no matter organic or not) am I going to create nitrate in the soil? That would kind of have serious implications for plant health.
My basic strategy is to use higher levels of Mo in foliar to help the plant convert the extra nitrate into protein (along with PhotoMag). But better yet would be to address the root cause of the high nitrate.
If I drive my C:N ratio tighter than 10:1 in the soil, no matter the source of that N (and no matter organic or not) am I going to create nitrate in the soil? That would kind of have serious implications for plant health.
My basic strategy is to use higher levels of Mo in foliar to help the plant convert the extra nitrate into protein (along with PhotoMag). But better yet would be to address the root cause of the high nitrate.
Yea...hugh lovell says 5:1 N:S. He claims as soon as nitrate starts building up you shut down N fixing.
I have an indoor grow going at an ec of 0.3 with no extra N amends for going on 2 cycles...other than sea shield. Green as can be.
So basically you want root exudates to mineralize those amendments for you is why you put them on at planting? So the lant and microbes work with each other
I have an indoor grow going at an ec of 0.3 with no extra N amends for going on 2 cycles...other than sea shield. Green as can be.
So basically you want root exudates to mineralize those amendments for you is why you put them on at planting? So the lant and microbes work with each other
So still thinking about the nitrate thing. This involves both logic and math so please tell me if I hop off the rails on either.
If me calcs are right the Coot mix adds 0.56 lbs of N per yard from Neem, crab meal and kelp meal.
An acre furrow slice (6 inches deep, 43,560 sq ft) is 807 yards. So 807 x 0.56 = the equivalent of dumping about 450 lbs of N on an acre. Maybe there is some farmer in Iowa using that much, but that is pushing it.
Now when you think about ppm you gotta take into account the weight of the Coot mix vs field soil. So about 700 lbs per yard for Coot vs 2 million lbs per acre. 2,000,000/807 = 2,478 for field soil per yard. So 2,478/700 = 3.5.
So that 450 lbs per acre becomes the equivalent (ppm wise) to 3.5x450 = about 1600 lbs of N per acre. oooops. That right there might explain nitrate off the charts.
Is it any wonder people feel the need to flush? Is it any wonder there are so many articles about spider mites or how many chem miticides are being used?
Is me thinking and math right...please pick it apart if it is not.
If me calcs are right the Coot mix adds 0.56 lbs of N per yard from Neem, crab meal and kelp meal.
An acre furrow slice (6 inches deep, 43,560 sq ft) is 807 yards. So 807 x 0.56 = the equivalent of dumping about 450 lbs of N on an acre. Maybe there is some farmer in Iowa using that much, but that is pushing it.
Now when you think about ppm you gotta take into account the weight of the Coot mix vs field soil. So about 700 lbs per yard for Coot vs 2 million lbs per acre. 2,000,000/807 = 2,478 for field soil per yard. So 2,478/700 = 3.5.
So that 450 lbs per acre becomes the equivalent (ppm wise) to 3.5x450 = about 1600 lbs of N per acre. oooops. That right there might explain nitrate off the charts.
Is it any wonder people feel the need to flush? Is it any wonder there are so many articles about spider mites or how many chem miticides are being used?
Is me thinking and math right...please pick it apart if it is not.
Here is a really interesting article that my buddy Anderson gave me
http://www.jtropag.in/index.php/ojs/article/viewFile/1009/290
It is worth the time to read it plus it makes me wonder. There is definitely some kind of essential oil in the biological advantage. I know this cause product S does not have that dead hooker pussy smell. Makes a guy wonder if this may be the reason it is in there.
If I knew that it might influence my decision to use ba or not.
http://www.jtropag.in/index.php/ojs/article/viewFile/1009/290
It is worth the time to read it plus it makes me wonder. There is definitely some kind of essential oil in the biological advantage. I know this cause product S does not have that dead hooker pussy smell. Makes a guy wonder if this may be the reason it is in there.
If I knew that it might influence my decision to use ba or not.
C
c-ray
Greg Willis recommends 10-50 tons of good compost per acre, on hurting land in year one of a regeneration program, with 50 tons being the ideal.. how many lbs of N do you figure that is?
C
c-ray
Steiner says Ca can transform into N, and Si into Ca so..
A shitload...but at the same time it depends on how much carbon comes with it. I am guessing as long as you do not exceed a 1:10 N:C ratio...keep it tied up in that humus flywheel...then you are safe. If you add that much as nitrate you are fucked.
N from sources like Neem come without that built in C:N ratio
edit...the question becomes will you ever have enough S in that soil to mineralize the N. Which is OK...you simply would add a little every grow and mine that humus.
So transmutation...how much energy do you reckon that takes? Maybe it is possible...but is it efficient?
C
c-ray
I've read up to 6x more N in a compost pile than what it began with, simply by adding a few lbs per cubic yard of quick or hydrated lime and bd preps..
Yes your question is what I was bringing when I mentioned the interaction with S ...constantly chasing our tail with the common marijuana paradigms ...
Plants have it figured out..let them do what they need to do
So I have been looking at a test for worm power vermicast. It has 18.2% carbon and 1.8% nitrogen. That nitrogen is virtually all organic...only 2200 mg/kg nitrate.
And then I was watching Hugh Lovel talk about compost and maybe a piece of the puzzle fell into place for me...maybe not...but
The pH of the worm power is 7.1, not enough sulfer to solubilize the organic nitrogen.
But put it in a low pH soil and it starts to solubilize and oxidize to nitrate. Wouldn't it be ironic if the LOS guys added too much gypsum and changed the pH of their soil enough to flood it with soluble nitrates defeating the reason for all the compost in the first place.
I could be wrong but the thought makes me smile. I need more data.
Plus it would help explain why bob wilt does not mind that his blueberry soil has a 6.8 pH. It lets the plants take up less nitrate and keeps them healthy.
And then I was watching Hugh Lovel talk about compost and maybe a piece of the puzzle fell into place for me...maybe not...but
The pH of the worm power is 7.1, not enough sulfer to solubilize the organic nitrogen.
But put it in a low pH soil and it starts to solubilize and oxidize to nitrate. Wouldn't it be ironic if the LOS guys added too much gypsum and changed the pH of their soil enough to flood it with soluble nitrates defeating the reason for all the compost in the first place.
I could be wrong but the thought makes me smile. I need more data.
Plus it would help explain why bob wilt does not mind that his blueberry soil has a 6.8 pH. It lets the plants take up less nitrate and keeps them healthy.
L
Luther Burbank
Milky, this is something I'd like to know a definitive answer to. I'm mostly running my old mix from a few years ago in organics, but recently mixed a batch of the new "los" recipe using worm power for my castings. I need to send it off to be tested because a couple weeks after mixing it burned the shit out of some transplants.
Jerry has done a lot for our cause and his efforts will be carried onward.
Labeling and registration is in its final stage
It's the same quality of product just a blend that was developed through testing on ganj
It's the same quality of product just a blend that was developed through testing on ganj
