a ppk for a 6 plant limit

[av8or]

This is what I do in my downstair UC rooms (not PPK yet). 5-600's in the diamond pattern. That picture of your plant on day one of flip, how much do you strip it after the stretch? Do you have any pictures of one after the stretch and you cleaned it out?

That pic was day 6 of stretch. I cleaned her out almost entirely the day I flipped her though. That's what I meant when I said she kinda sprung up on me. I'm going to toss another trellis net on her tonight and clean her out again. I'll try to remember to take pictures.

Starting from the bottom, inner-most fan leaves, I wait till the leaf is fully grown, then I wait three weeks, then start pulling them off. Either do a few rigorous cleanings or progressively yank fans off all the way through harvest. Ideally, I only knuck buds off branches and machine trim them wet right off the plant. Fans are already plucked by then.

 

[av8or]

Thank you for the words of wisdom. You're absolutely right about the ceiling height, 9 foot is going to suck. I should have stuck to my original plan which was to use vertical bulbs but then a friend talked me into the DE's claiming he pulls 3lbs per light with 9 plants each and just topping them. I'm an idiot.

Trees are out the question for me unless I switch lights. I'm hoping that with the right training I can make a 4.5x4.5 canopy of dense bud. If I have to add a couple more plants to make that happen easier I will which would also reduce my veg times so that is a plus if I go that route. I will find out soon enough, I'm hoping to have some clones loaded into the system over the next couple days.

That plant in the picture is a beast by the way. It is results like that that might make me put my DE's up for sale and pickup some cheap 600's.

Haha I hear ya brother. Don't go selling anything just yet. If you don't mind growing more plants, then there's your answer. It's a bit easier to grow a bunch of short plants than it is to train one monster plant to fill the same space in a flat canopy. Plus, with more plants you can grow more strains!

As for your friend pulling three pounds a light, that's certainly possible. I've got buddies doing that, too. I tend to use credible, repeatable numbers for planning purposes. Strain selection is paramount when you get in to the heavy yield numbers. I grew a 4 pounder in that same room as I grow my usual 1.5 pound plants.

The reason I grow trees is because of Oregon law. I don't have to report my growing or yields to the state if I keep my plant numbers down in medical legal limits. So, I just grow bigger plants and sacrifice some yield to do so.

If, however, I didn't have laws or any other restrictions (space, money, electricity, etc.) I would drop the DEs down like the vertical bulbs, only horizontal without a hood. Then grown a vertical SOG with rows of plants on each side of the bulb. There are some dudes in Colorado doing it and it looks like its super efficient.

One thing I will say for growing trees: it's a lot less work than growing a lot of smaller plants. Truthfully, I spend an average of 8-10 hours a week growing weed. That is all-inclusive. Propagation, cultivation, havest, possessing...everything except consumption! That takes way more time haha! Ppk trees are easy treezy!

 

[McKush]

.

I doubt I'll update my original thread. Maybe I should start a new one? I dunno....are you guys' and gals' in want of yet another ppk thread?

Yah mon! Please do brother.

 

[Mr Blah]

Yah mon! Please do brother.

I second that motion.

 

[DunHav`nFun]

Haha I hear ya brother. Don't go selling anything just yet. If you don't mind growing more plants, then there's your answer. It's a bit easier to grow a bunch of short plants than it is to train one monster plant to fill the same space in a flat canopy. Plus, with more plants you can grow more strains!

As for your friend pulling three pounds a light, that's certainly possible. I've got buddies doing that, too. I tend to use credible, repeatable numbers for planning purposes. Strain selection is paramount when you get in to the heavy yield numbers. I grew a 4 pounder in that same room as I grow my usual 1.5 pound plants.

The reason I grow trees is because of Oregon law. I don't have to report my growing or yields to the state if I keep my plant numbers down in medical legal limits. So, I just grow bigger plants and sacrifice some yield to do so.

If, however, I didn't have laws or any other restrictions (space, money, electricity, etc.) I would drop the DEs down like the vertical bulbs, only horizontal without a hood. Then grown a vertical SOG with rows of plants on each side of the bulb. There are some dudes in Colorado doing it and it looks like its super efficient.
One thing I will say for growing trees: it's a lot less work than growing a lot of smaller plants. Truthfully, I spend an average of 8-10 hours a week growing weed. That is all-inclusive. Propagation, cultivation, havest, possessing...everything except consumption! That takes way more time haha! Ppk trees are easy treezy!

Very few folks realize that it takes a certain hybrid to make 3 , 4 , and 5 lb plants with any consistency once all limiting factors have been overcome in any type of timely manner /timeframe......inside....

The very first and only time I ever grew in a PPK or rather a bastardized version of it was last summer , and I was not disappointed....but.....

To utilize cu ftg in a grow room with bare bulbs hanging like I`m used to , the plants have to be 50/50 Sat/Ind hybrids for as much vertical stretch as well as horizontal once flipped to 12/12 IME to fill the room up top to bottom as well as side to side and yield accordingly....that said...

AV8or nailed it with being able to grow a 4 lber and better with the proper hybrid , while the majority of popular strains these days are so indica dominant that they veg slow as fuck and don`t stretch for shit with nowhere near the yield , thus my conclusion that it`s a good thing the DE fixtures have evolved to penetrate far better than all their HPS and MH predecessors did for horizontal increased penetration as well as yield...anyways....

Start a thread and keep carryin the torch Av8 if you can spare the time so folks will keep learning about the easiest damn all but set it and forget it setup for big plants that`s ever evolved , and for the record...

I for 1 still wonder why folks still toy with RDWC(recirculating death without cause) with PPK`s around other than lack of knowledge.....anyways....

Delta.........Thanks Av8or........

Happy Holidays all....and....

Peace....DHF....

 

[Slipnot]

I am not here to spew nonsense but would love to see a indoor 4 pound plant with ppk any other type of grow meaning 1 plant i have grown for a very long time and those numbers are unrealistic in real world settings.
for instance out door this year 12 foot tall by same wide yielded me just under 6 pounds dry
And trust me there is not a light source in the world that will compare to the Sun
and that was with 5 months Veg time all natural. comparin wattage per sq foot

vertical or not one would need a outrageous amount of vertical or horizontal lights to compare and even trying to run the same numbers as the sun will create other serious issues like bleaching etc. excessive heat and plant stress being indoor

Sure with some hybrid strains some are seeing 1 pound plants plus on occasion possibly 2 pound plants anything more is fairy tales.Even 2 pounds is pushing it again in real world settings

PPK seems like a decent style like anything else trial n error to master it like any other style

But like i said would love to see a 4 pound plant that is 24 wet pounds good luck

 

[C.O.B.]

I'm assuming you're using a single overhead light in that tent. So...put the res outside your tent with the float bucket inside. Attach the float bucket to the ppk base bucket W/ Goodyear hose at their bases. Put your pump inside the float bucket with a feed hose attached. Run it to the top ppk bucket to feed your plant site. Víola, just like that that you have a kick ass ppk system. The like attaching the mixing res and the float bucket is that small vinyl tubing that jams into the fitting on the float valve.

@av8or I have 3 overhead lights. 2 215 watt diy cree cob bars/panel and a 330 store bought led fixture with crees and monos,all true wall draw. So my my float/control res is also my pump bucket...ahh i see. Got confused on the 3 bucket system. So I'd still need the cereal box for the float? ......Nevermind viewed the third 3rd grade drawing of av8's lol j/k. Really cleared some things up. Reading 3-4 different ppk threads has my mind scrambled a bit, trying to pilfer ideas and build techniques while trying to apply them to my grow/situation.

Appreciate you guys having the patience to answer my questions. Believe me when I say I am still reading ppk threads. Ha, they've led me all over the site!

use the black garden hose with the 13/16" undersized hole to make the connection to the bulk res then use a hose barb to 1/2" pipe thread connector with a 1/2" pipe thread cap on it drilled out to 5/16" for the 3/8" od, 1/4" id vinyl hose that fits the float valve.


using the garden hose out of the bulk res allows you to use standard fittings like a ball valve or t's to multiple floats. all a lot cheaper than john guest fittings

home depot, lowes, and most other hardware stores have the above fittings. i used the picture from usplastics because i found it first.


D9 thank you. This is what I was wondering. If and how to use the garden hose from the bulk res out. I think I am on my way to PPK land!!!!! I will start a thread to try and get some help and stop cluttering up this one. Peace.

C.O.B.

 

[C.O.B.]

Heya cob if your new to plumbing start with a good moisture barrier and ability to retain spills....... lol. Seriously. Mistakes and accidents happen. Whatever you start with will likely be ok and just think of it as iteration #1 the baseline. Tweak and update as u find something better or a need that wasnt anticipated. Itll be a process but dont wait until you think youve finally gotten to the perfect design. It wont be and the first hardly ever is.... start a thread and youll get some followers who will help.

Thats what i did. Started research in '12 and built in '13. Kicking out big 1-2 elbers in 3 yrs time with lots of learnin while doing and havin fun.

Met some fine people along the way like you!

Thanks Mckush. It is a process indeed. I just like to have my ducks lined up before grabbing the rifle. I have your ppk link o rama bookmarked. Its my go to for easy ppk navigation. Peace.

C.O.B.

 

[McKush]

...
PPK seems like a decent style like anything else trial n error to master it like any other style
...

This part i agree. I only manage 1-2 elber plants tho so cant make a 4lb claim. Hmmmm now whoooooo could?

Lol.

Dont use ppk to grow big plants!

 

[Slipnot]

All i am saying is a 4 pound plant dry is a monster , and i hate to say it but for indoor you would have better luck seeing a Unicorn before seeing one 4 pound plant indoor

 

[C.O.B.]

On my way to the depo to pick up the last of the nick nacs needed to complete ppk construction! Imbedding av8ors most recent pics into memory. The system itself is so simple to construct, I got lost in the plumbing sauce of the differing styles. Peace.

C.O.B. Heyyy my 52 post!

 

[McKush]

All i am saying is a 4 pound plant dry is a monster , and i hate to say it but for indoor you would have better luck seeing a Unicorn before seeing one 4 pound plant indoor

Cheers mate im funnin' anyway. 4lb claim is saying something i agree 100%. I have not yet come close to it either. But ive also culled and harvested big plants in ppk. Its cool and i dont have a problem with skeptics bc im always that way to a fault irl. Dont care tho its how i like to be. I cant make a 4lb claim tho chap but i understand others can and they may just also choose not to show..... so maybe we will never know.... lol. If i get 4 and am still around i will come back and update this thread.

Peace brother its all good

Edit; i agree about it being a monster too. Lol. You wouldnt believe it unless you saw a pic and understand how big 7gal tub is and how the tub to plant ratio in the pic is all fucked up. Because the tub is too small relative to that plant.....

 

[McKush]

I liken PPK to SWC/NFT results with a huge security band.

Honestly that probably still fails to describe it correctly....

I dont often go for low number indoor soiless growing of big plants methods my friends, but when i do, i choose PPK. Stay growing my friends.

 

[Boutique Manettino]

 

[delta9nxs]

Hey McKush,

Another close comparison would be PPK vs RDWC (recirculating deep water culture). So like UnderCurrent, MedPatientBuckets, DIY.

Don't really put trees in SWT or NFT as much because of the size of the plants / individual containers spaced out seem to work better for that.

DHF nailed it a page back when he said he's curious why people go the RDWC route with the PPK setup available, super easy to build and run.

Where you mentioned shallow water culture and nutrient film technique... I think of Krusty Buckets (DHF has more to say on them than me)... they were (5) gallon buckets filled with lava rock and plumbed together at the bottom with one or two top feed lines. Had air lines into the bottom of each bucket and you needed a massive air pump to drive all your modules.

Basically the nutrient would "cascade" down over the lava rocks (think irregular shaped stones about 2-3x the size of hydroton) and then be churned in a bubbly froth at the bottom. The roots would grow down in, thru and around the rocks.

So the OG Krusty setup would be kind of NFT as the nutrient flows over the surfaces of the lava rocks < and creates little micro cultures in each pock - supposedly > and then the frothy explosion of bubbles at the bottom of each container could be considered shallow water culture however....

....If you were really on point with your Krusty game, you got a jackhammer and punched out a big hole in your foundation to sink the res down. This apparently kept it cooler. Perfect for rental houses....

....but no thank you!

I got to the PPK project via replacing the fast water culture in RDWC with Coco chow mix. Never tried Krusty Buckets but not sure I missed a lot.

Some of you guys know me here and while I'm not growing in my PPK systems at the moment (I'm not recirculating right now), I really like the direction these threads continue to take.

I agree with everything posted by the regulars - except the posts about taking plants at 45 days. I've said that privately in pm's so I'll say it here publicly... to each his own but that's just not the way I grow resin.

Other than that it's kind of cool how a post goes up by a handle that hasn't participated at all in the PPK threads (at least in the last (6)+ years I've been reading them) and that calls into question the information posted by a very respected, hard-working and significant contributor to the stacked containers and hose called PPK... and it goes over very smoothly... just calm, peaceful and non-reactive. All are welcome.

This is super cool guys!!

yes, we are super cool, aren't we?

 

[C.O.B.]

Argh! Purchased everything except the d&$n float valve. Hodepo and lowes don't carry "our" kind only toilet. Walmart no longer carries the plastic white ones I see in the ppk threads. What's a future ppk'er to do? Any suggestions? Peace.

C.O.B.

 

[C.O.B.]

The Kerick model or models similar, appear to be available online only. Ebay,amazon,usplastics etc... Was hoping to avoid buying online. There is a mini model named "bobby". Will this suffice?
https://www.walmart.com/ip/BOBBY-RM64-Mini-Float-Valve-1-4-Inside-Dia.-Brass-Plastic/40860589

Edit* It a no go. Order thru walmart. Ugh!

 

[av8or]

I am not here to spew nonsense but would love to see a indoor 4 pound plant with ppk any other type of grow meaning 1 plant i have grown for a very long time and those numbers are unrealistic in real world settings.
for instance out door this year 12 foot tall by same wide yielded me just under 6 pounds dry
And trust me there is not a light source in the world that will compare to the Sun
and that was with 5 months Veg time all natural. comparin wattage per sq foot

vertical or not one would need a outrageous amount of vertical or horizontal lights to compare and even trying to run the same numbers as the sun will create other serious issues like bleaching etc. excessive heat and plant stress being indoor

Sure with some hybrid strains some are seeing 1 pound plants plus on occasion possibly 2 pound plants anything more is fairy tales.Even 2 pounds is pushing it again in real world settings

PPK seems like a decent style like anything else trial n error to master it like any other style

But like i said would love to see a 4 pound plant that is 24 wet pounds good luck

Here's the four pounder. You clearly.haven't read through any of the thread to say silly stuff like this. I've only been growing just over two years so I don't have anywhere near your amount of years in, but hey....I'll take my routine two pounder unicorns over your inability to understand the difference between indoor and outdoor yields vs plant size. No trial and error required for ppk. Go read my first thread. I grew a one pounder within 6 months and a two pounder two months after that. I am not master of.anything but by everyone else's standards (except yours) I do pretty well (*false humility*).

Unless of course what you meant to say was, "holy moly! A 4 pound indoor plant! How did you do that?" In which case, again, go look up my thread. The list of people in ppk land that grow bigger trees than I do is a long one. HL45, Permaculture, Flower Farmer, Lilac Rain and that old bastard, Delta9nxs, were all growing three pounders indoor while I was still flying CH-47's around eastern Afghanistan.

What I mean to say is....go do your research and never miss an opportunity to keep your foot out of your mouth.

 

[av8or]

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=298002

For you lazy trolls out there, here's a gallery of how to grow big plants indoors, experience or no.

 

[Ravenboy]

Here's the four pounder. You clearly.haven't read through any of the thread to say silly stuff like this. I've only been growing just over two years so I don't have anywhere near your amount of years in, but hey....I'll take my routine two pounder unicorns over your inability to understand the difference between indoor and outdoor yields vs plant size. No trial and error required for ppk. Go read my first thread. I grew a one pounder within 6 months and a two pounder two months after that. I am not master of.anything but by everyone else's standards (except yours) I do pretty well (*false humility*).

Unless of course what you meant to say was, "holy moly! A 4 pound indoor plant! How did you do that?" In which case, again, go look up my thread. The list of people in ppk land that grow bigger trees than I do is a long one. HL45, Permaculture, Flower Farmer, Lilac Rain and that old bastard, Delta9nxs, were all growing three pounders indoor while I was still flying CH-47's around eastern Afghanistan.

What I mean to say is....go do your research and never miss an opportunity to keep your foot out of your mouth.

Well said .
I am only on my first PPK grow and I don't have much vertical

I am accustomed to doing heavily LSTd plants less than 30" from pot top to top, yielding about 3 to 4 zips. ( in hempy buckets)

My first PPK grow : its obvious that I will more than double my numbers ... some of my current 24 inch high plants are looking like they will go 6 to 7 0z , I am in week 7 of flower on 9 to ten week strains . They still have a lot of fattening to go thru. This are small plants with 10 to 15 tops . I get for about 7 weeks ; top one time at node 5 and LST HEAVILY


I always thought I needed more light penetration - in the past . What I needed was the PPK. The colas this time are twice as long and twice as thick . On some the colas are fully 24 inches long and I DO heavily trim fan leaves and lollipop the lower stuff